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The bizarrely unexpected problems when a crusty Grognard looks for similar

Started by Grognard GM, February 03, 2023, 09:44:03 PM

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Grognard GM

Quote from: Spinachcat on February 04, 2023, 08:16:30 PMAs for Grognard GM's RPG recruitment, I agree with others who mentioned the issue of too much leeway for players. There's something powerful about giving people LESS options. AKA, "Grognard GM running Dark Heresy on Tuesday 11am EST and Friday 2pm EST for 4 hours per session, seeking players can attend one or both sessions on a regular basis."

Then, if you get 2 people who can only do Wednesday at 4pm but really want to play Dark Heresy, then you consider changing the announcement and point out that you already have 2 players ready to go.

That's what I ended up having to do with the group of players I actually formed, in order to get anything going. I had to put forward specific games, then winnow down by time and day.

I didn't want to do this from the get-go, as if like to cycle games, and if I put forward CoC or Dark heresy, I know for a fact I'll get people that will want me to wear a hole in the ground being forever GM of that particular game. I'd rather have the initial difficulty.

Quote from: Spinachcat on February 04, 2023, 08:16:30 PMI can't speak for online VTT gamers, but older real life gamers mostly just want to have fun during their few hours of free time. Maybe its because I game with deplorable monsters constantly threatening democracy, but any "fast paced easy fantasy RPG" would be fine to scratch their D&D itch. "We're doing Dark Sun via True 20? Whatever. Do I roll high? Can I play an elf barbarian? You'll put everything I ever need to know about the campaign on one piece of paper in large print? Kewl. Let's dice."

I must reiterate here: I asked for people with a lot of free time, and that's what I got. In fact many of them said things like "I only sleep a few hours a day, and I'm free to the rest of the time. I really want to have people to game with!"

Those same people then go "Eh, pass." at whatever is offered. One player told me he wasn't interested in anything I put forward (7 systems, about 20 settings.)
I'm a middle aged guy with a lot of free time, looking for similar, to form a group for regular gaming. You should be chill, non-woke, and have time on your hands.

See below:

https://www.therpgsite.com/news-and-adverts/looking-to-form-a-group-of-people-with-lots-of-spare-time-for-regular-games/

Spinachcat

Perhaps that's the problem. These people with too much free time feel they can be picky to the Nth degree whereas the guy who can only VTT on Tuesdays between 2pm and 6pm is going to be thrilled playing whatever somebody will GM.

Omega

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 03, 2023, 09:44:03 PM
As fellow old warhorses, are you guys this fossilized in your gaming foibles? Are there entire genres you won't play? Do you only ever run the same game system exclusively? This is all very weird, and wrong, and weirdy-wrong to me.

I have some systems I like. BX AD&D 2e 5e D&D. Gamma World, Star Frontiers. Beyond the Supernatural, After the Bomb, Albedo, Torg, Shadowrun, Marvel Superherous, and a few others.

And I have systems I do not like, Like gurps. 3e/PF and 4e D&D. and a few others.

And a few systems I'd like to try like TFT, T&T, CP2020 and quite a few others.

And a few I am on the fence about. Like 2e, Rifts, and quite a few others.

When you go looking for players always make it really clear what your intent is. What system/s are likely how when where and why.
Then expect at least 90% to not read some part and thus be incompatible.

I have been really fortunate in that the players locally have been open to playing about anything I run and same for my online players.
My original gaming group was pretty eclectic. We played Torg, Robotech. Beyond the Supernatural, TMNT/After the Bomb, MSH. Mainly as I was into Palladium stuff at the time and Torg because a friend brought it in and wanted me to GM it

Grognard GM

Well, while only 4 of them are active and flexible so far, I do have 12 members on my private server now. So I'd call that...moderately successful? Mildly successful with room for great success?

And although they're not as proactive and flexible as I'd hoped, none of them are there for 5E, and none should melt at room temperature.

I'm a middle aged guy with a lot of free time, looking for similar, to form a group for regular gaming. You should be chill, non-woke, and have time on your hands.

See below:

https://www.therpgsite.com/news-and-adverts/looking-to-form-a-group-of-people-with-lots-of-spare-time-for-regular-games/

I

Quote from: Steven Mitchell on February 04, 2023, 12:21:04 AM

Working on my own system has cut this down even more, because now I've only got time for the top 2 things instead of top 3, and I honestly would rather work on that system than make priority 3 happen.  Out of the 20 odd players that I get to sometimes come to my 2 groups right now, they feel even more strongly about it.  They are fine playing a different system for a moderately long campaign (e.g. 18-24 months), but they do not want to change systems very often.  I'm the only one of all those people that even care about learning new systems.


You get twenty-odd players to come to your groups?  Online or in person?  If the answer is "in person," let us know the name of this gaming Mecca so that I may sell all of my worldly possessions (save my dice) and move thereto.

Grognard GM

Quote from: I on February 05, 2023, 05:45:51 PM
Quote from: Steven Mitchell on February 04, 2023, 12:21:04 AM

Working on my own system has cut this down even more, because now I've only got time for the top 2 things instead of top 3, and I honestly would rather work on that system than make priority 3 happen.  Out of the 20 odd players that I get to sometimes come to my 2 groups right now, they feel even more strongly about it.  They are fine playing a different system for a moderately long campaign (e.g. 18-24 months), but they do not want to change systems very often.  I'm the only one of all those people that even care about learning new systems.

You get twenty-odd players to come to your groups?  Online or in person?  If the answer is "in person," let us know the name of this gaming Mecca so that I may sell all of my worldly possessions (save my dice) and move thereto.

If he's running 5E or PF, he could be in any medium to large U.S. city.
I'm a middle aged guy with a lot of free time, looking for similar, to form a group for regular gaming. You should be chill, non-woke, and have time on your hands.

See below:

https://www.therpgsite.com/news-and-adverts/looking-to-form-a-group-of-people-with-lots-of-spare-time-for-regular-games/

Steven Mitchell

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 05, 2023, 06:09:26 PM
Quote from: I on February 05, 2023, 05:45:51 PM
Quote from: Steven Mitchell on February 04, 2023, 12:21:04 AM

Working on my own system has cut this down even more, because now I've only got time for the top 2 things instead of top 3, and I honestly would rather work on that system than make priority 3 happen.  Out of the 20 odd players that I get to sometimes come to my 2 groups right now, they feel even more strongly about it.  They are fine playing a different system for a moderately long campaign (e.g. 18-24 months), but they do not want to change systems very often.  I'm the only one of all those people that even care about learning new systems.

You get twenty-odd players to come to your groups?  Online or in person?  If the answer is "in person," let us know the name of this gaming Mecca so that I may sell all of my worldly possessions (save my dice) and move thereto.

If he's running 5E or PF, he could be in any medium to large U.S. city.

I did run some 5E during the last big round of recruitment, but all I'm running now is my own system, and it is all I've run for the last 18+ months.  It's all in person right now, though we did have a small group running online during the lockdown.  None of us really cared for it, but it happened to coincide with several of the regulars having to work on our usual game days, and short online sessions was all we could do there for awhile because of that.

Now, we never get 20+ at any one time.  A lot of them have conflicts from time to time, and so what we usually have is 5-9 showing up for a game session, but who shows rotates among that player base.  And we only play every 5 to 6 weeks in each group.  Not quite the gaming Mecca it sounds like. :D  OTOH, they are all friends, none of them cause any trouble, and frequently they recruit friends and family members, which keeps the circle expanding.  Plus, I've got a line on another pool of players, which I expect to add another 5 to 10 to the pool over the next year.

Basically, I never stop recruiting... to the point that I'll run a game for 10-12 people (or even 15 in a pinch) to keep the pool intact.  Some of the Core players have been in the pool for 35 years and counting.  During that time, I would estimate that we've run some version of D&D around 20 of those years. 

Opaopajr

 :) What you are presenting, with winnowing personality gates followed by a very open date, time, and system stare-and-shrug, was taught to me in sales as a passive hard sell tactic. You are applying awkward social pressure by passively not making the direct ask. And this after building value as an elite experience. It's like getting rarefied gasses and then putting it into a volume magnitudes larger; it dissipates.

You are attempting to do one of the hardest tricks in sales.  8) I would stop and leave that to pros.

My advice is follow through with your rarefied personality cut-offs and go for what Spinachcat gave example: the direct ask. Now typically a direct ask with two options helps people select, e.g. "I am open best at 6pm-11pms GMT and 9pm-2am GMT, which do you prefer?" And then work that on down to a tighter pitch like "Tues & Thurs, 6pm-11pm GMT, Supers using ICONS system." Expect to ask around 5 times before people commit.

Sales is a lot of applied individual & group psychology, which actually does change from culture to culture (and times and sub-cultures). There are fruitful lessons there to get over social awkwardness and diffused energies. Just some sales advice I picked up on life's 'journey'.  ;) Hope it helps!
Just make your fuckin\' guy and roll the dice, you pricks. Focus on what\'s interesting, not what gives you the biggest randomly generated virtual penis.  -- J Arcane
 
You know, people keep comparing non-TSR D&D to deck-building in Magic: the Gathering. But maybe it\'s more like Katamari Damacy. You keep sticking shit on your characters until they are big enough to be a star.
-- talysman

rytrasmi

Hey, man, I'm glad you got a group going and hope it works out.

You seem pretty intent on doing it the hard way. Opaopajr's comments are spot on. You're doing the personal stuff first and having the game follow. I've never seen it done that way. Normally the game leads and, if people get along, more games and friendship follows.

This is probably why you're having difficulty. But hey, if you get it to launch, great.

And I woulnd't even bother with a VTT at the start, if I were you. That just increases the difficulty, delays the first session, and is yet another thing for players to disagree with.
The worms crawl in and the worms crawl out
The ones that crawl in are lean and thin
The ones that crawl out are fat and stout
Your eyes fall in and your teeth fall out
Your brains come tumbling down your snout
Be merry my friends
Be merry

zircher

Heh, I literally hit all of the OP's check boxes, except that I have totally given up on playing with groups because I also have one more check box...

[X] Jealous spouse that will actively sabotage any face-to-face or online group that I'm in.

Remember boys and girls, don't be like Uncle Todd, marry a gamer or at least someone that has a freaking hobby.   :D



You can find my solo Tarot based rules for Amber on my home page.
http://www.tangent-zero.com

Grognard GM

Quote from: zircher on February 06, 2023, 10:40:21 PM
Heh, I literally hit all of the OP's check boxes, except that I have totally given up on playing with groups because I also have one more check box...

[X] Jealous spouse that will actively sabotage any face-to-face or online group that I'm in.

Remember boys and girls, don't be like Uncle Todd, marry a gamer or at least someone that has a freaking hobby.   :D




I thought I'd hit the jackpot, marrying a gamer. She was a videogame and boardgame player rather than rpgs, but close enough, and she'd play RPG's to spend time with me. Sadly that ended with medical circumstances, but at least she respects my need to game :)
I'm a middle aged guy with a lot of free time, looking for similar, to form a group for regular gaming. You should be chill, non-woke, and have time on your hands.

See below:

https://www.therpgsite.com/news-and-adverts/looking-to-form-a-group-of-people-with-lots-of-spare-time-for-regular-games/

Grognard GM

So I ran my session 1, and it was a smash success. People always really enjoy my games, it's just getting them to try that first dime bag of sweet, sweet GM'ing.

I'm a middle aged guy with a lot of free time, looking for similar, to form a group for regular gaming. You should be chill, non-woke, and have time on your hands.

See below:

https://www.therpgsite.com/news-and-adverts/looking-to-form-a-group-of-people-with-lots-of-spare-time-for-regular-games/

Venka

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 06, 2023, 11:20:50 PM
So I ran my session 1, and it was a smash success.

I'm glad this worked out for you.  Your approach described in the first post seemed so confrontational, but I couldn't really advise against it because honestly, that may be what's necessary to avoid interpersonal drama- you seemed to put a high priority on not dealing with highly incompatible people, so of course your initial filter would be harsh.

Grognard GM

Quote from: VenkaI'm glad this worked out for you.  Your approach described in the first post seemed so confrontational, but I couldn't really advise against it because honestly, that may be what's necessary to avoid interpersonal drama- you seemed to put a high priority on not dealing with highly incompatible people, so of course your initial filter would be harsh.

That's it exactly, better to pan a hundred streams in Winter to find those gold nuggets; than sign up for a company mine. The few players I have are all solid players, and it was worth the up-front hassle.

I actually had one of the players come to me after the first session, and say to me that he's really impressed at the quality of the players I've gathered. That was very gratifying, and I agree with him.

We were all doing accents, and having fun, and you could tell that the level of interplay was inspiring everyone to up their game. I'm quite pleased.

Now I just need to do it all over again in 2 days, with a different game system  :o
I'm certainly going to need some time just playing after a a month or two of running two different games a week  ;D
I'm a middle aged guy with a lot of free time, looking for similar, to form a group for regular gaming. You should be chill, non-woke, and have time on your hands.

See below:

https://www.therpgsite.com/news-and-adverts/looking-to-form-a-group-of-people-with-lots-of-spare-time-for-regular-games/

I

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 05, 2023, 06:09:26 PM
Quote from: I on February 05, 2023, 05:45:51 PM
Quote from: Steven Mitchell on February 04, 2023, 12:21:04 AM

Working on my own system has cut this down even more, because now I've only got time for the top 2 things instead of top 3, and I honestly would rather work on that system than make priority 3 happen.  Out of the 20 odd players that I get to sometimes come to my 2 groups right now, they feel even more strongly about it.  They are fine playing a different system for a moderately long campaign (e.g. 18-24 months), but they do not want to change systems very often.  I'm the only one of all those people that even care about learning new systems.

You get twenty-odd players to come to your groups?  Online or in person?  If the answer is "in person," let us know the name of this gaming Mecca so that I may sell all of my worldly possessions (save my dice) and move thereto.

If he's running 5E or PF, he could be in any medium to large U.S. city.

You're undoubtedly right.  But I'd rather spend an entire evening with my face buried in Claude Akins' asscrack than play either one of those games.