Quote from: jhkim;564371Sure, RaHoWa and white supremacists are bad, but I think less virulent racism is also important.  

For example, a company recruiter might be a little quicker to put a resume with the name "Lakisha" in the rejection bin than one with the name "Emily".  Those names are typical of a study published in 2009 by the National Bureau of Economic Research, which found that the exact same resumes with white-sounding names had a 50% higher callback rate than if they had distinctively African-American names - across a broad range of companies.  

This isn't virulent racism anything like RaHoWa.  The recruiter might not even realize she is doing it, but that bias is really damn important to Lakisha's life.  Things that contribute to these biases are at least worth discussing.

I agree work place discrimination based on race (or names indicating race or social class) are bad. I tend to be left leaning on most of these issues. So I am on board if people want to complain and talk about race and HR decisions. But that is very different from a crtiques of a kitchen sink setting with some cultural analogs in it. There is a certain point where it even becomes counter productive to look for these issues. I think it just reaches the point where people are not allowed to explore anything except races and cultures that they belong without being subject to accusations of racism.

Quote from: S'mon;564283Golarion has a big Egyptian-analogue nation, called Keb AIR. It's one of the most prominent bits of the Inner Sea World Guide. *sigh*

Please point out this "Keb Air" on this map or this wikia. The Egyptian-analogue is called Osirion. Maybe you meant Geb?
BTW, I have both the (old) Campaign Setting book and the (newer) Inner Sea World Guide within reach.
Thanks.

Quote from: Sacrosanct;564394That's the whole purpose of the grognards.txt thread in SA though, right?

I mean, the majority of posts there are pulled from other forums that they laugh at, so starting a thread on a major forum to start a shitstorm is exactly what they want because it gives them more quotes to post on SA.

Yeah, this board is much more generous: Pundit started a thread himself full of stuff for the goons to quote. Ettin didn't have to come over here and do it himself.

Yeah, that was probably his intent. Ettin annoys the shit out of me, and is why I quit rpgNET. If you really want to get mad check out his blog some time.

On topic, though, racism is an issue that I think RPGs could tackle, but it would be best if it wasn't with analagous cultures. That will just make it harder to do sanely and without getting into arguments over real world affairs.

Quote from: Sacrosanct;564394That's the whole purpose of the grognards.txt thread in SA though, right?

I mean, the majority of posts there are pulled from other forums that they laugh at, so starting a thread on a major forum to start a shitstorm is exactly what they want because it gives them more quotes to post on SA.

So yeah, it seems like threads like that are totally created because they get their kicks out of it.  You'd think someone at TBP on the admin staff is aware of SA and can put 2 and 2 together.

If someone at purple was smart enough, they wouldn't be purple.  Also since SA shares the same political agendas as Tangency means TRO is a just a chewtoy for the goons at this point.

Quote from: Sacrosanct;564394That's the whole purpose of the grognards.txt thread in SA though, right?

I mean, the majority of posts there are pulled from other forums that they laugh at, so starting a thread on a major forum to start a shitstorm is exactly what they want because it gives them more quotes to post on SA.

So yeah, it seems like threads like that are totally created because they get their kicks out of it.  You'd think someone at TBP on the admin staff is aware of SA and can put 2 and 2 together.

Ettin isn't a good person. He's actually a 4channer, and is basically just trolling both SA and RPGnet. There's a 4chan related IRC called suptg that plans this shit. I was, sadly, a part of it, but then they started turning it into some weird social justice thing instead of just doing it for fun.

Quote from: Stackmaster J;564467Ettin isn't a good person. He's actually a 4channer, and is basically just trolling both SA and RPGnet. There's a 4chan related IRC called suptg that plans this shit. I was, sadly, a part of it, but then they started turning it into some weird social justice thing instead of just doing it for fun.

Links?

PS - Welcome to the RPG Site, dude.

Sent them in a PM. Thanks! From what I've seen conversation will be a lot easier here without the fear of being banned. I didn't even post much because of that fear.

Quote from: Stackmaster J;564472Sent them in a PM. Thanks! From what I've seen conversation will be a lot easier here without the fear of being banned. I didn't even post much because of that fear.

Call me a stupid fucker.  Go ahead.

See if you're banned.  

   

Quote from: TomatoMalone;564442Yeah, this board is much more generous: Pundit started a thread himself full of stuff for the goons to quote. Ettin didn't have to come over here and do it himself.

God dam it.  I'm not Ettin.

Quote from: Sacrosanct;564394That's the whole purpose of the grognards.txt thread in SA though, right?

I mean, the majority of posts there are pulled from other forums that they laugh at, so starting a thread on a major forum to start a shitstorm is exactly what they want because it gives them more quotes to post on SA.

So yeah, it seems like threads like that are totally created because they get their kicks out of it.  You'd think someone at TBP on the admin staff is aware of SA and can put 2 and 2 together.

Except there is more than thread in that forum and quite honestly I've had the same discussion in other threads without people melting down into an gibbering mess.

Quote from: Stackmaster J;564472Sent them in a PM. Thanks! From what I've seen conversation will be a lot easier here without the fear of being banned. I didn't even post much because of that fear.

You don't have to fear being banned from this forum for calling other people braindead cunts.

Also, the link you sent me via PM made my firewall cry, so I didn't even connect to that chatroom you linked to.

Quote from: Benoist;564469PS - Welcome to the RPG Site, dude.

Likewise.   And nice avatar.  I have some serious nostalgia for that movie.

Quote from: technoextreme;564334The fact of the matter is that you'd effectively have to prove that there was bad faith involved or reckless disregard for the truth.

It's already been established that we are talking about RPGnet.

Quote from: jhkim;564016On the one hand, nothing is going to please everyone.  You're certainly bound to get complaints from someone.  However, that doesn't mean that everything is a wash and that no fiction or RPG or movie is really racist.

I'm not claiming that, though I do think that casually tossing around "racism" charges diminishes the ability to raise more legitimate racism concerns.  What I was pointing out is that even if someone were to make a best effort to avoid being called a racist, there is really no approach they could choose that would fully inoculate them from being called a racist, anyway.

Quote from: jhkim;564016I think there is a huge difference between:

1a) Using analogs of real-world cultures that embrace the stereotypes used by old, racist stories.  

1b) Using analogs of real-world cultures where you deliberately diverge from false old stereotypes and use stereotypes different than these for contrast.

While I think there is a difference, I think the latter can wind up being just problematic as the former.  Attributing cannibalism (to use part of your example) to a culture that did not actually practice cannibalism could easily be interpreted as a libelous slander.  Sure, it may clash with both the "noble savage" and the "ignorant primitive" stereotypes but it saddles them with "bloodthirsty monster" who practices something which is an almost universal taboo.  There is a reason why we see white businessmen and white supremacists, again and again, as the villains in action movies these days, because the movie studios face the same problem when portraying villains and it's boxed them into a corner with only a few valid choices.

Quote from: jhkim;564016I'm sure someone can complain about this, but this use of stereotype isn't in the same class as falling into false old stereotypes like the "noble savage in touch with the land" or "manipulative, lying, thieving gypsies."

Is it really better to see an ethnicity that you think has been falsely maligned as cannibals rather than noble savages?  

What's the actual problem?  That a stereotype used echoes a real world stereotype used for malicious purposes?  That the stereotype is false?  That the stereotype is negative?  That it's a stereotype at all?  Depending on who you talk to, any, all, or none of those things might be a problem.

Quote from: Stackmaster J;564467Ettin isn't a good person. He's actually a 4channer, and is basically just trolling both SA and RPGnet. There's a 4chan related IRC called suptg that plans this shit. I was, sadly, a part of it, but then they started turning it into some weird social justice thing instead of just doing it for fun.

I can't disagree about Getting. He comes off as false and very two faced to me.