Quote from: RPGPundit;1018414I hate Multi-classing.

That's a reasonable view. I hate classes in general, but if I agree to play a game with them I'm not going to complain about class restrictions.

Quote from: saskganesh;1018563The AD&D DMG starting age for a human mage was something like 20+2d8 years. Implied from this was that  training to be a mage could take a while, conceivably a couple of decades. Of course, not all of that had to be magic studies... the apprentice mage would do what a lot of interns and entry level workers do today: get coffee, run errands, rustle up the meals, basically be a servant, much like Mickey Mouse in the Sorcerer's Apprentice. (All of course to build discipline and learn obedience, says the mage, before he lies down for his third nap of the day.)  But yeah, there could be fast track if the PC wants to spend the denario. Say 4 years, but it would still take some work.

Usually. But because adventurers typically get involved with crazy shit, there's no shortage of faster tracks. Wishes, actions by a deity, crazy machines in dark dungeons that grant cool powers, influence of an artifact, whatever your imagination can come with, anything that serves to justify the switch. Just make it cool. But you are already there.

Mechanically I'd advise you to stay away from 3.0 era mix and match level dipping as that will lead to unfortunate ends. You are better off with standard double-classing, relaxing multi-classing or using 2.0 era type DIY kits.

What is dual classing?

Also, isn't the fastest "fast track" just multi classing?

It takes 20 years to be a wizard at level 1, but once you're gaining levels you can just pick wizard and get it in the 1 week of game time it takes to level up. Which I always thought was a weird thing.

Yeah, which is why it's dumb. These aren't just jobs; level 1 in a class represents a very significant amount of training (years!).  That's why level 1 fighters were called 'veterans'.

Dual classing was in AD&D where a character would change classes at a certain point and start gaining XP in the new class and only that class. He would retain the skills of the first class, but would not be able to use them until his new class level matched that of the first class. (He would of course, retain hit points already earned). It was for humans only as only demi's could multiclass ( I guess this was dropped later in 3.0). A double classer would need to have a prerequisite stat of at least 17 for the new class.

Example, Bob the Fighter makes it to 5th level. He has 50 hit points. For some fantastic reason his intelligence has gone up to 17, making it possible for him to switch to Magic User. He starts anew as a 1st level mage (with 50 hit points!) . He can't use fighter weapons, armor, gear , THACO, saves, until her becomes a 5th level MU, then he can mix and match as appropriate. If he does backslide in an adventure, he forfeits earned XP for that session, because he is not advancing as a mage.

A little clunky, but it works to a degree because there is a mechanical cost. It's rare and not something to be done lightly. Nobody is picking up a level of barbarian over the weekend so they have a daily at will rage ability.

Quote from: saskganesh;1019080Dual classing was in AD&D where a character would change classes at a certain point and start gaining XP in the new class and only that class. He would retain the skills of the first class, but would not be able to use them until his new class level matched that of the first class. (He would of course, retain hit points already earned). It was for humans only as only demi's could multiclass ( I guess this was dropped later in 3.0). A double classer would need to have a prerequisite stat of at least 17 for the new class.

Example, Bob the Fighter makes it to 5th level. He has 50 hit points. For some fantastic reason his intelligence has gone up to 17, making it possible for him to switch to Magic User. He starts anew as a 1st level mage (with 50 hit points!) . He can't use fighter weapons, armor, gear , THACO, saves, until her becomes a 5th level MU, then he can mix and match as appropriate. If he does backslide in an adventure, he forfeits earned XP for that session, because he is not advancing as a mage.

A little clunky, but it works to a degree because there is a mechanical cost. It's rare and not something to be done lightly. Nobody is picking up a level of barbarian over the weekend so they have a daily at will rage ability.

Hmm the only part that doesn't make sense is, why does he have to wait 5 levels to use his old Fighter stuff?

He doesn't, really, but he earns no XP if he uses them before his new class level exceeds his old class level (so level 6 in this example).

AD&D isn't really based on realism or logic except where convenient (read EGG's essay in the DMG on pg. 9 "APPROACHES TO PLAYING ADVANCED DUNGEONS & DRAGONS" where he discusses dropping realism/logic wherever it gets in the way of what he's trying to do).

So the fighter has to wait until level 6 because that makes the process different, and in many ways less convenient, than a demi-human multi-class.  It's couched in verbiage about how a human dual-class has to totally focus on what they're doing now instead of how they used to do things, but that's all blah-blah smoke and mirrors.  Having multiple classes is supposed to be a primarily non-human thing.  Humans can switch, and eventually synthesize, but they require much higher scores than a demi multi to even qualify for this path, and it's not as smooth for them.

Mac: he did not have to wait, he could have switched at L2 if he wanted (and if he had 17 INT). I picked L5 so he would have 50 hit points, which is considerable for a mage.

Thanks to EOTB to pointing out L6 is needed for synthesis.