Quote from: Ian Warner;465173Since you ask

Swearing
Intrigue
Weird Logic
Sensitivity
Wit
Bollocks

I take it Wit and Sensitivity are the dump stats?

JG

Using profanity has nothing to do with one's skill as a writer.

How it is used, and why, might, however.

Quote from: James Gillen;465207I take it Wit and Sensitivity are the dump stats?

JG

Depends if you're playing Malcolm Tucker or the Minister....

Quote from: Benoist;465208Using profanity has nothing to do with one's skill as a writer.

How it is used, and why, might, however.

We are in full agreement then.

Quote from: FrankTrollman;465172Back in 1989, Shadowrun 1E had special fake future-swear words that it used exclusively instead of real swear words. SR4 in 2005 used the real ones. That's pretty common. The 80s were prudish and people lived in fear of Tom Hanks. In the 21st century, we say Fuck.

-Frank

Indeed... we don't risk or even take time making up new words anymore... we just use the same old ones, even though they don't even mean the same thing.

The eighties were over the top awesome... The seventies plus. ...That is until 1986. I left an America that was a very interesting place in 1985 and returned in early 1987 to the big chill. A country that was paralyzed by a new four letter word. Aids. Fear ruled over reason and the moral compass was reset instantly by the news media and the medical establishment. I felt like I had just stepped backwards in time more than twenty some odd years. I was here just three months, and then left again.

There is a place for profanity in games, even in rules books. Where there's room for profanity there's also room for other creative alternatives as well that create the same or even new effects, without limiting or constraining the vocabulary of the people who happen to be playing the game.

Quote from: Soylent Green;465185Martin's "Game of Thrones" however is a much about politics as Dallas was about the oil business.  It captures the trappings and atmosphere of politics, but there is no context, no issues beyond personalities and nothing to take away from it. It's beautifully executed soap opera.

There is an issue behind the story though, it's blind greed and how it destroys the very thing that inspired it. Westeros starts out as a prosperous kingdom and is rapidly turned into a hellhole solely because of the greed of it's nobles. There is a lesson to be taken away from it, you may not agree with it but it's there.

Quote from: GameDaddy;465233Indeed... we don't risk or even take time making up new words anymore... we just use the same old ones, even though they don't even mean the same thing.

*Snipped bit*

There is a place for profanity in games, even in rules books. Where there's room for profanity there's also room for other creative alternatives as well that create the same or even new effects, without limiting or constraining the vocabulary of the people who happen to be playing the game.

You seem to be contradicting yourself or I'm not understanding what you're saying. The fake vulgarities of Shadowrun were part of the setting, dropping them for contemporary language doesn't strike me as creative at all. It just seems lazy and part of the using profanity equals maturity nonsense we get from the movie ratings system. "OMG E.T. can't be rated G no one will watch it! Quick throw some shits and damns in the dialogue!"

I agree that there is a time and place for most things, including profanity, but I don't see how it opens the door for anything.

Quote from: Xanador;465272There is an issue behind the story though, it's blind greed and how it destroys the very thing that inspired it. Westeros starts out as a prosperous kingdom and is rapidly turned into a hellhole solely because of the greed of it's nobles. There is a lesson to be taken away from it, you may not agree with it but it's there.

Exactly, it's Dallas all over again.

Quote from: Xanador;465272"OMG E.T. can't be rated G no one will watch it! Quick throw some shits and damns in the dialogue!"

"E.T. phone home... you stupid cunt Elliott"

Guess.

RPGPundit

You do realise that the theory going round is that the foul-mouth, ranting Pundit is just a screen persona and the in the flesh he is actually a mild-mannered Canadian who would not dream of using language any stronger than "gosh darnit"?

Quote from: Soylent Green;465273Exactly, it's Dallas all over again.

I'll concede the point the neither Dallas nor Game of Thrones are terribly "deep" works.  However, they are both still thoroughly adult in nature.

Something need not be "deep" to be for adults.  The Saw movies, for example, are not remotely deep.  But they aren't for kids, either.  Nor are the American Pie movies.

It need not be steeped in violence, profanity, or sexualization to be adult in nature, either.  Those Rock Hudson movies in the 50's certainly weren't deep but were clearly for adults.  The more classic Philidelphia Story-type romantic comedies were as well.

Heck, a lot of dramas aren't very deep either.  Treasure of the Sierra Madre surely wasn't, and they didn't even think adult women should be watching that at the time (LOL).  I'd argue stuff like The Winslow Boy wasn't really all that deep or made for children either, despite being used in literature classes.

I just don't see how happening to have a couple of dragons and undead things in the periphery of the story somehow turns it into something that would be for children if the language and sex were turned down (I'll assume we'd be leaving the violence in; most Americans could care less how much violence their child witnesses as long as there's no swearing or sex involved).

Political stuff for kids is boring.  So is amorality.

Just look at the opening half of the Phantom Menace.  I was around the target-age for the movies at the time (12 years old) and I couldn't tell you what the fuck the political shit was about.  Probably because it still doesn't make sense after examination, but it still didn't make for an entertaining movie.

When you're a little kid, you want obvious big bad evils (like the original Star Wars), you want globe-hopping plots and adventure, not characters examining their political agendas in a godless world where nearly everyone's a jerk.

I mean, there's that, or GoT just isn't a very good story.  I'd probably lean towards that.  Cool setting, interesting history, comparatively bad as a story.  I'm finding it enjoyable, but not in a "I give a shit about these characters" sort of way (aside from the little Stark girl and Jon).

Quote from: Peregrin;465331Political stuff for kids is boring.  So is amorality.

Just look at the opening half of the Phantom Menace.  I was around the target-age for the movies at the time (12 years old) and I couldn't tell you what the fuck the political shit was about.  Probably because it still doesn't make sense after examination, but it still didn't make for an entertaining movie.

When you're a little kid, you want obvious big bad evils (like the original Star Wars), you want globe-hopping plots and adventure, not characters examining their political agendas in a godless world where nearly everyone's a jerk.

I mean, there's that, or GoT just isn't a very good story.  I'd probably lean towards that.  Cool setting, interesting history, comparatively bad as a story.  I'm finding it enjoyable, but not in a "I give a shit about these characters" sort of way (aside from the little Stark girl and Jon).

I ddisagree . I read a lot across a range on genres from premo levi to kafka to stephen king and back. GOT is a great story. It combines petty human emotion with sweeping epic big stasge stuff whilst inverting a genre the good guys die the bad guys turn out to be not quite so bad aftyer all.

Idk. The chars seem pretty two dimensional, and are never allowed to move the story forward when they get the chance to.  Its interesting conceptually, like a historical recount, but on a dramatic level there's a lot of nothing happen all the time.

Quote from: Peregrin;465352The chars [...] are never allowed to move the story forward when they get the chance to.

I don't understand what you mean by that.

I have some issues with characterization in the series, but I don't see how characters "moving the story forward" has to do with their roundedness of portrayal.