Quote from: Abyssal MawBut I'm still going to wait and see.

As much Sturm und Drang as we're seeing, that's really all we can do.  It'll all come around, one way or another.  But I am terribly fond of Greyhawk.

The thing that irks me about Greyhawk is the ownership.  C'mon guys, shit or get off the pot.  If you're not going to do something with it (I mean, it won't even be your implied fucking setting anymore), then let some starry-eyed kid with a dream and lots of free time make it a labor of love that the rest of us can enjoy.

But no, we'll just pack it up in this crate over here and tell you we've got out top people working on it...if we bother to say anything at all...

Quote from: Abyssal MawAnd I'm also bugged by the Mary Sue-ification of how it all works.

AMen, brother.

Quote from: Abyssal MawBottom line: The Forgotten Realms is a tedious and romanticized take...I tend to associate almost everything bad about 2nd Edition with FR.

Go try and read a module - like Shadowdale (I think, it's downstairs and I'm too lazy to go look).  Talk about railroading...

Quote from: Abyssal MawBut I'm still going to wait and see.

I'll take alook at the new rules, but I'm not so sure I'll be doing much in the interim. Like I said, maybe it's better to start looking at finding ways to support a burgeoning 3.5 market - including a setting like Greyhawk.

Quote from: James J SkachThe thing that irks me about Greyhawk is the ownership.  C'mon guys, shit or get off the pot.  If you're not going to do something with it (I mean, it won't even be your implied fucking setting anymore), then let some starry-eyed kid with a dream and lots of free time make it a labor of love that the rest of us can enjoy.

But no, we'll just pack it up in this crate over here and tell you we've got out top people working on it...if we bother to say anything at all...

I would LOVE to see Greyhawk get some sort of deal like Planescape or Athas, but I sincerely doubt that'd ever happen.  Greyhawk's got too much for them to just let 'er go like that.

Tell you what, were I a Gentlemen of Considerably Independent Means, I'd love to have the rights to Greyhawk.

Quote from: Zachary The FirstI would LOVE to see Greyhawk get some sort of deal like Planescape or Athas, but I sincerely doubt that'd ever happen.  Greyhawk's got too much for them to just let 'er go like that.

Tell you what, were I a Gentlemen of Considerably Independent Means, I'd love to have the rights to Greyhawk.

If I were the one to give it, I would.

I'm going to make Silverosprey.

This will refer to a city near the Dery Veep, a lake of unknown depths and much trade. It will be so big there will be a ehtnicity of folks who live on barges that ply the waters.

There will be a half-demon overlord name Scuz who will rule a barren land to the north.

Quote from: James J SkachIf I were the one to give it, I would.

I'm going to make Silverosprey.

This will refer to a city near the Dery Veep, a lake of unknown depths and much trade. It will be so big there will be a ehtnicity of folks who live on barges that ply the waters.

There will be a half-demon overlord name Scuz who will rule a barren land to the north.

:haw:

Trust me, that's just off the top of my (pointy) head.

And if done right, I'd call it a parody and hide under fair use - seeing as how I wouldn't be charging for using it as a Living Campaign (or home campaigns, etc.)

Quote from: James J SkachTrust me, that's just off the top of my (pointy) head.

And if done right, I'd call it a parody and hide under fair use - seeing as how I wouldn't be charging for using it as a Living Campaign (or home campaigns, etc.)

You're allowed to profit off of parodies. :haw:

Quote from: Abyssal MawThe other promise made was somehow getting the Realms "novel team" and D&D R&D involved in writing some of the Living Realms adventures. so adventures would be tied to novels and (perhaps?) novels might be based on the adventures.

So where are the Swine War types crying about the invasion of metaplot into "real" gaming?[/snark]

Seriously, my tastes in D&D gaming seem to mirror Abyssal Maw's (I dig modernized, "dungeonpunk" stuff as long as it's not too OTT), but I actually like Realms... because I can take all the drippy shit from the novels, fire it into the sun, and make the setting my own.  I don't know how I'd feel about LFR, though.

My real question: does this mean we might see a rebooted Greyhawk CS hardback divorced from the Living concept?  God I hope so!

KoOS

So.

The Realms will be the new Living campaign, and the first 4E setting book. Meanwhile, there's talk of Warforged as core class. But then, so there is of Tieflings. On the fourth hand, the 4e art out there looks vaguely late 2E-ish.

You know what would KINDA NICE?

It would be kinda nice if WOTC put somebody on the design team, in a senior position, who's not just a mechanics monkey who's pixelbitching about CRs.

Because it seems to me the Big Picture needs some urgent attending to, seeing as it's clear as mud what 4E thinks its setting, its mood, and its visual concept is: the Realms, Eberron, Planescape, Midnight ("points of light in a world of darkness," or how did BS put it)...

a thousand points of light?

I like the Realms as setting, hate the realms as metaplot, and DESPISE the fucking novels.

So I can't imagine that this current plan will do anything good for the realms.  Fortunately, there's already two really excellent versions of the realms in print (the FR of the 1e box set, and the FR of the 3rd edition book, which are two very different worlds).  Plus there's also the FR of Ed Greenwood, the original one, that isn't like any of the published ones (its much, much better).

RPGPundit

Ed Greenwood is a really interesting guy.  His own take on FR would probably make Bradford Walker's "Joe Gamer" spontaneously combust!

KoOS

Should have thought of this earlier...

"We want to leverage the assets of the assumed parts of a D&D world – Mordenkainen, Bigby, Vecna, Llolth, Tiamat, Asmodeus, etc. However, we also want to call upon the great mythology that is more commonly known such as Thor, etc."

In other words: "we don't really want to use this stuff... but we don't want to lose our corporate assets either.  And we want to keep you know who from getting this stuff back again..."

Don't forget kids - trademarks remain valid as long as the owner actively uses and defends them and maintains their registrations with the applicable jurisdiction's trademarks office!

My knee-jerk reaction was, "Well, Greyhawk fans should be used to being supplanted and booted out by Forgotten Realms by now.  It's only happened how many times before?"

I grew up with Greyhawk, so I'm biased.  I want to like Forgotten Realms, but the goofy stuff (Mary Sues, everything-plus-the-kitchen-sink incorporation, insistence on implementing metaplot via novels I have no desire to read) and orientation toward absurdly high-powered stuff always keeps me away.

But I like the old "Baldur's Gate" computer games.  And the FR Boxed Set 1st Edition (with the parchmenty pages) was beautiful.  Every time I see that it makes me want to play with it.

...And, of course, Greyhawk has more than its fair share of goofiness.  Like I said, I'm biased by nostalgia.

What to do, what to do...?