Quote from: thedungeondelver;678426All I saw as a "default integration" of GH into 3e was the campaign setting getting some love and GH deities and worship thereof being the focus of clerical matters, so it wasn't that much more integration.

Well, it's when they started making changes to GH deities regardless of their background that IMO it started to come apart slowly, and not publishing anything for it.  It slowly devalued the campaign setting in consumers and the developers eyes.  I also think the factionalized nature of the fan-base makes it less likely to get a reboot.

Like I said, we might get a reprint of classic GH, I wouldn't expect anything more than that.

Quote from: Glazer;678404One of the things that interested me was that this will allow players to use 3.5, 4E and Next for their games. That's a lot of extra design work, so no wonder the development of Next is taking so long.

My familiarity with 4E is spotty at best, but I would have thought it and 3E irreconcilable. Unless the material they plan to release is as vague and mechanic-less as possible..."In the trees behind the village are 1d6 goblins that are...pretty mean. You know. Slightly meaner than they averagely are. Tougher, I suppose...I don't want to offend anybody with this description."

//Panjumanju

I suspect we'll see Next stat blocks in the printed/pdf material, with stats for the other editions available online.

Quote from: Haffrung;678469I suspect we'll see Next stat blocks in the printed/pdf material, with stats for the other editions available online.

I can hear the gnashing of teeth already.  Christ, with this new packet, they changed some of the monsters from having the spell description included as a power like in 4e, to just a list of spells per level/typical spells memorized and people are losing their shit over it.

No fiction, I've seen people say that they can't play as a DM if a dark cleric has:

"Spells: 3/2: inflict wounds, cure wounds, silence, sanctuary, aid"

instead of:

Power: inflict wounds.  Target within 25' suffers 9 (2d8) points of damage on failed constitution save vs. DC 15."


I guess looking up the spell description is too hard.  I'd think you'd learn them eventually and not have to keep looking them up.  And I suppose a high level monster caster would have to be 5 pages long with nothing but spell descriptions.   Waste of paper and space, IMO

Quote from: Sacrosanct;678472I guess looking up the spell description is too hard.  I'd think you'd learn them eventually and not have to keep looking them up.  And I suppose a high level monster caster would have to be 5 pages long with nothing but spell descriptions.   Waste of paper and space, IMO

Coming from 3e, the simplified, self-contained monster stat blocks were the best thing about 4e, IMO.

Quote from: hexgrid;678501Coming from 3e, the simplified, self-contained monster stat blocks were the best thing about 4e, IMO.

Coming from 2e the complex, Byzantine stat-blocks were the worst thing about 3e.

So I guess we agree

There is a happy medium.

I don't want designers to not give NPC mages a wide selection of spells because they take up to much space to reprint he rules. But having summaries of the most common attack is helpful.

Quote from: hexgrid;678501Coming from 3e, the simplified, self-contained monster stat blocks were the best thing about 4e, IMO.

Actually, I agree. One thing I dislike about 3E is the format where every monster is a fully stated NPC. Do I really need to know that the hobgoblin guard has a +2 skill in animal handling? I much preferred the 4E approach of monsters being monsters, and listing their relevant abilities in the stat block. And I was happy when I saw Next was taking the same approach. For example, the Asmadi Cultist in Next has a flaming weapon ability for 3d6. The cultist leader also has a beguiling ability that's explained right in the description. Cool. I don't need them all to be 3rd level clerics with a bunch of generic lvl 1 cleric spells. I frankly don't see why any monster short of a demon or a dragon needs more than two or three special abilities.

So chalk it up to another case of WotC veering back and forth and listening to whoever has their ear most recently.

While I agree on the stat blocks, I would still like to see monster descriptions go back to the 2e model. Will I always use the ecology of the monster? No, but it's nice to have it so as to have a generally accepted idea of where the monster should fit into the milieu.

Also, random monster encounter tables, dammit!

Quote from: hexgrid;678501Coming from 3e, the simplified, self-contained monster stat blocks were the best thing about 4e, IMO.

I personally find stat blocks to be the least useful part of a monster's description. I'd love it if WoTC took a cue from the recent Hacklopedia:



http://www.kenzerco.com/free_files/owlbeast.pdf

Quote from: TristramEvans;678658I personally find stat blocks to be the least useful part of a monster's description. I'd love it if WoTC took a cue from the recent Hacklopedia:



http://www.kenzerco.com/free_files/owlbeast.pdf

I like that. Reminds me of WFRP's Old World Bestiary.

Quote from: Haffrung;678662I like that. Reminds me of WFRP's Old World Bestiary.

Indeed, another one I liked, even if it was way too little for too much money at the time.

Actually my favorite "monster manual" isn't an rpg product at all but DiTerlizzi's (of Planescape fame) Spiderwick's Field Guide

Quote from: The_Rooster;678328Whenever there are these 'interactive' events that dictate a story in something, usually a TV series, I always cringe. It's like asking, "What is the worst possible idea that we could implement?"

Maybe it would work if they did the opposite of what people voted for?

Quote from: Piestrio;678508Coming from 2e the complex, Byzantine stat-blocks were the worst thing about 3e.

So I guess we agree

Complexity of stat blocks slows play and puts the emphasis on the wrong things.  It also led to all sorts of oddities (polymorph, anyone) since the focus was on the mechanics and not the way that the creature makes the adventure interesting (aka ecology).  

I did like how 4E managed to work in all of the relevant material.  I do know that I am starting to find Pathfinder stat blocks hard to work with now that it is getting too hard to memorize all of the different feats and they are scattered across many books.  I'd almost rather lose the space than need to make extensive notes for half of the encounters in an adventure path.