Alternate Sorcery System (inspired by Promised Sands)

[RTrimmer]

Were I gming with Sorcery set to this level of power I'd feel honor bound to tell the players that those 15 points for Sorcery were by far the biggest bargain in the game.

Unless you can do more than twice as much with basic Shapeshifting. 1 1/3 more with Conjuration. Etc. And Attributes.

Power level jacked up to 11, no 111, can be fun.

[jibbajibba]

Were I gming with Sorcery set to this level of power I'd feel honor bound to tell the players that those 15 points for Sorcery were by far the biggest bargain in the game.

Unless you can do more than twice as much with basic Shapeshifting. 1 1/3 more with Conjuration. Etc. And Attributes.

Power level jacked up to 11, no 111, can be fun.

Agreed. I use power trees so the Magicks tree looks more like

5 Magical aptitude
   2 - Per Power Word
    5 per advanced Power Word - requires 10 basic Power Words
5- Basic Sorcery - allows construction of basic spells (2 microspells maximum)    5 - Advanced Spell construction - mixing more that 2 microspells
   10 - Powering Sorcery with Advanced Powers
5 - Hang Spells
5 - Use of LynchPins
5 - Basic Conjuration

etc etc

so a really skilled sorcery (who can do what costs 15 in the basic game) ends up spending 25 points which seems reasonable.

The other option which is limiting sorcery doesn't seems to map to the way the books work.

[fezzster]

So, here's a question for you experienced Amber GM's.  I really feel like I have a good grasp of this game, and you've all helped me a lot with sorcery.  What still irks me is the "magic of shadow" part of casting.  It makes sense, I get why it matters, but I wonder what it looks like.  

Are there several different categories of 'magic of shadow' and each shadow falls into one category?  So a trained sorceror will know how to sense which type of magic is present, and s/he will just have to name it?

My tentative interpretation is that magic energy is made up of a finite number of elements, and the magic of any given shadow is made up of a specific set of these elements in a specific arrangement.  Something like that?

I am curious as to what this looks like in role-play.  It would be cool if it was more than, "I cast the lightning bolt I have memorized.  For my 2 lynchpins, I direct it toward the evil titan, and ... magic of this shadow."

[jibbajibba]

So, here's a question for you experienced Amber GM's.  I really feel like I have a good grasp of this game, and you've all helped me a lot with sorcery.  What still irks me is the "magic of shadow" part of casting.  It makes sense, I get why it matters, but I wonder what it looks like.  

Are there several different categories of 'magic of shadow' and each shadow falls into one category?  So a trained sorceror will know how to sense which type of magic is present, and s/he will just have to name it?

My tentative interpretation is that magic energy is made up of a finite number of elements, and the magic of any given shadow is made up of a specific set of these elements in a specific arrangement.  Something like that?

I am curious as to what this looks like in role-play.  It would be cool if it was more than, "I cast the lightning bolt I have memorized.  For my 2 lynchpins, I direct it toward the evil titan, and ... magic of this shadow."

Magic of Shadow is a bit metagamey as it effectively limits sorcerers just having racked spells always good to go.

The idea is that the magical conditions of any shadow are different and that the skilled Sorceror just gets this and so can adapt their spells to work with the locality.
You might forward the argument that it requires pattern or Logrus or some research to identify the power of shadow.

I use an alternate rule sometimes. I give every Shadow a magic rating from 0-1 this then acts as a multiplier on the power of spells cast. So generally a Strength spell might manipulate shadow reality to give you A temporary Strength boost equal to your Psyche on a world with Magic Index 0.5 this would be only half your psyche.
I do this for 2 reasons. 1 to limit Sorcery which as is stated upthread is very tough for the base cost. 2 to make shadow power sources more important. The Font of the 4 worlds is a major power source but in a sorcery system where power source is not important it has no effect.  So I rate Power sources like the Font on the same Shadow Magic Index and I allow wizards to use open Shadow path to link their magic back to power sources , similar to how the spikard seems to work.
So you might be on a shadow with only 0.5 MI so magic would be half as effective but if you link back to your power source they run at full or even above full. You can also buy shadow power sources with MI 1.0 for 8 points (double Primal shadow) although they will attract other power crazed denizens of shadows and act like a Shadow magnet.

So in short its just the background Magic radiation level but you can tweak it for your own reasons and use it to explain why some shadows are mundane and some magical.

[fezzster]

Magic of Shadow is a bit metagamey as it effectively limits sorcerers just having racked spells always good to go.

The idea is that the magical conditions of any shadow are different and that the skilled Sorceror just gets this and so can adapt their spells to work with the locality.
You might forward the argument that it requires pattern or Logrus or some research to identify the power of shadow.

I use an alternate rule sometimes. I give every Shadow a magic rating from 0-1 this then acts as a multiplier on the power of spells cast. So generally a Strength spell might manipulate shadow reality to give you A temporary Strength boost equal to your Psyche on a world with Magic Index 0.5 this would be only half your psyche.
I do this for 2 reasons. 1 to limit Sorcery which as is stated upthread is very tough for the base cost. 2 to make shadow power sources more important. The Font of the 4 worlds is a major power source but in a sorcery system where power source is not important it has no effect.  So I rate Power sources like the Font on the same Shadow Magic Index and I allow wizards to use open Shadow path to link their magic back to power sources , similar to how the spikard seems to work.
So you might be on a shadow with only 0.5 MI so magic would be half as effective but if you link back to your power source they run at full or even above full. You can also buy shadow power sources with MI 1.0 for 8 points (double Primal shadow) although they will attract other power crazed denizens of shadows and act like a Shadow magnet.

So in short its just the background Magic radiation level but you can tweak it for your own reasons and use it to explain why some shadows are mundane and some magical.

That's cool, I am fine with that metagamey aspect.  I have never been in any RPG game where the GM actually made the player come up with the actual incantations.  Though, I have known of a few such games.

I like MI 0-1 concept.  I was thinking of doing a similar thing wherein different shadows have different relative strengths of different types of magic present (either different elements or schools).  It may be cool, if not too much work, to combine these ideas.  So, perhaps X shadow's magical properties are or

I love the idea of an 8 point magic source shadow, and especially the magnetic aspect of such a thing.

It would also make sense that there were many ley lines extending throughout shadow, each bringing its own brand/concoction of magical energies.

My game resumes in a week.  I have lots of work to do!!

[Croaker]

Interesting.

I did a similar, yet different, thingie.

In short, and IIRC, creating a spell was more or less taxing on your endurance, and if you wanted it to last long, you needed to give it more energy, although this was a finite quantity: Sooner or later, a spell will expire.

Energy could came from your psyche and endurance, but this was quite limiting, so a sorcerer needed access to a Power Source in order to create the more powerful spells.
Linking a spell to a steady power source could also make it effectively constant, provided the source gave enough "juice" and the connection wasn't broken.

I also had the ability to fashion raw magical energy into crude forms (shields, blasts), like Mask did in the keep of the 4 worlds. This was very ineffective, so only useful in highly magical shadows or with a direct link to enough raw magical energy (like merlin did with the spikards when fighting Mandor)

[jibbajibba]

Interesting.

I did a similar, yet different, thingie.

In short, and IIRC, creating a spell was more or less taxing on your endurance, and if you wanted it to last long, you needed to give it more energy, although this was a finite quantity: Sooner or later, a spell will expire.

Energy could came from your psyche and endurance, but this was quite limiting, so a sorcerer needed access to a Power Source in order to create the more powerful spells.
Linking a spell to a steady power source could also make it effectively constant, provided the source gave enough "juice" and the connection wasn't broken.

I also had the ability to fashion raw magical energy into crude forms (shields, blasts), like Mask did in the keep of the 4 worlds. This was very ineffective, so only useful in highly magical shadows or with a direct link to enough raw magical energy (like merlin did with the spikards when fighting Mandor)

I use the later as well and allow advanced practioners of logruss or pattern to use those to power their spells, although  that comes with itsd own risks.

[RPGPundit]

I'll note that I've since discarded this concept of sorcery; I went a totally different route in Lords of Olympus.

However, if you were to use this, I would note that to create a troll out of nothing you'd need Conjuration. You might be able to use this Sorcery to bring a troll to you who you already had, but even then it might be easier to use Logrus.

RPGPundit