Quote from: J Arcane;372774All I was getting at originally is that with a property like this, in the hands of a company like Sanguine, I would be concerned it would be overly focused on the characters being animal people, as opposed to them being Japanese people who look like animals.

For example, I'm not convinced that making them into statted races makes any sense for the setting.  I think one should just make a character, and decide what animal makes the most sense for what they have in mind.  I can only think of one character that possessed any peculiar abilities that might warrant additional rules coverage, and that's because he was a snake with no arms.

Now I see your point.

Let's see how each game approaches the subject:

In Gold Rush Usagi Yojimbo, each race gets a Special Ability that only they get, and no other. For example, Rhinos get a special ability to withstand damage.

In Sanguine Usagi Yojimbo, each race gets two Gifts. These Gifts are not exclusive in any way, (except in a few cases, for example bats, and only bats, get the Fly Gift), everybody can get them, during chargen when you get free Gifts, or later with experience points.

As you can see, you have no reason to be concerned about Sanguine, in reality, its treatment of animal races is more open and flexible than Gold Rush's.

In defense of Gold Rush Usagi Yojimbo, it wouldn't be very difficult to make Special Racial Abilities open to everybody, just like Job Special Abilities. But note this is the default condition in Sanguine Usagi Yojimbo.

Other than this, your character doesn't get anything else for belonging to a race, no +1 to strength or something like that. This applies to both games.

QuoteMaybe I'd be better off just getting Sengoku or one of the other historic Japan games, and just adding on the animal thing myself as flavor text.

Sengoku is great, specially if you treat it like a setting supplement for a different setting. The system is not as bad as some people would have you believe, but it has some dealbreakers. It uses 13 (yes, 13) stats, and the list of skills is looooooooong, too long for my taste. It has different skills for Buddhism and Shintoism, go figure. Some of the talents were really good, but others were underpowered in comparison.

The setting information is top notch, but take into account that it applies to the Sengoku period, whereas Usagi Yojimbo is based on the Tokugawa period.

Regarding other games, I own Legend of the Five Rings 1st and 3rd, Sengoku, RQ Land of Ninja (another great supplement), Sengoku, Gold Rush Usagi Yojimbo and Sanguine Usagi Yojimbo, and in my opinion the last one is the best samurai RPG ever, no doubt. I don't own Bushido, RQ Land of Samurai (this one seems decent) or the Burning Wheel one, The Blossoms Are Falling, but if I ended up liking one of these more than Sanguine Usagi Yojimbo, I would chase the authors to marry them.

Quote from: RPGPundit;372777A pretty concrete example about how making it about Furry-ness changes things at a fundamental level.

RPGPundit

Except that there is no example there, just J Arcane's concern, that I think I addressed.

Quote from: Claudius;372787Except that there is no example there, just J Arcane's concern, that I think I addressed.

Ok, fair enough, I was running on the assumption that J Arcane was talking about a mechanic change that was actually in the present edition.

RPGPundit

Quote from: Claudius;372784Other than this, your character doesn't get anything else for belonging to a race, no +1 to strength or something like that. This applies to both games.

Sorry, but I checked it today and I see I was wrong about this. This only applies to Sanguine Usagi Yojimbo. In Gold Rush Usagi Yojimbo, you get a bonus to a few stats for belonging to a race (or should I say species?).

Quote from: Nicephorus;371978snip

I left out unintentionally two very important points, how combat works, and how Gifts work, which I see you commented on. Thank you!

Quote from: RPGPundit;372919Ok, fair enough, I was running on the assumption that J Arcane was talking about a mechanic change that was actually in the present edition.

RPGPundit

OK.

As I said, in both versions of Usagi Yojimbo the species you can choose for your character are differentiated, but it's not a big deal. And accusing Sanguine of stressing the animalness of the characters is nonsense, if anything, Gold Rush puts more emphasis on it, in Gold Rush UY every species gets a Special Ability no other species gets (although it could be houseruled easily), whereas in Sanguine UY that's not the case.

By the way, I wonder if in a future Usagi Yojimbo RPG you will be allowed to create a human character, like Lord Hikiji.

One last thing to J Arcane

I hope all your questions have been answered. If you have another question or doubt, please ask. I admit I'm a fan of Sanguine UY (although I don't dislike Gold Rush UY), and I hold the UY comics in high esteem, but I think that, like others in this thread, I have tried to be as objective as possible, saying the good and the bad.

And forget the "if you play it you'll become a furrrrrrrrrrrryyyyyyyy" bullshit. Both versions of UY are excellent games (even if you don't take into account the comic, which is great), and I feel they haven't been more successful because some people are bent on associating them with the worst aspects of furriness.

Don't do yourself a disservice, and check them out!