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I've cooked up this spell for a 5e campaign and I'd like some help making sure it works as intended and doesn't create too many unforeseen problems.

Spell: Mishusial's Manikin Mold
4th-level transmutation
Casting Time: 1 Action
Range:  Touch
Components: V, S
Duration: Instantaneous

You grant a sentient item either a small or medium humanoid form. The item keeps its Intelligence, Wisdom and Charisma scores, but loses all its special properties as long as it remains in humanoid form. It gains a Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution score of 10, and has 1d8 hit points. It speaks whatever languages it previously knew, plus one language the caster knows. It can revert to its item form as a free action at any time, but once it does so it cannot turn back into a humanoid until this spell is cast on it again.

While in humanoid form the item is considered a construct. It does not gain any of the traits of the humanoid it is masquerading as, but it does not need to eat, breathe or sleep. It is immune to poisons and diseases.

The appearance of the item's humanoid form is fixed and constructed from its subconscious ideals. It cannot look exactly like a specific person.

I may be obtuse here, but I don't think I grok what this spell is for. It would help me to understand what you are trying to do with the spell if you included one or two examples of what sort of item you envisage this spell being cast on and why someone might what to transmute that item.

So the spell is to transform a sentient item (say, an intelligent magic sword) into a humanoid form, more of a companion/familiar thing.  I dig it.

I don't see any major issues with it, although I'm not deep enough into 5e yet to be sure about the power levels on similar fourth-level spells.

I would definitely change it to 'humanoid or animal' form, even if that form were determined by the DM rather than the player, as it opens up more possibilities.  Some swords are housecats, y'know?

seems straightforward enough. i don't see any problems.

i wonder what happens when the construct is destroyed, though. is the item gone if that happens?

considering where we are here there obviously are no "unforseen problems"... only features.

I love it!

I can imagine a malicious item that has this cast on it crawling into a more likely bearer's back-pack and reverting back into item form! Very one-ring.  

There is one problem, though. What happens if the humanoid shape gets killed? Should there also be a time-limit on the transformation? An hour sounds good.

Sounds interesting.

Might want to set some paramiters on exactly what it can and cant be shaped into. Like only human, only humanoid, only beast, etc. And what its stats might be as a base guideline if its human seeming. IE: It has the stats of a veteran from the MM.

You likely need a clause such as, "When reduced to zero or less HP reverts back to its item form. The manikin cannot be Instantly Killed."

However I am partial to, "When unconscious reverts back to its item form. The manikin cannot be Instantly Killed." Makes for a fun surprise when a Sleep spell goes off.

Further, I'd drop the construct override of biological needs. Just leave it to immunity of disease and poison, and maybe not even that. Something about an item needing to eat, breathe, sleep, clothe from exposure, etc. is an incredible roleplay opportunity. The sheer resentment of having to stay awake alone to avoid reverting back to an item writes itself.

Also needs, "Items worn, held, or consumed by this manikin form are immediately dropped upon reverting back to its item form (consumed items appear in their current state of digestion)." You could easily powergame manikin items swallowing MacGuffins and then switching back to an item to lock them away. Besides, sleep deprived sentient items contemplating leaving a pile of digested goo & shit upon someone's backpack is priceless.

The intent of the spell is for sentient items to be able to experience some aspects of humanoid life, such a free movement, normal interactions, a mundane social identity, etc. I wrote it for use by NPCs, but I want it to be available for player use if they discover and like it. It is really a roleplaying tool, not a problem-solving tool, but I'm sure creative players could find all kinds of novel uses for it.

I made them stay constructs with non-biological limitations so that there would be some obvious ways to spot and investigate them in my campaign.

Allowing them to turn into animals would probably make the spell a little too useful. I'll think about it for a later, more advanced spell.

Here's a revision based on some of the comments and my further thoughts. How does it look now?

Spell: Mishusial's Manikin Mold
4th-level transmutation (Ritual)
Casting Time: 1 Action
Range: Touch
Components: V, S, M (a small clay mold shaped like the outline of a humanoid)
Duration: Instantaneous

You grant a sentient item either a small or medium humanoid form. The item keeps its Intelligence, Wisdom and Charisma scores, but loses all its special properties as long as it remains in humanoid form. It gains a Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution score of 10, and has 1d8 hit points. It speaks whatever languages it previously knew, plus one language the caster knows. It can revert to its item form as a free action at any time, but once it does so it cannot turn back into a humanoid until this spell is cast on it again.

While in humanoid form the item is considered a construct. It does not gain any of the traits of the humanoid it is masquerading as, but it does not need to eat, breathe or sleep. It is immune to poisons and diseases. If the item is reduced to 0 hit points or otherwise killed in its humanoid form, it reverts to its item form, is unconscious (even if it cannot normally be unconscious) for a hour and none of its abilities are useable during that time.

The appearance of the item's humanoid form is fixed and constructed from its subconscious ideals. It cannot look exactly like a specific person.

The indefinite duration is perhaps the one possible issue; things like Animal Messenger and Animate Dead seem to be limited to 24 hours. But I don't really see that as being particularly useful and the potential for interesting roleplaying is wonderful. (What methods does the caster have to dismiss the spell? I can see the magic item hiding or running away if it's not ready to go back to its former shape. Better still if the item learns to cast the spell on itself.)

You still need the clause about "worn, held, or consumed items drop back out." Just because you have "does not need" in no way prevents it from possessing or consuming something and taking it with them upon reversion. Trust me on this, this would be my first line of approach to utterly fuck up a campaign (if I were so inclined). And no, it is not obvious to every GM that that is how things should work, or whether it is a campaign breaker.

Quote from: Shipyard Locked;820301The intent of the spell is for sentient items to be able to experience some aspects of humanoid life, such a free movement, normal interactions, a mundane social identity, etc. I wrote it for use by NPCs, but I want it to be available for player use if they discover and like it. It is really a roleplaying tool, not a problem-solving tool, but I'm sure creative players could find all kinds of novel uses for it.

Good spell. I'd use it as a messenger, or a way to smuggle magic items into a prison; every tool should be a problem-solving tool. I'd add the ability for the caster to cancel it at-will, but nobody else, unless they have some form of "turn construct" or whatever power; I'd also let them take on animal form. But if they get reduced to 0 hit points, they die, and I'd only let them be animated by a character who the item feels has some relationship with it.

I'd probably also leave it at infinite duration, because that lets me have a village of rebel magic items (Whose animators have died or abandoned them); I'd also let them learn new things (And "level up"). Why yes, I am going for a "village of abandoned pokémon".

Alright, here's the update with Opao's modification. Anyone have final thoughts?

Spell: Mishusial's Manikin Mold
4th-level transmutation (Ritual)
Casting Time: 1 Action
Range: Touch
Components: V, S, M (a small clay mold shaped like the outline of a humanoid)
Duration: Instantaneous

You grant a sentient item either a small or medium humanoid form. The item keeps its Intelligence, Wisdom and Charisma scores, but loses all its special properties as long as it remains in humanoid form. It gains a Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution score of 10, and has 1d8 hit points. It speaks whatever languages it previously knew, plus one language the caster knows. It can revert to its item form as a free action at any time, but once it does so it cannot turn back into a humanoid until this spell is cast on it again.

While in humanoid form the item is considered a construct. It does not gain any of the traits of the humanoid it is masquerading as, but it does not need to eat, breathe or sleep. It is immune to poisons and diseases. If the item is reduced to 0 hit points or otherwise killed in its humanoid form, it reverts to its item form, is unconscious (even if it cannot normally be unconscious) for a hour and none of its abilities are useable during that time.

Objects worn, held, or consumed by the item in humanoid form are immediately dropped upon reverting back to its true form.

The appearance of the item's humanoid form is fixed and constructed from its subconscious ideals. It cannot look exactly like a specific person.

QuoteI'd probably also leave it at infinite duration, because that lets me have a village of rebel magic items (Whose animators have died or abandoned them); I'd also let them learn new things (And "level up").

Yeah, that's basically the vibe I'm going for: Sentient items want to live fuller lives, but must balance it against their inability to cast this crucial spell and their instinctive drive to be used for their true purpose.

Quote from: Shipyard Locked;820563If the item is reduced to 0 hit points or otherwise killed in its humanoid form, it reverts to its item form, is unconscious (even if it cannot normally be unconscious) for a hour and none of its abilities are useable during that time.

I really like the "or otherwise killed in its humanoid form" clause as it covers Instantly Killed and any other unforeseen methods of destruction (i.e. Disintegration?). Only the manikin is dying, not the item.

Only addition I would add is make it 1d4 hours of unconsciousness. Two reasons: 1) Randomness screws with predictability, and thus screws with potential gamesmanship. 2) Maintains consistency with already extant 5e rules about Falling Unconscious, thus less to remember, less exception, etc.

I really do like the "(even if it cannot normally be unconscious)" clause, by the way. First, turning off powers and sentience is a sensible penalty for getting your item buddy's vessel unnecessarily killed. Second, the idea of an ancient sentience getting addicted to the sensation of finally being off is an incredible roleplay opportunity.

This reminds me of some stuff Jan Švankmajer was going on about being an alchemist and sensing what objects wished to become when he animated them... that a spoon might want to dance and a set up cups might be inclined to fight to the death.
I guess that would make it good to have some clue about the temperament of an object before providing it the ability to act out its compulsions.

now admittedly im no good at spell balance but i see no reason to give it any extra languages

Quote from: tuypo1;820593now admittedly im no good at spell balance but i see no reason to give it any extra languages

I think the point was to allow it to communicate with the caster in all cases; I can see good potential for interesting game events if this were not the case, and probably most sentient items would already have a language in common with some party member if not the caster.

Actually, the point is that some sentient items have no spoken language and use telepathy instead. That clause is there to get around that problem.

So, revised version:

Spell: Mishusial's Manikin Mold
4th-level transmutation (Ritual)
Casting Time: 1 Action
Range: Touch
Components: V, S, M (a small clay mold shaped like the outline of a humanoid)
Duration: Instantaneous

You grant a sentient item either a small or medium humanoid form. The item keeps its Intelligence, Wisdom and Charisma scores, but loses all its special properties as long as it remains in humanoid form. It gains a Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution score of 10, and has 1d8 hit points. It speaks whatever languages it previously knew, plus one language the caster knows. It can revert to its item form as a free action at any time, but once it does so it cannot turn back into a humanoid until this spell is cast on it again.

While in humanoid form the item is considered a construct. It does not gain any of the traits of the humanoid it is masquerading as, but it does not need to eat, breathe or sleep. It is immune to poisons and diseases. If the item is reduced to 0 hit points or otherwise killed in its humanoid form, it reverts to its item form, is unconscious (even if it cannot normally be unconscious) for 1d4 hours and none of its abilities are useable during that time.

Objects worn, held, or consumed by the item in humanoid form are immediately dropped upon reverting back to its true form.

The appearance of the item's humanoid form is fixed and constructed from its subconscious ideals. It cannot look exactly like a specific person.

I like it! It's a really flavorful spell.

It's also pretty strong as you are turning an item into action economy and power projection. But you have enough restrictions on it to really tone down the power closer to a no-maintenance unskilled hireling. And most importantly, it writes its own adventures because the item retains its sentience & personality (a.k.a. GM control). You have to roleplay with the manikin to gain the most out of it.

It's a thinking PC's spell.

I'd still destroy the item if it's humanoid form hits 0 HP. Forces the character to think carefully whether to animate it (Or, you know, actually bond with their magic item) and take care of the animated form.

I'd probably also let it's humanoid form develop over time, so while it wouldn't change form during a session as a humanoid, it wouldn't necessarily have the same humanoid form every time it changed.

Quote from: Ladybird;820725I'd still destroy the item if it's humanoid form hits 0 HP. Forces the character to think carefully whether to animate it (Or, you know, actually bond with their magic item) and take care of the animated form.

Considering many sentient items are wondrous to relic and thus often extraordinarily hard to destroy — and a 1d8 commoner body is laughably easy to obliterate by the time 4th lvl spells are available — the spell would almost never be cast (except to annihilate morally opposing sentient items with ease, thus making them rarer). Too much risk for little reward. Even a flavorful home game table would be hard pressed for a reason to bother. The math on HP, or spell level, or both would have to be changed.

Quote from: Shipyard Locked;820716Actually, the point is that some sentient items have no spoken language and use telepathy instead. That clause is there to get around that problem.

fair enough

Quote from: Shipyard Locked;820716Actually, the point is that some sentient items have no spoken language and use telepathy instead. That clause is there to get around that problem.

So why not limit it to the cases where the target item uses telepathy? It doesn't break anything to include it, but it leaves out some possibly interesting situations where the item has neither telepathy nor languages in common with the caster.

Quote from: rawma;820738So why not limit it to the cases where the target item uses telepathy? It doesn't break anything to include it, but it leaves out some possibly interesting situations where the item has neither telepathy nor languages in common with the caster.

Because that's how I like it for the very specific need it meets in my current campaign. :D

fair enough

Quote from: Shipyard Locked;820742Because that's how I like it for the very specific need it meets in my current campaign. :D

OK, OK. But I like keeping future possibilities open, myself, since I never know what I'll need then. :)

I like it!