Covid, the "lockdowns" etc.

[Kiero]

I think it's irresponsible to say that vaccination doesn't work at all. At the same time, it's important to be honest which is something the CDC has consistently failed to do for over a year. The masks were bullshit, the 95% effectiveness figures we saw touted were obvious bullshit, the deceptive & coercive tactics to get people vaccinated, and countless other lies.

Each individual must think about their individual risk and evaluate whether they think the vaccine is beneficial enough to warrant the long term risks (including the social risk).

I just wish we (and by that I mean society as a whole) could have a mature conversation that was about minimizing harm from Covid rather than focusing obsessively on measures like masks & lockdowns & passports that haven't and won't work to actually minimize harm. Apparently it's better to introduce medical tyranny than to dare providing monoclonal antibodies or ivermectin freely to the population.

Vaccination as a general principle works. These "vaccines" do fuck all.

[FelixGamingX1]

I think it's irresponsible to say that vaccination doesn't work at all. At the same time, it's important to be honest which is something the CDC has consistently failed to do for over a year. The masks were bullshit, the 95% effectiveness figures we saw touted were obvious bullshit, the deceptive & coercive tactics to get people vaccinated, and countless other lies.

Each individual must think about their individual risk and evaluate whether they think the vaccine is beneficial enough to warrant the long term risks (including the social risk).

I just wish we (and by that I mean society as a whole) could have a mature conversation that was about minimizing harm from Covid rather than focusing obsessively on measures like masks & lockdowns & passports that haven't and won't work to actually minimize harm. Apparently it's better to introduce medical tyranny than to dare providing monoclonal antibodies or ivermectin freely to the population.

Vaccination as a general principle works. These "vaccines" do fuck all.

Now I'm interested in knowing how! Would you be kind to show the data?

[Ratman_tf]

The latest coronavirus may have displaced the various flu bugs, but assuming that's not true, I fully expect we'll see lockdowns during the next strong flu season.

Welcome to the new normal.

That is entirely possible. I can't speak yo the US system, it's probably fabulous, but the winter flu virus puts the NHS in an awful position. Coronavirus on top of that could stretch it beyond crisis.

This is one of those things you may not be worried about, it's just the sniffles likesay, but you don't want to be hit by a car or jumped by a jakie during this time. Remember that drunk drivers and random jakies are much more committed n vee the festive season..

Basically ICU beds are already full in the winter and any of us could randomly need one. There's no need of a big, or even small, conspiracy for any government to consider a lockdown during the worst period.

I have never actually seen a hospital overloaded due to Covid. I hear about it all the time. Maybe it does happen, but I can't ever remember a news crew getting some footage, even from a distance.

I saw it. My nearest hospital in fact. Ambulances lined up outside. Patients being treated in those ambulances because there were no remaining beds inside. Hallways full of patients in beds too.

Pardon me if I take an anonymous internet anecdote with no corroborating evidence with a grain of salt.

Ehhh, consider the source...

Even if true, and I'm super skeptical, it still doesn't change that I haven't seen it, and I mean to say that it's all words with not even a photo or news reporter in a hallway showing this stuff. Considering how eager the establishment media are swinging for vaccinations, I'd think a few live reports of overwhelmed hospitals with piles of corpses would be a powerful motivator.
Hell, I'd consider getting one of the vaccinations if the "overwhelemed" situation were in any way demonstrable.

[oggsmash]

The latest coronavirus may have displaced the various flu bugs, but assuming that's not true, I fully expect we'll see lockdowns during the next strong flu season.

Welcome to the new normal.

That is entirely possible. I can't speak yo the US system, it's probably fabulous, but the winter flu virus puts the NHS in an awful position. Coronavirus on top of that could stretch it beyond crisis.

This is one of those things you may not be worried about, it's just the sniffles likesay, but you don't want to be hit by a car or jumped by a jakie during this time. Remember that drunk drivers and random jakies are much more committed n vee the festive season..

Basically ICU beds are already full in the winter and any of us could randomly need one. There's no need of a big, or even small, conspiracy for any government to consider a lockdown during the worst period.

I have never actually seen a hospital overloaded due to Covid. I hear about it all the time. Maybe it does happen, but I can't ever remember a news crew getting some footage, even from a distance.

I saw it. My nearest hospital in fact. Ambulances lined up outside. Patients being treated in those ambulances because there were no remaining beds inside. Hallways full of patients in beds too.

Pardon me if I take an anonymous internet anecdote with no corroborating evidence with a grain of salt.

Ehhh, consider the source...

Even if true, and I'm super skeptical, it still doesn't change that I haven't seen it, and I mean to say that it's all words with not even a photo or news reporter in a hallway showing this stuff. Considering how eager the establishment media are swinging for vaccinations, I'd think a few live reports of overwhelmed hospitals with piles of corpses would be a powerful motivator.
Hell, I'd consider getting one of the vaccinations if the "overwhelemed" situation were in any way demonstrable.

I think the time media can do that has passed by.  There will be a leak down the road of Anderson Cooper standing up in the water he was pretending was chest high, or people gathered to look like a bunch and another angle showing the reality, etc.  I buy it is no fun to get, and that some people are in real danger.  You still do not sacrifice the children of a society for the preservation of the very old.

[Zelen]

Some good news regarding pursuing early treatment, apparently Ron Desantis is now considering providing ivermectin & zinc ionophores, among others, as early treatment options starting as early as next week. With any luck, promoting early treatment options like this will have a marked impact both reducing case numbers and saving lives. I think there's a lot of people who aren't eager to take injections, but are okay with taking common preventative medications.

[KingCheops]

Some good news regarding pursuing early treatment, apparently Ron Desantis is now considering providing ivermectin & zinc ionophores, among others, as early treatment options starting as early as next week. With any luck, promoting early treatment options like this will have a marked impact both reducing case numbers and saving lives. I think there's a lot of people who aren't eager to take injections, but are okay with taking common preventative medications.

I mean take the medicine that literally millions of people have been using for generations around the world or allow yourself to be experimented on with injections that have emergency approval not full clinical trials.  Seems pretty elementary to me.

[jhkim]

Even if true, and I'm super skeptical, it still doesn't change that I haven't seen it, and I mean to say that it's all words with not even a photo or news reporter in a hallway showing this stuff. Considering how eager the establishment media are swinging for vaccinations, I'd think a few live reports of overwhelmed hospitals with piles of corpses would be a powerful motivator.
Hell, I'd consider getting one of the vaccinations if the "overwhelemed" situation were in any way demonstrable.

Here's at least news reporters in hospital hallways. It doesn't show piles of corpses, but if they did, then you'd rightly say it was staged because doctors wouldn't pile the corpses up. Instead, it shows hospital rooms with people on ventilators.

For further viewing, here are some of the reports on the situation currently in Alabama.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFSU-upzlTA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZiPO-AVKBc

[oggsmash]

  What is the vast majority of 9?  6?  Odd to me the lady did not specify that, because if we are splitting hairs, it could mean 5.   I find it more interesting ANYONE who has been vaccinated is in the ICU.

[Ratman_tf]

Even if true, and I'm super skeptical, it still doesn't change that I haven't seen it, and I mean to say that it's all words with not even a photo or news reporter in a hallway showing this stuff. Considering how eager the establishment media are swinging for vaccinations, I'd think a few live reports of overwhelmed hospitals with piles of corpses would be a powerful motivator.
Hell, I'd consider getting one of the vaccinations if the "overwhelemed" situation were in any way demonstrable.

Here's at least news reporters in hospital hallways. It doesn't show piles of corpses, but if they did, then you'd rightly say it was staged because doctors wouldn't pile the corpses up. Instead, it shows hospital rooms with people on ventilators.

Some people in a hospital with Covid. 9 patients out of how much capacity? Up 103% compared to what? More (intentionally?) vague numbers, they kind I complained about earlier.
This doesn't look like an overwhelmed hospital at all.

For further viewing, here are some of the reports on the situation currently in Alabama.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFSU-upzlTA

Good God, between the guy doing the "ONE TWO PUNCH!" and the lady comparing vaccinations to skydiving, I think I became more vaccine hesitant, if that's even possible at this point.

[Mistwell]

Even if true, and I'm super skeptical, it still doesn't change that I haven't seen it, and I mean to say that it's all words with not even a photo or news reporter in a hallway showing this stuff. Considering how eager the establishment media are swinging for vaccinations, I'd think a few live reports of overwhelmed hospitals with piles of corpses would be a powerful motivator.
Hell, I'd consider getting one of the vaccinations if the "overwhelemed" situation were in any way demonstrable.

Here's at least news reporters in hospital hallways. It doesn't show piles of corpses, but if they did, then you'd rightly say it was staged because doctors wouldn't pile the corpses up. Instead, it shows hospital rooms with people on ventilators.

Some people in a hospital with Covid. 9 patients out of how much capacity? Up 103% compared to what? More (intentionally?) vague numbers, they kind I complained about earlier.
This doesn't look like an overwhelmed hospital at all.

For further viewing, here are some of the reports on the situation currently in Alabama.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFSU-upzlTA

Good God, between the guy doing the "ONE TWO PUNCH!" and the lady comparing vaccinations to skydiving, I think I became more vaccine hesitant, if that's even possible at this point.

And this is the problem even trying to respond to requests like this. Someone asks for a photo or video of overcrowded hospitals, with no standard set for what they would consider overcrowded to look like and no expertise in what overcrowding looks like. So someone answers, and it doesn't matter what the answer would be, the response is incredibly predictably "that doesn't look like overcrowded to me," and "that's too vague an answer to the vague question with no established standards or expertise I asked."

There is no winning in that scenario. It's an impossible goal because no answer can be specific enough given the questions parameters are vague, the person asking has no standards or expertise to assess an answer, and there is a bias going in to support the assumption that there isn't overcrowding.

And if I asked you for specifics you wouldn't give them or would give such absurd standards like "It has to look like a battlefield with hundreds of beds and people visibly coding with nobody able to respond." Because you're not looking for an honest answer. You're looking for validation of your preconceived notions.

But God bless him, JKhim will try anyway. The man is a fucking saint.

[Pat]

But God bless him, JKhim will try anyway. The man is a fucking saint.

You misspelled pond scum.

[Mistwell]

But God bless him, JKhim will try anyway. The man is a fucking saint.

You misspelled pond scum.

Not sure why you dislike him? I find him pretty respectful to people. I find you pretty respectful to people as well, if you're looking for a gauge of my assessments

[Ratman_tf]

Even if true, and I'm super skeptical, it still doesn't change that I haven't seen it, and I mean to say that it's all words with not even a photo or news reporter in a hallway showing this stuff. Considering how eager the establishment media are swinging for vaccinations, I'd think a few live reports of overwhelmed hospitals with piles of corpses would be a powerful motivator.
Hell, I'd consider getting one of the vaccinations if the "overwhelemed" situation were in any way demonstrable.

Here's at least news reporters in hospital hallways. It doesn't show piles of corpses, but if they did, then you'd rightly say it was staged because doctors wouldn't pile the corpses up. Instead, it shows hospital rooms with people on ventilators.

Some people in a hospital with Covid. 9 patients out of how much capacity? Up 103% compared to what? More (intentionally?) vague numbers, they kind I complained about earlier.
This doesn't look like an overwhelmed hospital at all.

For further viewing, here are some of the reports on the situation currently in Alabama.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFSU-upzlTA

Good God, between the guy doing the "ONE TWO PUNCH!" and the lady comparing vaccinations to skydiving, I think I became more vaccine hesitant, if that's even possible at this point.

And this is the problem even trying to respond to requests like this. Someone asks for a photo or video of overcrowded hospitals, with no standard set for what they would consider overcrowded to look like and no expertise in what overcrowding looks like. So someone answers, and it doesn't matter what the answer would be, the response is incredibly predictably "that doesn't look like overcrowded to me," and "that's too vague an answer to the vague question with no established standards or expertise I asked."

There is no winning in that scenario. It's an impossible goal because no answer can be specific enough given the questions parameters are vague, the person asking has no standards or expertise to assess an answer, and there is a bias going in to support the assumption that there isn't overcrowding.

And if I asked you for specifics you wouldn't give them or would give such absurd standards like "It has to look like a battlefield with hundreds of beds and people visibly coding with nobody able to respond." Because you're not looking for an honest answer. You're looking for validation of your preconceived notions.

And this is the problem with questioning a narrative. You Just throw accusations about my motivation and deflect from answering questions. I could say there's no evidence or line of argumentation that hospitals are not overcrowded that you will accept. So we're stuck pointing fingers at each other saying "He's not arguing in good faith!" We're down to rhetoric instead of discussion.

And while I sometimes enjoy a rhetorical battle, I also think it's a frivolous waste of time. Amusing, but not really productive.

But God bless him, JKhim will try anyway. The man is a fucking saint.

Yes, I imagine you'd have high regard for someone who agrees with you. 

[KingCheops]

Maybe hospitals should stop firing unvaccinated nurses who worked all through the pandemic without vaccines?  That'll cause all sorts of issues wouldn't it?

https://fee.org/articles/massive-nurse-shortage-hits-houston-weeks-after-150-unvaccinated-nurses-and-hospital-workers-fired/

[Mistwell]

Even if true, and I'm super skeptical, it still doesn't change that I haven't seen it, and I mean to say that it's all words with not even a photo or news reporter in a hallway showing this stuff. Considering how eager the establishment media are swinging for vaccinations, I'd think a few live reports of overwhelmed hospitals with piles of corpses would be a powerful motivator.
Hell, I'd consider getting one of the vaccinations if the "overwhelemed" situation were in any way demonstrable.

Here's at least news reporters in hospital hallways. It doesn't show piles of corpses, but if they did, then you'd rightly say it was staged because doctors wouldn't pile the corpses up. Instead, it shows hospital rooms with people on ventilators.

Some people in a hospital with Covid. 9 patients out of how much capacity? Up 103% compared to what? More (intentionally?) vague numbers, they kind I complained about earlier.
This doesn't look like an overwhelmed hospital at all.

For further viewing, here are some of the reports on the situation currently in Alabama.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFSU-upzlTA

Good God, between the guy doing the "ONE TWO PUNCH!" and the lady comparing vaccinations to skydiving, I think I became more vaccine hesitant, if that's even possible at this point.

And this is the problem even trying to respond to requests like this. Someone asks for a photo or video of overcrowded hospitals, with no standard set for what they would consider overcrowded to look like and no expertise in what overcrowding looks like. So someone answers, and it doesn't matter what the answer would be, the response is incredibly predictably "that doesn't look like overcrowded to me," and "that's too vague an answer to the vague question with no established standards or expertise I asked."

There is no winning in that scenario. It's an impossible goal because no answer can be specific enough given the questions parameters are vague, the person asking has no standards or expertise to assess an answer, and there is a bias going in to support the assumption that there isn't overcrowding.

And if I asked you for specifics you wouldn't give them or would give such absurd standards like "It has to look like a battlefield with hundreds of beds and people visibly coding with nobody able to respond." Because you're not looking for an honest answer. You're looking for validation of your preconceived notions.

And this is the problem with questioning a narrative. You Just throw accusations about my motivation and deflect from answering questions. I could say there's no evidence or line of argumentation that hospitals are not overcrowded that you will accept.

Well I saw it with my own eyes at my closest hospital (which I had plenty of comparison for, pre-pandemic, and which I'm pretty familiar with during the pandemic as I donated face masks to them a couple of times and spoke with their staff). They also ran out of nurses (who were sick too). Paramedics were warned that critically ill or seriously injured patients would not be admitted to that overcrowded emergency room, even if they were the closest facilities to the patients. Which let me tell you, isn't a nice thing to hear when it's YOUR closest emergency room.

My region of hospitals also hit "Medical gridlock" where rashes of emergency rooms closed at the same time, leaving paramedics spinning their ambulance wheels waiting for empty beds to deliver patients. Much of that was due to a sudden nursing shortage. You need a fixed number of nurses for each bed at your hospital/ICU/ER room, and they didn't have the nurses even when they turned to the emergency temporary nurse registry. So some hospitals which had beds couldn't take patients for those beds, which put pressure on the nearby hospitals to take that overload, which cause a cascade effect.

If you have some evidence that what I saw, and what I heard from the nurses and doctors in person, wasn't what it looked like and what they claimed directly to me then I am open to hearing it. The news also backed up what I saw, specifically about that hospital near me. It was listed as overloaded, and was.