TheRPGSite

But anyways, let's talk about Curt. Not being able to be a regular visitor at RPG.net, I had to do some digging to get more information than what I had yesterday.  Today, I discovered that what got him suspended for two days was a certain comment he made on a thread about, obviously, homosexuals; in response to a poster who Curt felt wasn't pro-gay enough.

No big surprise, right? Except for one thing:  if you see that thread now, you'll notice that the original statement in Curt's reply, the one that got him banned, has been replaced with a red-texted "edited by mods".

As in, covered up! Normally, the modclique is ALL too fucking happy to leave whatever comment was said on the offending poster's thread, to be able to show exactly why they just "had" to ban the fucker. But here, no, Curt's little comment is edited away as fast as possible.

I had to do some research to figure out just what it was, and then an anonymous tip brought it to my door.  Apparently, Curt said to this other poster:

QuoteSo if I were to say that your mother is a cum-guzzling whore, then in the right context that'd be okay?

The RPG.net mods, in their constant crusade to revise history and protect their own, tried to get rid of that statement, but here it is; preserved for all to see. Of course, the reason they edited this out is because their honest hope is that after the two-day vacation, they can reinstate Curt as a mod with full powers. After countless occasions of demonstrating why he is utterly and absolutely unsuited to being a mod of any kind, these fucks still want him back.  In fact, he's still listed as a mod right now.

Imagine what would have happened to any normal poster if they'd called someone else's mother a "cum-guzzling whore"? I can bet you anything that they wouldn't be made a mod, that's for sure.  But Curt is special, he's one of them, he's part of the clique.  So much for equality under the rules...

RPGPundit

(march 10, 2007)

Isn't Curt a mod, now?

I think he retired and stormed out and came back again then again he might be a mod again.

He once told me that I didn't deserve to live.  I backed off.  Later back in the days of people trying to leave and start a new community I got invited to places he was hanging out.

Each time I joined one of these communities I made a point of asking him if he minded my coming because I didn't want to taint someone's utopia with my presence if it was going to cause a problem.

He denied even knowing who I was the first time and eventually even accused me of stalkerish behaviour.

I can see why he gets so mad about the issue in question.  For him it is the very definition of his existance.  For me it's a theological curiosity at best and another stupid reason for human beings to dehumanize each other at worst.

I don't think making him a mod was the answer.  Nor do I see banning him as having been the right move.  At that point in time on Tangency banning was a bit of a mark of honour.  It gave people popular clout in the mod warz.  Heck there were even people mass begging for bistromath to be reinstated.

Sad thing is : One time Curt said he enjoyed playing GURPS, then he was freaked out that he and I might enjoy playing same game.

He was probably some other moderator's lift to and from work for awhile. Probably why he got to do whatever he wanted on there for a time.


- Ed C.

Curt was sharing a flat with VoiceOfIsaac and Alexandria, who were both mods at the time. The three shared an internet connection. Had Curt defied his ban with a sock puppet, they'd have had to put in an IP ban, which would of course have knocked off two mods, too.

Since they couldn't keep him away, they made him a mod.

I imagine flatting with two mods also helped his case. "Once you know him in person, then you can understand," etc. It's not what you know but who you know, and all that.

If say Kyle calls someone a cunt, who am I to them? Just some random internet dickhead. But if the guy you're flatting with calls someone a cunt, well then you're going to cut him some slack. That's just human nature.

That site is the most appallingly moderated place I've ever seen. It's so blatantly biased and so badly run it beggars belief. These peopel are what i woudl consider cowards, they don't even bother to talk about whatever terrible crime or problem you have caused. And, from my (obviously bitter :D) experience the reason is always 'personal attacks'. Personal attacks, which translates as you have hurt one of the little darlings' feelings (though not really, they are just exceptionally precious).
Two things really bug me about their style though:
1. What's good for the goose isn't good for the gander, which means that youc an't act bad and get banned, but peopel who respond in kind are somehow allowed to do so because it's in response. That's a huge double standard in my book and arrogance of the worst kind.

2. defending yourself only makes things worse, because it is automatically and inexorably transalated as being argumentative, difficult and will of course exacerbate the problem

So instead of meeting you as an equal and treating you like an adult, these people behave like spoilt kids of the worst kind. Ironically if anyone spoke to me like that in real life, they'd be lucky not to walk away with a slap!

It really is pathetic; as pathetic as it is unfortunate. But that's the way of the interweb it seems. This so called frontier for free expression really is at the whim of petty little hitlers (oop godwin's rule, you've broken the interweb! oh noes!), whose enjoyment of their little slice of autocracy is commensurate with just how utterly pathetic it is.

So what should be a really good site full of ideas and expression is a sad little clique. No wonder gamers get the reputation they do. Get a life!

Rant over.

Quote from: Kyle AaronCurt was sharing a flat with VoiceOfIsaac and Alexandria, who were both mods at the time. The three shared an internet connection. Had Curt defied his ban with a sock puppet, they'd have had to put in an IP ban, which would of course have knocked off two mods, too.

You seem to know a lot about the goings on at the cliquenest. Are you sat in the building opposite with a pair of binoculars?:raise:

Quote from: AnthrobotYou seem to know a lot about the goings on at the cliquenest. Are you sat in the building opposite with a pair of binoculars?:raise:

No, it was openly discussed at the time. Curt talked about moving in with the two mods, later her got "perma"-banned, and so on.

It was all out there. You could go picking through the "Boneyards" before they delete it all and check if you want.

Quote from: AnthrobotYou seem to know a lot about the goings on at the cliquenest. Are you sat in the building opposite with a pair of binoculars?:raise:

I thought the living arrangements with VoI, A2K, and Curt was common knowledge.  They discussed in Tangency often enough that even a slow-on-the-uptake fellow like myself knew what was what.

The moderation there is pretty bad, and I say this as someone who manages to stay out of trouble. I really don't know what's a bannable offense over there. A couple days ago, as provided by Koltar, I read the thread that got J Arcane banned from rpgnet., and his banning was remarkably stupid. Granted, J Arcane isn't exactly sweetness and light, and I don't know what his previous offenses were, but whatever he did, didn't merit a ban. He wasn't THAT bad. Supposedly, he was "acting like a mod". From what I could see, he was a little condescending, but if that's a bannable offense, then they'd need to ban a HUGE percentage of the posters there....:haw:

They specifically cited a warning he was given months previously to the EXACT day. It sounds pretty damn nitpicky to me, almost like the mods were planning a revenge ban or something.

I also don't understand rpgnet's pretense about the website being an "emotionally safe place", when it's anything but that. If anything, the environment there encourages passive-aggressive behavior, thus making it LESS "emotionally safe".

This isn't a total slam on the site. There's some cool and interesting stuff there, but it's like having a cigarette ash in your chocolate cake. It won't kill the cake, but it WILL partially taint your enjoyment of it. :raise:

Quote from: Sacrificial LambThey specifically cited a warning he was given months previously to the EXACT day. It sounds pretty damn nitpicky to me, almost like the mods were planning a revenge ban or something.

Yes and no. Noting who got warned or suspended when lets them at least try to be fair. If they didn't note down those things, then people would say, "why did X get permabanned for saying "fuck you" when X never did anything before but Y did all these other things... It's not fair!"

So an attempt at consistency and fairness can lead to nitpickiness. And not being nitpicky can lead to inconsistent and unfair moderation, more so than you see now.

On the other hand, sometimes you get on the shit list of a particular mod and from then on, it's only a matter of time.

There's not really any easy solution. In the end you just have to pick a way you want things to be done, a style you want the place to have, and stick to it.

Quote from: Kyle AaronYes and no. Noting who got warned or suspended when lets them at least try to be fair. If they didn't note down those things, then people would say, "why did X get permabanned for saying "fuck you" when X never did anything before but Y did all these other things... It's not fair!"

So an attempt at consistency and fairness can lead to nitpickiness. And not being nitpicky can lead to inconsistent and unfair moderation, more so than you see now.

On the other hand, sometimes you get on the shit list of a particular mod and from then on, it's only a matter of time.

There's not really any easy solution. In the end you just have to pick a way you want things to be done, a style you want the place to have, and stick to it.

You might be right, Kyle....but the real point is, perma-banning J Arcane in that instance was total overkill. It didn't even merit a three-day ban. If they found the thread so annoying, they should have just said, "J Arcane, stop being a dick", and closed the thread. And he was only being MILDLY dickish anyway...

He was the Diet Coke of Dick. Just one calorie. Not dickish enough. But what's done is done, and I guess the mods disagree....:pundit:

Well, they've often said that if you go back, email them and apologise for your misdeeds, there's a good chance they'll have you back. And it's happened, and not only with that idiot Curt.

Most of the people who stay permabanned are the sorts of people who are not inclined to apologise for their misdeeds on rpg.net... :cool:

Quote from: Sacrificial LambI also don't understand rpgnet's pretense about the website being an "emotionally safe place", when it's anything but that. If anything, the environment there encourages passive-aggressive behavior, thus making it LESS "emotionally safe".

This is the bind they're in. Banning overt aggression just drives the conflict 'underground,' with sarcasm, IL announcements and pettiness becoming the new language of dispute. It results in the bannings of those who've adhered to the letter of law but not the spirit. Of course the upshot of all this is that RPGnet becomes more vulnerable to accusations of inconsistency and favouritism than ever before.

I still like the place. For sheer breadth of gaming discussion it can't be beat. It's just a real pain to navigate at times.

Quote from: DrewI still like the place. For sheer breadth of gaming discussion it can't be beat. It's just a real pain to navigate at times.

Yeah. Sometimes though, the numerous threads of the flavour of the month gets a bit tiring. Other than that I think it's a pretty good place to hang out in. You do kinda of get lost amongst the crowd, but folks there are generally friendly.

Regards,
David R

Indeed. There are plenty of people there who manage to abide by the rules and have decent gaming discussions. It seems like the moderation only really becomes a problem for those who can't walk away from situations. Eventually their tempers fray and they find themselves on the wrong side of the "emotionally safe environment." :D

Quote from: DrewIndeed...................... Eventually their tempers fray and they find themselves on the wrong side of the "emotionally safe environment." :D

Irony is - THIS forum (rpgsite) is actually a friendlier atmosphere more times than not.
 Trying to create an emotionally safe environment is a goal that is set up for failure at the start.


- Ed C.

Quote from: KoltarTrying to create an emotionally safe environment is a goal that is set up for failure at the start.

How dare you oppress my right to be emotionally safe!

I'll see you in court.

:D

As I've said before, this forum is the only one on which I've seen genuine and spontaneous apologies given by one member to another over some offence given or taken.

Amazing what happens when people are responsible for themselves like grownups :cool:

Quote from: Kyle AaronWell, they've often said that if you go back, email them and apologise for your misdeeds, there's a good chance they'll have you back. And it's happened, and not only with that idiot Curt.

Most of the people who stay permabanned are the sorts of people who are not inclined to apologise for their misdeeds on rpg.net... :cool:

I for one would gladly go back the day THEY come and apologize to ME.

Won't be holding my breath, of course, but why would I apologize when they're the ones who are in the wrong, and have always been in the wrong?

RPGPundit

Quote from: Kyle AaronAs I've said before, this forum is the only one on which I've seen genuine and spontaneous apologies given by one member to another over some offence given or taken.

Amazing what happens when people are responsible for themselves like grownups :cool:

You're welcome.

RPGPundit

Quote from: Kyle AaronAs I've said before, this forum is the only one on which I've seen genuine and spontaneous apologies given by one member to another over some offence given or taken.

Amazing what happens when people are responsible for themselves like grownups :cool:

Except it happens all the time on RPG.net.  Seriously.

Looking back, I agree somewhat that the moderation during that period was...interesting to say the least.

The moderation now is much more hands off, and only real assholes get any kind of banning at all.

Although, really, to what purpose does dredging all this shit up really have to do with anything?  I mean, it was quite some time ago - who, other than Pundit and the other banned retards who constantly harangue about a site they flamed out on YEARS ago, cares about some stupid shit involving Curt and VoI and A2K?

And me, since I'm commenting?  I haven't checked in here in a while, and whats the first thing I see coming back, and thus get involved in?  An RPG.net screed.  Jesus.  I almost thought Pundit had worked these out of his system by now.

Seriously, P, aren't there better things to spend time talking about?  Things that INTEREST you?  Things that you WANT to talk about?  About the beauty of the Montevidean nights, while smoking pipes and drinking good scotch?  What is it about RPG.net that you just can't let GO of?  You have a great little community here.  Focus all that energy HERE.

I keep saying this, and keep hoping you'll listen.  It was good for a while, and maybe this thread is one straw in the stack that I happened to find, but dude - let it GO.

Dude, HMG, that is a seriously disingenuous, and uninformed response.  I expect better from you man.  

This is, essentially, an automated repost from a year ago, and the first such "OMG RPGnet suxxors" thread in some time.  And you might have known that if you'd bothered to stick around, or given fair shrift to it's percentage of the general discourse here.

You do know how this forum works, right?  It's just a repost of every last one of his blog posts, exactly one year later.  Why he does it, I dunno.  Maybe just as a way of seeing what's "changed" in a year, how the climate is different.  Maybe it's just his giant ego.  I've been known to pull up old threads just to read some clever thing I wrote eons ago.  

I don't really see why it should bother you so much at that, after all, you hardly post here, and it's not like anything said here has much effect on the rampaging purple mob anyway.  It's just bored sideline commentary, who the fuck gives a shit?  Does it really hurt you that much?

Quote from: HackmastergeneralExcept it happens all the time on RPG.net.  Seriously.

I've yet to see it. Perhaps Tangency's become a hot-bed of frank, genuine and open expression of worthwhile ideas, I wouldn't know, I can't see it. Outside there, no-one has a chance to apologise before they're banned - temporarily or permanently - and when apologies do pop up they're of the forced, "I'm sorry I called you a cunt - I'm sorry you're a cunt" type that you get when they're forced.

Of all discussion sites I've ever seen, this is the only one where I've regularly seen genuine and unprompted apologies from people about what they've said to another poster. Sure, it happens now and then everywhere - but it happens reasonably frequently here.

Quote from: HackmastergeneralThe moderation now is much more hands off, and only real assholes get any kind of banning at all.

I dunno, really, that's what they said a couple of years ago, too. What that usually means - and I say this as someone having used almost the same words as you just did - is just, "they just ban posters I don't like or care about anyway."

Quote from: HackmastergeneralAlthough, really, to what purpose does dredging all this shit up really have to do with anything?  I mean, it was quite some time ago - who, other than Pundit and the other banned retards who constantly harangue about a site they flamed out on YEARS ago, cares [...]

I assume the purpose is to compare and contrast the different sites.

I may be a retard, but I didn't flame out on rpg.net. My ban was a genuine surprise to me.

Quote from: hackmastergeneralAnd me, since I'm commenting?  I haven't checked in here in a while, and whats the first thing I see coming back, and thus get involved in?  An RPG.net screed.  

Then you're not looking very far into on the "new posts" list. There's plenty of rpg discussion, and even some rpg design discussion. If you choose to talk about this rather than that stuff, that's your fault.

Quote from: Kyle AaronI may be a retard, but I didn't flame out on rpg.net. My ban was a genuine surprise to me.

I've just been banned from there again, and just like the last time it took me entirely by surprise.  I posted a personal observation about women gamers in a thread about personal observations about women gamers, and since it wasn't a flattering observation, I got banned for making a "general attack."

Utterly ridiculous.

The kicker:  My observation was that women are very good at using ostracization to prevent criticism of women.

That's beautiful, man :)

You should be proud of that!

When you're unbanned you can return to the thread, quote the banning post, and say, "QED".

Of course they will ban you again then, but...

They didn't ban you for that, they banned you for being a dick - then becoming a crazy motherfucker.

Dude, you have issues.

Quote from: CthyThey didn't ban you for that, they banned you for being a dick - then becoming a crazy motherfucker.

Dude, you have issues.

He lives in Seattle, what do you expect? Everyone in Seattle has issues. Serious ones.

Lol, never been so I'll take your word on that:p

Quote from: CthyThey didn't ban you for that, they banned you for being a dick - then becoming a crazy motherfucker.

Magical historical revision!

They banned me for because I posted a personal observation about women gamers in a thread about personal observations about women gamers.  They permabanned me for becoming a crazy motherfucker.  Actually, that's not even true either.  Darren MacLarren permabanned me because I attacked Michelle Lyons in her journal, on an entirely unrelated issue.  Within minutes Darren had posted to her journal saying I would be permanently banned.  That's when I decided to just start fucking with them.

And who the heck are you, their proxy on the rpg site?  Which one of them has his/her hand up you ass?

EDIT: Hey, you joined this forum just to come snark me, didn't you?  Of your five comments so far, three are snark aimed at me.  So you're stalking me on the internet, and calling me the crazy motherfucker?  More likely, you're not crazy, you're just fucking with me.  You must be a rpg.net mod to achieve that level of hypocrisy.

I love people who think other people's dickishness justifies their dickishness.  I love them with my fist. ;)

Quote from: Kyle AaronWhen you're unbanned you can return to the thread, quote the banning post, and say, "QED".

Of course they will ban you again then, but...

By the way, thanks for the QED idea Kyle.

Quote from: JackalopeNo. They banned me for because I posted a personal observation about women gamers in a thread about personal observations about women gamers.

Not quite. They banned you for making a group attack against women gamers in a thread about personal observations about women gamers.

Quote from: JackalopeIf I had to hazard to guess why, I would theorize the following: Male gamers are stereotyped as being unable to attract women, as being hard-up and/or desperate for sex. Women who are mentally unstable, physically unattractive, and financially instable -- i.e. subaverage women -- are unlikely to be able to compete with the average woman in the mating marketplace. These women would have no success at all on the bar scene, for example.

So they migrate to gaming circles, where I believe they believe they will have less competition and be more likely to find men willing to date them. Considering all of these women I've known have actually been quite successful in finding mates in gaming circles, I can't say this an entirely delusional strategy.

No mate, your wrong. I came on this site to have a look round and see whats rocking. Then I came across you and your inability to accept you have been a dick.

I stood up for you in challenging some of the mods calls, but then you had to go and stick your head up your own arse by threatening to ruin a prearranged gathering. I argued for you, asked for you to be given a break as your views were often valid - then you go and become a fucking psycho, which makes me look bad for voicing my support.

No one asked me to come here, I saw it mentioned on an unrelated site and popped along. It just pisses me off when someone has to rebuild the past to give their actions justification.

:raise:

Quote from: JackalopeI love people who think other people's dickishness justifies their dickishness.  I love them with my fist. ;)

Jeez more violent threats.  You need to attend some anger management classes.

Or go to a biker bar, where they will show anonymous internet geek what hard is really all about.

Once again, shoe, other foot.  Look at the first sentance there, and see if it fits your own bad self.

Quote from: JackalopeMagical historical revision!

They banned me for because I posted a personal observation about women gamers in a thread about personal observations about women gamers.  They permabanned me for becoming a crazy motherfucker.  Actually, that's not even true either.  Darren MacLarren permabanned me because I attacked Michelle Lyons in her journal, on an entirely unrelated issue.  Within minutes Darren had posted to her journal saying I would be permanently banned.  That's when I decided to just start fucking with them.

Do you have a link to Lyon's journal?

RPGPundit

Quote from: DrewNot quite. They banned you for making a group attack against women gamers in a thread about personal observations about women gamers.

Except that what he said is something we've ALL seen and ALL know to be true: the "Queen Bee" complex, where women in gaming clubs and groups who would otherwise not be exactly "supermodel" material gets to have her own little "stable" of adoring superannuated-virgin geeks specifically because of the lack of women.  

Jackalope was banned from rpg.net for stating one of those nasty stubborn things that so many of the rpg.netters hate: facts.

RPGPundit

Quote from: CthyNo mate, your wrong. I came on this site to have a look round and see whats rocking. Then I came across you and your inability to accept you have been a dick.

I stood up for you in challenging some of the mods calls, but then you had to go and stick your head up your own arse by threatening to ruin a prearranged gathering. I argued for you, asked for you to be given a break as your views were often valid - then you go and become a fucking psycho, which makes me look bad for voicing my support.

No one asked me to come here, I saw it mentioned on an unrelated site and popped along. It just pisses me off when someone has to rebuild the past to give their actions justification.

:raise:

Well, welcome aboard Cthy!

And for that matter, welcome aboard Jackalope.  I don't give a fuck what you've been accused of on other sites; the only thing that will get you banned on this site would be your behaviour here: and stating your opinions is not a bannable offense.  Don't disrupt the functionality of the forums, don't commit any felonies or engage in harassment of other members, and you'll be fine.

I have to tell you though, on a personal level:your comments about the "bucket of shit" were just really stupid. You should have realized that this would just give them the ammo they needed to now justify their previously unjustifiable banning of you.

RPGPundit

Quote from: RPGPunditI have to tell you though, on a personal level:your comments about the "bucket of shit" were just really stupid. You should have realized that this would just give them the ammo they needed to now justify their previously unjustifiable banning of you.

RPGPundit

It did strike me a bit odd that someone who is a criminal justice major would resort to threats (on the internet where it's clearly documented for all to see no less) against the physical well being of others, or be so quick to bouts of aggression.


Anywho, to your earlier mention of "queen bees", it definately exists in the other site.  I just try to ignore it.  For example, I can't help but get the feeling that Tehana is one of those.  She often posts pictures of herself, usually in cosplay, and revels at the dozens of comments that follow.  comments that are all the same:

"How Youuuu doin'?"
"I'll be in my bunk"
etc.

She's alright, looks-wise, but I doubt she gets the attention IRL that she does on that forum.  And unlike many of the other women who post on that board, I don't see a whole lot of contribution to actual discussion of many of the topics posted.  But I'll be damned if she isn't a forum favorite.  But since it's relatively harmless, I suppose it's no big deal.  

It's kind of a shame to most of the other women who are interesting to have a conversation with and also just so happen to be attractive, as there's this stereotype and assumption that they too are queen bees before they even get a chance to speak.  And since there is a common attitude of high school boy maturity among many of the posters there, one of these women can say something completely thoughtfull and it would be ignored under a deluge of "horny boy" posts commenting on her boobs or something.  

So yes, Tangency sure does love their queen bees.

Heya!

You took my old Nutkinland sig, and turned it into your username!;)

Welcome aboard!

Quote from: DrewNot quite. They banned you for making a group attack against women gamers in a thread about personal observations about women gamers.

That's not a group attack against women.  That's an explanation of why I think certain types of women are drawn to gaming.  I didn't even say it was a fact, I said it was a theory that attempt to explain why my own personal experience with women in my game has been so largely unpleasant.

A group attack requires actually attacking some group of people.  I only attempted to explain my own experiences.

Quote from: HackmastergeneralJeez more violent threats. You need to attend some anger management classes.

:rolleyes:  Since you're obviously very slow on the uptake, next time I will do more than wink when I make a joke.

Quote from: RPGPunditDo you have a link to Lyon's journal?

Here ya go. (http://anaka.livejournal.com/)  She's deleted all of my comments.  The original comment I left there was taking her to task for jumping in on the post-ban dogpiling that occurred, when her use of a quote from me in her sig.line was a perfect example of the sort of social ostracization games too which I had referred.  Within minutes of posting the comment Darren responded telling me I was permabanned.  That's when I decided to play Internet Terrorist.  

Also, I'd point out that I got the idea to threaten the meet-up when, completely unprovoked, Michelle claimed she was scared to go to the meet-up because I might be there.  Now, she did this because she's the sort of person who plays social ostracization games.  Nevermind that her fears were completely unfounded and unreasonable, she felt the need to let everyone know that she was scared of me (more likely she was scared that if we met IRL I'd bring up her shitty arguments about gender in gaming, and utter inability to argue her points rationally), she wanted everyone to know she was "scared" of me because that makes me look like the Big Bad Wolf, scaring the Poor Delicate Little Girl.  In a forum full of male gamers with White Knight Syndrome, such tactics are an excellent way for women who can't defend their beliefs rationally to protect their opinions from criticism.  So she's the one who put the idea in my mind, and I decided to prey on her fears.  She wanted to cast me in the role of Dangerous Internet Person, and I played along.

So in other words you said 'Its a Trap!' complete with Admiral Ackbar voice...



.... then made sure to stand right in the middle of the big red X on the ground as long as you could stand to make sure it caught you.




Good to know.

Quote from: Acta Est FabulaIt did strike me a bit odd that someone who is a criminal justice major would resort to threats (on the internet where it's clearly documented for all to see no less) against the physical well being of others, or be so quick to bouts of aggression.


Anywho, to your earlier mention of "queen bees", it definately exists in the other site.  I just try to ignore it.  For example, I can't help but get the feeling that Tehana is one of those.  She often posts pictures of herself, usually in cosplay, and revels at the dozens of comments that follow.  comments that are all the same:

"How Youuuu doin'?"
"I'll be in my bunk"
etc.

She's alright, looks-wise, but I doubt she gets the attention IRL that she does on that forum.  And unlike many of the other women who post on that board, I don't see a whole lot of contribution to actual discussion of many of the topics posted.  But I'll be damned if she isn't a forum favorite.  But since it's relatively harmless, I suppose it's no big deal.  

It's kind of a shame to most of the other women who are interesting to have a conversation with and also just so happen to be attractive, as there's this stereotype and assumption that they too are queen bees before they even get a chance to speak.  And since there is a common attitude of high school boy maturity among many of the posters there, one of these women can say something completely thoughtfull and it would be ignored under a deluge of "horny boy" posts commenting on her boobs or something.  

So yes, Tangency sure does love their queen bees.

I think there's a lot of truth to that, but I guess my reaction is "Meh. S'internet gamer forum innit? "

RPGnet definitely does have a culture, and that culture is obviously heavily influenced by the posters as a whole, and by a sizeable minority in particular. But again, I don't lose sleep over that.



As for Jackalope, I'm never happy when a new member ends up getting himself banned due to a failure to understand the above culture. But pretty much even the ones that start off with a warning on Day One do tend to settle down after that.
In Jackalope's case he simply only kept opening his mouth to change feet.

And whilst the forum sympathy level was low - and the pisstaking level conversely high - some posters did indeed stand up for him on some things.

And just to set things in perspective - Jackalope was banned three times, in very short order. That actually takes some doing if you are other than a p0rn-spammer.

The first time was for three days (which is obviously beyond a warning, but hardly excommunication).

The second time, presumably following the return after three days, was for 30 days, essentially for being a dick. Now that's a serious ban, but it was still only temporary.

The third time, the permaban, took place during the above 30 days, for reasons well-described elsewhere.

As for Jackalope's apparent assertion that he was only "roleplaying" the Dangerous Internet Person - I wish him luck with that.:cool:  
(On the plus sides, that does give me an idea for a My Life with Master character, and of course the whole episode has re-introduced me to this forum. :D   )

Quote from: MotorskillsI think there's a lot of truth to that, but I guess my reaction is "Meh. S'internet gamer forum innit? "

No, I understand.  That's why I tend to ignore most of that stuff.  It just kind of makes you want to roll your eyes bit when you see a group of guys fall all over themselves in a form of internet cock-posturing like they've never gotten laid before.

I suppose if you want to play games, you have to deal with the socially awkward person that comes to every group.

Quote from: RPGPunditWell, welcome aboard Cthy!

And for that matter, welcome aboard Jackalope.  I don't give a fuck what you've been accused of on other sites; the only thing that will get you banned on this site would be your behaviour here: and stating your opinions is not a bannable offense.  Don't disrupt the functionality of the forums, don't commit any felonies or engage in harassment of other members, and you'll be fine.

RPGPundit

Howdy boss, thanks for the welcome. S'cool site you've got here.

Quote from: JackalopeThat's not a group attack against women.  That's an explanation of why I think certain types of women are drawn to gaming.  I didn't even say it was a fact, I said it was a theory that attempt to explain why my own personal experience with women in my game has been so largely unpleasant.

A group attack requires actually attacking some group of people.  I only attempted to explain my own experiences.

Please. The fact that you believe the above to be true doesn't stop it from being a group attack.

I've bolded the relevant part of your post, just in case you really are confused as to why a site like RPGnet would take you to task over it. You identified a group, then attacked it by claiming it's members were "mentally unstable, physically unattractive, and financially instable -- i.e. subaverage women."

If you can't see how that would be interpreted as a contravention of RPGnet's rules, pet theory or not, then I have really have nothing more to say to you.

Welcome to the four new members we appear to've picked up from this kerfuffle.

Quote from: DrewI've bolded the relevant part of your post, just in case you really are confused as to why a site like RPGnet would take you to task over it. You identified a group, then attacked it by claiming it's members were "mentally unstable, physically unattractive, and financially instable -- i.e. subaverage women."

No.  That's not what I said.  You have a reading comprehension problem.

I was theorizing why mentally unstable, physically unattractive, and financially instable -- i.e. subaverage women -- seem to be drawn to gaming.  There is a very real and meaningful difference between what I said and how you are summarizing it.  You seem to be under the greatly mistaken impression that I was identifying women gamers as mentally unstable, physically unattractive, and financially instable.  That is not what I said at all.  I was attempting to explain why I had encountered so many subaverage women in my gaming career.  You can't attack subaverage women by identifying them as subaverage women.

There's nothing in what I said to get offended by, unless of course you can't actually comprehend written English.  Which I honestly think is a huge part of the problem.  I am constantly amazed by people's utter inability to read simple English.

Unless, of course, you consider acknowledging that subaverage women exist is an attack on women as a whole.  Which is exactly how people reacted.  But that's utterly irrational.  Subaverage women must exist, it's necessitated by the existence of average and above average women.

A rational person would agree that the average woman is not mentally unstable, physically unattractive, and financially instable, and that these are negative traits, and thus a woman displaying these traits must be subaverage.

It's really not that hard to comprehend, unless you're a moderator on rpg.net.

Any appeal to rationality by a person who threatens physical violence and degredation is inherently ridiculous. You know what you did, and no amount of half-arsed, self righteous justification will distract from that.

I'm done with this. Enjoy your stay here.

Quote from: DrewAny appeal to rationality by a person who threatens physical violence and degredation is inherently ridiculous. You know what you did, and no amount of half-arsed, self righteous justification will distract from that.

I'm done with this. Enjoy your stay here.

Translation:  You can't actually defend what you just claimed, and refuse to admit you were wrong.

You're pathetic.

Quote from: Motorskills(On the plus sides, that does give me an idea for a My Life with Master character, and of course the whole episode has re-introduced me to this forum. :D   )

Welcome aboard, Motorskills, and might I ask: how did this incident serve to "re-introduce" you to this forum? How did you come to find out about theRPGsite due to this incident?

RPGPundit

Quote from: JackalopeI was theorizing why mentally unstable, physically unattractive, and financially instable -- i.e. subaverage women -- seem to be drawn to gaming.  

Like attracts like.

Of course, it's just your experience, so...

Quote from: JackalopeThat's when I decided to play Internet Terrorist.

QuoteShe wanted to cast me in the role of Dangerous Internet Person, and I played along.

Sounds to me like you walked right into being banned.  I can't imagine any reasonably run forum that would put up with someone posing as an "Internet Terrorist" or "Dangerous Internet Person" even if the script had been written by others.

Quote from: RPGPunditAnd for that matter, welcome aboard Jackalope.  I don't give a fuck what you've been accused of on other sites; the only thing that will get you banned on this site would be your behaviour here: and stating your opinions is not a bannable offense.  Don't disrupt the functionality of the forums, don't commit any felonies or engage in harassment of other members, and you'll be fine.

And while you're extending such a warm welcome to a turd the size of Jackalope, you can extend a farewell to me and delete my account here.

Quote from: O'BorgAnd while you're extending such a warm welcome to a turd the size of Jackalope, you can extend a farewell to me and delete my account here.

I'm not normally into the translation business, but let me put the above into English.

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!
:bawling:

I get it, Jackalope's a dick, but as long as he doesn't bring the forum to a screeching halt with his douchebaggery, who really cares?

There was a reference in one of the discussion threads that reminded me I needed to check up on this place.

Well I lurked here for a while about 6-12 months ago, I forget exactly.

I didn't save the link at the time, which was probably a mistake.  Whilst my spare time is at a premium, the general forum makes a refreshing change from "the other place". and there is useful gaming info here as well.

Quote from: O'BorgAnd while you're extending such a warm welcome to a turd the size of Jackalope, you can extend a farewell to me and delete my account here.

Remind me again, did you leave RPGnet after the Poison'd debacle?

TheRPGsite has dealt with assholes before (Nox, anyone?), but only for what they did here, not there.

Jackalope is getting a warm welcome?

Well fuck, what's a cold welcome around here?

Or did O'Borg mean "warm" as in "flaming"? Is there anyone who, having responded to Jackalope at all, has not abused him?

Is this like how Obama has to go to his old pastor's house and brass it up with an AK-47 before anyone will believe he thinks the guy said some stupid stuff?

Quote from: Kyle AaronJackalope is getting a warm welcome?

Well fuck, what's a cold welcome around here?

Or did O'Borg mean "warm" as in "flaming"? Is there anyone who, having responded to Jackalope at all, has not abused him?

Is this like how Obama has to go to his old pastor's house and brass it up with an AK-47 before anyone will believe he thinks the guy said some stupid stuff?

To heck with that, I have more of a problem of the old vocal (or is it postal on a fourm?), exit as some kind of moral stand, as I don't see any other reason to do so. I mean it's not like some dumbass posting stupid shit online is the evil that happens when good men do nothing.

It's slacktivism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slacktivism), baby! O'Borg probably forwards emails about oppression in Tibet, and joins Facebook groups protesting the Iraq war.

Jackalope appears to be a cocksmock. But no doubt he will soon toke up again once more, calm down a lot, laugh and shake his head at himself, then settle down to not gaming at all and just dropping sarcastic comments in threads about gaming, apparently SOP for heavy tokers.

Quote from: JackalopeTranslation:  You can't actually defend what you just claimed, and refuse to admit you were wrong.

Nope. I could have quite easily pulled your argument apart by highlighting your confusion between subjective experience and objective reality as the foundtion of a theoretical posture based largely on frothing misogyny.

I really couldn't be bothered though. You're a fucking internet stalker who's beyond reason.

If I may be so bold.  I think Jackalope deserves as much of a chance here as anyone else.  I do think his assessment of anyone as sub-average indicates he'll dig his own grave.  But I don't deny him the chance to participate here.

He's been thrown out of the padded room.

Welcome to the meat grinder.

The rpgsite not generally banning people means that we're free to speak our minds.

Agreed. He's his own worst enemy anyway.

Quote from: David JohansenIf I may be so bold.  I think Jackalope deserves as much of a chance here as anyone else.  I do think his assessment of anyone as sub-average indicates he'll dig his own grave.  But I don't deny him the chance to participate here.

He's been thrown out of the padded room.

Welcome to the meat grinder.

The rpgsite not generally banning people means that we're free to speak our minds.

Wasn't Nox eventually banned?

I think you could make a really good arguement both ways.

One one hand, preventative medicine is a good thing.  "Ounce of prevention, etc"  Does anyone here seriously think he's not going to have the exact same thing happen here?  Why put yourself through all that?  Given the no moderation policy, the shit that set him off on arpig is like magnified twentyfold here.  He got upset with people making fun of him - and then came right to the place that not only will do that 10fold over tBP, but also won't censure people for it, so he's going to catch much worse stuff here than he did on arpig.  Its like watching a guy with a leaky can of propane walk into a Matchmakers convention - no good can possibly come of this.

On the other, he's comported him self better in the non-rpg.net related threads than he ever did on tBP.  Maybe he does.  Plus it would really fly in the face of everything the Pundit claims to stand for if he bans him for shit from tBP.

Further flipped, you can't ignore a mans history.  Hes shown a willingness to take board issues off-board and track down and follow people with threats and intimidation.  Perhaps he's just not worth the effort.

Quote from: HackmastergeneralOne one hand, preventative medicine is a good thing.  "Ounce of prevention, etc"  Does anyone here seriously think he's not going to have the exact same thing happen here?  Why put yourself through all that?

You  should change your name to Witchhuntergeneral, it would suit your personality better.

QuoteGiven the no moderation policy, the shit that set him off on arpig is like magnified twentyfold here.  He got upset with people making fun of him -

No idiot, the shit that set me off on rpg.net was the piss-poor moderation.  I have no problem with people making fun of me, I have a problem with a moderation staff that takes me to task for "insulting people" when no insult was made nor intended, and then proceeds to either outright mock me or encourage other users to mock me.  it wasn't the mockery that bothered me, it was the HYPOCRISY and ABUSE OF AUTHORITY.  RPG Pundit is never going to provoke the kind of reaction out of me, because while he may have some opinions that I disagree with (and some I agree with), he doesn't appear to be a completely hypocritical asswipe like Nina, Darren, et al.

When you play in someone elses house you play by their rules, if you dont like it dont go there.

But I have to agree with you the moderation is flipping awful and theres no real way of challenging a mods call. Thats just the way it is, its never going to change.

I did however frequently ask for the piss taking thread about you to be closed and the response I got was "No, we like this thread, its gonna stay open." In my eyes it damaged any faith I had left in their mod staff - acting childish and pathetic.

But then you went all crazy eyed and threatening, you lost me I'm afraid. :raise:

Quote from: MotorskillsThere was a reference in one of the discussion threads that reminded me I needed to check up on this place.

Well I lurked here for a while about 6-12 months ago, I forget exactly.

I didn't save the link at the time, which was probably a mistake.  Whilst my spare time is at a premium, the general forum makes a refreshing change from "the other place". and there is useful gaming info here as well.

Well, that's cool. I'm glad you're here, and hope you stick around now! Personally, I think our RPG-discussion tends to be much more lively and interesting than theirs.

RPGPundit

Quote from: HackmastergeneralWasn't Nox eventually banned?

IIRC, he was banned from the Off Topic forum only.

Quote from: HackmastergeneralWasn't Nox eventually banned?

Nox was never banned. NO ONE has ever been banned from theRPGsite (apart from spammers), as of yet.

Nox was locked out of the Off-topic forum only, and left the site of his own accord as a result. And good riddance to him.
Locking people out of certain forums is, thus far, the worst sanction that has ever been applied here in a year of operation.

QuoteHe got upset with people making fun of him - and then came right to the place that not only will do that 10fold over tBP, but also won't censure people for it, so he's going to catch much worse stuff here than he did on arpig.

I can't say for sure, I'm sure he could tell you, but I'm betting from what I saw in the relevant RPG.net threads was that Jackalope got "upset" because he was being unfairly moderated, and then people started mocking him and were allowed to do so with impunity, while his every statement was being watched with hawk-like attention for any potentially bannable offense.  Its understandable how something like that could lead someone into a rage once he got banned; its unfortunately stupid on his part that he chose to express that rage the way he did.

theRPGsite is different. People can mock him here, sure. He can also argue back. No one is going to censure him for stating his opinions, as long as said opinions are on-topic to the thread he's saying them on, and not trolling that disrupts the functioning of the forum. Their actual content is not subject to censorship the way they are in RPG.net, where even actually factual comments can get you banned if they don't fit with what the modclique wants to hear.

So I'm hopeful that he'll be ok here. On the other hand if he's really just an oversensitive guy that freaks out at anyone arguing with him, well, then you're right, he won't last long here. But from what I saw, it was way more about the fact that on RPG.net the modclique had tied his hands behind his back while giving everyone who didn't like him tire irons, and told them to go nuts.  I mean shit, they wrote 60 fucking pages of people hurling abuse at him. It made me think of what I imagine the scene must have been back when they burned heretics in the village square; howling mobs hurling obscenities and abuse in an orgy of insult, letting all their pettiness and animal frustrations out on the chosen victim, before he was finally executed, to show everyone else how conformity wins. It was pretty fucking sick.

 

QuotePlus it would really fly in the face of everything the Pundit claims to stand for if he bans him for shit from tBP.

Exactly. Which is why I would never do such a thing, and said as much upthread.

QuoteFurther flipped, you can't ignore a mans history.  Hes shown a willingness to take board issues off-board and track down and follow people with threats and intimidation.  Perhaps he's just not worth the effort.

Let me clarify here: if any member of theRPGsite gets consistently stalked or threatened by any other member, on PMs, emails, or anything else off-site, please let me know. It will of course be taken very seriously. Stalking someone on PMs or emails would be no different than if someone was consistently stalking someone in the threads on the forum. Its something I'd see very negatively, and would take action about if it was serious enough.

Of course, if the dude is threatening you by some medium outside of the internet, then you really don't want to get in touch with a forum administrator so much as you might want to get in touch with some agency of Law Enforcement.

RPGPundit

Quote from: CthyWhen you play in someone elses house you play by their rules, if you dont like it dont go there.

But I have to agree with you the moderation is flipping awful and theres no real way of challenging a mods call. Thats just the way it is, its never going to change.

I did however frequently ask for the piss taking thread about you to be closed and the response I got was "No, we like this thread, its gonna stay open." In my eyes it damaged any faith I had left in their mod staff - acting childish and pathetic.

Yup. That's why you should stick around here and participate in theRPGsite: we're NOT an "emotionally safe environment", but at least the administration isn't a gang of power-tripping petty hypocrites.

RPGPundit

Good to hear.:D

Quote from: JackalopeI have no problem with people making fun of me, ....

Oh, so you don't have a problem when I say:

"When you claim to be a criminal justice major, but admit to spending time in jail, going off on violent rampages, and engaging in illegal drug use, I hate to break it to to you, but the above behavior doesn't transfer over into credits for a degree.  So your 'major' is either complete bullshit, or one of the most ironic things I've heard in a long time."

Or you don't have a problem if I post something like this, which is fast becoming my opinion of you:

(http://img383.imageshack.us/img383/5835/bjorkstalkerdn5.jpg)

We should move on now, methinks.

Quote from: HackmastergeneralFurther flipped, you can't ignore a mans history.  Hes shown a willingness to take board issues off-board and track down and follow people with threats and intimidation.  Perhaps he's just not worth the effort.

The difference is, nobody here is afraid of him. I think our delicate sensibilities can survive the onslaught of yet another Toughest Guy On The Internet.

You seem terribly eager to be RPG.net's most ardent defender on this board, Hackmastergeneral. Why is that? I mean, do as you like, but it seems like a pointless effort.

Quote from: laffingboyThe difference is, nobody here is afraid of him. I think our delicate sensibilities can survive the onslaught of yet another Toughest Guy On The Internet.

You seem terribly eager to be RPG.net's most ardent defender on this board, Hackmastergeneral. Why is that? I mean, do as you like, but it seems like a pointless effort.

And it has nothing to do with "sensibilities" , its has to do with "Is the amount of time effort and bandwidth this guy is going to suck up worth the investment he is likely to put in?"  On one hand, he's comporing himself fairly well here.  On the other, how long is it before someone sets him off?  And then we've seen where that road lies - is just accepting the inevitable and punching this guys ticket ahead of time the right route?

I don't see it happening, but the point was, this guy has already flamed out on two different forums.  In the last one, he tracked people down and threatened them quite viciously on private non-related websites.  He caused the cancellation of a meet-n-greet because he threatened to show up and do violence to those in attendance, and has made very specific and pointed threats to the board in general.

I agree, he's full of sound and fury, signifying nothing - but on the other hand, can you be too careful?

Meh.

As for the rest, it has nothing to do with "eager to defend".  I enjoy the place, and also enjoy this place.  For different reasons.  When I smell bullshit, which the bitchfests about bannings from rpg.net often involve, I call it.

If I see something wrong at tBP, I'll call that out too.  But overall, I don't have a problem with the modding there - its overall pretty fair.  Honestly, I fail to see what people bitch about, because most other forums that have any kind of modding are run with an iron fist and jackbooted heel, and no dissent or discussion of mod calls is allowed.  Trouble tickets is a veritable bitchfest.  And there are plenty of websites where modding has little to no oversight, and it turns into a petty tinpot dictatorship.  The thing is, when you get your dander up, then they'll stop listening, but if you raise issues reasonably, they usually respond reasonably.  But, on the other hand they are human, and mistakes are made.  They're pretty good at owning up to genuine mistakes.  Most other websites won't admit to mistakes at all.

Quote from: RPGPunditI can't say for sure, I'm sure he could tell you, but I'm betting from what I saw in the relevant RPG.net threads was that Jackalope got "upset" because he was being unfairly moderated, and then people started mocking him and were allowed to do so with impunity, while his every statement was being watched with hawk-like attention for any potentially bannable offense.  Its understandable how something like that could lead someone into a rage once he got banned; its unfortunately stupid on his part that he chose to express that rage the way he did.

theRPGsite is different. People can mock him here, sure. He can also argue back. No one is going to censure him for stating his opinions, as long as said opinions are on-topic to the thread he's saying them on, and not trolling that disrupts the functioning of the forum. Their actual content is not subject to censorship the way they are in RPG.net, where even actually factual comments can get you banned if they don't fit with what the modclique wants to hear.

So I'm hopeful that he'll be ok here. On the other hand if he's really just an oversensitive guy that freaks out at anyone arguing with him, well, then you're right, he won't last long here. But from what I saw, it was way more about the fact that on RPG.net the modclique had tied his hands behind his back while giving everyone who didn't like him tire irons, and told them to go nuts.  I mean shit, they wrote 60 fucking pages of people hurling abuse at him. It made me think of what I imagine the scene must have been back when they burned heretics in the village square; howling mobs hurling obscenities and abuse in an orgy of insult, letting all their pettiness and animal frustrations out on the chosen victim, before he was finally executed, to show everyone else how conformity wins. It was pretty fucking sick.

If I were a woman, I'd want to have your babies.  You. Rock.

We're going to get along fine.

Quote from: Acta Est FabulaOh, so you don't have a problem when I say:

"When you claim to be a criminal justice major, but admit to spending time in jail, going off on violent rampages, and engaging in illegal drug use, I hate to break it to to you, but the above behavior doesn't transfer over into credits for a degree.  So your 'major' is either complete bullshit, or one of the most ironic things I've heard in a long time."

I've never been to jail, nor claimed to have spent time in jail.  I've never even gotten a traffic ticket.  My legal record is, in fact, spotless.

I am bothered when people attribute claims to me that I did not make.  That's lying, and I would rather you not spread lies about me.  The rest of what you said is merely stupid and hyperbolic.  It certainly doesn't bother me.

Quote from: Jackalope.........................................................................................
I am bothered when people attribute claims to me that I did not make.  That's lying, and I would rather you not spread lies about me.  The rest of what you said is merely stupid and hyperbolic.  It certainly doesn't bother me.

Want some cheese with that whine?

The point is made - you are building a paper trail of statements in text that guarantee you will never get a job in the criminal justice system.
And yeah, you fit the word "unstable" - thats why I used it in another thread title.

This thread was originally about Curt and his banning - maybe you could e-mail him and you two can have a nice game together?


- Ed C.

Quote from: JackalopeI've never been to jail, nor claimed to have spent time in jail.  I've never even gotten a traffic ticket.  My legal record is, in fact, spotless.

I am bothered when people attribute claims to me that I did not make.  That's lying, and I would rather you not spread lies about me.  The rest of what you said is merely stupid and hyperbolic.  It certainly doesn't bother me.

I swore I read that you spent a brief time in jail.  But you know what? That's only one of the things I had listed, and even if you disregard it, it doesn't take away from my point at all.  That being, I find it dripping with irony that you claim to be a criminal justice major while breaking laws (threats of bodily harm online, smoking weed), and not only engage in violent rampages, but encouraging them as normal behavior (...anyone who is 30 and hasn't been in a bar fight isn't living.)

So how exactly is that stupid and hyperbolic if it's true?  As I see it, one of 3 things are true:

1. You do in fact have a record and are headed for disaster
2. You're still living in your basement and feel the need to make shit up to make yourself look more badass on the internet
3. You're genuinely a victim of multi-personality disorder.

Quote from: Acta Est FabulaI swore I read that you spent a brief time in jail.

I'm sure you believe a lot of nonsense that has no basis in reality.

QuoteBut you know what? That's only one of the things I had listed, and even if you disregard it, it doesn't take away from my point at all.

It does take away from your point if you're completely wrong though.

QuoteThat being, I find it dripping with irony that you claim to be a criminal justice major while breaking laws (threats of bodily harm online, smoking weed), and not only engage in violent rampages, but encouraging them as normal behavior (...anyone who is 30 and hasn't been in a bar fight isn't living.)

Do you understand that a criminal record and drug use would not, in any way, prevent one from getting a degree from a college?  A hardened ex-con once found guilty of murder could pursue a criminal justice degree.

QuoteSo how exactly is that stupid and hyperbolic if it's true?  As I see it, one of 3 things are true:

1. You do in fact have a record and are headed for disaster
2. You're still living in your basement and feel the need to make shit up to make yourself look more badass on the internet
3. You're genuinely a victim of multi-personality disorder.

None of those things is remotely true.

Quote from: KoltarThe point is made - you are building a paper trail of statements in text that guarantee you will never get a job in the criminal justice system.

I'm not interested in a job in the criminal justice system.  Many people keep assuming that, but when I got my degree I never had any intention of going into that line of work.  I walk with a limp due to a dog attack when I was 10.  I was never going to be a cop.  You have to be able to run 1.5 miles in 10 minutes to become a cop (or something, I forget the exact figure).  I can't run more than 100 yards without my ankle giving out, and spend most of my time wearing an ankle brace.

Quote from: Jackalope.....................................................................

 I walk with a limp due to a dog attack when I was 10.  I was never going to be a cop.  You have to be able to run 1.5 miles in 10 minutes to become a cop (or something, I forget the exact figure).  I can't run more than 100 yards without my ankle giving out, and spend most of my time wearing an ankle brace.

No sympathy from me.

You act like a jerk on the internet.
 I've had to use a cane to walk since 2005 - that doesn't change the fact that things go a lot easier when you try to get along with people.

You also admit to pursuing a degree in a career path where you claim you don't have much a chance of getting a job.

Sounds like you're either a defeatist or not real bright in making your schooling and career choices.
(Does explain a little why the Forge stuff appealed to you)


- Ed C.

Quote from: HackmastergeneralI enjoy the place, and also enjoy this place.  For different reasons.  When I smell bullshit, which the bitchfests about bannings from rpg.net often involve, I call it.

A fair answer, and another bullshit spotter can't be a bad thing.

Jackalope will be whatever he's gonna be. This board won't indulge him with the hysterical swooning that other sites would, so he'll either unfuck himself and get with the program, or he'll be mocked and ignored 'till he goes off to some other messageboard where he can be the Scary Crazy Guy. Either way, who gives a shit?

At least he can write in clear and coherent sentences, which puts him several notches above most of the assholes clogging up the Internet (present company excluded, of course).

Quote from: laffingboyA fair answer, and another bullshit spotter can't be a bad thing.

Jackalope will be whatever he's gonna be. This board won't indulge him with the hysterical swooning that other sites would, so he'll either unfuck himself and get with the program, or he'll be mocked and ignored 'till he goes off to some other messageboard where he can be the Scary Crazy Guy. Either way, who gives a shit?

At least he can write in clear and coherent sentences, which puts him several notches above most of the assholes clogging up the Internet (present company excluded, of course).

With Jackalope, the bullshit is so strong, you'd have to have synthesia not to smell it.

But yeah, my meaning in posting that wasn't to try to lobby to get him tossed - it was just asking some very pointed questions, to provoke thought.  I never operated under any delusions he'd get the shift - Pundit wouldn't do that, he'd get roundly hung from every corner of this place for the seeming hypocritical (though in some ways intelligent and cautious) decision.  Beyond that, he just wouldn't do it - its not in his nature to toss someone out for another boards mess, most notably BP's.

Quote from: Chango ChiI don't believe a fucking word you post, you're not only a massive failure but also a huge liar.

In what way, little boy?  Thats big words, can you back em up with some actual fact, or are you still smarting over getting tossed from the .net, and like the little bitch you are, start lashing out at others?  

Seriously, what?

Quote from: KoltarNo sympathy from me.

I wasn't asking for sympathy.  I'm just bored of people telling me how I'm never going to get a job in the criminal justice without first bothering to fidn out if that's my goal.

QuoteYou act like a jerk on the internet.

And clearly, that makes me unique.  I mean, I think you act like a jerk on the internet.  So....buttons?

QuoteYou also admit to pursuing a degree in a career path where you claim you don't have much a chance of getting a job.

Sounds like you're either a defeatist or not real bright in making your schooling and career choices.
(Does explain a little why the Forge stuff appealed to you)

:rolleyes:  Having a college degree of any sort is valued by many employers.  I am, for example, more likely to be promoted to management by the company I work for than many of my co-workers, who do not have college degrees.

Quote from: JackalopeAnd clearly, that makes me unique.  I mean, I think you act like a jerk on the internet.  So....buttons?

You actually think KOLTAR acts like a jerk?  Wow...

Just shows how you'll lash out at anyone and everything who criticizes you and gets in your way.

Quote from: HackmastergeneralYou actually think KOLTAR acts like a jerk?  Wow...

I don't know if 'jerk' is the word I'd use. 'Ass', maybe. 'Schmuck', definitely.

Quote from: droogI don't know if 'jerk' is the word I'd use. 'Ass', maybe. 'Schmuck', definitely.

Schmuck, sure.  I can see.  But JERK?  A less offensive poster I cannot imagine.

Quote from: KoltarSounds like you're either a defeatist or not real bright in making your schooling and career choices.
(Does explain a little why the Forge stuff appealed to you)

Some of that Forge stuff appeals to me too, koltar.

Regards,
David R

Quote from: David RSome of that Forge stuff appeals to me too, koltar.

Regards,
David R

Yes - but you've proven to be quite reasonable, and all the arguments I've seen you involved in you tend to debate things with intelligence and style.


Jackalope on the other hand.......

Quote from: David RSome of that Forge stuff appeals to me too, koltar.

Nobody's perfect.

Quote from: Kyle AaronNobody's perfect.

You will change your mind about Forge games, when I run them for you, Kyle.

Regards,
David R

Quote from: Jackalope:rolleyes:  Having a college degree of any sort is valued by many employers.  I am, for example, more likely to be promoted to management by the company I work for than many of my co-workers, who do not have college degrees.

Yeah, but you're screwed.  You either show up to work stoned off your ass, or it seems when you're not stoned, you're prone to go off on a rage.  In either case, regardless of degree, employers don't look to fondly upon that behavior.

Are you guxys actually discussing his job-credentials?
And his general life-success-chances?

What´s wrong with everyone of you?

Quote from: SettembriniAre you guxys actually discussing his job-credentials?
And his general life-success-chances?

What´s wrong with everyone of you?

They are a gang of unctuous and sanctimonious idiots, each reinforcing the other's belief that if they blow enough hot air across the internet something of consequence will happen.  Or perhaps they merely are infatuated with their own uniformed, ignornat opinions.  They would hardly be uniqure in that respect.   It's extremely pathetic watching them fall all over themselves to hurl judgments and make their asinine assertions.

Really, they're no different than the idiots over at rpg.net (or the idiots anywhere else).  Thankfully, here I won't get banned for pointing out that they are mere idiots with mouths full of shit, and hearts full of spite, except here they don't have the permission of the moderators, and my hands aren't being tied behind my back to prevent me from responding to them honestly.  

Which means I can freely say they are mere fools for a scandal, blithering dunderheads enraptured by their ability to crap from their mouths.

Quote from: HackmastergeneralYou actually think KOLTAR acts like a jerk?  Wow...

Just shows how you'll lash out at anyone and everything who criticizes you and gets in your way.

I don't have a problem with people who criticize me.  I do think people who criticize me in an uniformed, ignorant way while refusing to hear out my side are jerks.  But that makes me utterly ununique amongst men.  So you, Koltar, and the others who have managed to talk about me for five days now: jerks.

I mean really, do you honestly expect me to see you differently?  All you've done is dissemble righteousness, shoving your petty little judgments in my face.  Why on Earth would I have anything but a low opinion of you?  You are foolish, rude and contemptible, as are Koltar and several others, the very definition of jerks.

And before you say it, yes, I am well aware that you perceive me the same way.  Honestly, if you feel the need to point out something so blindingly obvious once more, you will only be proving that you're a fool in love with his own opinions.

So sayeth the Pot...

Quote from: SettembriniAre you guxys actually discussing his job-credentials?
And his general life-success-chances?

What´s wrong with everyone of you?

I SERIOUSLY agree with Settembrini here. Since he got here, I can't think of (or haven't seen) anything that Jackalope has done that has in any way come even close to being offensive, except in as much as he's gotten himself caught up in this flamewar with a bunch of people who resent him from Rpg.net and are trying to continue the public pillory that was started over there.

Let it the fuck go, people. You don't like Jackalope? Fine. You're entitled not to. But you'd be smarter to just stop talking about him. Let him post about RPGs, rather than wasting his time arguing with you peoples' attacks, and let's see how useful or detrimental to THIS site he is on his merits regarding RPG-discussion.
And meanwhile, all of you that are having this stupid-ass argument could do worse than to go write about RPGs yourselves.

RPGPundit


PS: my advice to you, Jackalope, would be to ignore these guys and just participate in threads about RPGs.  You've dismissed them already, anyone who looks will be able to form their opinion about whether you or they are in the wrong, and again, you seem like a smart guy so this sort of squabbling ought to be beneath you.
At least, in my own personal experience, I've found that the best responses are found in actually showing your superiority, not just talking about it. When the Swine were attacking me with personal attacks, I'd fire backs with attacks on Swine ideologies. When they banned me from RPG.net, I started the blog; and when they claimed that my blog would never go anywhere, I didn't waste time just insulting them, I went ahead and created one of the most successful RPG blogs on the net (and insulted them in the process, which is way cooler than just insulting them and not actually accomplishing anything aside from the insult). Then they did the same thing, mocking theRPGsite; my revenge was to make theRPGsite a huge success and to prove that the modclique's claims that you couldn't possibly have an RPG discussion site worth going to without heavy moderation was a lie.
So you want "revenge" on these guys, go write in the main RPG forum, start threads there, comment on other threads here, design, actual play, the amber forum if you're into Amber, and prove yourself to be a valuable commentator on RPGs.  Then you would come to be respected and liked here, and I'm even betting that many of the people who've argued with you here would have to admit they were wrong; and the other ones are already people who aren't very well-liked around here to begin with, so being seen as a more essential poster than they are would be a more than suitable revenge.

Actually, I just hate his habit of doing three or four posts in a row as SOP.

That shit gets old quick.

Is Jackalope a RPG now? Because we sure are talking about him a lot for something that isn't a game.

Quote from: RPGPunditI SERIOUSLY agree with Settembrini here. Since he got here, I can't think of (or haven't seen) anything that Jackalope has done that has in any way come even close to being offensive, except in as much as he's gotten himself caught up in this flamewar with a bunch of people who resent him from Rpg.net and are trying to continue the public pillory that was started over there.

He tracked people he got in a pissing match with to their live journals, and sent multiple threatening emails and messages.  Can you really blame people?  And if you haven't noticed, a bunch of people who are smacking him around here don't even post on RPG.net.

QuoteLet it the fuck go, people. You don't like Jackalope? Fine. You're entitled not to. But you'd be smarter to just stop talking about him. Let him post about RPGs, rather than wasting his time arguing with you peoples' attacks, and let's see how useful or detrimental to THIS site he is on his merits regarding RPG-discussion.
And meanwhile, all of you that are having this stupid-ass argument could do worse than to go write about RPGs yourselves.

RPGPundit

On one hand you telling people to "let it the fuck go" considering how you still go off on rpg.net after, what, 4-5 years after having been banned is delicious delicious irony, you are right.  I've wasted entirely too much of my life, fun as its been, talking about him.  And, again, I am having a positive conversation with him in RPG, and that seems to be going well.

It can't have been that long ago, can it? I found the Pundits blog from comments in teh Blue Rose review before he was banned while I was in Afghanistan... that was, like, 3 years ago....


....wasn't it?

Quote from: SpikeIt can't have been that long ago, can it? I found the Pundits blog from comments in teh Blue Rose review before he was banned while I was in Afghanistan... that was, like, 3 years ago....


....wasn't it?

Was it only three years ago?  Shit man, time is a fucked up bitch...it seems like longer.

I dunno.  It seems longer, but maybe it was only three years ago.

All that crystal meth is wrecking my brain.  Maybe I better stop.

Quote from: HackmastergeneralWas it only three years ago?  Shit man, time is a fucked up bitch...it seems like longer.

I dunno.  It seems longer, but maybe it was only three years ago.

All that crystal meth is wrecking my brain.  Maybe I better stop.

ah but at least it's given you a keen fashion sense, as presented by yon avatar...

Quote from: HackmastergeneralWas it only three years ago?  Shit man, time is a fucked up bitch...it seems like longer.

I dunno.  It seems longer, but maybe it was only three years ago.

All that crystal meth is wrecking my brain.  Maybe I better stop.

do a google search of site:rpg.net nisarg, and you'll get the time frame.  Odd thing about reading some of those old threads is how many tenured posters here talked shit about RPGPundit back then after he was banned, and yet here in today's world they are banned from TPB and now reside here.  A bit ironic, if I do say so myself.

Quote from: Acta Est Fabulado a google search of site:rpg.net nisarg, and you'll get the time frame.  Odd thing about reading some of those old threads is how many tenured posters here talked shit about RPGPundit back then after he was banned, and yet here in today's world they are banned from TPB and now reside here.  A bit ironic, if I do say so myself.

He in fact once internet-threatened to beat up a chum of mine, not unlike Jackalope did to those folks on TBP.

The site, on the other hand, is bigger than its current administrator.

Sett , The Pundit and Pseudoephedrine are right.

JLope made a spectatcle of himself on TBP and continues to do so in threads where the main goal seems to be to mock the shit out of him. He's participating in other threads, is talking about his gaming and is contributing in a positive way to this site.

Let's just drop it folks.

Regards,
David R

Quote from: Spikeah but at least it's given you a keen fashion sense, as presented by yon avatar...

Yeah, thats me and a buddy when we were pretending to be Super Hero Action Rangers.  I'm in the blue.

Quote from: David RSett , The Pundit and Pseudoephedrine are right.

JLope made a spectatcle of himself on TBP and continues to do so in threads where the main goal seems to be to mock the shit out of him. He's participating in other threads, is talking about his gaming and is contributing in a positive way to this site.

Let's just drop it folks.

Regards,
David R

If you haven't seen, between this and the Chi Chango threads, we've moved past it to other stuff.

I'm having a hoot.

"Wild Elf Dude"?

Don't go away mad.

Just go away.



TGA

He´s part or the "Tangency-invasion-Force" I guess. They are trying to subvert the board with their retarded posting culture. There´s about a dozen of them flying around here right now.

If we don´t sit that out, we are bound for Kitten-Pic-hell, I fear!

Quote from: SettembriniHe´s part or the "Tangency-invasion-Force" I guess. They are trying to subvert the board with their retarded posting culture. There´s about a dozen of them flying around here right now.

If we don´t sit that out, we are bound for Kitten-Pic-hell, I fear!

That tar covered brush of yours is mighty broad, I notice.

Quote from: Last KnightThat tar covered brush of yours is mighty broad, I notice.

Well, there's no doubt that these guys came from out of RPG.net; but I certainly don't think it was some kind of intentional conspiracy on the modcliques' part. That would conflict with their believing that "no one goes here" anymore.

RPGPundit

I like it here, but I swear I'm walking if I see a single pathetic arsewiping "Vibes" thread.

I can clearly say that there is very little on the internet thats pisses me off more than someone who asks for +vibes+ because their third cousin, twice removed, has died peacefully in their sleep.

Oooo my lifes soooooo bad, I need some random internet people just to get me through my day.

Oooo, I just stubbed my toe. +vibes+.

Ooooo my bums big +vibes+.

Stupid fucking vibes gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
Godamnit
:mad:

news just in - 'Cthy on a rampage in the Fishergate Centre 'cause someone said they felt peaky'

hAVE A BARMCAKE :)

Its a feckin bread roll.






















Sorry, I'm not from up t'north.

Quote from: RPGPunditWell, there's no doubt that these guys came from out of RPG.net; but I certainly don't think it was some kind of intentional conspiracy on the modcliques' part. That would conflict with their believing that "no one goes here" anymore.

RPGPundit

I take exception because I am from RPG.net. I'm here because of a comment made, about Jackalope, by a mod, in Trouble Tickets.

I'm not here to persecute Jackalope; I'm not here to make TheRPGSite into Tangency 2 Electric Boogaloo; I'm not here to look down my nose at all you slumming chummers who got kicked off TBP 'cause you obviously suXX0rz so goddamn much.

I am here because I enjoy discussing games, I enjoy discussing other topics with gamers, and because I really like the freedom that exists here to cut loose and call someone a tool when they're being a tool, without having to worry about him being so effected by being called a tool by some tool on the internet that he immediately has to go home and get his Kalashnikov and empty out a small supermarket - or whatever the fuck they're so scared of over there.

So, when Chango_Chi gets painted as an RPG.net-tard from the Tangency Invasion Force for acting like a complete and utter wankrod, I take it a little sensitively. It's like looking at Cat Piss Man and going 'well, he's just another gamer'.

Quote from: Last KnightI take exception because I am from RPG.net. I'm here because of a comment made, about Jackalope, by a mod, in Trouble Tickets.

I'm not here to persecute Jackalope; I'm not here to make TheRPGSite into Tangency 2 Electric Boogaloo; I'm not here to look down my nose at all you slumming chummers who got kicked off TBP 'cause you obviously suXX0rz so goddamn much.

I am here because I enjoy discussing games, I enjoy discussing other topics with gamers, and because I really like the freedom that exists here to cut loose and call someone a tool when they're being a tool, without having to worry about him being so effected by being called a tool by some tool on the internet that he immediately has to go home and get his Kalashnikov and empty out a small supermarket - or whatever the fuck they're so scared of over there.

So, when Chango_Chi gets painted as an RPG.net-tard from the Tangency Invasion Force for acting like a complete and utter wankrod, I take it a little sensitively. It's like looking at Cat Piss Man and going 'well, he's just another gamer'.

Yeah, I agree that its unfair to RPG.net to paint Chango that way; he's a 4chan-esque troll that was banned from rpg.net some time before being banned here; he was as unwelcome there as he is here, because he's not really any kind of participant at all. Just one of those people who get that most pathetic of jollies by going to websites and trying to disrupt them, without even having a real agenda aside from bothering everyone.

RPGPundit

Quote from: CthyI like it here, but I swear I'm walking if I see a single pathetic arsewiping "Vibes" thread.

I can clearly say that there is very little on the internet thats pisses me off more than someone who asks for +vibes+ because their third cousin, twice removed, has died peacefully in their sleep.

Oooo my lifes soooooo bad, I need some random internet people just to get me through my day.

Oooo, I just stubbed my toe. +vibes+.

Ooooo my bums big +vibes+.

Stupid fucking vibes gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
Godamnit
:mad:

Cthy, don't worry. We're definitely not that kind of site.  If anyone ever did post one of those things, it'd likely be as satire; and if it wasn't, they'd be more likely to be resoundingly mocked and humiliated.

RPGPundit

Quote from: RPGPunditYeah, I agree that its unfair to RPG.net to paint Chango that way; he's a 4chan-esque troll that was banned from rpg.net some time before being banned here; he was as unwelcome there as he is here, because he's not really any kind of participant at all. Just one of those people who get that most pathetic of jollies by going to websites and trying to disrupt them, without even having a real agenda aside from bothering everyone.

RPGPundit

Precisemente, dear sir.

Quote from: CthyI like it here, but I swear I'm walking if I see a single pathetic arsewiping "Vibes" thread.

Is that the thing in Tangency these days? To have for example,

[Vibes please] My cousin went to prison
[Vibes needed] My mom thinks I'm hot
etc?

I mean, to have it formalised by having a certain established way of posting the thread... that's freaky shit.

Quote from: RPGPunditYeah, I agree that its unfair to RPG.net to paint Chango that way; he's a 4chan-esque troll that was banned from rpg.net some time before being banned here; he was as unwelcome there as he is here, because he's not really any kind of participant at all. Just one of those people who get that most pathetic of jollies by going to websites and trying to disrupt them, without even having a real agenda aside from bothering everyone.

RPGPundit

That, and Chango was banned in Tangency almost immediately after creating an account, so it's not like he's an "rpg.netter" or anything.

I half want to ask what the hell "vibes" are, and half think I'm probably better off not knowing.

Quote from: JackalopeI half want to ask what the hell "vibes" are, and half think I'm probably better off not knowing.

"Vibes" are prayers for folks who indulge in mysticism but want to pretend they are above religion.

Quote from: CthySorry, I'm not from up t'north.

And you're in Preston, that's harsh ! :)

It's just well wishing.  Is it really such a big deal?

"Hey, things suck."
"Damn, that's too bad, feel better."

Friends do it and communities do it.  If someone was complaining to their buddies over a beer about their hurt arm or cousin's trouble or whatever no one would bat an eye.  If a preacher said "Let's keep Mr. Smith in our prayers as he goes in for surgery" it would be perfectly normal.

Quote from: SeanAnd you're in Preston, that's harsh ! :)

Someones gotta be here I suppose, I just pulled the shortest straw.


As to the vibes thing, its just internet self gratification. I'm sure there are those who really do need the kindness of internet strangers but there are others who seem to think its fine being attention whores.

Quote from: Halfjack"Vibes" are prayers for folks who indulge in mysticism but want to pretend they are above religion.

That is such a good way to put it.  I'm impressed.

It is so hilarious that they actually cancelled their meet & greet.  I know Seattle is a little soft, but seriously.

Quote from: walkerpIt is so hilarious that they actually cancelled their meet & greet.  I know Seattle is a little soft, but seriously.

Nah, it happened.  It was quite fun, too.  We just went to a different location.

ah, good to know.

Quote from: C.W.RichesonIt's just well wishing.  Is it really such a big deal?

Except that it's really fishing for sympathy, isn't it? It's one thing for people to notice that you're having a bad day and offer condolences.  It's another to actively ask people for sympathy.  Many people are uncomfortable or disdainful of that sort of histrionic.

!i!

Ian's post was hurtful to me. Please help.

I'm sorry but Spike will not be returning to the forum, he is....indesposed.

No more requests for false sympathy and "vibes".

Quote from: SpikeIan's post was hurtful to me. Please help.

Here, I can help:

Get the sand out of your vagina.

Quote from: Ian AbsentiaExcept that it's really fishing for sympathy, isn't it? It's one thing for people to notice that you're having a bad day and offer condolences.  It's another to actively ask people for sympathy.  Many people are uncomfortable or disdainful of that sort of histrionic.

!i!

I don't understand it. This place is supposed to be for the thick skinned, but the admittedly maudlin 'vibes' posts are usually tagged clearly. Why read them if they're going to irritate you? Do people get a kick out of that?

I've never heard of them before this thread, but I don't like the sound of them at all.  I'm with Cthy.  That shit leads to Tangency.  Stay frosty, people.

Quote from: Ian AbsentiaExcept that it's really fishing for sympathy, isn't it? It's one thing for people to notice that you're having a bad day and offer condolences.  It's another to actively ask people for sympathy.  Many people are uncomfortable or disdainful of that sort of histrionic.

I bet a lot of it, is just attention whoring and oneupmanship. The worst are those that degenerate into flamewars about the dumbest of topics.

Regards,
David R

Quote from: walkerpThat shit leads to Tangency.  Stay frosty, people.

Shut up, bitch.

Seanchai

Quote from: SeanchaiShut up, bitch.

That's the spirit!

What do you call the opposite of 'vibes'?

Quote from: laffingboyThat's the spirit!

What do you call the opposite of 'vibes'?

reality

The opposite of "vibes" is Gordon Ramsay. Or a drill sergeant.

Sergeant stands over man collapsed on the ground, panting after a run.
"Are you injured, soldier?"
"No, sergeant - I'm exhausted."
"GET THE FUCK UP! I haven't given you permission to die yet!"

Quote from: laffingboyThat's the spirit!

What do you call the opposite of 'vibes'?

'Seanchai'. :haw:

Quote from: Kyle AaronIt was all out there. You could go picking through the "Boneyards" before they delete it all and check if you want.

I'll take your word on the matter Kyle. Trawling through the middens of rpg.net is a dirty business and I'd need a biohazard suit and a full course of innoculations before I'd contemplate such a thing.:deflated:
You are made of sterner stuff.

Um, not really. It's just that I was there at the time so I saw it all happen.

But you know, unless they've deleted their Boneyards already, it should be verifiable...

Looks like he's been banned again, this time for good. (http://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?t=458045) I just know this is going to come up here sooner or later, so I might as well bump this to get it out the way.

Quote from: Koltar;187093Irony is - THIS forum (rpgsite) is actually a friendlier atmosphere more times than not.
 Trying to create an emotionally safe environment is a goal that is set up for failure at the start.


- Ed C.

 He's absolutely correct. I was absolutely flabbergasted at the support I received when i left my wife, my life went to shit, my dad died, etc. I still look at all the kindness I received from that period to cheer me up sometimes, especially when I am feeling particularly misanthropic. I don't agree w/ a lot of people here, and I might call them douches at times, but I don't sincerely think MOST people here are douchebags. Well, except for Sunboy.

"After extensive discussion Backstage for several days, the staff have decided to permanently ban Curt from the site under R.10 for problematic behavior.

Curt has had more chances than anyone else on this site, but we're having the same problems with his behavior in 2009 that we were having in 2004. There comes a point where whatever he brings to the site is outweighed by his history, the stream of reports he generates, his problematic relationship with many of the staff, and his insistence on being a consistent source of conflict in the forums.

Rule 10 was designed for those users who stay within the letter of the law, but who are nonetheless a problem for the site as a whole. Curt, over the years of repeated issues and troublesome interactions with other users and the staff, has proved that he's just too problematic to allow to remain on this site.

Because of the numerous suspensions and bans in the past, there will be no appeal from this decision. The thread in TT will be opened up if there are any questions or discussion, but it will be monitored closely and shut down quickly if it gets out of hand."
 
 
 this "rule 10" sounds like an easily abused crock of shit easy way to close policy loopholes. More like " We never did like you, and now we impose Rule 10 to ban you".   Which I can also see could have happened to Pundit and Koltar, amongst others.
 
 Fuck, just be fuckin' honest and say " We don't like you, so we're kicking you out of our clubhouse!"  That's essentially what it is. Maybe Curt is a douche, but this "Rule 10" sounds like a fuckin' joke to me. I'm glad I chose to come here when here was negatively being portrayed there.

I haven't read the whole TT thread, but just from the first two pages I'm almost laughing. Such anguish over losing dear old Curt - why, what ever could he have done to warrant this? Blah blah blah. One of the most consistently contentious jackasses in the history of ANY forum, banned multiple times as noted, then brought back as a fucking MOD - and they just can't understand what could have happened to poor little Curt!

If he'd been a right-winger, he'd have been gone after the first contrarian post in Tangency some years back, I'd wager.

Fucking hypocrites.

That said, I'd welcome him here with open arms. I don't think disagreement, sometimes even screaming hissy-fit disagreement, is something to be avoided. I'm sure we could have many constructive debates, and probably a few knock-down-drag-outs as well. Which is what its all about, after all.

It's the catch-all rule. Really, with rule 10 they don't need any others.

I've said it before and it's still true: every forum has only one rule, don't fuck with the mods. All that varies is what "fucking with" means to an individual mod. Pundit's good in that he doesn't take things personally, so you can really give him the ragging he deserves and be in no fear of a ban. Mods generally tend to be more precious types.

Hmmm....  Anyone want to take bets that Curt et al (Theron, Winna, Red, etc) have created yet another forum of their own and have posted 100+ pages about how fucked up RPG.net is for daring to ban him?

Quote from: Acta Est Fabula;308809Hmmm....  Anyone want to take bets that Curt et al (Theron, Winna, Red, etc) have created yet another forum of their own and have posted 100+ pages about how fucked up RPG.net is for daring to ban him?

RPGDouche.com?

I own a copy of the LUG Star Trek rpg and the Narrator's Toolkit for it (by S John Ross).  I got them after Curt, who had seen me mention that I really liked the original series but couldn't get with the later stuff, dug up pictures of the books and promised me that if I liked TOS I'd really like the tone of these books.

He was right, it was a great recommendation.  I owe him one for it.  And that's all I have to say on the matter really.

There's no need to set up another forum when you can just set up Facebook accounts and get your echo chamber on that way.

Turns out I do have one more thing to add after all.

Ironic to see this thread here, while Pundit's ugly homophobicly titled thread graces the front page.

Somehow I suspect Curt won't be coming here.

Can't see the thread, rpg.net seems to be having troubles again.

Curt could take heart in the fact that everyone is telling Pundit he's a cocksmock. Not that Curt, being basically a bitter non-gamer, would have much to contribute here. But still.

Quote from: Clayton WickIf "contentious" threads scattered across Tangency and Trouble Tickets were a reason to permaban a poster, I'm left wondering why Curt gets kicked from the site while CavScout gets a simple forum ban. It reads more like there were some moderators who just plain didn't like Curt.

This post made me laugh. :) :heh:

I've managed to look at some of the thread.

It was indeed funny. This is funnier:

Quote from: DLathropThe fact of the matter is this: Curt's presence made a LOT of GLBT members feel safe posting in Tangency.

Safe from what?

What, exactly, is supposed to be the raison d'etre of rpg.net? Not rpgs, apparently, in the minds of many of its users. Sad, sad.  If only others had got as many chances as Curt... at least most of us permabanned actually talked about rpgs.

Funny that no-one brings up that outside of Tangency, Curt was inoffensive... because outside of Tangency, he almost never posted. He was never there to talk about rpgs. He never wanted to talk rpgs on rpg.net. They could have just banned him from Tangency. And he would have been as quiet as if he were permabanned.

I swear, binning Off Topic was the best thing was ever done for therpgsite.

Quote from: Kyle Aaron;308854I swear, binning Off Topic was the best thing was ever done for therpgsite.

Binning?

They turned it into a binary object file?







(damn, no "Shit Eating Grin" graphic)

I really, really need to stop reading that TT thread... but I can't. With every passing post, I feel sanity points dropping like over-ripe figs.

Banning Curt is apparently a direct attack on homosexual gamers. ON FUCKING RPG.NET.

Now that Curt is gone, and they don't feel safe, what are the Mods going to do to replace Curt's comforting presence?

ON RPG.NET.

I...have....no...words...

Wait, yes I do.

ITS A FUCKING RPG SITE! A SITE ABOUT ROLEPLAYING GAMES! ON THE INTERNET! HOLY SHIT!!!11one!!

Wait a minute....

Curt likes STAR TREK too?
And sent the LUG version free to someone?


Dang, considering what I said in this post earlier in the thread:

http://www.therpgsite.com/showpost.php?p=184257&postcount=4

It almost sounds like he's the angrier and gay version of me.

 There's a scary and strange thought.

...thinking  I need some more meds now.....

- Ed C.

The problem with Curt was he thought making people feel uncomfortable was the only acceptable means of interaction for minorities.

Regards,
David R

Quote from: David R;308872The problem with Curt was he thought making people feel uncomfortable was the only acceptable means of interaction for minorities.

Regards,
David R

Maybe he should have thought of inviting to a roleplaying game?

From what I've heard and seen thats a pretty fun way of interacting with people.


- Ed C.

Ed, that's not what I meant. Nevermind.

Regards,
David R

Quote from: David R;308877Ed, that's not what I meant. Nevermind.

Regards,
David R

I Knew what you meant ....

Always thought that Curt should lighten up half the time I saw him on there.

- Ed

Mind you, rpgnet's tolleration of Curt's behaviour has always been proof positive of the biased and hypocritical moderation policies.  When rpg.net modded up back in the day there were always some people and causes the rules didn't apply to.  Oh well, as long as Darren's a mod rpgnet will be lost in the moral low ground.

eh, just went back to RPGnet, and ya know, when I first heard of this site, it was because it was being advertised as a trainwreck. But, Moping Muhammad on a Moped, that site is the trainwreck, hands down.
 
 I mean, shit, if it wasn't for net, I wouldn't have been introduced to UA or UnMet...but, SHEYAT!

Best watch yourself, Shal - you and Pseudo got red-flagged for "advertising" for theRPGsite. Don't wanna get banned now for mentioning the competition in inappropriate places.

Oh fucking well. They can take my "privs" of reading countless posts about Exalted. I hear that inhaling Zyklon B was once considered a priv as well.

Quote from: Koltar;308878I Knew what you meant ....

Always thought that Curt should lighten up half the time I saw him on there.

- Ed

That's why Tangency and Off Topic in general is extremly toxic for gaming sites. Although Tangency is obviously left wing that was never enough for Curt. In life there may be a middle ground but online it's not even a consideration. The making it safe comment is telling. Like the Pundit, Curt had invested too much in his online persona. He thought he was Spartacus, leading his people to freedom....

Regards,
David R

Quote from: Werekoala;308868ITS A FUCKING RPG SITE! A SITE ABOUT ROLEPLAYING GAMES! ON THE INTERNET! HOLY SHIT!!!11one!!

It really hasn't been an RPG site for a number of years.

All I know is, if I could collect all the crosses in that thread I could string power lines from New York to LA and have a few left over.

Quote from: Werekoala;308888All I know is, if I could collect all the crosses in that thread I could string power lines from New York to LA and have a few left over.

Damn!!

 I discovered the 3 or 4 pages in there where someone implied that Vipergrrl was homophobic or bigoted.

Her?

 My Sweet Kahless but those people are whacky.

She defended her4self pretty good. Kind of weird the drift went that way.
 Most of them are missing the fact that 'ol Curt was just abrasive and vitriolic as often as possible. Doesn't matter that he was gay or not, he turned into an irritant and an abusive poster.

- Ed C.

As A SIdenote: I really do miss posting in nBSG or STAR TREK threads that Vipergrrl started or participated in. She seems like good people. The sort I used to meet at conventions back when I went to them more frequently.

Quote from: Koltar;308891Most of them are missing the fact that 'ol Curt was just abrasive and vitriolic as often as possible. Doesn't matter that he was gay or not, he turned into an irritant and an abusive poster.

You would have thought he fit right in, then.

Heh, and now reading the thread it turns out (http://forum.rpg.net/showpost.php?p=10502675&postcount=665) that a transgendered man is not comfortable because he's brought down by all the transgendered women posting. So I guess it's only an "emotionally safe environment" for the right kind of gay, lesbian, transgendered, etc.

And walkerp - who should be unbanned from here! - receives a warning for suggesting rpg.net should be at least half about rpgs.

It's a wonderful little soap opera for us.

Quote from: shalvayez;308801this "rule 10" sounds like an easily abused crock of shit easy way to close policy loopholes. More like " We never did like you, and now we impose Rule 10 to ban you".   Which I can also see could have happened to Pundit and Koltar, amongst others.
 
 Fuck, just be fuckin' honest and say " We don't like you, so we're kicking you out of our clubhouse!"  That's essentially what it is. Maybe Curt is a douche, but this "Rule 10" sounds like a fuckin' joke to me. I'm glad I chose to come here when here was negatively being portrayed there.

I wouldn't cry too much for Curt. He's definitely "dying by the sword" as it were; he was probably the worst mod of all time (which is REALLY saying a lot for that site!) and no one liked to make use of the rules (written and unwritten) at RPG.net to censor and persecute people there more than he did.

RPGPundit

I'll repeat it here: RPG.net is where people get *Banned to*.

Well, one thing that's come of it is an absolute statement by the mods that they are pro-gay marriage and openly opposed to any discussion of the other side of the issue.  I think a lot of crap that's happened over the years could have been avoided if they made that clear in the rules from the beginning.  I may have to book mark that post for future use.

Yes it was obvious if you read Tangency for any length of time but the place has a painful history of some religious newbie coming along and openning up a can of whupass on themselves.

Me, I was there for the original rpgnet gay debates, so the bias has never surprised me.  My position has moved over the years and I think that's healthy.

Well I am pro gay marriage, too - but who gives a fuck? What has that to do with rpgs?

I'm against gay marriage. *Waits for flames*

Quote from: Narf the Mouse;308925I'm against gay marriage. *Waits for flames*

Look, I'm sure you'll find somebody someday.

 Keep trying - okay?


{{{:-)

I'm sure Blackberry could initiate you, if you don't mind that whole "yiffing" thing.

Quote from: RPGPundit;308912I wouldn't cry too much for Curt. He's definitely "dying by the sword" as it were; he was probably the worst mod of all time (which is REALLY saying a lot for that site!) and no one liked to make use of the rules (written and unwritten) at RPG.net to censor and persecute people there more than he did.

RPGPundit

 Oh, wasn't 'crying" for that douchenozzle, just saying that Rule 10 is a tad open for abuse, and he probably abused it as much as anybody else.
 
 And is as far as gay marriage is concerned, we Iowans are a bit more....sophisticated than the rest of you, as we allow for gay marriage. Before California, Before New York, IOWA once again shows we respect civil liberties more than just about any other state.
 
 Now if we can only get our marijuana laws to be SANE.

A predominantly RPGnet guy necroes this thread and we play along?

Bad kitty!

Predominately RPGnet = Exalted player = blah.

Quote from: Kyle Aaron;308896Heh, and now reading the thread it turns out (http://forum.rpg.net/showpost.php?p=10502675&postcount=665) that a transgendered man is not comfortable because he's brought down by all the transgendered women posting. So I guess it's only an "emotionally safe environment" for the right kind of gay, lesbian, transgendered, etc.

.

Its a dirty little secret of the GBLT community that the various groups don't like each other almost as much as they claim straights don't like them as a whole.

I mean, sure... you can diagram out webs of appropriate interactions or what have you, and as far as I know there hasn't been a 'hate crime' perpetrated from within the 'community' of note... but the biases are there.

Quote from: Spike;308984Its a dirty little secret of the GBLT community that the various groups don't like each other almost as much as they claim straights don't like them as a whole.

I mean, sure... you can diagram out webs of appropriate interactions or what have you, and as far as I know there hasn't been a 'hate crime' perpetrated from within the 'community' of note... but the biases are there.

Isn't that the dirty little secret of every niche community, though?  One glance at the Geek Hierarchy shows it to be more of a template than a chart.

Shit's been going on the Net for years, even before browsers. Person starts up a clubhouse, person kicks people out of clubhouse because he/she don't like em.
 
Me? I never fit into any clique. But, same goes for my BBS, i guess, if some retarded frogmonkey I have hated for years logged on, I'm not likely to keep them around. Kudos to Pundit for having more patience for frogmonkeys.

Yeah, somehow playing in a larp is 'better' than writing fanfiction. Or something.
Or edition wars.
Or 'My game is better than your game' wars.

Meanwhile, sensible people are 'just' having fun.

Quote from: StormBringer;308987Isn't that the dirty little secret of every niche community, though?  One glance at the Geek Hierarchy shows it to be more of a template than a chart.

Thats just it: its not really a community at all but a collection of seperate communities that are brought together by a common cause. Its a political thing, really.

Though I suppose there is an element of the 'True Scotsman' to it.  Gays don't consider Lesbians to be 'True Queers' because lesbians have greater public acceptance in the mainstream.  Gays and Lesbians both consider Bi's to not be True Queers because they are just dabbling fashionistas.  Trannies have so many flavors its not funny, but they don't consider the gays/lesbians to be 'true queers' because they don't get stared at on the streets... but they also don't consider other flavors of trannys 'True Queers' because they aren't 'us'...

Y'know... I think the only real difference is that 'geeks' can dabble in the other catagories while the various GBLT really can't without entirely changing catagories.

About the only thing freakier in similar terms was the university I went to where the faculty from Africa were highly prejudiced against the black Americans on staff and in the classrooms...

One of the most ironic bannings on RPG-related sites I have seen. Curt, who has had more second and third and fourth chances than anything else, finally gets his desserts and it suddenly makes the environment "less emotionally safe"? That's comedy.

OTOH, the thread was also highly informative about how various GLBT people view the world and each other, so that's another plus. A few folks also mentioned something apparently called The Wilde Side - is that an invitation-only RPGNet subforum?

They have several special subforums for members to join. When I last saw it, there was a Philosophy subforum, a Writer's subforum, and so on. A few are public and anyone can join, a few are visible only to members and presumably you must be invited.

The Wilde Side is the GLBT(Q) subforum.

Quote from: StormBringer;308887It really hasn't been an RPG site for a number of years.

It still is, Stormy. There's just a REALLY big section for talking about Everything Else. :)

Quote from: Dan Davenport;309143It still is, Stormy. There's just a REALLY big section for talking about Everything Else. :)

:)

I have a conspiracy theory that last year's pruning was to get Tangency smaller than TRO again.  ;)

Quote from: Kyle Aaron;309120They have several special subforums for members to join. When I last saw it, there was a Philosophy subforum, a Writer's subforum, and so on. A few are public and anyone can join, a few are visible only to members and presumably you must be invited.

The Wilde Side is the GLBT(Q) subforum.

Perhaps I am pointing out the obvious. But why the fuck would you have all these sub-forums that are not about RPG's on an RPG discussion site?

And why make them invisible to non-members - And hard to find for members?

It smacks of elitisim, it does.

Ghettoism, more like. Segregation of the GLBTQOMGWTFBBQ(insert next initial here) crowd. I'm surprised they stood for it - well, not really, since no doubt they pushed for it.

I agree with Spike. A special club house for only those in the know. Sounds pretty elitist to me as well. It also seems pretty dumb as well. I'm sure their must be other sites that cater directly to the sub forum subject. But then again the people on these tbp sub-forums wouldnt be kings of the castle there either. Bringing us back to the thoughts of elitism.

Quote from: Werekoala;309212Ghettoism, more like. Segregation of the GLBTQOMGWTFBBQ(insert next initial here) crowd. I'm surprised they stood for it - well, not really, since no doubt they pushed for it.

It was a number of different groups on RPG.net, actually, not just queer people, who wanted their own forums. The current list is:

"Creative Writing Collective
Sound and Vision
Health and Fitness
Parents & Parenting
Philosophers and Philotheists
The Wilde Side
Toys and Collectibles

Frankly, they aren't that bad at all. They keep discussion on specific recurrent topics focused in their own little area so that people who want to talk about those things can find one another more easily and not clog up the main forums with it.

Quote from: Ronin;309205Perhaps I am pointing out the obvious. But why the fuck would you have all these sub-forums that are not about RPG's on an RPG discussion site?

Well, it's like this:

Originally, there were no forums at all.

People wanted to comment on reviews. The site added review forums.

People wanted to talk about RPGs in general. The site added a general forum.

People wanted to talk about everything with their RPG-playing online friends. Which was fine, except that it started drowning out the RPG talk. The site added Tangency.

People in Tangency wanted to talk about specific subjects without being drowned out in the general chaos. The site added more specific forums, and, eventually, subforums.

The short version? Folks want to talk about assorted subjects with friends they've made at RPGnet without having to migrate to a different site.

Whether that degree of inclusiveness is a good or bad thing is a matter of taste, of course, but basically, that's why.

Still seems silly to discuss say Toys and Collectibles, on an RPG site. Than on a Toys and Collectibles site. The whole talk about it with your RPG buddies is kind of weak. Because if your that into it why wouldnt you be on a Toys and Collectibles site? Then to make it a secret club on top is even sillier. Sounds a lot like big fish little pond syndrome to me.

Quote from: Ronin;309239Still seems silly to discuss say Toys and Collectibles, on an RPG site. Than on a Toys and Collectibles site. The whole talk about it with your RPG buddies is kind of weak. Because if your that into it why wouldnt you be on a Toys and Collectibles site? Then to make it a secret club on top is even sillier. Sounds a lot like big fish little pond syndrome to me.

*shrug* Silly or not, people seem to like it. Not having a vested interest in the subject myself, I'll leave the analysis to others. :)

Quote from: Ronin;309205Perhaps I am pointing out the obvious. But why the fuck would you have all these sub-forums that are not about RPG's on an RPG discussion site?

So they can have an emotionally-safe environment.

Quote from: Ronin;309239Still seems silly to discuss say Toys and Collectibles, on an RPG site. Than on a Toys and Collectibles site. The whole talk about it with your RPG buddies is kind of weak. Because if your that into it why wouldnt you be on a Toys and Collectibles site? Then to make it a secret club on top is even sillier. Sounds a lot like big fish little pond syndrome to me.

As the person who campaigned quite a bit for the Toys & Collectibles group, I'll attempt to explain a bit.

For one, even at my obsessive reading and posting height, I could only keep up with about three forum sites.  At the time I was most invested in RPGnet.  I wanted one stop shopping.  I didn't want to go find yet another forum I didn't have time to involve myself in.

I also didn't want to post in Tangency.  Tangency was a horrible mess.  

So, I campaigned for a Toys and Collectibles group.  And I made even more of an ass of myself than I usually do.  But I did it because I genuinely believed it would be a good idea to provide a place for such discussion outside the politics and draema of Tangency.

If you didn't like it, it was never in your face.  The goings on of the Toys and Collectibles group probably never affected you.  I seriously doubt it was ever anything the moderators really had to pay any attention to.  

I'm sorry you didn't like it.  It was an honest attempt to provide something to the site I was a regular participant of.  It was effectively the last thing I did before I gave up entirely.

As far as I can tell from the various sub groups I joined the main thing they prove is that without zebras, hyenas starve.

The point of many of them was simply to have a place where there were rules against certain types of behaviour.  For instance, the philosophers and philotheists forum was given an extremely tight, no warnings, instaban rule for any kind of agressive or hostile behaviour.

Of course this resulted in a group where someone posted something got a few amens and it fell off the page.

Oh poor Curt.  Now he will have to find somewhere else to be a gimmick.
Seriously, did that dude have any other notable characteristics other than (none of our damn business) his sexuality?

Naturally RPGnet is whining since its super liberal land there.  I tend to vote left and hate Fox News yet even I think they are a bunch of goobers who are totally out of it!

Why neither of my accounts ever got banned the way that place runs is beyond me.  A couple red texts, but nothing else.  

I guess I wasn't mean enough.  (And generally don't mean any harm even when I am pissed off.)

Oh well, maybe one day RPGnet will realize its there to be about RPGs and not the free wussy version of Something Awful.

Actually RPGnet is what lead me to drop 10 bucks (+5 for an avatar) there.  Its RPG section mostly bites, but after the namby pamby tastic RPGnet a place most people claim is full of big old meanies seemed like right up my alley.  (They aren't for the most part, but there are some folks who complain SA isn't a paradise for the douchebag anymore.  I... do not understand those people.)

That's RPGnet's biggest problem.  Its become Tangencyland and that place's far left wingnuttery has infected the whole place.

Well, it's as people said at the time of my banning a few years back. The moderation, the weight of efforts of people posting, it's away from rpgs. As I noted upthread, this is seen very strongly in the fact of walkerp saying, "maybe people should post at least half the time about rpgs" and receiving a warning.

Curt, if he even has ever gamed, is probably a fatbeard anyway. If he couldn't blather on about social issues he'd be arguing "canon" on the Traveller mailing list, or arguing "history" on the Berkeley Ars Magica list.

I'm so glad we got rid of Off Topic. Phew. Dodged a bullet there. It's not a matter of being left-wing or right-wing or whatever, it's just a matter of non-gaming bullshit eroding the gaming discussions. Political talk attracts freaks and loons the way turds attract flies.

Quote from: Koltar;308870Wait a minute....

Curt likes STAR TREK too?
And sent the LUG version free to someone?


Dang, considering what I said in this post earlier in the thread:

http://www.therpgsite.com/showpost.php?p=184257&postcount=4

It almost sounds like he's the angrier and gay version of me.

 There's a scary and strange thought.

...thinking  I need some more meds now.....

- Ed C.

He recommended, he didn't send a free copy, that would be exceptional.

But it was a good recommend, based on comments I'd made and so tailored to me, and in threads like this kind deeds are I think worth remembering also.

Oh, WalkerP - who should immediately be reinstated as a poster here - was wasting his time with that argument.

I think Tangency should be deleted, simple as that.  Rpg.net IMO should be an rpg focussed site, not a "community" for people so fucking sad that they need online vibes to get through their days.

But I lost that argument, as did JDCorley, WalkerP and others.  Given we lost that argument, there really is no point in flagellating the deceased equine over it.  Tangency stays, live with it or post somewhere else.

Quote from: Captain Rufus;309305Oh poor Curt.  Now he will have to find somewhere else to be a gimmick.
Seriously, did that dude have any other notable characteristics other than (none of our damn business) his sexuality?

Yes, frequent and serious abuse of moderator powers. Baiting posters to be banned. That sort of thing.

QuoteActually RPGnet is what lead me to drop 10 bucks (+5 for an avatar) there.  Its RPG section mostly bites, but after the namby pamby tastic RPGnet a place most people claim is full of big old meanies seemed like right up my alley.  (They aren't for the most part, but there are some folks who complain SA isn't a paradise for the douchebag anymore.  I... do not understand those people.)

SA has almost become a family site in the last 5 or 6 years compared to its past... around 1999 or 2000, it was a lot wilder, a bit like 4Chan is today, except smaller. You can still find bits of the old SA spirit in Helldump3000 (or whatever Fuck You and Die! is called today), but it is almost all ironical or self-referential today.

Still, best general discussion site on the net, MSPAINT threads are still full of dadaist fun, and the $10 registration fee keeps away a lot of the net rabble.

Quote from: BalbinusBut I lost that argument, as did JDCorley, WalkerP and others. Given we lost that argument, there really is no point in flagellating the deceased equine over it. Tangency stays, live with it or post somewhere else.

More or less the case. However, I think RPGNet has become a better place in the last one and a half years - maybe also more boring, but moderation and posting both seem to have diminished a bit. Even Tangency has a bit less of the creepy manchilde vibe than it used to have.

For myself I've always wanted them to allow a broader range of discussion on the main board as long as you can tie it into gaming.  If you're discussing gaming the war in Afgahanistan or how to game the latest cool genre movie or how to build miniature scenery that you can use for rpgs it should all be allowed on open.

If you're talking about your latest free coke you can go do it on Tangency.  Mind you, I'd like the threaded veiws back while we're at it.

Quote from: David Johansen;309418If you're talking about your latest free coke you can go do it on Tangency.  Mind you, I'd like the threaded veiws back while we're at it.

If I recall, vBulletin has the option for threaded views, but they aren't quite what the Jurassic software had.

Quote from: Ronin;309239Still seems silly to discuss say Toys and Collectibles, on an RPG site. Than on a Toys and Collectibles site. The whole talk about it with your RPG buddies is kind of weak. Because if your that into it why wouldnt you be on a Toys and Collectibles site? Then to make it a secret club on top is even sillier. Sounds a lot like big fish little pond syndrome to me.

Because if you post at a website long enough, you learn of other people at that forum that has interests in things you have interest in.  And you want to talk about it with them.  Easier to do it on one site, rather than traipse through many sites.

EVERY forum of any size has an "off topic" discussion forum, because any decent sized website has large groups of long time posters who form friendships, have shared interests, and quite frankly don't always want to talk about *website's main topic* all the time.  And again, don't want to have to set up meetings on other websites to do it.

Come back here in 5 years, and I guarantee you this website will have it's own "vibe" hell, it already does.  If the mods and significant portion of the posters didn't actively work against it, the Off-Topic section would have devolved into it's own Tangency.  It's just what happens.  

You guys HAVE your website where there is no non-gaming related discussion.  Why bother about RPG.net's?  People who want all gaming, all the time come here.  People who want more go there.  Some float between the two, because a) you can't get enough gaming talk and b) they are different beasts with different attitudes and board culture.  

But really, for all the talk, Tangency is still dwarfed by the amount of RPG talk on RPG.net.  It's not even close.  Yeah, Tang is the second biggest section of the site, but its second by a large margin.  The site is still about games and gaming.

It's only second because they deleted half the bloody posts.

Prior to my own exile, the Tangency forum outnumberd RPO and all the other miniscule RPG forums by like 2 to 1.

Quote from: J Arcane;309630It's only second because they deleted half the bloody posts.

Prior to my own exile, the Tangency forum outnumberd RPO and all the other miniscule RPG forums by like 2 to 1.

I thought before the pruning, it slightly outnumbered the RPG forums, but now I can't remember.  It was enough to suggest it was as much a general-interest site as RPG site.

The thing that bothers me about the hidden subforums is they are hidden.

My only problem with them is how painfully lame they are.  Other than the freelancers group I don't think any of them have enough traffic to justify their existance.

In the case of Tangency and Wilde Side, they have to hide them because of their "suitable for minors" concerns. When you have topics like your first anal sex and the like, that doesn't match the "family friendly" image they want for the roleplaying section. Remember that the rpg.net forums are part of a commercial enterprise (skotos, rpgshop, etc). So they become sensitive about their image; that's why you can't use profanity in places like SJGames.

Quote from: Hackmastergeneral;309602Because if you post at a website long enough, you learn of other people at that forum that has interests in things you have interest in.  And you want to talk about it with them.  Easier to do it on one site, rather than traipse through many sites.

EVERY forum of any size has an "off topic" discussion forum, because any decent sized website has large groups of long time posters who form friendships, have shared interests, and quite frankly don't always want to talk about *website's main topic* all the time.  And again, don't want to have to set up meetings on other websites to do it.

Come back here in 5 years, and I guarantee you this website will have it's own "vibe" hell, it already does.  If the mods and significant portion of the posters didn't actively work against it, the Off-Topic section would have devolved into it's own Tangency.  It's just what happens.  

You guys HAVE your website where there is no non-gaming related discussion.  Why bother about RPG.net's?  People who want all gaming, all the time come here.  People who want more go there.  Some float between the two, because a) you can't get enough gaming talk and b) they are different beasts with different attitudes and board culture.  

But really, for all the talk, Tangency is still dwarfed by the amount of RPG talk on RPG.net.  It's not even close.  Yeah, Tang is the second biggest section of the site, but its second by a large margin.  The site is still about games and gaming.

Like stated by those before tangency is only smaller because it has been pruned.
But it is a classic case of big fish little pond. Why talk to what upwards of 10-15 people about a non-rpg subject. When you could talk about it on a site dedicted to it that has hundreds of posters. Why not ask these people you know have the same interests to join you at said place. The whole I've got to much time invest in RPG.net or its easier to do it one place is BS. Your lazy, cant make new friends and would rather hang out in your secret castle hidden from others on the board you frequent. So only you guy can recruite the people you want. Not even that you have control whos offered access. But if people dont know it exsists, how the hell can they want to join. So only the people you want show up. So then you are a big fish in this small pond.
Yes you are correct that sometimes one will want to talk about subjects besides the main topic of the site. But that should never over take the main purpose of the site. Which it did at tbp. Till they pruned that away. But the same sense and culture is still present and it will again over take it. It would be better called a pop culture/nerd site that happens to talk about RPG. Because it is plainly obvious that its not the focus anymore.
As for this places offtopic would have developed into a tangency. Maybe, maybe not. But your right the mod and amin fixed it. Helping to keep the focus of the site. Thats what good mods/admin do. The tbp has no giudance, no focus. So it is crushed by the lack of focus. Moving away from what they were and claim to be.

The thing is, Tangency became RPGnet, or at least how all discussion is filtered.  It started affecting everything.  Where half the posters seem to think their sexual preferences or gender (original or not) defines them and must make sure everyone knows about it.

You can't be tough on a topic on that site unless its an approved to hate one.  Even if its done respectfully the hordes will jump someone's shit if they don't like the content.  Heck, you could see that in the TT thread about Curt.  One subject could basically be summarized as: "Poster X is gay.  You are not.  You do what he says when he says to do it or you HATE GAY PEOPLE YOU BIG BASTARD FUCKFACE".

Frankly its an RPG site filled with spergy nerds.  Not the front line of getting equality and justice for all.

Hell, Curt probably caused more than a few folks to go the opposite way just because of how annoying and in your face he was.

Which is a damned shame because everyone should be able to do what they wish provided it doesn't genuinely harm another.

But being a twatwaddle about it doesn't help.

I think you can tell a lot about a discussion forum and its real purpose by the sorts of things the most prominent posters have in their sigs.

If, on a forum, most of the sigs are game-related, then it's probably about games. If they're political, then...

So for example we knew that droog's intentions here on therpgsite were never to talk about rpgs, because his sig was always something political. But we know that David R is all about the gaming, because his sig always has something game-related.

Rather than simply counting posts or threads by subforum, it can thus be more instructive to look at sigs.

Quote from: Kyle Aaron;309700I think you can tell a lot about a discussion forum and its real purpose by the sorts of things the most prominent posters have in their sigs.

If, on a forum, most of the sigs are game-related, then it's probably about games. If they're political, then...

So for example we knew that droog's intentions here on therpgsite were never to talk about rpgs, because his sig was always something political. But we know that David R is all about the gaming, because his sig always has something game-related.

Rather than simply counting posts or threads by subforum, it can thus be more instructive to look at sigs.

Kyle,

Your skills seem bloody high for a Gamers character, you sure about those?

Any chance of a version of the pdf by the way without the statting yourself crap?  I don't think it adds value and I disagree with some of your methods anyway, Gamers I like but those pages seem a detractant to me.  What do you say?

Quote from: Ronin;309684Like stated by those before tangency is only smaller because it has been pruned.

Even before that, the numbers weren't that far apart.  I forgot about the big pruning.  Funny how that works...

QuoteBut it is a classic case of big fish little pond. Why talk to what upwards of 10-15 people about a non-rpg subject. When you could talk about it on a site dedicted to it that has hundreds of posters. Why not ask these people you know have the same interests to join you at said place. The whole I've got to much time invest in RPG.net or its easier to do it one place is BS.

No, it's not.  Why post on 15 different forums when there is one that's got a big catch-all, has a lot of posters I like and respect, and has a modding style that suits me?  It's silly to have to say to someone every time you want to talk to them about something that's not game-related to say 'Ohh, I've got a post up on this other forum, come talk about it" or whatever.
Again, sometimes you just don't want to talk about games, but you like all the posters at one forum.  It's nice to have a place to go shoot the breeze and not have to try coordinating 5 different sites.
Some don't like that, and that's cool.  Just don't go to tangency.

QuoteYour lazy, cant make new friends and would rather hang out in your secret castle hidden from others on the board you frequent. So only you guy can recruite the people you want. Not even that you have control whos offered access. But if people dont know it exsists, how the hell can they want to join. So only the people you want show up. So then you are a big fish in this small pond.

I really don't understand what you are saying here.  I recognize the words as English, but I don't understand your point.

QuoteYes you are correct that sometimes one will want to talk about subjects besides the main topic of the site. But that should never over take the main purpose of the site. Which it did at tbp.

In your opinion.  In mine, it's still a gaming-focused website.  But Tangency yes is a huge part of the RPG.net culture.  Only a fool would refute that.  But I LIKE that part of the culture.  You don't.  So, you have this place.  Isn't it cool that we can all find a place we like to hang out and talk about shit?

QuoteTill they pruned that away. But the same sense and culture is still present and it will again over take it. It would be better called a pop culture/nerd site that happens to talk about RPG. Because it is plainly obvious that its not the focus anymore.

No it's not plainly obvious.  It's only obvious in here because you have an echo chamber of a lot of disenfranchised and disillusioned former posters here who always had a hate-on for Tangency.  RPGs are still the name of the game.  For me, Tang has always been what separates RPG.net from the endless number of gaming websites out there.  I can talk about RPGs anywhere, but no other website has a place like Tangency.  Not that I've found anyway.

QuoteAs for this places offtopic would have developed into a tangency. Maybe, maybe not. But your right the mod and amin fixed it. Helping to keep the focus of the site. Thats what good mods/admin do. The tbp has no giudance, no focus. So it is crushed by the lack of focus. Moving away from what they were and claim to be.

So I didn't just see a Motivational Posters thread in Media and Inspiration, right?  
Look, social groups will eventually form mores and social pecking order and social institutions.  Thats what social groups DO.  Get three people together on an island, and one will eventually be at the bottom.  Get 5 people together and three will eventually form their own clique.  
Websites are no different.  The only reason this place doesn't do the same things is because the mods and posters actively work against it, because a large portion of what defines RPGsite is "We are NOT tBP", and thats not a negative, neccessarily.  It filters down from modding/admin-style, to the hostility towards any remotely non-RPG discussion, etc etc.  

RPG.net, like any large entity, has lots of people pulling it in a lot of directions.  Tang has a big pull on the website sure - it has driven large swaths of mod policy, frex.  But it is modded DIFFERENTLY than RPG stuff.  It's just evolved into this big thing, and in efforts like the Big Prune the mods are trying to get it more under control and be more manageable, but honestly, you couldn't get rid of it.   Not now.  It's too ingrained into the board.  

But, again, isn't it lucky you have a place you can post about RPGs without having to muck around in Tangency?

Quote from: Kyle Aaron;309700I think you can tell a lot about a discussion forum and its real purpose by the sorts of things the most prominent posters have in their sigs.

If, on a forum, most of the sigs are game-related, then it's probably about games. If they're political, then...

So for example we knew that droog's intentions here on therpgsite were never to talk about rpgs, because his sig was always something political. But we know that David R is all about the gaming, because his sig always has something game-related.

Rather than simply counting posts or threads by subforum, it can thus be more instructive to look at sigs.

Meh - my only part of my RPG.net sig is "Beaverpack", simply because I still find it amusing.  I otherwise have no sig, and have no sig here.  I have no one pithy line about gaming I can use to sum up my gaming experiences.  And I play too many games to bother listing them all.
I'd post a sig quote from Order of the Stick - but hey, my avatar already does that.  Is that close enough?  Its a COMIC about gaming?

QuoteNo it's not plainly obvious. It's only obvious in here because you have an echo chamber of a lot of disenfranchised and disillusioned former posters here who always had a hate-on for Tangency. RPGs are still the name of the game. For me, Tang has always been what separates RPG.net from the endless number of gaming websites out there. I can talk about RPGs anywhere, but no other website has a place like Tangency. Not that I've found anyway.

Ehh, I was a fairly active member of Tangency in my day.  Spent far more time there and on OGO than I ever did in RPO.

The only thing that really seperates it from other off-topic forums I've spent time on like Colony of Gamers is the rampant cliquishness and the tendency to just decide one day you're no longer part of it.  

Tangency and RPGnet did rather specifically serve to temper my enthusiasm for online community.  I had a lot of friends there, real honest to got people I met and even knew in real life, I spent a lot of time talking to everyone there, a lot of people knew me very well, as well as anyone does in real life.

And then one day the moderators just up and decide to cut me off from the group because I'm a little too mean to a troll now and then?  And within a year I'm just another banned troll, only occasionally mentioned snarkily in a TT thread.

Sort of made it abundantly clear what the value of investing much effort into this sort of shit really is to anyone else.

They don't give a fuck about you, or me, or anyone else.  At any arbitrary point, they could just as well decide you're not acceptable to the clique anymore, and you're not only instantly a pariah, but physically cut off from the community you were once a proud part of.

What the fuck kind of social community is that?

Quote from: J Arcane;309797Ehh, I was a fairly active member of Tangency in my day.  Spent far more time there and on OGO than I ever did in RPO.

The only thing that really seperates it from other off-topic forums I've spent time on like Colony of Gamers is the rampant cliquishness and the tendency to just decide one day you're no longer part of it.  

Tangency and RPGnet did rather specifically serve to temper my enthusiasm for online community.  I had a lot of friends there, real honest to got people I met and even knew in real life, I spent a lot of time talking to everyone there, a lot of people knew me very well, as well as anyone does in real life.

And then one day the moderators just up and decide to cut me off from the group because I'm a little too mean to a troll now and then?  And within a year I'm just another banned troll, only occasionally mentioned snarkily in a TT thread.

Sort of made it abundantly clear what the value of investing much effort into this sort of shit really is to anyone else.

They don't give a fuck about you, or me, or anyone else.  At any arbitrary point, they could just as well decide you're not acceptable to the clique anymore, and you're not only instantly a pariah, but physically cut off from the community you were once a proud part of.

What the fuck kind of social community is that?

I have never seen you referenced like that.  I don't pay attention to every TT thread, mind.

Quote from: Hackmastergeneral;309799I have never seen you referenced like that.  I don't pay attention to every TT thread, mind.

I don't know how often it happens, mind you.  I don't really read over there, pretty much cut the site off entirely after the banning.  I had a sockpuppet for a while I never posted from that I just used so I could search up old threads easier, but it got deleted for inactivity.

Over the intervening years I've had a post or two passed to me though that were less than favorable.  During the great pruning of Tangency I popped over to take a peek and see if any of my threads were being saved, and at least one of them was a flamewar that I was mostly on the recieving end of, and I think there was at least another that was one of my bannings.  And very recently while looking for an old RPO post I discovered they'd actually deleted my account, and all my old threads and posts now show up as unregistered ones now.

Doesn't paint a great picture of respect for a former comrade, now does it?

Quote from: Balbinus;309743Kyle,

Your skills seem bloody high for a Gamers character, you sure about those?

You must have missed the discussions where we changed the default skill from -2 to 0, which also takes the first level from +1 to +3. That's because so many players "forget" to put in the -2 in play. The base difficulty also goes from 8 to 10.

So instead of default skills being -2 on 2d6 vs 8, it's 0 on 2d6 vs 10. Instead of starting skills of +1 on 2d6 vs 8, it's +3 on 2d6 vs 10. A little bit counterintuitive to start at +3 instead of +1, but saves on subtraction in play, which as I said players often conveniently forget to do.

Thus, most of my skills are at starting level :)

Perhaps you could comment on the GAMERS design thread here (http://www.therpgsite.com/showthread.php?t=10992).

QuoteAny chance of a version of the pdf by the way without the statting yourself crap?  I don't think it adds value and I disagree with some of your methods anyway, Gamers I like but those pages seem a detractant to me.  What do you say?

Just don't print those pages, you silly sod :)

Fire me an email, I'll send you the .ods version, you can edit as you wish.

Quote from: Hackmastergeneral;309788Even before that, the numbers weren't that far apart.  I forgot about the big pruning.  Funny how that works...

As other stated yeah they were that far apart and yes it is funny when people conveniently forget facts.
 

Quote from: Hackmastergeneral;309788No, it's not.  Why post on 15 different forums when there is one that's got a big catch-all, has a lot of posters I like and respect, and has a modding style that suits me?  It's silly to have to say to someone every time you want to talk to them about something that's not game-related to say 'Ohh, I've got a post up on this other forum, come talk about it" or whatever.
Again, sometimes you just don't want to talk about games, but you like all the posters at one forum.  It's nice to have a place to go shoot the breeze and not have to try coordinating 5 different sites.
Some don't like that, and that's cool.  Just don't go to tangency.

Then why are you here why do you go any where else? You can take care of all your discussion needs right?

Quote from: Hackmastergeneral;309788I really don't understand what you are saying here.  I recognize the words as English, but I don't understand your point.

Thats because your ignorant, so let me explain it. I'll use small words and short sentences for your well being. What I am saying is that the reason you dont go to a site that focuses on toys and collectables for example, is because on a smaller basically invitation only subforum. You can be a big man in the little forum. Where in a larger forum your contributions would be of vastly lesser impact and possibly lost in the traffic.

Quote from: Hackmastergeneral;309788In your opinion.  In mine, it's still a gaming-focused website.  But Tangency yes is a huge part of the RPG.net culture.  Only a fool would refute that.  But I LIKE that part of the culture.  You don't.  So, you have this place.  Isn't it cool that we can all find a place we like to hang out and talk about shit?

Your right it is cool that we have places that cater to our interests. You know mine being RPGs, and your evidentally beong discussing who would win in a crazy fantasy fist-fight between Anne Frank and Lizzie Borden.
Again I'm confused why you are here?

Quote from: Hackmastergeneral;309788No it's not plainly obvious.  It's only obvious in here because you have an echo chamber of a lot of disenfranchised and disillusioned former posters here who always had a hate-on for Tangency.  RPGs are still the name of the game.  For me, Tang has always been what separates RPG.net from the endless number of gaming websites out there.  I can talk about RPGs anywhere, but no other website has a place like Tangency.  Not that I've found anyway.

No it has nothing to do with this being an echo camber. It has everything to do with the Tangency section will take over in post content again. You have even stated, "But Tangency yes is a huge part of the RPG.net culture.  Only a fool would refute that." Your right it is a huge part. A huge peice that overwhelms the RPG content.

Quote from: Hackmastergeneral;309788So I didn't just see a Motivational Posters thread in Media and Inspiration, right?  
Look, social groups will eventually form mores and social pecking order and social institutions.  Thats what social groups DO.  Get three people together on an island, and one will eventually be at the bottom.  Get 5 people together and three will eventually form their own clique.  
Websites are no different.  The only reason this place doesn't do the same things is because the mods and posters actively work against it, because a large portion of what defines RPGsite is "We are NOT tBP", and thats not a negative, neccessarily.  It filters down from modding/admin-style, to the hostility towards any remotely non-RPG discussion, etc etc.

Yup and if you look at that thread you'll notice me ragging on it for being retarded, and a waste of space on this board.
Your right the reason it doesnt happen here is that people work against it. They keep the focus on RPGs. Because thats what this site is about. TBP has lost sight of that. TBP is kind of like a crossover SUV. It does everything. It just doesnt do anything very well.

Quote from: Hackmastergeneral;309788RPG.net, like any large entity, has lots of people pulling it in a lot of directions.  Tang has a big pull on the website sure - it has driven large swaths of mod policy, frex.  But it is modded DIFFERENTLY than RPG stuff.  It's just evolved into this big thing, and in efforts like the Big Prune the mods are trying to get it more under control and be more manageable, but honestly, you couldn't get rid of it.   Not now.  It's too ingrained into the board.

Thet could have though. They let it go out of control. Now your right it cant be stopped. Its out paced the focus of the site. Taken it over.

Quote from: Hackmastergeneral;309788But, again, isn't it lucky you have a place you can post about RPGs without having to muck around in Tangency?

Yes I am.

There is something I thought about RPGnet that still holds true.

They mean well for the most part, they really do.  The problem is that in trying to be nice nice and all they in many cases have become raging jerks in the process, possibly causing more harm than good.

At this point I am not sure much can be done about this.  Tangency is the site now instead of a side bit.

And honestly all Tangency is is a shitty version of Something Awful's General Bullshit forum which has far funnier and far more useful general news and interest threads.

Except at SA the GBS thread frequenters really don't affect the Gun subforum that really doesn't affect TV which doesn't affect electronic games which doesn't affect Music and so on.

At RPGnet Tangency has become the point of the site for many people and steers the style and content of the entire site.

Again I understand they mean well but...

I took a quick spin through the front page of Tangency for the first time in a long time, just out of curiosity inspired by this whole froofraw. Just skimmed the thread titles.

I want that 26 seconds of my life back, please.

Quote from: Captain Rufus;309882There is something I thought about RPGnet that still holds true.

They mean well for the most part, they really do.  The problem is that in trying to be nice nice and all they in many cases have become raging jerks in the process, possibly causing more harm than good.

..

Apologies for the double post, but I don't know about that 'mean well' thing. My experienced with the so-called moderators led me to believe them a boorish, craven lot, deeply resistant to adult-style conversations.

Quote from: Ronin;309835As other stated yeah they were that far apart and yes it is funny when people conveniently forget facts.

No, I just forgot they pruned the old posts down in tang, because it doesn't really affect my life at all.  
 

QuoteThen why are you here why do you go any where else? You can take care of all your discussion needs right?

Why does it so concern you that Tangency exists?

QuoteThats because your ignorant, so let me explain it. I'll use small words and short sentences for your well being. What I am saying is that the reason you dont go to a site that focuses on toys and collectables for example, is because on a smaller basically invitation only subforum. You can be a big man in the little forum. Where in a larger forum your contributions would be of vastly lesser impact and possibly lost in the traffic.

No, it's because that phrase I posted from you was so full of bad grammar and spelling mistakes, I couldn't understand it.

For ex: I have people on a gaming forum I like, and I know we are all interested in toys (as an example - I really am not that interested in toys and collectibles).  Why bother going through a seperate step to discuss toys, when we are all in one space already?  If I like toys and collectibles, I am likely already on other sites discussing that.  But I have a certain section of posters on my favorite site that also like it, and I want to talk to them about some toy that comes out.  It's nice to have a spot that lets me do that.

I'm not big on the sub-forums.  I am on a few, mostly because people post some awesome photos on the photo sub forum, but I mostly lurk there, and don't really do that very much.

QuoteYour right it is cool that we have places that cater to our interests. You know mine being RPGs, and your evidentally beong discussing who would win in a crazy fantasy fist-fight between Anne Frank and Lizzie Borden.
Again I'm confused why you are here?

I discuss RPGs.  Duh.  I also enjoy discussions about politics and geek media and random stuff.  I have one site that lets me do all of that, and another that lets me do two of those things.  Sometimes I take a break from RPG.net, or just want to discuss RPGs with different people.  There are people on this site I used to talk with over at tBP, and while Pundit and I don't see eye-to-eye on everything, he's often got at least an interesting take on stuff.  
Like I said, if you like RPGs (which I do) you can't get enough discussing RPGs, or at least mining other sites for ideas.

QuoteNo it has nothing to do with this being an echo camber. It has everything to do with the Tangency section will take over in post content again. You have even stated, "But Tangency yes is a huge part of the RPG.net culture.  Only a fool would refute that." Your right it is a huge part. A huge peice that overwhelms the RPG content.

It didn't before the prune, and with pruning in place, it doesn't anymore.

Look, if you just look at thread turnover, the few days I've been back here the thread turnover on the RPG sections of RPG.net has been bigger WAY BIGGER than over here.  Sure, they have more members, so that's always going to happen, but when I look for new posts here and there, even just the RPG stuff, theres easily twice the amount there than here.  That's not disrespecting this place - but what you are saying just doesn't hold true.  

 

QuoteYup and if you look at that thread you'll notice me ragging on it for being retarded, and a waste of space on this board.
Your right the reason it doesnt happen here is that people work against it. They keep the focus on RPGs. Because thats what this site is about. TBP has lost sight of that. TBP is kind of like a crossover SUV. It does everything. It just doesnt do anything very well.

My point was, if being the "not RPG.net, esp in regards to Tang" wasn't so important here, it would already have happened.  Maybe not in the same way - in a social circle, the people involved influence how the social network evolves.  No two social circles will evolve the same way.  Part of the Tang culture comes from it's longevity and stuff that's been going on for years (the Britpack stuff, frex).

The culture here has evolved it's own circumstances.  It's just as prevelant, just not as pronounced or extreme.
 

QuoteThet could have though. They let it go out of control. Now your right it cant be stopped. Its out paced the focus of the site. Taken it over.

No, it's just become ingrained on the site and site culture.  It is one part that makes up the whole of it.  It's a unique little spot that would be sad to lose.  

QuoteYes I am.

Good.  You should always be happy with what you are doing and where you are doing it.

Quote from: Doom;310007Apologies for the double post, but I don't know about that 'mean well' thing. My experienced with the so-called moderators led me to believe them a boorish, craven lot, deeply resistant to adult-style conversations.

It begins again, and lo the circle turns again, turning and turning ever after, unto infinity.  What was, is again, and what is shall again come to pass.  Ever and anon.