So here's the revised list of chapters for my Kickstarter:
FOREWARD
INTRODUCTION
UNSTATED ASSUMPTIONS – WARGAMING
PLAYER SKILL
LESSNARD ALONE!
UNSTATED ASSUMPTIONS – D&D AND DIPLOMACY
UNSTATED ASSUMPTIONS – D&D AND CHAINMAIL
UNSTATED ASSUMPTIONS – D&D AND TRACTICS
YRAG, XAGYG, REDNIBLLEPS, AND GRONAN
FANTASTIC MEDIEVAL WARGAMES CAMPAIGN
SETTING ERNIE ON FIRE and TIM AND THE BALROGS
GARY incl THE NIGHT WE FED ERNIE TO THE MONSTER and NO KILLING THE PRINCESS
DAVE SUTHERLAND
DAVE incl NECROSS THE (HA HA HA!) MAD
UP IN THE AIR, JUNIOR BIRDMEN!
GARY AND DAVE
WHY PAY US TO HAVE FUN FOR YOU
GHOULASH THE BALROG AND THE ORCS
GARY LOSES CONTROL OF HIS GAME
PHIL
ONCE THERE WAS A LAND CALLED GREYHAWK inc 99 SIDED RANDOM MONSTER DIE
GARY GYGAX GAME DESIGN
MY GREYHAWK BALROG AND WIZARD TIMES
PLAYING IN GREYHAWK AND BLACKMOOR
BUT HOW DO I DO IT
THE GREATEST UNSTATED ASSUMPTION
THE LOST END GAME
THINGS PEOPLE DON'T KNOW
THE DJINN, THE BALROG, AND THE PANCAKE OF THREE WISHES
OUTDOOR SURVIVAL
AFTERWORD
My question is, is there anything anybody would like to know about that I've left out? The parameters are that it's before 1977 (before AD&D 1E). Also, I'm not interested in one-sentence or one-paragraph subjects like "Did you ever encounter a Tarrasque" or "Did Gary Gygax use miniatures for D&D?"; I'm looking for subjects people are interested in that would require fairly long answers, between 500 words anywhere up to 5000 words.
Thanks.
Changes, if any, between the fans and players then. And the fans and players now.
Changes between RPG designers then and RPG designers now.
Experiences with the D&D Hysteria & Witch Hunts if any?
Desperately clamoring for attention at TBP?
Quote from: JeremyR;791268Desperately clamoring for attention at TBP?
Go fuck yourself.
And when you're done, tongue my pee hole.
IDK, I think a one-paragraph joke chapter can work, I'm sure you could think of one.
The chapter list seems good.
1) Do you think that was a joke?
2) There are actually interesting posters there, and despite my inclinations I do not intend to turn this book into a rant about the superiority of my taste in gaming.
Quote from: Omega;791267Changes, if any, between the fans and players then. And the fans and players now.
Changes between RPG designers then and RPG designers now.
Experiences with the D&D Hysteria & Witch Hunts if any?
I really don't have much experience with fans, players, and RPG designers now, and it goes against my "before 1977" guidelines. I hesitate to use my experiences on the internet as any sort of authority.
I was in my late 20s when the whole hysteria hit, so it had virtually no effect on me, and it was after 1977.
Gary and religion, how he felt about designing the spiritual dimension of the game.
When did genres other that fantasy/science fantasy enter the conversation as potential future designs, and which ones excited who?
The handling of stealth.
Quote from: Old Geezer;7913101) Do you think that was a joke?
2) There are actually interesting posters there, and despite my inclinations I do not intend to turn this book into a rant about the superiority of my taste in gaming.
???
My comment was in relation to this...
Quote from: Old Geezer;791265Also, I'm not interested in one-sentence or one-paragraph subjects like "Did you ever encounter a Tarrasque" or "Did Gary Gygax use miniatures for D&D?"; I'm looking for subjects people are interested in that would require fairly long answers, between 500 words anywhere up to 5000 words.
Something like,
DID GARY GYGAX GIVE WOMEN A NEGATIVE STRENGTH MODIFIER BECAUSE HE HATED WOMEN
Pee hole, mine: tongue....but, you know, funny.
Perhaps a chapter on the cultural and entertainment environment of the 70s, and how that informed the game?
I think everyone should chill out; I like making fun of OG as much as any well adjusted person should, but I think it will be interesting and cool to read through a detailed account of his memories of the whole scene. Over on the dreaded P I chimed in that I would particularly like to hear about the ca. 1972-5 era when Chainmail was the book at the table but something a but beyond that was being played. This experience was my entry to the hobby (though alone and a couple years later), so I'm quite curious to hear what was going through people's heads.
I'm not sure if it's included in your afterword but maybe a synopsis of where the hobby has gone and your reintroduction into it via forum authority and fandome of the beginning from your perspective. It may not be relevant to the topic but to why the book was written.
Some really good stuff here, thanks. Much of this stuff is already in there, but there's some stuff to add. More like fleshing out existing chapters, but heck, you folks can't know that.
Like, yeah, I spend a good chunk talking about what it was like as CHAINMAIL transmogrified.
Quote from: Ladybird;791339???
My comment was in relation to this...
Something like,
DID GARY GYGAX GIVE WOMEN A NEGATIVE STRENGTH MODIFIER BECAUSE HE HATED WOMEN
Pee hole, mine: tongue.
...but, you know, funny.
Which syllable of "pre-1977" is too hard to understand?
I want a Dave vs. Gary chapter.
I am quite interested in your thoughts on the GM style of Dave Arneson vs. the GM style of Gary Gygax, both how they approached the game rules, the development of their campaigns and how they evolved as GMs over time (or not). Also, any other notable GMs of the era who "invented" stuff that became standard, or more importantly GM stuff that didn't become canon in game books.
Quote from: Old Geezer;791265"Did Gary Gygax use miniatures for D&D?"
I would be interested in at least 500 words on how the use of miniatures and maps at the table changed and evolved, also differences in how use of minis by GMs of the era. Minis and grids are such an iconic part of D&D, whether you use them or not, so exploring that development would be great.
Quote from: Armchair Gamer;791340Perhaps a chapter on the cultural and entertainment environment of the 70s, and how that informed the game?
I agree. The 70s are an alien planet compared to 2014. I think it will be important to remind the audience about how the era affected the development and popularity of the game.
BTW, why are you cutting off at 1977?
I'll talk about Dave's gaming compared to Gary's gaming, but I flatly refuse to speak about the lawsuit, etc.
I'm cutting off at 1977 -- actually it's 1976, to correct myself.
1976 is when Strategic Review magazine was cancelled and turned into "The Dragon" and "Little Wars." At that point D&D became no longer "a strange variant of miniatures wargaming," which is the story I'm telling.
Did you encounter the WRG "Ancients" edition with a fantasy appendix? How about other early fantasy wargame experiments? Other campaigns inspired by some word of the Arneson and Gygax games, but with their own rules?
You may discount this, but I intend to read your book in order to learn more about these guys as people. Not just names that are famous in gaming circles but who they actually were. So as long as your chapters include the truth about them and how they played, then I'll be a satisfied customer.
Quote from: jeff37923;791585You may discount this, but I intend to read your book in order to learn more about these guys as people. Not just names that are famous in gaming circles but who they actually were. So as long as your chapters include the truth about them and how they played, then I'll be a satisfied customer.
+1.
Though I agree with Armchair and Spinach as well, I'd definitely like insight on how the specific cultural environment of the times, in your opinion, affected the game, if you have any thoughts on the matter.
Do you have a chapter where you explained how you come into playing wargames and RPGs and how you begin to play with Gary Gyagax, Dave Anerson and their buddies ?
How have you organized your book ? thematically or chronologically ?
I am not really sure who you are, so I am largely unaware of what your book is about.
Can you give me a quick synopsis of your background and what you're writing about?
Quote from: ZWEIHÄNDER;791850I am not really sure who you are, so I am largely unaware of what your book is about.
Can you give me a quick synopsis of your background and what you're writing about?
He used to be part of Gary and Dave's regular game groups up until around the time OD&D was published, it's an oral history of his memories of the pre-publication days of the hobby.
Quote from: yabaziou;791640Do you have a chapter where you explained how you come into playing wargames and RPGs and how you begin to play with Gary Gyagax, Dave Anerson and their buddies ?
Similar to this, I would be interested in knowing how new players were recruited for the game, what the 'pitch' was for people to give it a go and what the rough conversion rate was. I'm interested in how easy or hard it was to get players for a new concept and how quickly they 'got' it.
Quote from: Old Geezer;791582I'll talk about Dave's gaming compared to Gary's gaming, but I flatly refuse to speak about the lawsuit, etc.
I actually have little/no interest about the lawsuit, but why won't you speak about it?
My interest in Dave vs. Gary is 99% about them as GMs. My hope is that after reading your book, I get some bits to help me become a better DM.
Quote from: Old Geezer;791582At that point D&D became no longer "a strange variant of miniatures wargaming," which is the story I'm telling.
Interesting. How did you come to the decision to cut off at this time? You certainly were involved in the years afterward.
Quote from: Old Geezer;791582I'll talk about Dave's gaming compared to Gary's gaming, but I flatly refuse to speak about the lawsuit, etc.
I'm cutting off at 1977 -- actually it's 1976, to correct myself.
1976 is when Strategic Review magazine was cancelled and turned into "The Dragon" and "Little Wars." At that point D&D became no longer "a strange variant of miniatures wargaming," which is the story I'm telling.
This may be addressed elsewhere in the thread, but I think you're doing people a disservice by not covering the explosion itself - that's a big chunk people will be fascinated by and want to know what happened as seen from an "insider".
I'm very curious about Don Kaye since his untimely death being averted seems one of the biggest paths not taken in the development of TSR as a company and I know very little about him.
To quote my chapter:
GARY AND DAVE
It's not really possible to talk much about the "old days" of D&D without somebody bringing up the whole "Gary Gygax vs Dave Arneson" issue. I have no sympathy for those who wish to indulge their curiosity. Those with an honest interest in history will find more reliable sources.
I have two things to say.
As part of the first lawsuit, I gave a deposition. My conclusion was that
"Dungeons and Dragons is a creation of both Dave Arneson and Gary Gygax. If either of those two had not been involved, Dungeons and Dragons would not exist." I stood by it then, and I stand by it now. That is the plain, simple truth as I see it.
My second thing to say is to reprise what I said when I was interviewed for "Dungeons and Dragons: A Documentary." And I quote:
"As far as I'm concerned, unless we are talking about Dave Arneson's original Blackmoor group of some ten or fifteen guys, and Gary Gygax' original Greyhawk group plus maybe two or three years of TSR people, outside of that fairly small circle of individuals, the rest of the world needs to open itself a big ol' can of Shut The Fuck Up."
I stand by those words as well. Those with some ghoulish interest in reviving possible conflicts between two of my friends who have both passed away will have to find their schadenfreude elsewhere.
Old Geezer,
I would like to hear about your experiences with female gamers in the early years and observations regarding the shift in dynamic towards inclusiveness in the hobby.
Thanks!
Quote from: ZWEIHÄNDER;791976Old Geezer,
I would like to hear about your experiences with female gamers in the early years and observations regarding the shift in dynamic towards inclusiveness in the hobby.
Thanks!
Speaking for myself, I've seen just the opposite shift. Girls and women seem a lot scarcer among players today than in the 1970s.
Quote from: Old Geezer;791972Those with some ghoulish interest in reviving possible conflicts between two of my friends who have both passed away will have to find their schadenfreude elsewhere.
It might be interesting for you to address the lawsuit from the position of being able to discuss how it affected everyone in the circle who knew both parties, and who were friends with both. AKA, were people able to keep friendships or did things erupt like an ugly divorce that tore apart friendships? And were there ever any reconciliations?
Your deposition fits what's I've heard. DA + GG = D&D, and D&D did not develop without the influence of one upon the other.
But I wonder if their is a way to discuss the social / personal aspects of the conflict without appealing to "ghoulish interest", especially since you can discuss it even handed as you were friend to both. Maybe there are rumors that you feel you can set straight?