Um, wow.

I'm like David R - I've never played with a gamer who's been that disgusting.  Maybe it's the town I live in, or maybe it's the fact that I generally only game with people I know from elsewhere, but I can't imagine I'd stay in a situation like that.

My own home is kept fairly clean, as I would be embarrassed to have my friends dealing with my messiness.  Also, my fiancee would beat me on the head if the place got too messy.

Yeah, I just don't get it.  I wouldn't believe people like this existed were it not for conventions.

-O

I don't know why people put up with this stuff, but hey.  I only see two real options here:

• You can't take going to his house.  So don't go there.  You can't stand listening to his personal issues, so tell him not to bring them up.
• You don't mind.  You've put up with it till now, so just keep putting up with it.

That's it.  That's all it boils down to.

Now me, I'd just take option #1 because that seems the sane thing to do.  I don't like having to spray myself down with poison unless I absolutely have to.

Frankly this thread is just you trying to either get people to work you up enough to where you have the courage to do #1, give you some sort of "easy way out" that simply doesn't exist (ala the weasely "I'm allergic" idea), or run through enough options you don't intend to follow through with anyway until you wind up at #2 but you just had to whine about it to feel like you tried something.

I'm not trying to be mean about that, either.  I've been here before in a way, though thankfully it didn't involve filth and horror.  I'm just pointing it out.

Good luck.

Quote from: C.W.RichesonThis is something that close friends do, but it is odd to hear it in a group setting.  I'd probably try to shift the conversation back to gaming as quickly as I reasonably could.

Unfortunately, some people equate "I game with you" to "I'm your close, personal friend".  They somehow miss the whole "acquaintance" thing.

Of course, it's not necessarily that.  Some people just have truly terrible senses of boundries in general (they'd talk like that to strangers).

At least that's only obnoxious.  The whole filthy-pit-of-hell thing going on is not only disgusting, but adverse to one's health.  Not only would I not game there, I would not have any interaction at all with a person who lived like that.

I'm always amazed how anyone can live like that.  My family was pretty poor, but we still always had a clean house, clean clothes, etc.

You're under no obligation to suffer in order to spare his feelings.  You can always say, "I'm sorry, we've decided we don't want to meet at your house."  If he asks why, just tell him.  You've already put up with it, and made some fairly obvious comments.  You've done the polite thing...don't make yourself miserable because he has problems.

I think it's time for me to tell the ferret story. A friend of mine moved into a sharehouse with some people I didn't know and hadn't met. A couple of us went to his house for a bit of game one day.

The house reeked, but the kitchen was bearable. As I sat there I heard a little stumping noise and a ferret poked its head round the door. "Oh, they just run around the house," said my friend. Riiiiiight....

A couple of months later my friend decided to move out, after having to erect barriers to keep the ferrets from chewing his stuff. I went over to help him move, and the house seemed worse than before. I soon found out why. As we moved furniture in the living room, we kept on coming across little drifts of splintered chicken bones and takeaway chicken boxes.

"Oh, the guys give them their left-over takeaway," said my friend.

We also found little piles of ferret shit behind and under every piece of furniture. Has anybody smelt ferret shit? It was borne in on me that ferrets, unlike rats, are carnivorous, and that meat makes the most pungent shit.

I have a very strong stomach, but I think even I did a bit of dry-retching that day.

ciado, I think you've put up with enough.  If you're not sure, I suggest you try a trick that works pretty well for me: ask yourself what advice you'd give one of us if you'd just read this message from one of us on the board.  I think you'd likely tell us to, ahem, bug out of there!  :deflated:

Quote from: ciadoI'm not all that desperate to game, SO and I have another 2x/month group, but I feel like a bad person if I dissemble or get mean/blunt.

For some reason this reminded me - is there anyone in his group who you'd say is the guy's friend? Or who introduced you all? You could always lay it on them!

In my own group, we have a guy who is prone to being smelly - like bad feet, but all over. It happened about half the sessions, and also I wasn't sure how to approach the issue - he's a fairly quiet and non-confrontational guy. If he were a pushy loud sort, then I'd just say, "mate, you stink! Clean up!" But he's fairly mild-mannered, so I didn't know what to say. Then I remembered that another guy in the group is the one who actually brought him into it, and is his friend outside the group. Woohoo! An excuse to foist the job off onto someone else!

"Mate, you're his friend, it'd be better coming from you. You can put it politely in private, instead of us having an intervention in the group and embarassing everyone."
"Yes, you're right. I'll talk to him."
"Besides, you brought him into the group, so it's your responsibility."
"Fair enough!"
"So you have until next session. If next session he's still stinky, well you know how every gamer makes a character firing twin Desert Eagles? I'll come out with twin deodorants, blazing away from the hip."

I don't know what he said to the guy, but the next session the guy showed up showered, shaved, haircut, a nice pressed collared shirt, and quite neutral smelling. Excellent!

So, is there someone else you can foist the job onto?

Aside from that, try to remember that there's a difference between "aggressive" and "assertive". Just because you're saying what you have to say, doesn't mean you're being nasty. Like my suggestion,

"We feel that it's easier to concentrate on the game if the venue has calm and quiet animals, and is clean and neat. Also, we're very touched that you trust us so much as to share such intimate things with us, but during game sessions we'd like to focus on game talk, we can talk about personal stuff outside the sessions."

That's assertive, it gets the message across, but is not rude or nasty. If he takes it as rude and nasty, just refuse to engage in the argument. Bring it up when you're not at his place, and the group's already doing something else - not on his "home ground" he'll be less inclined to scream and shout in indignation that you're telling him what a stinker he is.

You may think it rude to tell him to clean himself up, but I would say it's more rude to simply walk away from him without explanation - which, if you don't say anything, is what you'll end up doing.

Quote from: C.W.RichesonI've actually met a lot of people like this.  So many that I tend to assume gamers are like this now.
I've started threads on this very topic on other sites, such as RPG.net, specifically because of the frequency I've encountered it in my gaming life.  By and away most people online seem to consider cleanliness very important, at least of the "Vacuum and dust once a week, clean the toilet" level.  Sadly, this has never conformed with my experiences - most people seem to tolerate or actively embrace disgusting living environments.

Okay, I find this very disturbing, esp the second sentence.

Regards,
David R

Quote from: David ROkay, I find this very disturbing, esp the second sentence.

I have more horror stories regarding gaming than anyone I've ever met  From urinating on my carpet to father/daughter fondling under the table to horrific homes (condemnable), lighters being held to ceilings because "this kind of wood doesn't burn", fires in my home, stalking, queen bees, couch shitting, theft "because that guy that hosted us was a dick", theft "because he can afford it", theft "why not?", etc.

This doesn't touch ordinary stuff like not cleaning oneself or washing clothing.  This is also off the top of my head

I know it's not a pissing contest or anything, but I swear I've had the worst luck with meeting folk.  It's probably because for many years I haven't had friends that gamed and I've had to rely on random meetings and friends of friends...

Which is why I can identify with the OP so well.  I have, literally, been in that exact same situation with multiple other people.

P.S.: Oh yeah.  The time the host was bored with the D&D game and turned on hard core bestiality for us to watch.  How can I forget that?  If you have a random group of folk over to play D&D and find the game slow why not show some donkey/human sex to spice things up?

See, now I definitely know that faster-than-light travel exists, because CWR is obviously posting from another planet. Planet Hardcore Donkey-Love, in the Freakazoid System. :eek:  Come back to Earth, CWR!

Quote from: C.W.RichesonFrom urinating on my carpet to father/daughter fondling under the table to....

....  the host was bored with the D&D game and turned on hard core bestiality for us to watch.

Holy shit. I mean the worst experience I ever had was when during the drive home a friend turned to me and said - "Did you notice the wine wasn't served at room temperature ?"

You my friend have had some truly horrible experiences...

Regards,
David R

Quote from: JimBobOzSee, now I definitely know that faster-than-light travel exists, because CWR is obviously posting from another planet. Planet Hardcore Donkey-Love, in the Freakazoid System. :eek:  Come back to Earth, CWR!

I really want to

Moving again at the end of the year.  I really envy folk who have groups of friends that play for years and years.

Quote from: David RHoly shit. I mean the worst experience I ever had was when during the drive home a friend turned to me and said - "Did you notice the wine wasn't served at room temperature ?"

That actually provoked laughter, which is rare when reading a board.  Thanks

QuoteYou my friend have had some truly horrible experiences...

Yeah

Quote from: C.W.RichesonI really want to

Moving again at the end of the year.  I really envy folk who have groups of friends that play for years and years.

Pfft. My game groups last a year, on average. Then someone moves house or changes jobs or gets married or breaks up or decides they hate someone in the group or they discover rpg theory or something else like that, and the group dissolves.

Usually there's overlap in the groups, so that if I'm gaming with Anna, Bob, Charlie and Dave, perhaps Anna and Bob marry and run off to make choo-cooky-bubba-no-you-shmoopy noises at each-other, while Charlie has a fight with Dave over whose turn it was to buy pizza then misses a few sessions and loses the habit of showing up and one day just stops replying to our emails and phone calls, leaving me with Dave.

So me and Dave watch dvds and talk shit for two weeks then Dave mentions at work he knows this IT consultant person Erika who used to game until someone in her group raped her character, but because she's stubborn she'd like to try it again, and then I remember Frank who I met once at a con and he bought me a pie when I had spent all my money on some old second-hand rpgs I didn't need, and Frank also knows Georgina well actually he's married to her, and she used to game, and they're all happy to give it a go, we meet at the pub to see if we like each-other and we do, so now I have Dave, Erika, Frank and Georgina. We game together for about ten months and then Dave gets this new job where he has to work every evening, and...

And so it goes.

There are heaps of gamers out there, and very few of them are stinky or freaks. And those who are stinky are usually a bit boring as gamers anyway. You don't get tactical genius hacking or elegant thespianism from Randy Donkey-Lover with the roaches. So, you know, not much of a loss.

It is a testament to just how disturbing this thread is that I found the Hardcore Donkey-Love to be one of the less-creepy elements. :raise:   I have the same confrontational issues you do Ciado, I have confrontations regularly at work so I don't want to have to deal with them at home or at a game when I'm supposed to be having fun.

I think you have gotten some good advice here so I'll only add this.  I think JimBob had the right idea but in this case it seems like both this guy and his wife are just too lazy to go to the trouble of cleaning up the filth and I doubt that will change even if you do say something.  After all, they already know they are living in filth and don't have a problem with it.  I've been in houses with fleas and it is a major undertaking to get rid of them.  Sooner or later you are going to carry some home with you and then you will be infested too.  That being the case, I hate to say it but the game just isn't worth it.  Even if you game at your house this guy is going to bring some fleas along sometime and you will end up with them anyway.  It is a noble effort trying not to hurt his feelings but if he cared what others think he would clean up the house like any civilized person.  Cut your losses and move on.

Good luck.

That must be some absolutely transcendant gaming. Like, some mind expanding, trippy, last-twenty-minutes-of 2001: A Space Odyssey type of shit. I can't imagine how on Earth that that's superior to not gaming at all.

I mean, chilled wine!? Next, you'll tell us it came out of a box.