Don't forget the Tarantella (Giant Spider) -- instead of killing, it's bite makes you dance!

Some of the poisons are instantly lethal, but others take up to10 turns to take effect -- which could be enough time to get help / antidote.

Quote from: Stuart;221503Some of the poisons are instantly lethal, but others take up to10 turns to take effect -- which could be enough time to get help / antidote.

As a gm, I would be generous with allowing a second save on slow acting poisons if they sucked the poison out or had healing herbs or whatever as I'm not a big fan of save or die.  AD&D 2e had specific rules under herbalism for that.  
 
But every character should have a missile weapon or a way to attack from a distance to deal with nasty melee attacks with poison or draining.

Moldvay giant centipede's make you violently ill for 10 days if you fail your save.  Then you get better.

Quote from: Nicephorus;221509As a gm, I would be generous with allowing a second save on slow acting poisons if they sucked the poison out or had healing herbs or whatever as I'm not a big fan of save or die.  AD&D 2e had specific rules under herbalism for that.

Yes, that's a good idea -- anything that gets the players to have their characters act in a realistic way is a good rule in my opinion.

Yanno, I've never cared for older editions of D&D because I'm generally fanatical about character design choice, and pre-3e pretty much entirely lacks it in any sense I find meaningful.

Occasionally though, I do find myself craving a simpler D&D-ish sort of game, and I do have a copy of the RC at my disposal.

The only problem is, I just can't fucking get through it.  A number of our favorite internet trolls liked to whine about 3e and how "complicated" it is, and hold up RC like some paragon of simplicity, but the truth of the matter is, that book is a fucking wall of rules bloat the likes of which I've not seen in some time.  

I'm sure the game seems simple if you just started with the boxed sets as a lad and slowly worked your way from B to E to C and so on, but taken all at once it's just too fucking much.  It feels like exactly what it is:  5 seperate, but linked, games, mashed together into one single megagame that's simply too much to take in outside the context of that programmed instruction path.

That's why I like the separate books.  Just start with the Red Basic Book (Moldvay or Mentzer) and that's all you need!  You don't need anything from the other books until your groups been playing for a while.  64 pages for a complete game.

Or download Labyrinth Lord. True, I haven't read straight through but as a Moldvay clone which only tries to incorporate the first two boxes, it ought to be a lot easier to digest.

I have the RC in front of me right now. If you fail the save vs. poison you become violently ill for 10 days, can only move at half speed and will not be able to perform any other physical action. Small creatures save or die.

Quote from: J Arcane;221526Yanno, I've never cared for older editions of D&D because I'm generally fanatical about character design choice, and pre-3e pretty much entirely lacks it in any sense I find meaningful.

Occasionally though, I do find myself craving a simpler D&D-ish sort of game, and I do have a copy of the RC at my disposal.

The only problem is, I just can't fucking get through it.  A number of our favorite internet trolls liked to whine about 3e and how "complicated" it is, and hold up RC like some paragon of simplicity, but the truth of the matter is, that book is a fucking wall of rules bloat the likes of which I've not seen in some time.  

I'm sure the game seems simple if you just started with the boxed sets as a lad and slowly worked your way from B to E to C and so on, but taken all at once it's just too fucking much.  It feels like exactly what it is:  5 seperate, but linked, games, mashed together into one single megagame that's simply too much to take in outside the context of that programmed instruction path.

I don't think I worked up through the boxes, and to me RC seems piss easy to be honest.  Chargen particularly is very quick and straightforward.

Quote from: Elliot Wilen;221528Or download Labyrinth Lord. True, I haven't read straight through but as a Moldvay clone which only tries to incorporate the first two boxes, it ought to be a lot easier to digest.

It gives clerics spells at first level though, I prefer the original rule of having to wait until second.

Quote from: Balbinus;221537It gives clerics spells at first level though, I prefer the original rule of having to wait until second.

It also removes a number of "human" monsters from the list.  A small thing, but a subtle shift in the tone of the game.  To me anyway.  I like the various humans on the list (Acolyte, Noble, Trader, Veteran etc).

Huh, don't have it here. Well, if that's an issue, there's Basic Fantasy--but it takes more liberties with the underlying algorithms from what I've heard.

Quote from: J Arcane;221526Occasionally though, I do find myself craving a simpler D&D-ish sort of game, and I do have a copy of the RC at my disposal.

The only problem is, I just can't fucking get through it.  A number of our favorite internet trolls liked to whine about 3e and how "complicated" it is, and hold up RC like some paragon of simplicity, but the truth of the matter is, that book is a fucking wall of rules bloat the likes of which I've not seen in some time.  

I love classic D&D, but I heartily agree with this sentiment.  I really don't like much in the RC that isn't already in the Moldvay/Cook version of the rules.

The Skills system seems to be lauded by many even though it's pretty much the near-universally hated NWP system from 2nd Edition AD&D.  The Weapon Mastery rules are an overcomplicated mess.  The extra classes like Druid, Avenger and Mystic weren't really needed.

I did like the more detailed tables for determining the contents of a non-magical treasure hoard, the extra monsters, etc., but most of the extra stuff in the RC isn't needed.

Labyrinth Lord is much closer to Moldvay Basic than Basic Fantasy is.  LL is a very good product, but since I already own B/X in print it doesn't replace those for me.

Quote from: Nicephorus;221509But every character should have a missile weapon or a way to attack from a distance to deal with nasty melee attacks with poison or draining.

Sure, but minions seek to engage us in melee so making missile fire impractical, plus you need enchanted weapons or magic to hurt the level draining critters.

Our GM uses tactics, the monsters do not go gentle into that good night.