Quote from: Spinachcat;711345I am surprised about the love for Promethean. The book didn't grab me at all, but I keep hearing that people seem to love it in actual play.

Promethean reminds with a lot of Wraith, despite dealing with different supernatural types. Well executed and very evocative, but quite an odd concept from a gaming perspective.

Quote from: Skywalker;711338Very true. They are brought in line with each other.

Then again, none of the nWoD lines play particularly nicely with others anyway

Better than the oWoD lines, though, if only because of the more standardized template interaction. By the way, an upcoming HtV supplement called Mortal Remains will cover in greater detail the creatures featured in the remaining lines, with each one getting its own chapter: Promethean, Changeling, Geist, Mummy, and Demon.

Quote from: The Yann Waters;711354Better than the oWoD lines, though, if only because of the more standardized template interaction. By the way, an upcoming HtV supplement called Mortal Remains will cover in greater detail the creatures featured in the remaining lines, with each one getting its own chapter: Promethean, Changeling, Geist, Mummy, and Demon.

Yeah. I doubt they will have rules for playable versions of those at a page count of 200, but the book will be awesome.

Quote from: Géza Echs;711320I loved reading all the gonzo zaniness... But I enjoyed playing in the smaller-scope games.

Didn't we all?

I had fun with a few gonzo games, though. Not the modules, most of which were shitty railroads. But you haven't lived if you haven't played an over-the-top True Black Hand Elders game complete with half the group being TBH and the other half beholden to other factions and a lot of subdued PvP until something really, really bad comes along and everyone has to get their shit together. Good times.

Quote from: Géza Echs;711320Huh. I hated the oWoD version of Hunter but really enjoyed Changeling. The Big Three are what I was tempted to look at first, since they're what I followed fairly extensively in the oWoD era (though, to be honest, I only dipped my toe into Werewolf. It never gelled for me, somehow).

One of my homies was a huge Dreaming fan and even he recognizes that Lost is a better (or at least, easier) game. Generally speaking, Lost is far more horrific and urgent than Dreaming.

Quote from: Géza Echs;711320Huh. As I just mentioned, the 'mortals' aspect is something I'm intrigued by (though I'm a bit gun-shy now that you've said it blends into the new version of Hunter). What's Block by Bloody Block? A spin-off from Slasher (which did look cool to my eyes)?

Block By Bloody Block is a generic, modular, sandboxy city sourcebook (which should be easy enough to graft, with minimal modification, on any city you're using for your game) for Hunter: The Vigil. Each chapter describes a city district (e.g. housing projects, university campus, affluent suburb, etc.) and at least one supernatural threat for each district (e.g. the werewolf pack that runs the slums but also keeps spirits in check; the demon-possessed janitor in the university and the professor he keeps in thrall; the slasher who leads a cult in the upper-middle-class suburb, and this was a few years before this crappy series with Kevin Bacon and James Purefoy).

Quote from: Géza Echs;711320Are any of the... what're they called, covenant? Let's call them covenants. Are any of the covenant books worthwhile? Fuck it, are any of the clan books worthwhile?

Ummm, not sure. The Covenant Books are nice but none of them stands out to me as a must-have. Except maybe VII, which takes the super-mysterious not-Sabbat of V:tR and gives you not one, not two, but three different possibilities of what to do with them. Belial's Brood is also nice if you want vampire Satanists in your game (and who doesn't?).

As for the Clanbooks, they're mostly fluff. Decent fluff, a few good ideas, but not nearly as interesting and game-relevant as the V:tM Clanbooks.

Quote from: Géza Echs;711320Cool. What's the Night Horrors series?

A series of books (one for each line, except V:tR which got two) detailing individual NPC antagonists with unique backstories and abilities.

Quote from: Géza Echs;711320Should I even bother with reading the core book first? Or dive right in with Tome of the Mysteries and refer to the core book as needed?

TotM does a good job of clearing up the confusing stuff from the core rulebook. But you have to read the core book and get confused in the first place.

Quote from: Géza Echs;711320That raises a good point - you seem to be suggesting books on the basis of their utility for gaming (and pure entertainment value as well, of course). Are there any books you'd recommend on the basis of reading pleasure alone? Since I likely won't be able to game any time soon, I'm tempted to prioritize on the basis of what's simply fun to read.

And, as I've said, if there's anything you can recommend me away from, I'd appreciate it. I'd prefer not to waste time!

Ummm, never looked at it this way. Nothing as trepidating as the oWoD, I'm afraid. I did enjoy reading M:tA and C:tL books because they do a very good job of conveying wonder and horror; I'd recommend Intruders, Astral Realms and Summoners, and maybe Seers of the Throne and Imperial Mysteries too, for Mage; and everything, but especially the first sourcebook (Winter Masques? The one with all the antagonists) and Night Horrors: Grim Fears for Changeling. War Against The Pure was a fun read too.

On a side note, I'm happy that we're haviung a nWoD thread. They're all to rare here, and even on TBP and G+ for that matter.

I'm even happier to see the Changeling and Hunter love. These are my favorite lines, really, even though I'm a sucker for the Big Three.

Quote from: Skywalker;711327The mortal line and HtV are superb. HtV has a supplement for each monster type (Vampire, Mages, Werewolves (and spirits)) with a shorthand system for all three which is superior in some ways to the full system As such, with HtV alone, you can do all of the three main lines as well in a much simpler yet darker light.

Yes! Also, H:tV plus the relevant monster book (e.g. Witch Hunters for M:tAw) makes for a great antagonists book. When I finally sit down to run M:tAw I am so using the Knights of Saint George.

Quote from: Spinachcat;711345I did not like the nWoD Werewolf compared to the original. There was something raw and vital that I feel got neutered, but I never went beyond the core book for nWoD's Werewolf.

But I really enjoyed the nWoD Mage incredibly more than the original. It was really impressive in actual play, but our campaign only lasted about a year and I didn't follow the line too much afterwards.

I am surprised about the love for Promethean. The book didn't grab me at all, but I keep hearing that people seem to love it in actual play.

I think doing away with the cosmic conflict might lend the impression that the apocalyptic urgency is gone and substituted by a lingering, fatalistic malaise. Still, I like the renewed focus on terriotorial conflict, patrolling your turf, and protecting common people from supernatural horrors even when your own life sucks and it's probably going to be nasty, brutal and pretty damn short. Also, if you need a world-threatening scenario, Night Horrors: Wolfsbane has you covered with the Idigam.

As for Mage, well, the solipsistic "magick" world-view was pretty awesome and mind-blowing when I was 16, and I still think Ascension is a kick-ass game, but I find Awakening a subtler take on many of the same themes (though hubris takes front and center, the freedom vs. control thing is there too. Hell, I've even read a campaign log in which PCs travelled to an alternate reality in which the Nameless War went differently, with the Free Council and the Seers merging to form something very much like the Technocracy).

I started reading the new Vampire today, but I might have to start off with something else. The tone of it is just a bit too much for me - especially the repeated focus on Danse Macabre (which is a cool idea but a very, very over the top term). Plus, I'm so used to the old VtM that it's giving me a cognitive dissonance headache.

That being said, I do like that they've moved away from the Gothic punk idea and into a world that feels... Darker, somehow. There's an air of desperation to the setting that I like.

Quote from: The Butcher;711414I did enjoy reading M:tA and C:tL books because they do a very good job of conveying wonder and horror; I'd recommend Intruders, Astral Realms and Summoners, and maybe Seers of the Throne and Imperial Mysteries too, for Mage; and everything, but especially the first sourcebook (Winter Masques? The one with all the antagonists) and Night Horrors: Grim Fears for Changeling.

The first supplement for Changeling, that antagonist book, was Autumn Nightmares which features the more detailed rules for fetches, hobgoblins, and True Fae, along with dozens of NPCs (including changelings, mortals, and one vampire). The initial four supplements actually follow the seasons, so it was followed by Winter Masques (about the seemings and kiths, as well as internationality and multiculturalism among the fae), Rites of Spring (which expands on the various supernatural powers of the changelings, as well as pertinent concepts like Clarity, Glamour, and cold iron), and Lords of Summer (a "splat book" with information about the Seasonal Courts and the largest selection of entitlements in the line, but also a chapter on freeholds in general).

RoS is the one I'd usually recommend for a first supplement because its mechanics and clarifications make quite a difference in playing the game, but that might not be the best choice for reading.

Quote from: Silverlion;711296From what I understand the Promethean the Created is a very good book. I rather liked the Core book, but didn't care for any of the settings/monster divisions  that I read (Werewolf, Vampire), but people have repeatedly recommended Promethean. I've also heard good things of the Changeling book.

I have Promethean. It is the one system that seems to have an end game in mind that makes you sympathetic to prometheans as cursed monsters.

I haven't run it yet. Id probably tone done the "wasteland" effect, and maybe have the PCs all pic the same species group. The different types of Promethean don't really mesh with each other well.

The enemies of the Prometheans, plus the overall tone reminds me of the original first several issues of Swamp Thing, or the old "House of Secrets" type horror comic books.

As a complete game, tone, etc - its my favorite of the nWOD.

Quote from: The Butcher;711416On a side note, I'm happy that we're haviung a nWoD thread. They're all to rare here, and even on TBP and G+ for that matter.

I'm even happier to see the Changeling and Hunter love. These are my favorite lines, really, even though I'm a sucker for the Big Three.

I echo all of this. I have a strong love for Geist too, which has the mood of Wraith and Promethean but seems much more playable. Unfortunately, it lacks the support of Changeling and Hunter.

Also, Demon looks pretty awesome too. I really liked the ideas in God Machine Chronicle and the idea of using GMC and Demon for a Hunter the Vigil game has me all a tingle

Quote from: Lynn;711458I have Promethean. It is the one system that seems to have an end game in mind that makes you sympathetic to prometheans as cursed monsters.

I snagged the Promethean PDF a couple of weeks ago when Drivethru was handing it out as a scavenger hunt freebie, but haven't done anything with it, at least yet.

I really enjoyed reading my copy of H:tV.  I've ran one session of the vanilla nWoD, but it seemed cool.  Finally, my WoD buddies on Facebook all rave about Mage.

Being a Mage fangirl I recommend Mage even though the corebook is a slog the suppliments really improve it. Also the blue books are stellar.

For me, Changeling the Lost is easily the best rpg White Wolf has ever published. I also think Vampire the Requiem is very good. Werewolf and Mage are crap. I am unfamiliar with the rest of their new stuff.

Is there an overarching sense of metaplot through - or even between - the game lines? The metaplot was both the best and the worst thing of oWoD; I'm curious as to whether or not they fine-tuned the concept for nWoD at all.

Quote from: Géza Echs;711599Is there an overarching sense of metaplot through - or even between - the game lines? The metaplot was both the best and the worst thing of oWoD; I'm curious as to whether or not they fine-tuned the concept for nWoD at all.

There's none.