TheRPGSite

I saw a link to this article posted on Reddit, so opened the page for later. Later turned out to be a couple of days and now I can't find the post. Checking the article page (still open in my browser) I saw it's archived - https://archive.is/0Nv3c

So this was posted on Medium, shared on Reddit at least once, and within 2 days the original, Reddit link, and even the SoundCloud account with the interview extracts are gone too?!

Did anyone else see it?

While in A's interview he says only that Patrick Stuart is "a bit of a prick", Stuart says Olivia Hill (formerly at the company that did popular '90s goth horror game Vampire: The Masquerade) "sounds insane", while when Olivia Hill's girlfriend (and employee) Francita Soto claimed Hill was an abuser and that Hill's game-designer wife Filamena Young was as well, Robert Bohl (author of punk-teen simulator RPG Misspent Youth) sympathised with Soto saying he had secretly had issues with Hill for years, Shoe Skogen (former moderator of the largest and most influential OSR Discord forum) accuses Hill of sketchy sexual behavior in role-play chat and sending mentally-ill people to harass her, while Skogen's ex-, Emmy Allen, also known as "Cavegirl" and "Emily Allen" (author of the game Dungeon Bitches), claims Skogen abused her (Cavegirl ) during their relationship— though Skogen and Cavegirl have never physically met, Skogen in turn says Erika Muse (currently a moderator at the OSR Discord that Skogen used to moderate) outed Cavegirl as trans, while Fiona Maeve Geist (who is also trans) claims that Cavegirl falsely accused her, Geist, of outing Cavegirl as trans, while Brian Yaksha concurs in his interview that Cavegirl is a "a piece of work" and "racist", Yaksha also says Chris McDowall (founder of the OSR Discord forum, as well as author of indie games Into the Odd and Electric Bastionland) is an "egotistical jackass", and further says that two of early indie darling PH Lee's games (Bliss Stage and Hot Guy's Making Out) promote child abuse, but Ash Kreider (author of Our Traveling Home "A Ghibli-inspired fantasy tabletop RPG about queer romance, found family, and finding healing through belonging"), in their interview (in addition to attacking two creators behind the ten million dollar Avatar: Legends Kickstarter respectively as "soulless and toxic" and a "tenderqueer" who made a name for herself by being "nice" but not "kind"), claims PH Lee's enemies used "GamerGate-level harassment tactics" against Lee including contacting mutuals on Twitter and asking them to unfollow Lee, which, however, is a tactic PH Lee's ally Whitney Beltrán (who formerly worked on official D&D's recent Ravenloft supplement with her partner Ajit George and who, last I checked was working on an official triple-A Dungeons and Dragons video game) definitely did to yet another designer.

Wow.  ::)

Emails revealed in the court documents reveal the smoking gun — Adkison made the decision to harass Smith about 40 minutes after being asked to by one of Adkison's friends at Evil Hat Productions— the same company that produced Thirsty Sword Lesbians and the popular indie game system Fate.

Just wow. I hope Zak has a copy of all this.

were you able to archive the audio links?  The audio has been scrubbed from Soundcloud.

Quote from: Cathode Ray on January 27, 2024, 09:38:28 AM
were you able to archive the audio links?  The audio has been scrubbed from Soundcloud.

Hopefully someone has. The audio is entirely missing from SoundCloud. Someone want to bury this much, maybe?

QuoteIf we are to believe accusations of abuse simply because someone made them, we would have to conclude that literally everyone in the tabletop RPG scene is an abuser, very much including all of the women.

At least it would be a more realistic portrayal of perpetrators. 

What this tells me is that the left is both a bunch of abusers and liars simultaneously; I doubt this is much of a revelation to most of you reading this thread.

QuoteSo I read as much as I could stand and then I went for a run because it made me so angry. Because there is nothing I can think of that fills me with more impotent rage than a fellow woman lying about abuse. And not just lying about it, but weaponizing her allegations to actively destroy someone. It is an affront to everything I believe in and everything feminism stands for. It makes it easier for people to dismiss truthful claims (of which an estimated 92–98 percent of all allegations are — or, at least allegations to the police — which her statement was not), and it changes the focus of the entire issue. Instead of supporting and fighting for women who are victims or survivors, we end up talking about one woman who made it all up.

Dr. Weisman, you're going to spend a lot of time feeling angry and betrayed when you really start seeing the full truth of all the accusations that get made, even reports to the police.  In truth, police prove the accusations in police reports surrounding sexual assault and rape to be absolutely false at twice the rate they are proven to be true and roughly 60% of all accusations with police reports to be mostly likely false.

All but one of the #metoo public cases have been determined to have been frauds.  Bill Cosby was convicted with out any one of his accusers stories having any corroborating evidence or testimony and now several of the women who testified have been shown to be less than reliable.

QuoteWhich leads me to the question everyone asks: Why would someone lie about this? Why would someone willingly invite the judgement and attention of others on such a sensitive and painful topic? Why would anyone, ever, want to go through the horror and trauma that so often accompanies the divulgence of sexual assault? I cannot think of a single woman of my acquaintance, myself included, who has been the victim of sexual assault who would not trade anything in the world to be able to forget it even for a day. And then you get sucked into this weird place where she could not possibly be lying and the proof she is not lying is that she is saying anything at all.

There are several social media posts made by women that fully realize that they wield power with accusations and are willing to use it for their own ends without constraints of morality.  In my own personal life I have heard women use it a threat to get their own way and brag about ruining someone's life in this manner.  I even got laughed at when I stated they exposed themselves.  "Everyone already knows.  I can do what I want as long as I have a guy that can be pinned as my abuser."

QuoteI want to repeat this because Skogen admitted it over and over and to this day sees nothing wrong with it: Skogen decided to represent a man as a sexual predator to the entire Googling world because she did not like his tone.

I cannot help but think this thread belongs in the The RPGPundit's Own Forum section.  https://www.therpgsite.com/the-rpgpundit-s-own-forum/

Fascinating read, but the article itself is sort of bizarre. The writing style in certain parts is a bit, off. People admitting on tape how much of an asshat they are is, off. Note that with AI, voice can easily be faked, though the soundcloud files are gone now anyway. That the article itself disappearing is, weird. I guess the researcher seems like a real person, though their personal domain is down https://cbweisman.com/. But maybe it has been for awhile, who knows.

I sort of feel like the shit the article is writing about is right in line with how these communities/people operate. But a part of me is also wondering if it's even real at all or some sort of elaborate troll.

Quote from: Dracones on January 27, 2024, 11:09:35 AM
Fascinating read, but the article itself is sort of bizarre. The writing style in certain parts is a bit, off. People admitting on tape how much of an asshat they are is, off. Note that with AI, voice can easily be faked, though the soundcloud files are gone now anyway. That the article itself disappearing is, weird. I guess the researcher seems like a real person, though their personal domain is down https://cbweisman.com/. But maybe it has been for awhile, who knows.

I sort of feel like the shit the article is writing about is right in line with how these communities/people operate. But a part of me is also wondering if it's even real at all or some sort of elaborate troll.

Given that much of this was already publicly known and proven in court, I doubt that there's any bit of it that's false. 

Going to take it with a bit grain of salt until it comes back online or author makes a comment on why it was removed. Although its not hard to guess she removed it due to threats and harrassment.

Audio clips are here (https://youtu.be/8GJAJNbF2Tg), and they were posted less than 13 hours ago. I'm trying to get a timeframe as to when they were deleted.

Quote from: Anon Adderlan on January 27, 2024, 12:04:25 PM
Audio clips are here (https://youtu.be/8GJAJNbF2Tg), and they were posted less than 13 hours ago. I'm trying to get a timeframe as to when they were deleted.

Bless you, Becami Cusack.

There are several things weird about this article...

Quote from: BadApple on January 27, 2024, 12:08:08 PM

Quote from: Anon Adderlan on January 27, 2024, 12:04:25 PM
Audio clips are here (https://youtu.be/8GJAJNbF2Tg), and they were posted less than 13 hours ago. I'm trying to get a timeframe as to when they were deleted.

Bless you, Becami Cusack.

I guess? Like all other Zakolytes they have me blocked.

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 27, 2024, 12:19:42 PM
There are several things weird about this article...

And it keeps getting weirder, because if you look at the author's profile on medium you'll find they're being followed by only two people, one of whom is 'erik tenkar'.

That sounds like a bunch of really classy folks, right there.  A constantly thrashing ball of misery.

Could anyone give us the TL;DR?

EDIT: the author is on Twitter since 2019... with a couple of tweets, but about 19 followers, Olivia Hill and James Brian Murphy (trollsmyth) being the only names I've heard before. She also follows half a dozen RPG people you might recognize.

EDIT 2: This is all very strange. I would be very suspicious if I cared enough.

One strange thing in the article is the author's amazement that his goes on throughout the left.  The one line is that "Zac is not a fascist.  The accusations are false.  As evidence, he was arrested for attending a BLM protes tin 2020."  Protesting at BLM doesn't exclude someone as a fascist.  BLM, inc. is full of people of that mindset.

Thank you so much for preserving the audio.  When I see something I think it's important, I archive it in case a situation like this arises.

   This is contributing to my 'abandon the hobby' leanings ... :)

Quote from: Cathode Ray on January 27, 2024, 02:07:04 PM
One strange thing in the article is the author's amazement that his goes on throughout the left.  The one line is that "Zac is not a fascist.  The accusations are false.  As evidence, he was arrested for attending a BLM protes tin 2020."  Protesting at BLM doesn't exclude someone as a fascist.  BLM, inc. is full of people of that mindset.

   Did you miss the part at the start where the writer says she understands "why right-wingers want to hurt diverse groups of creative people," but "[does] not have a handle on why diverse groups of creative people hurt each other."?

Quote from: Armchair Gamer on January 27, 2024, 02:08:40 PM
   This is contributing to my 'abandon the hobby' leanings ... :)

Quote from: Cathode Ray on January 27, 2024, 02:07:04 PM
One strange thing in the article is the author's amazement that his goes on throughout the left.  The one line is that "Zac is not a fascist.  The accusations are false.  As evidence, he was arrested for attending a BLM protes tin 2020."  Protesting at BLM doesn't exclude someone as a fascist.  BLM, inc. is full of people of that mindset.

   Did you miss the part at the site where the writer says she understands why "right-wingers" want to hurt people, but is baffled by why leftists would?

I saw.  Yeah.  That baffles me, because the people who are upset about a black character in the Star Wars universe, as she says, has got to be so minuscule that it's insignificant.  The leftists that baffle her are pervasive.

Quote from: Cathode Ray on January 27, 2024, 02:10:29 PM

Yeah.  That baffles me, because the people who are upset about a black character in the Star Wars universe4, as she says, has got to be so minuscule that it's insignificant.  The leftists that baffle her are pervasive.

   I think it comes from the same place--a Manichean, universalizing approach that assumes all on the other side are embodiments of foulness, while all those who share the author's beliefs on some points are spotless children of light in all regards.

Quote from: Anon Adderlan on January 27, 2024, 12:26:29 PM

Quote from: BadApple on January 27, 2024, 12:08:08 PM

Quote from: Anon Adderlan on January 27, 2024, 12:04:25 PM
Audio clips are here (https://youtu.be/8GJAJNbF2Tg), and they were posted less than 13 hours ago. I'm trying to get a timeframe as to when they were deleted.

Bless you, Becami Cusack.

I guess? Like all other Zakolytes they have me blocked.

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 27, 2024, 12:19:42 PM
There are several things weird about this article...

And it keeps getting weirder, because if you look at the author's profile on medium you'll find they're being followed by only two people, one of whom is 'erik tenkar'.

Either it's legit and it's worth preserving or it's a fraud in which case the evidence is worth preserving.  Either way, I'm glad it was recorded somewhere.  Unless in my naivete I misses something. 

HERE IS A LINK TO THE FULL AUDIO CLIPS FROM THE INTERVIEWS IN THE ARTICLE GRIM JIM IS DISCUSSING:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GJAJNbF2Tg&list=PPSV

PROOF THAT HATE MOBBING DESTROYS LIVES AND PEOPLE ARE DOING IT "BECAUSE IT FEELS GOOD"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GJAJNbF2Tg&list=PPSV

Quote from: concretesibyl on January 27, 2024, 05:56:20 PM
PROOF THAT HATE MOBBING DESTROYS LIVES AND PEOPLE ARE DOING IT "BECAUSE IT FEELS GOOD"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GJAJNbF2Tg&list=PPSV

Interesting, thanks for the link.

Out of curiosity, may I ask who are you? I noticed you only have 3 posts, all about this.

This whole thing is very weird (but I haven't finished reading it).

Quote from: Eric Diaz on January 27, 2024, 07:33:47 PM
Out of curiosity, may I ask who are you? I noticed you only have 3 posts, all about this.

THEY ARE AN AGENT OF JUSTICE SPAMMING THE SAME LINK OVER AND OVER AGAIN FOR JUSTICE!

Anyone who is truly interested in this, I recommend you use a youtube audio download tool to grab those links before they get memoryholed.

How exhausting these people seem.  ::) How others have the energy to work with them professionally, let alone incestuously travel similar off-work social circles, is beyond me. 

I believe nothing of these things beyond that demi-monde being tiresome.  8) Extraordinary claims, extraordinary evidence, formal legal procedure to chastise actionable wrong-doing. Beyond that...  ::) ::) ::)

I found the article interesting on the psychology of the prime movers. Their determination to destroy Zak's life through concocted false allegations because they don't like his 'tone'. Which seems to mean his insistence on logic and facts over emotional reasoning.

One thing reading the whole thing did is make me wary of believing even seemingly neutral factual statements about someone.

There's that saying of Lincoln's that to have the true measure of a person, give them power.  And just look at how these people behaved once they had the barest sliver of it.  The moment they could step on someone else's face, they did.

QuoteOnce, off the hump of Brazil, I saw the ocean so darkened with blood it was black, and the sun fainting away over the lip of the sky. We'd put in at Fortaleza, and a few of us had lines out for a bit o' idle fishin'. It was me had the first strike. A shark, it was. Then there was another, and another shark again... 'till all about, the sea was made of sharks, and more sharks, still, and no water at all. My shark had torn himself from the hook, and the scent, or maybe the stain, it was, and him bleeding his life away drove the rest of them mad. Then the beasts to to eatin' each other. In their frenzy, they ate at themselves. You could feel the lust of murder like a wind stinging your eyes, and you could smell the death, reeking up out of the sea. I never saw anything worse... until this little picnic tonight. And you know, there wasn't one of them sharks in the whole crazy pack that survived.

Orson Welles' shark monologue from The Lady From Shanghai (which is an excellent movie even in its butchered state) still goes hard.

Weird how almost everyone mentioned in that article is a mentally ill sexual deviant.

So basically the people we already knew were fucktards are proven to be fucktards with their own words?

Quote from: DocJones on January 28, 2024, 09:19:22 AM
Weird how almost everyone mentioned in that article is a mentally ill sexual deviant.

Yes. My thoughts exactly.

The woke Lesbian being baffled that people on the right side of history would lie or be bad people is amusing in an exhausting way. Eventually progs, and even garden variety eternal Democrats are going to have a hell of a hangover once the copium wears off.

I mean they'll still blame it on Trump and Nazis, but knowing deep down what they supported is going to hurt.

It was posted twice on r/RPG and removed both time for Zak S content. In other words, Zak S is now being used to indicate Wrongthink. Anyone actually surprised?

This article is massively long. Medium thinks it takes almost an hour to read. When I get a chance I will follow up with whether or not it's even worth it to give this article a full post mortem because we could be at an article that long for weeks.

As I've mentioned on twitter:

The article seems to imply several targets, but (apparently) only mentions one.

I guess others were targeted. Who are they? Why aren't they mentioned? Why was it deleted?

Also, who is the author and what is her relation to these people? Did se ran a 4-y study to publish a post for a couple of days?

(I know almost nothing about this, just curious)

Quote from: Eric Diaz on January 28, 2024, 02:42:47 PM
As I've mentioned on twitter:

The article seems to imply several targets, but (apparently) only mentions one.

I guess others were targeted. Who are they? Why aren't they mentioned? Why was it deleted?

Also, who is the author and what is her relation to these people? Did se ran a 4-y study to publish a post for a couple of days?

(I know almost nothing about this, just curious)

Is it possible that the Authoress took the woke rhetoric at face value all these years, and didn't know the "we're the good guys" bit is code? If so, she may have put this out meaning to clean house of bad elements, only to be attacked for "turning on her own and enabling Nazis."

I think this is a credible possibility, Grognard GM. That she sees no issue at all with the "modus operandi" until they turn on each other, and she refuses to defend some on the other side of the spectrum.

But I don't know. The whole thing feels strange. Again, I'm curious to know who the author is and what are her relations with these people.

Not that I doubt any of the allegation she makes, they sound credible enough (I don't know if they are true or not and I don't know much about most people mentioned).

Also, those 15 minutes sound very damning, but I wonder... 15 minutes out of how many hours? Where is the rest?

And this is the result of a 4 year study?

EDIT: from what I've heard from GrimJim and RPGPundit, they were severely targeted themselves. There are probably many others. And I can think of at least one RPGNet mod that claimed to have been harassed by one of these people, but not sure she was mentioned either, despite (apparently) being very much in the same political camp.

Anyway, doesn't affect me directly, I'm interested in the same way I was interested in the Serial podcast, feels like a bit of a mystery.

Quote from: Fheredin on January 28, 2024, 01:00:53 PM
It was posted twice on r/RPG and removed both time for Zak S content. In other words, Zak S is now being used to indicate Wrongthink. Anyone actually surprised?

  Same thing happened on EN World (https://www.enworld.org/threads/the-worst-people-you-have-never-met-or-what-i-learned-during-a-four-year-academic-study-of-online-harassment-in-the-dungeons-dragons-community.702303/), with the moderator statement: "This thread will not be used to re-litigate the issue of Zak S."

  Any sign of it in Tangency on TBP?

Quote from: Armchair Gamer on January 28, 2024, 03:56:12 PM

Quote from: Fheredin on January 28, 2024, 01:00:53 PM
It was posted twice on r/RPG and removed both time for Zak S content. In other words, Zak S is now being used to indicate Wrongthink. Anyone actually surprised?

  Same thing happened on EN World (https://www.enworld.org/threads/the-worst-people-you-have-never-met-or-what-i-learned-during-a-four-year-academic-study-of-online-harassment-in-the-dungeons-dragons-community.702303/), with the moderator statement: "This thread will not be used to re-litigate the issue of Zak S."

  Any sign of it in Tangency on TBP?

EN World's 'political neutrality' strikes again.

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 27, 2024, 12:19:42 PM
There are several things weird about this article...

That is an understatement.

Quote from: Armchair Gamer on January 27, 2024, 02:08:40 PM

   Did you miss the part at the start where the writer says she understands "why right-wingers want to hurt diverse groups of creative people," but "[does] not have a handle on why diverse groups of creative people hurt each other."?

Diverse groups of creative people have been hurting eachother long before RPGs. Writer wars were a thing. And I lost track of the artist wars at art conventions. Comic artists and writers at eachother throats and sniping incessantly.

Moreso whenever money is involved.

Enworld bans threads on Zak S. because they become shit shows for the moderators. The thread that was banned was immediately turning to that subject. Considering their reputation for being litigious, banning a thread discussing them seems prudent.

Quote from: Armchair Gamer on January 28, 2024, 03:56:12 PM

Quote from: Fheredin on January 28, 2024, 01:00:53 PM
It was posted twice on r/RPG and removed both time for Zak S content. In other words, Zak S is now being used to indicate Wrongthink. Anyone actually surprised?

  Same thing happened on EN World (https://www.enworld.org/threads/the-worst-people-you-have-never-met-or-what-i-learned-during-a-four-year-academic-study-of-online-harassment-in-the-dungeons-dragons-community.702303/), with the moderator statement: "This thread will not be used to re-litigate the issue of Zak S."

  Any sign of it in Tangency on TBP?

And that's a really treacherous pattern.

1.  Lie about a person and make them radioactive.
2.  All discussion of the person gets banned.
3.  Truth comes out.
4.  All discussion has been banned, so you can never clear your name or hear the truth.

Quote from: Omega on January 28, 2024, 04:25:29 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 27, 2024, 12:19:42 PM
There are several things weird about this article...

That is an understatement.

I think I can put my finger on the problem; it isn't just that the audio clips are missing--although they link to a Soundcloud which is completely empty--but that this is supposedly an article put together by a lady with three graduate degrees, she spent four years putting it together...and there are absolutely no citations for anything.

I don't actually think this article was written by "Clio Belle Weisman."

There's no obvious professional reason to write a big article like this, let alone to post it, post it on a few forums, and then to take it down a few hours later like something special happened behind the scenes. It's also written in more an NYT Op-Ed slander piece style than an academic style. Rest assured a scholarly article author like Weisman would struggle to write NYT style op-ed pieces because the styles conflict. But the last problem is probably the killer; Clio Belle Weisman has a minimum of three graduate degrees. There's actually a paper "Functional Family Therapy" you can find via Google that Weisman appears to have written, and a followup paper Weisman is primary author on, both of which at least have citations.

This article has no citations at all. Between that and the fact that every social media account attached to the name is an inactive stub, I suspect the author is being falsely attributed.

Even if every claim the article makes is true, it's only hearsay without citations. Heck, we can't even prove this article is not written by ChatGPT.

Quote from: Brad on January 28, 2024, 10:04:15 AM
So basically the people we already knew were fucktards are proven to be fucktards with their own words?

Yup.

Quote from: Fheredin on January 28, 2024, 01:00:53 PM
It was posted twice on r/RPG and removed both time for Zak S content. In other words, Zak S is now being used to indicate Wrongthink. Anyone actually surprised?

This article is massively long. Medium thinks it takes almost an hour to read. When I get a chance I will follow up with whether or not it's even worth it to give this article a full post mortem because we could be at an article that long for weeks.

The first 20% is interesting, though not really doing anything other than confirming what we already knew.

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 28, 2024, 06:05:54 PM

Quote from: Fheredin on January 28, 2024, 01:00:53 PM
It was posted twice on r/RPG and removed both time for Zak S content. In other words, Zak S is now being used to indicate Wrongthink. Anyone actually surprised?

This article is massively long. Medium thinks it takes almost an hour to read. When I get a chance I will follow up with whether or not it's even worth it to give this article a full post mortem because we could be at an article that long for weeks.

The first 20% is interesting, though not really doing anything other than confirming what we already knew.

To me, the value of the article isn't that we learned anything new but that it's information that's been denied coming from a new vector.  If we can verify the authenticity of the article and the sound clips, then it's one more piece of evidence to preserve for the cause of fixing society and doing away with the woke nonsense.  If it's a fraud of some kind, then it would be good to know so that we can be prepared for similar efforts of information manipulation.

I don't think anyone should be treated like Zak was.  I believe you nail someone to the wall for their actual sins, not make shit up because you don't like their tone.  That said, it's hard to have sympathy for someone who knowingly sleeps with vipers when they get bit.

Quote from: BadApple on January 28, 2024, 06:32:37 PM
To me, the value of the article isn't that we learned anything new but that it's information that's been denied coming from a new vector.  If we can verify the authenticity of the article and the sound clips, then it's one more piece of evidence to preserve for the cause of fixing society and doing away with the woke nonsense.  If it's a fraud of some kind, then it would be good to know so that we can be prepared for similar efforts of information manipulation.

"One more piece of evidence".

I'll admit that the thought crossed my mind - maybe the article is posted and then taken down, only to be archived as a "piece of evidence" for some future litigation?

This could be the case even if the things she says are true, but difficult to prove.

I have no idea. Just something that crossed my mind while asking myself how and why the article was written in such manner.

(again, just playing "internet detective" and having no knowledge of most these people, and I feel bad for anyone unjustly attacked).

Quote from: Fheredin on January 28, 2024, 05:20:00 PM

Quote from: Omega on January 28, 2024, 04:25:29 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 27, 2024, 12:19:42 PM
There are several things weird about this article...

That is an understatement.

I think I can put my finger on the problem; it isn't just that the audio clips are missing--although they link to a Soundcloud which is completely empty--but that this is supposedly an article put together by a lady with three graduate degrees, she spent four years putting it together...and there are absolutely no citations for anything.

I don't actually think this article was written by "Clio Belle Weisman."

There's no obvious professional reason to write a big article like this, let alone to post it, post it on a few forums, and then to take it down a few hours later like something special happened behind the scenes. It's also written in more an NYT Op-Ed slander piece style than an academic style. Rest assured a scholarly article author like Weisman would struggle to write NYT style op-ed pieces because the styles conflict. But the last problem is probably the killer; Clio Belle Weisman has a minimum of three graduate degrees. There's actually a paper "Functional Family Therapy" you can find via Google that Weisman appears to have written, and a followup paper Weisman is primary author on, both of which at least have citations.

This article has no citations at all. Between that and the fact that every social media account attached to the name is an inactive stub, I suspect the author is being falsely attributed.

Even if every claim the article makes is true, it's only hearsay without citations. Heck, we can't even prove this article is not written by ChatGPT.

The audio clips are available in GrimJim's channels, I think. These are 15 damming minutes, but then again where is the rest?

(also, they are posted in this thread by a mysterious guy - with only 3 posts - that then disappeared)

I do agree the article feels strange.

I don't know about the author, Clio Belle Weisman seems to have a small internet footprint, as I've mentioned. Looking at her almost inactive twitter (and followers, followed), I cannot tell wether this is hear actual account. Some tweets seem legit. But I don't know.

Quote from: Eric Diaz on January 28, 2024, 06:52:49 PM

Quote from: Fheredin on January 28, 2024, 05:20:00 PM

Quote from: Omega on January 28, 2024, 04:25:29 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 27, 2024, 12:19:42 PM
There are several things weird about this article...

That is an understatement.

I think I can put my finger on the problem; it isn't just that the audio clips are missing--although they link to a Soundcloud which is completely empty--but that this is supposedly an article put together by a lady with three graduate degrees, she spent four years putting it together...and there are absolutely no citations for anything.

I don't actually think this article was written by "Clio Belle Weisman."

There's no obvious professional reason to write a big article like this, let alone to post it, post it on a few forums, and then to take it down a few hours later like something special happened behind the scenes. It's also written in more an NYT Op-Ed slander piece style than an academic style. Rest assured a scholarly article author like Weisman would struggle to write NYT style op-ed pieces because the styles conflict. But the last problem is probably the killer; Clio Belle Weisman has a minimum of three graduate degrees. There's actually a paper "Functional Family Therapy" you can find via Google that Weisman appears to have written, and a followup paper Weisman is primary author on, both of which at least have citations.

This article has no citations at all. Between that and the fact that every social media account attached to the name is an inactive stub, I suspect the author is being falsely attributed.

Even if every claim the article makes is true, it's only hearsay without citations. Heck, we can't even prove this article is not written by ChatGPT.

The audio clips are available in GrimJim's channels, I think. These are 15 damming minutes, but then again where is the rest?

(also, they are posted in this thread by a mysterious guy - with only 3 posts - that then disappeared)

I do agree the article feels strange.

I don't know about the author, Clio Belle Weisman seems to have a small internet footprint, as I've mentioned. Looking at her almost inactive twitter (and followers, followed), I cannot tell wether this is hear actual account. Some tweets seem legit. But I don't know.

The article wasn't "posted anonimously tro some internet forums" it was published in the author's Medium and then taken down together with the audio clips.

Now, let's say it's a fake: Why, What purpouse, Who benefits?

To incite the harassment of the named persons? By whom? And who benefits from faking it?

The only named innocent victim is Zak, but he seems to be doing a fine job of suing the slanderers, so has no need for such a fake.

Not a single leftard would benefit from it nor would they dream of presenting Zak as an innocent victim.

Occam's Razor, which conclusion needs the least logical jumps?

Quote from: GeekyBugle on January 28, 2024, 07:57:19 PM

Quote from: Eric Diaz on January 28, 2024, 06:52:49 PM

Quote from: Fheredin on January 28, 2024, 05:20:00 PM

Quote from: Omega on January 28, 2024, 04:25:29 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 27, 2024, 12:19:42 PM
There are several things weird about this article...

That is an understatement.

I think I can put my finger on the problem; it isn't just that the audio clips are missing--although they link to a Soundcloud which is completely empty--but that this is supposedly an article put together by a lady with three graduate degrees, she spent four years putting it together...and there are absolutely no citations for anything.

I don't actually think this article was written by "Clio Belle Weisman."

There's no obvious professional reason to write a big article like this, let alone to post it, post it on a few forums, and then to take it down a few hours later like something special happened behind the scenes. It's also written in more an NYT Op-Ed slander piece style than an academic style. Rest assured a scholarly article author like Weisman would struggle to write NYT style op-ed pieces because the styles conflict. But the last problem is probably the killer; Clio Belle Weisman has a minimum of three graduate degrees. There's actually a paper "Functional Family Therapy" you can find via Google that Weisman appears to have written, and a followup paper Weisman is primary author on, both of which at least have citations.

This article has no citations at all. Between that and the fact that every social media account attached to the name is an inactive stub, I suspect the author is being falsely attributed.

Even if every claim the article makes is true, it's only hearsay without citations. Heck, we can't even prove this article is not written by ChatGPT.

The audio clips are available in GrimJim's channels, I think. These are 15 damming minutes, but then again where is the rest?

(also, they are posted in this thread by a mysterious guy - with only 3 posts - that then disappeared)

I do agree the article feels strange.

I don't know about the author, Clio Belle Weisman seems to have a small internet footprint, as I've mentioned. Looking at her almost inactive twitter (and followers, followed), I cannot tell wether this is hear actual account. Some tweets seem legit. But I don't know.

The article wasn't "posted anonimously tro some internet forums" it was published in the author's Medium and then taken down together with the audio clips.

Now, let's say it's a fake: Why, What purpouse, Who benefits?

To incite the harassment of the named persons? By whom? And who benefits from faking it?

The only named innocent victim is Zak, but he seems to be doing a fine job of suing the slanderers, so has no need for such a fake.

Not a single leftard would benefit from it nor would they dream of presenting Zak as an innocent victim.

Occam's Razor, which conclusion needs the least logical jumps?

A fairly common false flag attack is to create a false piece of information, get people to believe in it and associate with it, expose it as fake, then claim that those that believed it are just as bad as those that put the false information forward.

It's bullshit but it does seem to work in the court of public opinion.

There is a domain matching that author's name, but it's gone. The original article is gone.

The tone of the article is weird. I mean, the main thing is complaining about people saying things without proof, and then it proceeds to demolish several people and call them liars, without proof. It's not what you would call even-handed.

Forgery? Trolling? Defending Zac, or defending having defended him? An un-self-reflective author going where angels dare not tread? Mental health breakdown? I have no clue.

Has Zak weighed in on this?

Quote from: Thornhammer on January 28, 2024, 09:03:02 PM
Has Zak weighed in on this?

If he's smarter than I think he is, he won't.

I mean, if he just said whether he talked to this person, that would be enlightening.

Quote from: pawsplay on January 28, 2024, 09:38:06 PM
I mean, if he just said whether he talked to this person, that would be enlightening.

After reading the article, my theory is Zak is banging the author.

Quote from: DocJones on January 28, 2024, 11:02:07 PM

Quote from: pawsplay on January 28, 2024, 09:38:06 PM
I mean, if he just said whether he talked to this person, that would be enlightening.

After reading the article, my theory is Zak is banging the author.

I, of course, have no factual basis for asserting such a thing.

Quote from: GeekyBugle on January 28, 2024, 07:57:19 PM

Quote from: Eric Diaz on January 28, 2024, 06:52:49 PM

Quote from: Fheredin on January 28, 2024, 05:20:00 PM

Quote from: Omega on January 28, 2024, 04:25:29 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 27, 2024, 12:19:42 PM
There are several things weird about this article...

That is an understatement.

I think I can put my finger on the problem; it isn't just that the audio clips are missing--although they link to a Soundcloud which is completely empty--but that this is supposedly an article put together by a lady with three graduate degrees, she spent four years putting it together...and there are absolutely no citations for anything.

I don't actually think this article was written by "Clio Belle Weisman."

There's no obvious professional reason to write a big article like this, let alone to post it, post it on a few forums, and then to take it down a few hours later like something special happened behind the scenes. It's also written in more an NYT Op-Ed slander piece style than an academic style. Rest assured a scholarly article author like Weisman would struggle to write NYT style op-ed pieces because the styles conflict. But the last problem is probably the killer; Clio Belle Weisman has a minimum of three graduate degrees. There's actually a paper "Functional Family Therapy" you can find via Google that Weisman appears to have written, and a followup paper Weisman is primary author on, both of which at least have citations.

This article has no citations at all. Between that and the fact that every social media account attached to the name is an inactive stub, I suspect the author is being falsely attributed.

Even if every claim the article makes is true, it's only hearsay without citations. Heck, we can't even prove this article is not written by ChatGPT.

The audio clips are available in GrimJim's channels, I think. These are 15 damming minutes, but then again where is the rest?

(also, they are posted in this thread by a mysterious guy - with only 3 posts - that then disappeared)

I do agree the article feels strange.

I don't know about the author, Clio Belle Weisman seems to have a small internet footprint, as I've mentioned. Looking at her almost inactive twitter (and followers, followed), I cannot tell wether this is hear actual account. Some tweets seem legit. But I don't know.

The article wasn't "posted anonimously tro some internet forums" it was published in the author's Medium and then taken down together with the audio clips.

Now, let's say it's a fake: Why, What purpouse, Who benefits?

To incite the harassment of the named persons? By whom? And who benefits from faking it?

The only named innocent victim is Zak, but he seems to be doing a fine job of suing the slanderers, so has no need for such a fake.

Not a single leftard would benefit from it nor would they dream of presenting Zak as an innocent victim.

Occam's Razor, which conclusion needs the least logical jumps?

Medium is not exactly a financial institution running KYC, and there isn't a single other article on that account to verify that this is the same person. It's a one-off.

Like I said, the real problem is that the article has zero citations (apart from audio which no skeptic will see as necessarily damning) so even if it is completely true, it is also completely useless at actually changing Zak S's situation, much less the larger situation of the industry. It isn't like I doubt the things in the article can't be true. But the article itself isn't skeptic-proof investigative journalism. It doesn't even give me the leads to do the investigative journalism myself with. It's just...a dead end. The article is almost an hour of reading and it effects a rhetorical cul de sac.

Quote from: Fheredin on January 28, 2024, 11:25:34 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on January 28, 2024, 07:57:19 PM

Quote from: Eric Diaz on January 28, 2024, 06:52:49 PM

Quote from: Fheredin on January 28, 2024, 05:20:00 PM

Quote from: Omega on January 28, 2024, 04:25:29 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 27, 2024, 12:19:42 PM
There are several things weird about this article...

That is an understatement.

I think I can put my finger on the problem; it isn't just that the audio clips are missing--although they link to a Soundcloud which is completely empty--but that this is supposedly an article put together by a lady with three graduate degrees, she spent four years putting it together...and there are absolutely no citations for anything.

I don't actually think this article was written by "Clio Belle Weisman."

There's no obvious professional reason to write a big article like this, let alone to post it, post it on a few forums, and then to take it down a few hours later like something special happened behind the scenes. It's also written in more an NYT Op-Ed slander piece style than an academic style. Rest assured a scholarly article author like Weisman would struggle to write NYT style op-ed pieces because the styles conflict. But the last problem is probably the killer; Clio Belle Weisman has a minimum of three graduate degrees. There's actually a paper "Functional Family Therapy" you can find via Google that Weisman appears to have written, and a followup paper Weisman is primary author on, both of which at least have citations.

This article has no citations at all. Between that and the fact that every social media account attached to the name is an inactive stub, I suspect the author is being falsely attributed.

Even if every claim the article makes is true, it's only hearsay without citations. Heck, we can't even prove this article is not written by ChatGPT.

The audio clips are available in GrimJim's channels, I think. These are 15 damming minutes, but then again where is the rest?

(also, they are posted in this thread by a mysterious guy - with only 3 posts - that then disappeared)

I do agree the article feels strange.

I don't know about the author, Clio Belle Weisman seems to have a small internet footprint, as I've mentioned. Looking at her almost inactive twitter (and followers, followed), I cannot tell wether this is hear actual account. Some tweets seem legit. But I don't know.

The article wasn't "posted anonimously tro some internet forums" it was published in the author's Medium and then taken down together with the audio clips.

Now, let's say it's a fake: Why, What purpouse, Who benefits?

To incite the harassment of the named persons? By whom? And who benefits from faking it?

The only named innocent victim is Zak, but he seems to be doing a fine job of suing the slanderers, so has no need for such a fake.

Not a single leftard would benefit from it nor would they dream of presenting Zak as an innocent victim.

Occam's Razor, which conclusion needs the least logical jumps?

Medium is not exactly a financial institution running KYC, and there isn't a single other article on that account to verify that this is the same person. It's a one-off.

Like I said, the real problem is that the article has zero citations (apart from audio which no skeptic will see as necessarily damning) so even if it is completely true, it is also completely useless at actually changing Zak S's situation, much less the larger situation of the industry. It isn't like I doubt the things in the article can't be true. But the article itself isn't skeptic-proof investigative journalism. It doesn't even give me the leads to do the investigative journalism myself with. It's just...a dead end. The article is almost an hour of reading and it effects a rhetorical cul de sac.

That's because you want it to be false, and this is just a lame excuse.  You have audio of people saying that they targeted and harassed someone via industry contacts, and you want "citations"?  Of what?  What kind of journal article is going to carry more weight than a person's own admissions?

This reminds me of the retards at Wikipedia.  The subject of an article can write in that the article gets his birthday wrong and the smooth brains there will object to changing it because primary sources aren't allowed.  Citations are a tool; accuracy is a goal.  The presence or absence of citations doesn't  make something accurate or not.  The most it can do is ease the process of confirming the accuracy of something.  This is scientism at its worst.

Quote from: Eirikrautha on January 29, 2024, 12:04:47 AM

Quote from: Fheredin on January 28, 2024, 11:25:34 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on January 28, 2024, 07:57:19 PM

Quote from: Eric Diaz on January 28, 2024, 06:52:49 PM

Quote from: Fheredin on January 28, 2024, 05:20:00 PM

Quote from: Omega on January 28, 2024, 04:25:29 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 27, 2024, 12:19:42 PM
There are several things weird about this article...

That is an understatement.

I think I can put my finger on the problem; it isn't just that the audio clips are missing--although they link to a Soundcloud which is completely empty--but that this is supposedly an article put together by a lady with three graduate degrees, she spent four years putting it together...and there are absolutely no citations for anything.

I don't actually think this article was written by "Clio Belle Weisman."

There's no obvious professional reason to write a big article like this, let alone to post it, post it on a few forums, and then to take it down a few hours later like something special happened behind the scenes. It's also written in more an NYT Op-Ed slander piece style than an academic style. Rest assured a scholarly article author like Weisman would struggle to write NYT style op-ed pieces because the styles conflict. But the last problem is probably the killer; Clio Belle Weisman has a minimum of three graduate degrees. There's actually a paper "Functional Family Therapy" you can find via Google that Weisman appears to have written, and a followup paper Weisman is primary author on, both of which at least have citations.

This article has no citations at all. Between that and the fact that every social media account attached to the name is an inactive stub, I suspect the author is being falsely attributed.

Even if every claim the article makes is true, it's only hearsay without citations. Heck, we can't even prove this article is not written by ChatGPT.

The audio clips are available in GrimJim's channels, I think. These are 15 damming minutes, but then again where is the rest?

(also, they are posted in this thread by a mysterious guy - with only 3 posts - that then disappeared)

I do agree the article feels strange.

I don't know about the author, Clio Belle Weisman seems to have a small internet footprint, as I've mentioned. Looking at her almost inactive twitter (and followers, followed), I cannot tell wether this is hear actual account. Some tweets seem legit. But I don't know.

The article wasn't "posted anonimously tro some internet forums" it was published in the author's Medium and then taken down together with the audio clips.

Now, let's say it's a fake: Why, What purpouse, Who benefits?

To incite the harassment of the named persons? By whom? And who benefits from faking it?

The only named innocent victim is Zak, but he seems to be doing a fine job of suing the slanderers, so has no need for such a fake.

Not a single leftard would benefit from it nor would they dream of presenting Zak as an innocent victim.

Occam's Razor, which conclusion needs the least logical jumps?

Medium is not exactly a financial institution running KYC, and there isn't a single other article on that account to verify that this is the same person. It's a one-off.

Like I said, the real problem is that the article has zero citations (apart from audio which no skeptic will see as necessarily damning) so even if it is completely true, it is also completely useless at actually changing Zak S's situation, much less the larger situation of the industry. It isn't like I doubt the things in the article can't be true. But the article itself isn't skeptic-proof investigative journalism. It doesn't even give me the leads to do the investigative journalism myself with. It's just...a dead end. The article is almost an hour of reading and it effects a rhetorical cul de sac.

That's because you want it to be false, and this is just a lame excuse.  You have audio of people saying that they targeted and harassed someone via industry contacts, and you want "citations"?  Of what?  What kind of journal article is going to carry more weight than a person's own admissions?

This reminds me of the retards at Wikipedia.  The subject of an article can write in that the article gets his birthday wrong and the smooth brains there will object to changing it because primary sources aren't allowed.  Citations are a tool; accuracy is a goal.  The presence or absence of citations doesn't  make something accurate or not.  The most it can do is ease the process of confirming the accuracy of something.  This is scientism at its worst.

Sadly we live in the post fake audio/video age, the audio files aren't 100% proof positive of anything. Especially not without the author's backing the article.

Even if the files contain actual audio, clips can be edited and re-ordered to create misleading impressions.

The thing to me is that the article accomplishes basically nothing.  Upon being told that these people are a bunch of feckless backstabbers, people here are all, "Yeah, we know.  And?"  While the places where they're popular are just deleting and locking down any mention of it to sweep it under the rug as fast as possible, exactly like the article accused them of doing, so nothing's going to be changing there either.

Quote from: Valatar on January 29, 2024, 01:43:34 AM
The thing to me is that the article accomplishes basically nothing.  Upon being told that these people are a bunch of feckless backstabbers, people here are all, "Yeah, we know.  And?"  While the places where they're popular are just deleting and locking down any mention of it to sweep it under the rug as fast as possible, exactly like the article accused them of doing, so nothing's going to be changing there either.

Personally I think I learned a lot about how the process works and the motivations of the perpetrators.

(I'm playing the "internet detective" game again, I have no particular information about this case)

Patrick Stuart apparently has confirmed talking to this person; so this is probably a real person, as Patrick is portrayed in a negative light in the article, IMO.

https://twitter.com/pjamesstuart/status/1751884833867890952

What is her relationship to the people mentioned in the article remains a mystery. Why only 15 minutes - TEN SECONDS for Patrick - were shown also remains unsolved.

One possibility is that the article is TRUE, but the motives are FALSE. Yes, this is not an "academic work", but an actual investigation to gather evidence against these people, for whatever motive (vindication, litigation, repairing of reputations).

That would explain lots of things, including the number of people that are eager to believe/broadcast the contents and the number of people that are suspicious of the format/motives.

Also explains why it only shows the most damming audios; the rest of the conversation might be interesting for "academic" purposes, but doesn't accomplish the goal of painting these people in a negative light.

Without hearing the conversations, I would bet they were "fishing expeditions": let people talk until you give them enough rope to hang themselves.

Quote from: Eirikrautha on January 29, 2024, 12:04:47 AM
That's because you want it to be false, and this is just a lame excuse.  You have audio of people saying that they targeted and harassed someone via industry contacts, and you want "citations"?  Of what?  What kind of journal article is going to carry more weight than a person's own admissions?

This reminds me of the retards at Wikipedia.  The subject of an article can write in that the article gets his birthday wrong and the smooth brains there will object to changing it because primary sources aren't allowed.  Citations are a tool; accuracy is a goal.  The presence or absence of citations doesn't  make something accurate or not.  The most it can do is ease the process of confirming the accuracy of something.  This is scientism at its worst.

No, I am consciously compensating for confirmation bias. Fact is there are a number of claims in the article which should be citable; Mandy Morbid says Zak S compelled her to get a mohawk, but her hairdresser testified otherwise? Did the author interview the hairdresser or is that from a court document?

The citation is the proof that you didn't make something up and it is the way you allow other people to carry on investigative citizen journalism. I am not saying that adding citations makes something immutably true, but it makes it so that I can verify you aren't blowing smoke.

I also notice that, except for Patrick and GrimJim, I didn't see other people mentioned in the article commenting on it either.

Zak is strangely absent from the discussion - no audio from him, despite the article being 80% about vindicating him. He didn't tweet or comment about it, not even in his own blog AFAICT.

Maybe when they weigh in we can know more, and all my idle speculation will be useless.

I must stress, again, that, knowing little about the facts, still I absolutely sympathize with anyone who was unjustly targeted and harassed.

Quote from: DocJones on January 28, 2024, 09:19:22 AM
Weird how almost everyone mentioned in that article is a mentally ill sexual deviant.

You're not wrong, and it's impossible to dismiss as mere coincidence.

Quote from: Fheredin on January 28, 2024, 05:20:00 PM
I don't actually think this article was written by "Clio Belle Weisman."

But you don't actually know that.

Quote from: Eric Diaz on January 29, 2024, 10:35:56 AM
I didn't see other people mentioned in the article commenting on it either.

The only thing they can do is confirm/deny the quotes/recordings are authentic. However any comment will be seen as promoting the editorial, any confirmation interpreted as an endorsement of Zak, and if they haven't denied anything by now it's likely they can't. And it's hard to get a response out when so many fora are blocking any mention of the Z.

I guarantee this is a topic de facto in their echo chambers and whisper networks though.

Olivia (née David) Hill has also confirmed the existence of Dr Weisman and attempted to deflect by flapping about ethics and violated trust.
Which doesn't suggest any of it isn't true, of course, and just distracts.
There's also a lot of trolling and disinfo going on, but it's hard to tell what might be organised and what is just opportunism.
The audio has been confirmed as genuine and the voices of the people claimed by multiple sources. Can't say who, but it's enough for me to see it as genuine.

Quote from: Eric Diaz on January 29, 2024, 08:00:47 AM
(I'm playing the "internet detective" game again, I have no particular information about this case)

Patrick Stuart apparently has confirmed talking to this person; so this is probably a real person, as Patrick is portrayed in a negative light in the article, IMO.

https://twitter.com/pjamesstuart/status/1751884833867890952

What is her relationship to the people mentioned in the article remains a mystery. Why only 15 minutes - TEN SECONDS for Patrick - were shown also remains unsolved.

One possibility is that the article is TRUE, but the motives are FALSE. Yes, this is not an "academic work", but an actual investigation to gather evidence against these people, for whatever motive (vindication, litigation, repairing of reputations).

That would explain lots of things, including the number of people that are eager to believe/broadcast the contents and the number of people that are suspicious of the format/motives.

Also explains why it only shows the most damming audios; the rest of the conversation might be interesting for "academic" purposes, but doesn't accomplish the goal of painting these people in a negative light.

Without hearing the conversations, I would bet they were "fishing expeditions": let people talk until you give them enough rope to hang themselves.

For those without a twatter or blocked:

Quote
pjamesstuart
@pjamesstuart
Haven't read the article & don't want to. Did speak to Weisman long ago. Disappointed she got sucked into the Zak-Hole. My opinion on Zak has not changed. Every day I spend not thinking about that maniac is a victory. Never speak to Journalists or Academics, I certainly won't be.

Quote from: Eric Diaz on January 29, 2024, 10:35:56 AM
I also notice that, except for Patrick and GrimJim, I didn't see other people mentioned in the article commenting on it either.

Zak is strangely absent from the discussion - no audio from him, despite the article being 80% about vindicating him. He didn't tweet or comment about it, not even in his own blog AFAICT.

Yes, that is very strange and not like Zak would normally act, isn't it? I've already shared my theory on my livestream.

Here's everything you really need to know about #twatgate :
#dnd #osr #ttrpg

https://www.youtube.com/live/lTFQNcCIugU?si=PT4xR4XqyWNGwRc8&t=4350  (https://www.youtube.com/live/lTFQNcCIugU?si=PT4xR4XqyWNGwRc8&t=4350)

Including a comment by Zak

https://jrients.blogspot.com/2024/01/egghead-reports-research-weirdos-pissed.html?m=1

This is a goddamn soap opera plot and needs to be a Telonovela on Univision...

Quote from: Coffeecup on January 30, 2024, 04:32:31 PM
Including a comment by Zak

https://jrients.blogspot.com/2024/01/egghead-reports-research-weirdos-pissed.html?m=1

Reading Hill's meltdown, one guy already deleted his twatter account, sadly can't be archived, but I got screenshots of everything so far from Hill and the other guy who hasn't deleted his account.

So, the article IS real, the suspects participated in it and did what they admited doing.

There's increasing evidence that Clio Weisman really was involved, and that she really did make the premise, at least, of doing a study. Apparently, IF "Olivia" Hill can be believed, Clio did lie to them about her academic credentials (saying she was at Columbia when she was not). On a side note, its clear that there's something serious going on with Clio's professional activities, in that she left Columbia, then went to UNReno, but lasted only around a year there, and now seems to be living with her parents in Oregon and trying to get low-level psychotherapist work there while apparently doing academic work nowhere. So there could be other reasons, but looking at it on paper, it has all the look of a massive downward spiral, like the kind of things caused by stuff like academic scandals, or drug problems or having become involved in some fucked up relationship.

Also, we already know Clio has no issue with using deceptive methods in their research (I'm willing to believe Hill on this one at least, because I'm pretty sure that if Clio had been honest Hill would never have kept talking). Also, that they have no issue with using their research to do a "gotcha" article. And that Clio takes a completely non-objective 100% favorable view of Zak S.

That last point is still the biggest mystery: does Clio have prior experience with Zak? Do they know each other before/outside RPGs, was Clio already a gamer? Or involved in the art or porn fields? Or has she come to have some kind of relationship with Zak (game-master, friend, sex partner, etc) after initially meeting/interviewing him?
Any honest academic would want to reveal any and all personal relationships or connections they have with any potential subject. Hell, I make a point of mentioning any time I do a review of a Bedrock product I had nothing to do with, that Bedrock published one of my games like 12 years ago.

Because what hasn't changed is that it is VERY CLEAR, unquestionably so, that the real purpose of this article (as it is EIGHTY PERCENT of its content) was not primarily about condemning these woke cunts or to expose the toxic culture they created, but rather to act as Pro-Zak Propaganda to try yet again to reintegrate him into the hobby he's now marginalized from.
And don't get me wrong, there's good arguments for the Anathema declaration against being bullshit and hugely unjust, and that therefore the people who banned him forever or even mention or his name or products should be prompted to reverse course. But I HATE when someone presents me an INFOMERCIAL and tries to tell me its a News Report. This was a Zak S Infomercial, the Zak Smith Story Lifetime Special, masquerading as an objective academic study. It's an insult to everyone's intelligence that the people behind this thought anyone would fall for this, especially with how badly it was done.

Also, apparently (according to Hill, haven't checked), Clio has deleted her website.

Hill also posted this (this is Clio writing to Hill):


(https://twitter.com/machineiv/status/1752071999579447623/photo/1)

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 30, 2024, 05:54:56 PM
On a side note, its clear that there's something serious going on with Clio's professional activities, in that she left Columbia, then went to UNReno, but lasted only around a year there, and now seems to be living with her parents in Oregon and trying to get low-level psychotherapist work there while apparently doing academic work nowhere. So there could be other reasons, but looking at it on paper, it has all the look of a massive downward spiral, like the kind of things caused by stuff like academic scandals, or drug problems or having become involved in some fucked up relationship.

Depression is an academic job hazard (I should know) ;D and she says she's an abuse survivor. I think she's probably just a regular academic depression sufferer, not academic scandals/drugs/recent bad relationship.  And that depression probably prompted both the publication and the retraction. Remember she is far left, and clearly has trouble with the idea fellow far leftists are bad people, to the extent of finding it traumatic. She idealises Zak in the article, that might (slightly ironically) be from BPD, which often goes with depression.

Remind me again why I care about any of these people?

Guy won his defamation lawsuit. Somebody had to suck it up and publicly apologize. It's stickied. Cool.

Is it just me, or does this all sound like the TTRPG version of that guy who's crazy redneck girlfriend flips out and goes nuts and puts a brick through the windshield of his car?

Quote from: S'mon on January 30, 2024, 06:59:01 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 30, 2024, 05:54:56 PM
On a side note, its clear that there's something serious going on with Clio's professional activities, in that she left Columbia, then went to UNReno, but lasted only around a year there, and now seems to be living with her parents in Oregon and trying to get low-level psychotherapist work there while apparently doing academic work nowhere. So there could be other reasons, but looking at it on paper, it has all the look of a massive downward spiral, like the kind of things caused by stuff like academic scandals, or drug problems or having become involved in some fucked up relationship.

Depression is an academic job hazard (I should know) ;D and she says she's an abuse survivor. I think she's probably just a regular academic depression sufferer, not academic scandals/drugs/recent bad relationship.  And that depression probably prompted both the publication and the retraction. Remember she is far left, and clearly has trouble with the idea fellow far leftists are bad people, to the extent of finding it traumatic. She idealises Zak in the article, that might (slightly ironically) be from BPD, which often goes with depression.

A lot to unpack there. First off, of course she could be having personal trauma that has essentially derailed her career. But based on the assumption that she authored this article, it's clear that she was never actually professional and capable in any career. I think she's probably too unstable and undisciplined to be able to get on a track. 

As far as being traumatized by the idea of leftists being mean people we can't know if that's the real her or part of the standard Zak-themed-article format. We've seen them before:
-credited to have been written by a woman
-impeccable leftist credentials (in terms of both diversity quota and activism) to make it impossible to dismiss as a "right wing rant" (ie. "I was a totally normal ordinary ultra-left progressive democratic socialist queer lgbt sex-positive polyamorous activist like everyone else, so when I say Zak is totally innocent you can't question me")
-disparaging of the right
-pretense to being highly skeptical of certain accusations being made against woke leftists only to be shocked to find they are true
-pretense to being initially skeptical of Zak's innocence only to realize that all accusations against him are a pack of lies.
-detailed litany of all the woes of Zak and all his great qualities and how certain mentally ill women have slandered him while toxic progressives who hate him got him cancelled.
-The section on Zak goes way too long, to the point that no normal human could possibly interested in that much detail about Zak Smith except Zak Smith himself.
-Inevitably, the obsession with Zak and his particular case and his particular complaints and his particular obsessions ends up making the article much weaker at everything it intended, not only at critiquing the toxic cancel-culture elements of the hobby, but also ironically at making people more sympathetic to Zak.

Quote from: Corolinth on January 30, 2024, 09:24:26 PM
Remind me again why I care about any of these people?

Guy won his defamation lawsuit. Somebody had to suck it up and publicly apologize. It's stickied. Cool.

Is it just me, or does this all sound like the TTRPG version of that guy who's crazy redneck girlfriend flips out and goes nuts and puts a brick through the windshield of his car?

Very much so, except in this case it's "crazy progressive bisexual pornhub star girlfriend"

Quote from: Corolinth on January 30, 2024, 09:24:26 PM
Remind me again why I care about any of these people?

Guy won his defamation lawsuit. Somebody had to suck it up and publicly apologize. It's stickied. Cool.

Is it just me, or does this all sound like the TTRPG version of that guy who's crazy redneck girlfriend flips out and goes nuts and puts a brick through the windshield of his car?

LOL you and me both.

Perhaps the good doctor's fall from the ivory tower was due to a terrible madness acquired from 4 years of speaking with these despicable assholes.

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 30, 2024, 09:37:42 PM-The section on Zak goes way too long, to the point that no normal human could possibly interested in that much detail about Zak Smith except Zak Smith himself.

By any chance, was Zak's porno speciality fellating himself?

Hill is merely making a classic and hominem argument.

And usually people who argument like that try to avoid talking about content.
Considering that none of the points being raised against Weissman negate the article.

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 30, 2024, 05:54:56 PM
Because what hasn't changed is that it is VERY CLEAR, unquestionably so, that the real purpose of this article (as it is EIGHTY PERCENT of its content) was not primarily about condemning these woke cunts or to expose the toxic culture they created, but rather to act as Pro-Zak Propaganda to try yet again to reintegrate him into the hobby he's now marginalized from.
And don't get me wrong, there's good arguments for the Anathema declaration against being bullshit and hugely unjust, and that therefore the people who banned him forever or even mention or his name or products should be prompted to reverse course. But I HATE when someone presents me an INFOMERCIAL and tries to tell me its a News Report. This was a Zak S Infomercial, the Zak Smith Story Lifetime Special, masquerading as an objective academic study. It's an insult to everyone's intelligence that the people behind this thought anyone would fall for this, especially with how badly it was done.

Having just now read the whole thing and listened to the audio quotes, I agree that it comes across as very much over-the-top cheerleading for Zak. This part especially was using her psych credentials to endorse him, which seemed odd.

QuoteSmith allowed me to do a psych eval on him without hesitation:

As a psychotherapist I can tell you he exhibits no symptoms of narcissistic personality disorder or any of the other diagnoses du jour Internet strangers like to pin on him, though he does show minor signs of the depression and anxiety that you would expect from someone who has almost nothing because he was betrayed by the person he loved most and dozens of people he had tried to help.

That is using her credentials to support him, but I doubt a single eval is sufficient to diagnose any personality disorder (or rule out any diagnosis). Also, I find this part odd:

QuoteThe start of their argument was predictable and is all well-recorded— Hill's wife said something that was not true and Zak, very politely and patiently at first, asked her to stop.

Having interacted with Zak online, I find the "politely and patiently" to be implausible.

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 30, 2024, 09:37:42 PM
A lot to unpack there. First off, of course she could be having personal trauma that has essentially derailed her career. But based on the assumption that she authored this article, it's clear that she was never actually professional and capable in any career. I think she's probably too unstable and undisciplined to be able to get on a track. 

As far as being traumatized by the idea of leftists being mean people we can't know if that's the real her or part of the standard Zak-themed-article format. We've seen them before:
-credited to have been written by a woman
-impeccable leftist credentials (in terms of both diversity quota and activism) to make it impossible to dismiss as a "right wing rant" (ie. "I was a totally normal ordinary ultra-left progressive democratic socialist queer lgbt sex-positive polyamorous activist like everyone else, so when I say Zak is totally innocent you can't question me")
-disparaging of the right
-pretense to being highly skeptical of certain accusations being made against woke leftists only to be shocked to find they are true
-pretense to being initially skeptical of Zak's innocence only to realize that all accusations against him are a pack of lies.
-detailed litany of all the woes of Zak and all his great qualities and how certain mentally ill women have slandered him while toxic progressives who hate him got him cancelled.
-The section on Zak goes way too long, to the point that no normal human could possibly interested in that much detail about Zak Smith except Zak Smith himself.
-Inevitably, the obsession with Zak and his particular case and his particular complaints and his particular obsessions ends up making the article much weaker at everything it intended, not only at critiquing the toxic cancel-culture elements of the hobby, but also ironically at making people more sympathetic to Zak.

I basically agree with you about the article, but I'm pretty sure it was the real person who did the interviews - over four years - and who wrote it.

Quote from: rytrasmi on January 30, 2024, 10:04:33 PM
Perhaps the good doctor's fall from the ivory tower was due to a terrible madness acquired from 4 years of speaking with these despicable assholes.

Those repeated 1d6 to 1d10 SAN losses definitely add up.

Quote from: rytrasmi on January 30, 2024, 10:04:33 PM
Perhaps the good doctor's fall from the ivory tower was due to a terrible madness acquired from 4 years of speaking with these despicable assholes.

Reading it I got the impression from page one the writer was a serious-minded liberal with all the usual assumptions, then as it goes on they are surprised and depressed again and again and again to find the 'good guys' are among the most vile humans she has ever encountered. Then over too much wine decided to publish an incomplete manuscript that they regretted publishing the next day. Your quip may be totally accurate. Their author's worldview probably collapsed around them.

Quote from: Coffeecup on January 30, 2024, 11:25:44 PM
Hill is merely making a classic and hominem argument.

And usually people who argument like that try to avoid talking about content.
Considering that none of the points being raised against Weissman negate the article.

You aren't wrong, but the article making it all about Zak invited that particular weakness (of making it all about Zak) in.

So perhaps I'll need to eat crow on CBW not being the author. I am still not entirely sold, but alternative explanations for the crazy do now come to mind.

When I searched CBW up, I also noticed her moving around a lot. Study in Alabama, New York, job in Nevada, currently in Oregon with no immediately obvious employment. Three graduate degrees. This is the bio of someone who has poor self-discipline and is up to her eyeballs in debt, but I also want to point out that while most social workers are generously described as vapid parasites, the exceptions to that rule can make vicious enemies. It isn't beyond the pale for her to be fleeing death threats. My supposition is that she researched Zak S hoping to get a monetizable following by "cracking the case" of an "abuser"...and proceeded to fall in love with the subject.

This puts CBW in an awkward position because defending Zak S is basically all or nothing, even if the truth isn't so clear. I think that the evidence Zak S did something wrong is not particularly solid and the evidence the internet mob which got him blacklisted everywhere did wrong things is plain to see. I think that Zak S stuck his dick in crazy, and that he tactically misplayed the controversy. The original blacklists were to abuse Zak, but after his lawsuits, it is now a self-defense to avoid litigation. Even if we could perfectly exonerate Zak S (which we probably can't) he has burned down his bridges back into the industry. That said, while dumb these are not wrong. I am not actually familiar with any wrongdoing I can verify, and innocent until proven guilty.

So you wind up with CBW having the conflicting desire to protect Zak S and her own poor self discipline to actually stay the course and fight against what is sure to be an abusive mob of Zak-haters. Confused desires lead to confused, rambly article, which the author herself pulled down because she doesn't have the mental health to take the abuse these people would surely send her way given the chance. I would say this resembles Harley Quinn and Joker except that I don't actually see any evidence CBW ever directly interacted with Zak S. The confused Gordian knot of emotion which led to this is entirely contained in CBW and self-detonated on its own accord.

This unfortunately reinforces my opinion that the article is an unreliable source.

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 30, 2024, 09:37:42 PM
A lot to unpack there. First off, of course she could be having personal trauma that has essentially derailed her career. But based on the assumption that she authored this article, it's clear that she was never actually professional and capable in any career. I think she's probably too unstable and undisciplined to be able to get on a track. 

As far as being traumatized by the idea of leftists being mean people we can't know if that's the real her or part of the standard Zak-themed-article format. We've seen them before:
-credited to have been written by a woman
-impeccable leftist credentials (in terms of both diversity quota and activism) to make it impossible to dismiss as a "right wing rant" (ie. "I was a totally normal ordinary ultra-left progressive democratic socialist queer lgbt sex-positive polyamorous activist like everyone else, so when I say Zak is totally innocent you can't question me")
-disparaging of the right
-pretense to being highly skeptical of certain accusations being made against woke leftists only to be shocked to find they are true
-pretense to being initially skeptical of Zak's innocence only to realize that all accusations against him are a pack of lies.
-detailed litany of all the woes of Zak and all his great qualities and how certain mentally ill women have slandered him while toxic progressives who hate him got him cancelled.
-The section on Zak goes way too long, to the point that no normal human could possibly interested in that much detail about Zak Smith except Zak Smith himself.
-Inevitably, the obsession with Zak and his particular case and his particular complaints and his particular obsessions ends up making the article much weaker at everything it intended, not only at critiquing the toxic cancel-culture elements of the hobby, but also ironically at making people more sympathetic to Zak.

Careful, Pundit, you could get cancelled all over again for what this implies.  ;)

In the past decade and a half, there's been such a rush to "diversify" professional disciplines that proper screening for candidates to be up to par just hasn't been done.  This has been happening in all the fields; science, engineering, medicine, etc. 

A prime example of the failure of this effort is the FIU bridge collapse in 2018.  https://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local/5-years-later-fiu-bridge-collapse-remembered/2993692/  What this article won't tell you is that this was being done by a staff of all female engineers that had not been educated in the discipline of rigor.  It had been waived for them as an unnecessary impediment to women in a male dominated field.   tools developed in response to lessons learned in blood are being swept away as a mere inconvenience and gatekeeping so under-qualified individuals can reap the rewards of high status jobs and positions.

The coming genocide will born of ineptitude rather than malice. 

Let me be clear to any reader; I believe in real equal opportunity.  Anyone that meets the strict requirements and is willing to take the responsibility seriously should have these kinds of jobs.

Quote from: Fheredin on January 31, 2024, 08:25:26 AM
So perhaps I'll need to eat crow on CBW not being the author. I am still not entirely sold, but alternative explanations for the crazy do now come to mind.

When I searched CBW up, I also noticed her moving around a lot. Study in Alabama, New York, job in Nevada, currently in Oregon with no immediately obvious employment. Three graduate degrees. This is the bio of someone who has poor self-discipline and is up to her eyeballs in debt, but I also want to point out that while most social workers are generously described as vapid parasites, the exceptions to that rule can make vicious enemies. It isn't beyond the pale for her to be fleeing death threats. My supposition is that she researched Zak S hoping to get a monetizable following by "cracking the case" of an "abuser"...and proceeded to fall in love with the subject.

This puts CBW in an awkward position because defending Zak S is basically all or nothing, even if the truth isn't so clear. I think that the evidence Zak S did something wrong is not particularly solid and the evidence the internet mob which got him blacklisted everywhere did wrong things is plain to see. I think that Zak S stuck his dick in crazy, and that he tactically misplayed the controversy. The original blacklists were to abuse Zak, but after his lawsuits, it is now a self-defense to avoid litigation. Even if we could perfectly exonerate Zak S (which we probably can't) he has burned down his bridges back into the industry. That said, while dumb these are not wrong. I am not actually familiar with any wrongdoing I can verify, and innocent until proven guilty.

So you wind up with CBW having the conflicting desire to protect Zak S and her own poor self discipline to actually stay the course and fight against what is sure to be an abusive mob of Zak-haters. Confused desires lead to confused, rambly article, which the author herself pulled down because she doesn't have the mental health to take the abuse these people would surely send her way given the chance. I would say this resembles Harley Quinn and Joker except that I don't actually see any evidence CBW ever directly interacted with Zak S. The confused Gordian knot of emotion which led to this is entirely contained in CBW and self-detonated on its own accord.

This unfortunately reinforces my opinion that the article is an unreliable source.

Eat some more crow, the culprits themselves (3 at least) have confirmed (by having a meltdown) the article and the recordings.

Quote from: Fheredin on January 31, 2024, 08:25:26 AM
So perhaps I'll need to eat crow on CBW not being the author. I am still not entirely sold, but alternative explanations for the crazy do now come to mind.

When I searched CBW up, I also noticed her moving around a lot. Study in Alabama, New York, job in Nevada, currently in Oregon with no immediately obvious employment. Three graduate degrees. This is the bio of someone who has poor self-discipline and is up to her eyeballs in debt, but I also want to point out that while most social workers are generously described as vapid parasites, the exceptions to that rule can make vicious enemies. It isn't beyond the pale for her to be fleeing death threats. My supposition is that she researched Zak S hoping to get a monetizable following by "cracking the case" of an "abuser"...and proceeded to fall in love with the subject.

This puts CBW in an awkward position because defending Zak S is basically all or nothing, even if the truth isn't so clear. I think that the evidence Zak S did something wrong is not particularly solid and the evidence the internet mob which got him blacklisted everywhere did wrong things is plain to see. I think that Zak S stuck his dick in crazy, and that he tactically misplayed the controversy. The original blacklists were to abuse Zak, but after his lawsuits, it is now a self-defense to avoid litigation. Even if we could perfectly exonerate Zak S (which we probably can't) he has burned down his bridges back into the industry. That said, while dumb these are not wrong. I am not actually familiar with any wrongdoing I can verify, and innocent until proven guilty.

So you wind up with CBW having the conflicting desire to protect Zak S and her own poor self discipline to actually stay the course and fight against what is sure to be an abusive mob of Zak-haters. Confused desires lead to confused, rambly article, which the author herself pulled down because she doesn't have the mental health to take the abuse these people would surely send her way given the chance. I would say this resembles Harley Quinn and Joker except that I don't actually see any evidence CBW ever directly interacted with Zak S. The confused Gordian knot of emotion which led to this is entirely contained in CBW and self-detonated on its own accord.

This unfortunately reinforces my opinion that the article is an unreliable source.

"Stuck His Dick in Crazy" could probably pretty much be the title of Zak's life story...

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 31, 2024, 08:48:30 AM


"Stuck His Dick in Crazy" could probably pretty much be the title of Zak's life story...

Yep. Been there, done that. Crazy in bed, Crazy in life.
Trade offs, ya know.

Quote from: Eric Diaz on January 28, 2024, 06:52:49 PM
The audio clips are available in GrimJim's channels, I think. These are 15 damming minutes, but then again where is the rest?

Only if they are real. We now live in an age where voices can be faked to varying degrees and so this piece could one in an ever growing field of fakes. And it is only going to get worse.

Quote from: Omega on January 31, 2024, 01:45:12 PM

Quote from: Eric Diaz on January 28, 2024, 06:52:49 PM
The audio clips are available in GrimJim's channels, I think. These are 15 damming minutes, but then again where is the rest?

Only if they are real. We now live in an age where voices can be faked to varying degrees and so this piece could one in an ever growing field of fakes. And it is only going to get worse.

Olivia Hill has confimed it's her/him/it, two other individuals did also confirm the article is factual, their complaint is about etrhics not about veracity, next question?

Saying an article is factual merely because it contains facts is perhaps giving too much credit.

The fact that the article was taken down from Medium suggests to me that an editorial decision was made. Like, this might not be a good article. Anyone have any insight into that?

The other did call Mandy a liar... without proof. So was it taken down because legal exposure? Did Zak ask her to take it down, because it makes accusations without proof?

Quote from: blackstone on January 31, 2024, 10:57:55 AM

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 31, 2024, 08:48:30 AM


"Stuck His Dick in Crazy" could probably pretty much be the title of Zak's life story...

Yep. Been there, done that. Crazy in bed, Crazy in life.
Trade offs, ya know.

Yeah, sure me too. There's a time and a place for all of that and it's called college. But to still be doing that when you're in your late 40s is pretty embarassing, especially if you have money.

if anything, this whole twatgate rpgdrama had reminded me of Ocule's list. I really will only support creators who I know are decent.

Looks like a case of leopards eating faces. I guess you never thought it would happen to you, huh, Zak?
(https://img.fae.ro/e5a0e9.jpeg)

Glad so see these underhanded POS's get exposed, but Zak belongs right there with 'em. Sorry, old boy, but...

Why, I remember when Zak S was just a baby sea lion, on Google+.

Quote from: JanDevries on January 31, 2024, 09:25:29 PM
Looks like a case of leopards eating faces. I guess you never thought it would happen to you, huh, Zak?
(https://img.fae.ro/e5a0e9.jpeg)

Where did Macris post this? Twitter?

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 31, 2024, 09:50:27 PM

Quote from: JanDevries on January 31, 2024, 09:25:29 PM
Looks like a case of leopards eating faces. I guess you never thought it would happen to you, huh, Zak?
(https://img.fae.ro/e5a0e9.jpeg)

Where did Macris post this? Twitter?

Autarch Discord.

So now, even Brianna Wu is trying to walk back cancel culture....

Quote from: jeff37923 on January 31, 2024, 10:59:42 PM
So now, even Brianna Wu is trying to walk back cancel culture....

Good for zem. Now zey can go away, because while I will forgive without the force-choke, I do not forget, and nubmskulls like Brianna Wu can go take a hike and never come back.

Quote from: JanDevries on January 31, 2024, 09:53:11 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on January 31, 2024, 09:50:27 PM

Quote from: JanDevries on January 31, 2024, 09:25:29 PM
Looks like a case of leopards eating faces. I guess you never thought it would happen to you, huh, Zak?
(https://img.fae.ro/e5a0e9.jpeg)

Where did Macris post this? Twitter?

Autarch Discord.

Well, I'm glad to see it. Because I knew this from way back when, and its one of the things that was a kind of final breach between me and Zak, as Macris was both my friend and at some moments my boss, and I knew just how badly Zak betrayed him, all to try to seem cool to the gang of leftist cunts who would never accept him because he'd done porn.
But Alex was always kind of mild in his public criticism of what Zak did, and this is (I think) the first time I've seen him publicly make a clear and unequivocal statement about what Zak had done.

.

Well Zak, now that you've been drawn here, would you care to make a statement about what exactly is your relationship to Clio Weisman, and what part you played in the creation of the article that appeared and was later taken down from Medium? Want to go on record about whether you wrote any of it? And if not, do you think it met your expectations? Did you have an opportunity to read it before it was published; and if so, did you realize that the almost hero-worship nature of the 80% of the article that was all about you would not in fact do much for your cause, but would rather damage the credibility of the article as a whole, inevitably reading far more like some kind of bad propaganda piece and distracting from what could have been a much more clever take down of all the people who attacked you (and me, and Grim, and Raggi, though it would maybe be too much to expect you to ever have the thought of any of us cross your mind)? I mean, you are a pretty smart guy, so you must have realized that this would just give people like Olivia Hill the chance to use "it's just Zak ghostwriting" or "its just another woman that Zak has brainwashed into defending him" (which, btw, is exactly what Olivia Hill has been doing, over on Something Awful) so as to change the public conversation away from their awful behavior to the subject of you, you, you...

Also, what you shared just now doesn't seem to actually contradict any of what Macris said in his discord post. It's public record that you did quit the show. And the email seems to suggest that you did in fact try to strong-arm him. Hypocritically, as you ignored him pointing out that there were people who had called for you not to be hired in exactly the same way; but of course you always made it clear that you do in fact believe in Censorship and piss all over free speech, you just don't believe YOU should ever be censored. Which pretty much means you believe exactly what people like Olivia Hill or Varg Vikernes believe about free speech. Every asshole in the world believes THEY should get to say whatever they want; that's not free speech, it's just solipsism.
Did you keep the money? As far as I can see that's the only place where you could claim he's lying, if you returned that money. I seem to recall that you did in essence accuse him of promoting transphobia for hiring on Brandon Morse. You were very loud about that, and yet sadly it gained you no special brownie points from the SJW crowd (as we used to call them back then). They'll still hate you forever for doing porn.

I didn't steal anything as the emails make clear.

If you can't even acknowledge that the emails prove Macris wasn't telling the truth, then I'm not going to go play performing monkey for you here.

If you do that: Happy to oblige. But we both have to play by the same rules.

Quote from: Zak S on February 01, 2024, 05:23:38 AM
I didn't steal anything as the emails make clear.

If you can't even acknowledge that the emails prove Macris wasn't telling the truth, then I'm not going to go play performing monkey for you here.

If you do that: Happy to oblige. But we both have to play by the same rules.

Imagine posting an email screenshot intending to disprove something when instead it makes you look like even more of a melodramatic pompous ass. This email doesn't "prove" anything other than a fucking lawyer decided to tell you in the nicest way possible to go fuck yourself for breach of contract.

Quote from: Zak S on February 01, 2024, 05:23:38 AM
I didn't steal anything as the emails make clear.

If you can't even acknowledge that the emails prove Macris wasn't telling the truth, then I'm not going to go play performing monkey for you here.

If you do that: Happy to oblige. But we both have to play by the same rules.

How do you mean you didn't steal anything? Did you return the money that had already been paid for you, for production you failed to complete? You do get that "write it off as a loss" is still a LOSS, because you did not do what you were paid to do, right? I mean if you tell me that you returned what was supposed to be your salary for the show, which you have not stated clearly as of yet, then I could agree that you did not 'steal', you only cost them money with nothing to show for it. But you haven't even stated that clearly yet.

Quote from: Zak S on February 01, 2024, 03:07:48 AM
.

Zak, dude, you ain't helping your case with this.  Basically, the dude gave you money for a project that you pulled out of and didn't refund.  That's what I'm seeing in the email you posted here.  That qualifies as theft in nearly every state in the US.  He very well could have legitimately sued you for the losses or filed a criminal complaint against you.  He, in turn, was super nice to you and just wrote it off rather than justifiably destroying you.  This is something you need to be humble and grateful about.

Your behavior here is completely unprofessional and shows that you lack character.

[EDIT: you know what, I'd better sit this one out. I just hope the truth about everything and everyone will come out, eventually.]

Quote from: Zak S on February 01, 2024, 05:23:38 AM
I didn't steal anything as the emails make clear.

If you can't even acknowledge that the emails prove Macris wasn't telling the truth, then I'm not going to go play performing monkey for you here.

If you do that: Happy to oblige. But we both have to play by the same rules.

This is a shame, because I truly wanted to objectively listen you Zak's side of the story with honest answers to these questions.  but I shouldn't have expect anything but this kind of response from anyone of the woke mentality.

Quote from: Zak S on February 01, 2024, 05:23:38 AM
I didn't steal anything as the emails make clear.

If you can't even acknowledge that the emails prove Macris wasn't telling the truth, then I'm not going to go play performing monkey for you here.

If you do that: Happy to oblige. But we both have to play by the same rules.

Just say you don't want to answer the question lol

Quote from: Cathode Ray on February 01, 2024, 08:58:21 AM
This is a shame, because I truly wanted to objectively listen you Zak's side of the story with honest answers to these questions.  but I shouldn't have expect anything but this kind of response from anyone of the woke mentality.

If someone mowed his yard while wearing a Trump hat, he'd call the cops for hate speech. If the dude said Zak stiffed him for the yard work, Zak would produce video evidence of the guy wearing a Trump hat, as if that somehow exonerates his theft.

Zak is a special kind of inconsequential clown who was given a huge platform in the smallest possible circus tent and he thinks he his opinions are remotely valuable outside of a few thousand retards on RPG messageboards. SAD!

An account called b9anders attempt to raise the issue on RPGnot.
Looks like he has been been PermBanned for "posting on behalf of a banned user."

I'm calling Univision as this is now prime for a thursday night soap opera drama and putting in a call on short sale on Jiffy Pop stock options.

Quote from: Thorn Drumheller on January 31, 2024, 05:51:08 PM
if anything, this whole twatgate rpgdrama had reminded me of Ocule's list. I really will only support creators who I know are decent.

Isn't that the truth?

I work in the corporate world - it's filled with mid-wits, nincompoops, bureaucratic twats, and a few geniuses. But the level of drama in the TTRPG world is so... *weeeirdly* childishly pathetic and malicious. When it *could* be so much better. But fuck me if watching this unfold as representative of the hobby... Jesus. It's pretty laughable.

There are good people in this hobby making good products. Support them. I'd say "ignore the weirdos" - but it's clear they won't ignore you if you get into the industry on a meaningful level. But fuck me if I'll work with anyone associated with this bullshit.

No amount of freelancing is worth "credit" earned on the backs of being a potential target for fucktard malignant bottom-feeding narcissists in this industry. (and in full disclosure I've worked with a few of them mentioned in the distant past not that it matters now - it was a more innocent time before the madness set in). But now? BWAHAHAH I'll reinvent the wheel on my own dime, thanks.

Quote from: Brad on February 01, 2024, 09:39:33 AM

Quote from: Cathode Ray on February 01, 2024, 08:58:21 AM
This is a shame, because I truly wanted to objectively listen you Zak's side of the story with honest answers to these questions.  but I shouldn't have expect anything but this kind of response from anyone of the woke mentality.

If someone mowed his yard while wearing a Trump hat, he'd call the cops for hate speech. If the dude said Zak stiffed him for the yard work, Zak would produce video evidence of the guy wearing a Trump hat, as if that somehow exonerates his theft.

Zak is a special kind of inconsequential clown who was given a huge platform in the smallest possible circus tent and he thinks he his opinions are remotely valuable outside of a few thousand retards on RPG messageboards. SAD!

Even tiny shitpiles have their kings.

It's also been alleged that Zak released screenshots of a private convo from the Autarch Discord in an attempt to get Macris and his partner Mike - who as far as I can see, has done nothing to Zak - in hot water with Disney/Marvel over Zak & Macris' personal beef. The beef in question allegedly being that Zak felt he was owed Macris' support during Mandygate, despite Zak having screwed Macris over. The screenshots "coincidentally" dropped as the ACKS II Kickstarter was launching.

Zak, did you have any involvement with the attempts to sabotage the ACKS II Kickstarter?

Over on one of the OSR groups on Facebook, someone said that Alex Hopson, who is working with Zak on a project called Nebulith (which is intended to "decancel" Zak, as Hopson himself put it), asked for his email address last November in order to promote a project. Then, the day the article dropped, Hopson emailed him (and, presumably, everyone else whose email addresses he had collected) with an update about Nebulith (which none of these people had backed or anything), along with the link to Weisman's article.

Zak, what was your and/or Alex's advance notice of/involvement in the writing of Weisman's article?

Edit: well, well, the Macris screenshots from the time of the ACKS II KS have now disappeared from imgur. Almost as if someone is trying to cover their tracks. I just saw them yesterday.

Hi, Zak!

quote is not edit d'oh

quote is not edit

Quote from: JanDevries on February 01, 2024, 10:02:07 AM
It's also been alleged that Zak released screenshots of a private convo from the Autarch Discord in an attempt to get Macris and his partner Mike - who as far as I can see, has done nothing to Zak - in hot water with Disney/Marvel over Zak & Macris' personal beef. The beef in question allegedly being that Zak felt he was owed Macris' support during Mandygate, despite Zak having screwed Macris over. The screenshots "coincidentally" dropped as the ACKS II Kickstarter was launching.

Zak, did you have any involvement with the attempts to sabotage the ACKS II Kickstarter?

...

Edit: well, well, the Macris screenshots from the time of the ACKS II KS have now disappeared from imgur. Almost as if someone is trying to cover their tracks. I just saw them yesterday.

Hi, Zak!

You don't even need to ask, because Zak posted it on his blog: https://dndwithpornstars.blogspot.com/2023/09/im-going-to-break-some-news-about-new.html

The guy who posted it on Reddit (sombodystoleme (https://www.reddit.com/user/sombodystoleme)) is either a Zak sockpuppet or one of his dicksuckers, because his only posts are related to Zak drama.

I am curious what Zak's connection with Clio is.

So Zak is fine and dandy with trying to ruin peoples' careers, just so long as the target is someone who is not Zak.  I see.  Well, given the interactions I've seen him undertaking with people here, I can't say I find it out of character for him; never exactly seen the milk of human kindness overflowing from him.

Quote from: tenbones on February 01, 2024, 09:56:01 AM

Quote from: Thorn Drumheller on January 31, 2024, 05:51:08 PM
if anything, this whole twatgate rpgdrama had reminded me of Ocule's list. I really will only support creators who I know are decent.

Isn't that the truth?

I work in the corporate world - it's filled with mid-wits, nincompoops, bureaucratic twats, and a few geniuses. But the level of drama in the TTRPG world is so... *weeeirdly* childishly pathetic and malicious. When it *could* be so much better. But fuck me if watching this unfold as representative of the hobby... Jesus. It's pretty laughable.

There are good people in this hobby making good products. Support them. I'd say "ignore the weirdos" - but it's clear they won't ignore you if you get into the industry on a meaningful level. But fuck me if I'll work with anyone associated with this bullshit.

No amount of freelancing is worth "credit" earned on the backs of being a potential target for fucktard malignant bottom-feeding narcissists in this industry. (and in full disclosure I've worked with a few of them mentioned in the distant past not that it matters now - it was a more innocent time before the madness set in). But now? BWAHAHAH I'll reinvent the wheel on my own dime, thanks.

hehe. So true. I mean my dreams of being in the industry died on the vine long ago....thankfully.

It's been so refreshing though to ignore so many "rpg creators". It took me a bit to sell off stuff I didn't want anymore (still got some stuff).

Even selling the stuff that was touted so high and mighty I still have loads of fantastic stuff by decent creators.

Quote from: tenbones on February 01, 2024, 09:56:01 AM

Quote from: Thorn Drumheller on January 31, 2024, 05:51:08 PM
if anything, this whole twatgate rpgdrama had reminded me of Ocule's list. I really will only support creators who I know are decent.

I work in the corporate world - it's filled with mid-wits, nincompoops, bureaucratic twats, and a few geniuses. But the level of drama in the TTRPG world is so... *weeeirdly* childishly pathetic and malicious. When it *could* be so much better. But fuck me if watching this unfold as representative of the hobby... Jesus. It's pretty laughable.

As a customer, my reaction is that I have no interest in digging into the drama about who is right and wrong in these debates. In general, I'll buy based on whether it's a product I'm interested in, not based on whether the creator is a good person or not.

I don't care if the person who grew the oranges I buy is a good person or not, or what their politics are. I will boycott a major company at times, but it's the exception rather than the rule - and it's for major things, not stuff that I have to dig through social media for.

Quote from: jhkim on February 01, 2024, 08:29:46 PM

Quote from: tenbones on February 01, 2024, 09:56:01 AM

Quote from: Thorn Drumheller on January 31, 2024, 05:51:08 PM
if anything, this whole twatgate rpgdrama had reminded me of Ocule's list. I really will only support creators who I know are decent.

I work in the corporate world - it's filled with mid-wits, nincompoops, bureaucratic twats, and a few geniuses. But the level of drama in the TTRPG world is so... *weeeirdly* childishly pathetic and malicious. When it *could* be so much better. But fuck me if watching this unfold as representative of the hobby... Jesus. It's pretty laughable.

As a customer, my reaction is that I have no interest in digging into the drama about who is right and wrong in these debates. In general, I'll buy based on whether it's a product I'm interested in, not based on whether the creator is a good person or not.

I don't care if the person who grew the oranges I buy is a good person or not, or what their politics are. I will boycott a major company at times, but it's the exception rather than the rule - and it's for major things, not stuff that I have to dig through social media for.

I have more nuance than to pretend this analogy is the same when we've literally spent years on this and other forums talking about this and other shit relating to the hobby at large. Sorry, buying oranges isn't an "hobby" I engage in as a hobby.

Quote from: Valatar on February 01, 2024, 04:30:11 PM
So Zak is fine and dandy with trying to ruin peoples' careers, just so long as the target is someone who is not Zak.  I see.  Well, given the interactions I've seen him undertaking with people here, I can't say I find it out of character for him; never exactly seen the milk of human kindness overflowing from him.

It takes a special kind of asshole to keep using the same shit that was used to destroy you. Meaning a stupid and evil asshole.

Quote from: GeekyBugle on February 01, 2024, 11:07:01 PM

Quote from: Valatar on February 01, 2024, 04:30:11 PM
So Zak is fine and dandy with trying to ruin peoples' careers, just so long as the target is someone who is not Zak.  I see.  Well, given the interactions I've seen him undertaking with people here, I can't say I find it out of character for him; never exactly seen the milk of human kindness overflowing from him.

It takes a special kind of asshole to keep using the same shit that was used to destroy you. Meaning a stupid and evil asshole.

My entirety of knowledge about the guy is when he had a thread created here to advertise that he just won a lawsuit, and his response was to insult and war with everyone that posted in it, even supportive or neutral people. That's all I need to know, he's an asshole with a hair up it.

the article was about liars

i told the truth

those things are opposites

Yeah no, not quite.  You took a man who had, as proved in your own email records, protected you from people ousting you for your politics, then went out of your way to sabotage his career because you disagreed with his politics.  Your "truth" that you posted was that he was objectively a bad person, but that was based on your entirely subjective opinion of the politics of a guy he worked with.  The extent of the man's crimes against humanity seem to be holding opinions that you disagreed with.

I posit that being a sleaze who sabotages people because of a bullshit reason like working with Milo Yawhateveropolis is not morally superior to being a sleaze who sabotages people because of a fabricated reason.

Quote from: Zak S on February 02, 2024, 12:18:37 AM
the article was about liars

i told the truth

those things are opposites

Sociopaths are really good at lying and convincing themselves they're telling the truth. Maybe you should see a therapist and get this sorted out.

Being a victim's rights advocate, I think that the burden of proof is still on Macris to demonstrate what happened. Ya know, innocent until proven guilty.

That said, I can totally see Macris's side of the matter. Nazis are the perfect example of the Boy who Cried Wolf, because almost none of the people decried as Nazis are even in the correct zip code of being real Nazis. If I were in his shoes and I had a collaborator pull out because "muh Nazis" and said collab didn't return an advance, I would probably also come to the conclusion this was grandstanding with the intent of walking out with the advance. If you (Zak) were honest about the intent, you needed to return the advance to prove that money was not one of your motives. As is, it looks like it will forever be up to the reader's interpretation what your motives actually were.

But again, Macris has to prove this. Zak doesn't have to prove anything.

Quote from: tenbones on February 01, 2024, 09:56:01 AM

Quote from: Thorn Drumheller on January 31, 2024, 05:51:08 PM
if anything, this whole twatgate rpgdrama had reminded me of Ocule's list. I really will only support creators who I know are decent.

Isn't that the truth?

I work in the corporate world - it's filled with mid-wits, nincompoops, bureaucratic twats, and a few geniuses. But the level of drama in the TTRPG world is so... *weeeirdly* childishly pathetic and malicious. When it *could* be so much better. But fuck me if watching this unfold as representative of the hobby... Jesus. It's pretty laughable.

There are good people in this hobby making good products. Support them. I'd say "ignore the weirdos" - but it's clear they won't ignore you if you get into the industry on a meaningful level. But fuck me if I'll work with anyone associated with this bullshit.

No amount of freelancing is worth "credit" earned on the backs of being a potential target for fucktard malignant bottom-feeding narcissists in this industry. (and in full disclosure I've worked with a few of them mentioned in the distant past not that it matters now - it was a more innocent time before the madness set in). But now? BWAHAHAH I'll reinvent the wheel on my own dime, thanks.

There is definitely a significant amount of creative envy. It is much easier to destroy competition who is smarter than you than it is to make a better game than them, so people who care about their place in the industry pecking order and who don't actually care about the game do that instead.

Quote from: Fheredin on February 02, 2024, 07:48:54 AM
Being a victim's rights advocate, I think that the burden of proof is still on Macris to demonstrate what happened. Ya know, innocent until proven guilty.

That said, I can totally see Macris's side of the matter. Nazis are the perfect example of the Boy who Cried Wolf, because almost none of the people decried as Nazis are even in the correct zip code of being real Nazis. If I were in his shoes and I had a collaborator pull out because "muh Nazis" and said collab didn't return an advance, I would probably also come to the conclusion this was grandstanding with the intent of walking out with the advance. If you (Zak) were honest about the intent, you needed to return the advance to prove that money was not one of your motives. As is, it looks like it will forever be up to the reader's interpretation what your motives actually were.

But again, Macris has to prove this. Zak doesn't have to prove anything.

I don't think Zak has even denied it. He's talked around denying it and said "the emails show Macris is lying" but the email seems to show that Macris is telling the truth.

Also it appears that Zak may have deleted another email attachment which demonstrably showed Macris was telling the truth.

I doubt Macris has access to the Escapist email account but Zak still has access to his hotmail. Therefore Zak should post the entire conversation log if he is confident in being correct. Preferably including a secondary email msg file.

Goddamnit, Zak, not only are you the centre of attention, meaning this story can't get traction where the mere mention of you is banned, but you can't go five minutes - and take this small measure of redemption in the public eye - without picking fights and punching yourself in the dick. For the love of glob, man, take the small win and stop alienating and demotivating people.

Quote from: Zak S on February 02, 2024, 12:18:37 AM
the article was about liars

i told the truth

those things are opposites

I said earlier, in this tread, that you'd be very smart to keep silent.  You must have an IQ below 87 for not only not keeping quiet about this article but actually posting proof of you being a shithead and screwing over to those you do business with.

You also have exhibited the same tendencies as the people that canceled you.  You demanded that someone loose work because you didn't like their social views.  That makes you the bad guy.  There's no way you didn't see this kind of behavior out of this crowd and how it was dishonestly applied before it happened to you.  You chose to align yourself with people that do the cancelling. 

You need to step away and do some deep personal reflection.

Quote from: GRIM on February 02, 2024, 09:49:20 AM
Goddamnit, Zak, not only are you the centre of attention, meaning this story can't get traction where the mere mention of you is banned, but you can't go five minutes - and take this small measure of redemption in the public eye - without picking fights and punching yourself in the dick. For the love of glob, man, take the small win and stop alienating and demotivating people.

At this point, posters should realize that some people are Drama Vortexes, and the best move is to get out of the gravitational pull...

At this point, I think the only thing to do with Zak is to commend him to the Divine Mercy.

Quote from: GRIM on February 02, 2024, 09:49:20 AM
Goddamnit, Zak, not only are you the centre of attention, meaning this story can't get traction where the mere mention of you is banned, but you can't go five minutes - and take this small measure of redemption in the public eye - without picking fights and punching yourself in the dick. For the love of glob, man, take the small win and stop alienating and demotivating people.

Too late. I'm demotivated. I, and others here, clearly see this is the game of malignant asshats that are the filmy layers of urine and feces that has continually been there in the hobby - and you and other victims are just a casualty of their games.

The solution is: gatekeep and rebuild. The more oxygen we give these narcissistic weasels the longer they persist in their shenanigans.

We need not forgive, we won't forget. Let's move forward. Re-litigating shit *we already knew* is pointless. We know those guy are bad actors. We don't need flaming smoke-belching guns. We ALREADY KNOW.

Quote from: GRIM on February 02, 2024, 09:49:20 AM
Goddamnit, Zak, not only are you the centre of attention, meaning this story can't get traction where the mere mention of you is banned, but you can't go five minutes - and take this small measure of redemption in the public eye - without picking fights and punching yourself in the dick. For the love of glob, man, take the small win and stop alienating and demotivating people.

What did I tell you?

We might know,  but normies didn't. It's important to get through to the go-alongs.

Quote from: tenbones on February 02, 2024, 11:59:07 AM

Quote from: GRIM on February 02, 2024, 09:49:20 AM
Goddamnit, Zak, not only are you the centre of attention, meaning this story can't get traction where the mere mention of you is banned, but you can't go five minutes - and take this small measure of redemption in the public eye - without picking fights and punching yourself in the dick. For the love of glob, man, take the small win and stop alienating and demotivating people.

Too late. I'm demotivated. I, and others here, clearly see this is the game of malignant asshats that are the filmy layers of urine and feces that has continually been there in the hobby - and you and other victims are just a casualty of their games.

The solution is: gatekeep and rebuild. The more oxygen we give these narcissistic weasels the longer they persist in their shenanigans.

We need not forgive, we won't forget. Let's move forward. Re-litigating shit *we already knew* is pointless. We know those guy are bad actors. We don't need flaming smoke-belching guns. We ALREADY KNOW.

I agree with Grim, it's not about the POS (Zak among them) who were victims of the same shit they do to others, it's not even about the innocent victims (Grim, Pundit, Macris and many others) it's about showing the normies the evidence that they are backing monsters.

Why do you guys think Literally Who is now decrying cancel culture as "hurting our own side"?

Normies must be kept in the dark for the woke to retain their power.

Quote from: GeekyBugle on February 02, 2024, 02:28:25 PM

Quote from: tenbones on February 02, 2024, 11:59:07 AM

Quote from: GRIM on February 02, 2024, 09:49:20 AM
Goddamnit, Zak, not only are you the centre of attention, meaning this story can't get traction where the mere mention of you is banned, but you can't go five minutes - and take this small measure of redemption in the public eye - without picking fights and punching yourself in the dick. For the love of glob, man, take the small win and stop alienating and demotivating people.

Too late. I'm demotivated. I, and others here, clearly see this is the game of malignant asshats that are the filmy layers of urine and feces that has continually been there in the hobby - and you and other victims are just a casualty of their games.

The solution is: gatekeep and rebuild. The more oxygen we give these narcissistic weasels the longer they persist in their shenanigans.

We need not forgive, we won't forget. Let's move forward. Re-litigating shit *we already knew* is pointless. We know those guy are bad actors. We don't need flaming smoke-belching guns. We ALREADY KNOW.

I agree with Grim, it's not about the POS (Zak among them) who were victims of the same shit they do to others, it's not even about the innocent victims (Grim, Pundit, Macris and many others) it's about showing the normies the evidence that they are backing monsters.

Why do you guys think Literally Who is now decrying cancel culture as "hurting our own side"?

Normies must be kept in the dark for the woke to retain their power.

The problem is that could have been done flawlessly, and instead it was done in such a way that the Left only needs to say "This is all just Zak, Zak, Zak" and everyone can discount it.

Quote from: RPGPundit on February 02, 2024, 02:36:21 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on February 02, 2024, 02:28:25 PM

Quote from: tenbones on February 02, 2024, 11:59:07 AM

Quote from: GRIM on February 02, 2024, 09:49:20 AM
Goddamnit, Zak, not only are you the centre of attention, meaning this story can't get traction where the mere mention of you is banned, but you can't go five minutes - and take this small measure of redemption in the public eye - without picking fights and punching yourself in the dick. For the love of glob, man, take the small win and stop alienating and demotivating people.

Too late. I'm demotivated. I, and others here, clearly see this is the game of malignant asshats that are the filmy layers of urine and feces that has continually been there in the hobby - and you and other victims are just a casualty of their games.

The solution is: gatekeep and rebuild. The more oxygen we give these narcissistic weasels the longer they persist in their shenanigans.

We need not forgive, we won't forget. Let's move forward. Re-litigating shit *we already knew* is pointless. We know those guy are bad actors. We don't need flaming smoke-belching guns. We ALREADY KNOW.

I agree with Grim, it's not about the POS (Zak among them) who were victims of the same shit they do to others, it's not even about the innocent victims (Grim, Pundit, Macris and many others) it's about showing the normies the evidence that they are backing monsters.

Why do you guys think Literally Who is now decrying cancel culture as "hurting our own side"?

Normies must be kept in the dark for the woke to retain their power.

The problem is that could have been done flawlessly, and instead it was done in such a way that the Left only needs to say "This is all just Zak, Zak, Zak" and everyone can discount it.

Especially if WE discount it as a Zak puff piece instead of grabbing it as the ram to break the illusion.

Zak only presented evidence that he is a thief, while he lied about the evidence he provided himself.

Quote from: GRIM on February 02, 2024, 02:07:40 PM
We might know,  but normies didn't. It's important to get through to the go-alongs.

^THIS^

Grim is 100% on point here, while a whole lot of other people seem to have lost the fucking plot.


All this focus on Z being in the article is the dumbest thing. Who cares? Why keep mentioning him?

He's a dick. Yeah, so he's innocent of what they accused him of...

In other news: He's still a dick that no one likes.

True, article didn't mention the names of some of the other people that have been hurt by these psychopaths.

So What?


The real focus should be on the fact that the scumbags in the article have since basically confirmed that it's all true.

That they are Still completely unrepentant.

And that to date NO ONE from their side has taken them to task for it.


Will that "change things" in the short run? No.

But it is only right that their villainy has been revealed for all to see, and that we now have a record of it.


The article gaining wider attention is a WIN people.

Stop trying to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory by making it all about some dick.

Quote from: jhkim on February 01, 2024, 08:29:46 PM

Quote from: tenbones on February 01, 2024, 09:56:01 AM

Quote from: Thorn Drumheller on January 31, 2024, 05:51:08 PM
if anything, this whole twatgate rpgdrama had reminded me of Ocule's list. I really will only support creators who I know are decent.

I work in the corporate world - it's filled with mid-wits, nincompoops, bureaucratic twats, and a few geniuses. But the level of drama in the TTRPG world is so... *weeeirdly* childishly pathetic and malicious. When it *could* be so much better. But fuck me if watching this unfold as representative of the hobby... Jesus. It's pretty laughable.

As a customer, my reaction is that I have no interest in digging into the drama about who is right and wrong in these debates. In general, I'll buy based on whether it's a product I'm interested in, not based on whether the creator is a good person or not.

I don't care if the person who grew the oranges I buy is a good person or not, or what their politics are. I will boycott a major company at times, but it's the exception rather than the rule - and it's for major things, not stuff that I have to dig through social media for.

Hey, you do you. I don't dig through social media either. I rely on "The ListTM" hehehe lol

https://youtu.be/r0nUFW3MQKI?si=qu9bjvBl88fGiEE_

still one of my fav pundit vids. Especially when Taylor Lane is brought up.

Quote from: Thorn Drumheller on February 02, 2024, 03:56:22 PM
https://youtu.be/r0nUFW3MQKI?si=qu9bjvBl88fGiEE_

still one of my fav pundit vids. Especially when Taylor Lane is brought up.

My favorite "under 30" journalist who just celebrated her 45th birthday at the same time! She's the gift that keeps on giving.

Quote from: tenbones on February 02, 2024, 11:59:07 AM

Quote from: GRIM on February 02, 2024, 09:49:20 AM
Goddamnit, Zak, not only are you the centre of attention, meaning this story can't get traction where the mere mention of you is banned, but you can't go five minutes - and take this small measure of redemption in the public eye - without picking fights and punching yourself in the dick. For the love of glob, man, take the small win and stop alienating and demotivating people.

Too late. I'm demotivated.

Demotivators! Yes, that's exactly what this conversation needed!

(https://despair.com/cdn/shop/files/immaturity_cc5d4a86-133b-4dfa-9236-b060d6a4e5cd_grande.jpg?v=1694492033)

Quote from: THE_Leopold on February 02, 2024, 04:53:40 PM

Quote from: Thorn Drumheller on February 02, 2024, 03:56:22 PM
https://youtu.be/r0nUFW3MQKI?si=qu9bjvBl88fGiEE_

still one of my fav pundit vids. Especially when Taylor Lane is brought up.

My favorite "under 30" journalist who just celebrated her 45th birthday at the same time! She's the gift that keeps on giving.

I think you're thinking about Taylor Lorenz.

Quote from: Thorn Drumheller on February 02, 2024, 03:56:22 PM
https://youtu.be/r0nUFW3MQKI?si=qu9bjvBl88fGiEE_

still one of my fav pundit vids. Especially when Taylor Lane is brought up.

Thanks! It's a good reminder.

Quote from: GRIM on February 02, 2024, 02:07:40 PM
We might know,  but normies didn't. It's important to get through to the go-alongs.

Fair enough. I still think directly engaging with the people involved is a bad idea. Commenting on them is another thing.

Quote from: Ratman_tf on February 02, 2024, 07:36:31 PM

Quote from: GRIM on February 02, 2024, 02:07:40 PM
We might know,  but normies didn't. It's important to get through to the go-alongs.

Fair enough. I still think directly engaging with the people involved is a bad idea. Commenting on them is another thing.

You are 1000% correct, we shouldn't engage with the culprits since ANY form of engagement will be called harassment.

Quote from: JanDevries on January 31, 2024, 09:25:29 PM
Looks like a case of leopards eating faces. I guess you never thought it would happen to you, huh, Zak?
(https://img.fae.ro/e5a0e9.jpeg)

Quote from: Zak S on February 01, 2024, 03:07:48 AM
(https://www.therpgsite.com/pen-paper-roleplaying-games-rpgs-discussion/the-worst-people-you-have-never-met/?action=dlattach;attach=3689;image)

Quote from: Zak S on February 01, 2024, 05:23:38 AM
I didn't steal anything as the emails make clear.

Technically correct. You did not steal the money, you breached the contract for ideological reasons, after being paid, and then proceeded to defame and undermine the financial endeavors of the person who contracted you. And an admission like that will do more to torch your career than anything the circular firing squad ever could.

Quote from: Zak S on February 01, 2024, 05:23:38 AM
If you can't even acknowledge that the emails prove Macris wasn't telling the truth, then I'm not going to go play performing monkey for you here.

If you do that: Happy to oblige. But we both have to play by the same rules.

Wait, so now you won't clarify the truth because people are being dishonest?

Jokes on you Pundit. Should have just made defamatory statements and wait to be corrected.

This has been wild to me, freakin wild.

We knew these people were twisted and hate filled, but having it laid out in detail like this is something else. Most of these people don't deserve to have any kind of career in gaming anymore. Evil Hat should shutter it's doors, Cam Banks should never write again... Fuck, I used to talk to David Hill on Twitter 10 years before he turned himself into "Olivia".

It's just a shame, a real fucking shame, most of this shit is going to get glossed over, and most of the perpetrators will never see any kind of Justice.

But I'm glad I've never liked any of the games these people have created. On top of thinking FATE just sucks, I can say I also don't run it for moral reasons now.

Quote from: Fheredin on February 02, 2024, 05:19:59 PM
Demotivators! Yes, that's exactly what this conversation needed!

(https://despair.com/cdn/shop/files/immaturity_cc5d4a86-133b-4dfa-9236-b060d6a4e5cd_grande.jpg?v=1694492033)

This is completely random, but I worked with the founders of despair.com. Larry Kersten was my boss.

Quote from: pawsplay on February 03, 2024, 02:44:28 PMThis is completely random, but I worked with the founders of despair.com.

You seem eminently qualified.

Quote from: pawsplay on February 03, 2024, 02:44:28 PM

Quote from: Fheredin on February 02, 2024, 05:19:59 PM
Demotivators! Yes, that's exactly what this conversation needed!

(https://despair.com/cdn/shop/files/immaturity_cc5d4a86-133b-4dfa-9236-b060d6a4e5cd_grande.jpg?v=1694492033)

This is completely random, but I worked with the founders of despair.com. Larry Kersten was my boss.

I'll bite! What was it like? Were they funny good-natured folks or brooding melancholics? What was the office vibe?

Quote from: amacris on February 03, 2024, 03:45:38 PM
I'll bite! What was it like? Were they funny good-natured folks or brooding melancholics? What was the office vibe?

I worked at a dotcom. Mostly fun, good-natured people. Kersten himself was kind of a grouchy, David Letterman type of funny. Good boss. A bit of a misfit in that the place ran on energy drinks and Quake. We eventually got bought by the largest telecommunications company in the world. Dr. Kersten left to do despair.com full time, but before he left, I remember this priceless moment. Someone had hung up one of the Despairities in the breakroom, and our VP of Customer Care decided he had to say something about it. He admonished us all for being cynical and giving in to negativity. Dr. Kersten just stood in the back and smirked.

The post in question was a picture of the Titanic, with the caption: It's possible your only purpose in life is to serve as a warning to others.

By the next year, the VP in question got moved, uh, horizontally, to "special projects."

End of tangent.

Quote from: pawsplay on February 03, 2024, 04:02:04 PM

Quote from: amacris on February 03, 2024, 03:45:38 PM
I'll bite! What was it like? Were they funny good-natured folks or brooding melancholics? What was the office vibe?

I worked at a dotcom. Mostly fun, good-natured people. Kersten himself was kind of a grouchy, David Letterman type of funny. Good boss. A bit of a misfit in that the place ran on energy drinks and Quake. We eventually got bought by the largest telecommunications company in the world. Dr. Kersten left to do despair.com full time, but before he left, I remember this priceless moment. Someone had hung up one of the Despairities in the breakroom, and our VP of Customer Care decided he had to say something about it. He admonished us all for being cynical and giving in to negativity. Dr. Kersten just stood in the back and smirked.
The post in question was a picture of the Titanic, with the caption: It's possible your only purpose in life is to serve as a warning to others.
By the next year, the VP in question got moved, uh, horizontally, to "special projects."
End of tangent.

Those old dotcom cultures were good fun. I would say that there is a direct correlation between being unable to laugh at Despair posters and being a bad manager, so your story makes sense to me. We used to hang them at The Escapist office.

I will confirm the most important part of this (or any other) story... yeah, it was me.  I originated #TwatGate  You're welcome.

CHA'ALT

Quote from: VengerSatanis on February 04, 2024, 04:35:25 PM
I will confirm the most important part of this (or any other) story... yeah, it was me.  I originated #TwatGate  You're welcome.

CHA'ALT

So tomorrow night at 8pm Eastern, on my Youtube, I'll be doing something I haven't been able to do for a long time. Maybe times really are a' changing, because for the first time in at least a decade a leftist wants to debate me, on the topic of this article. Assuming I figure out the tech parts, C. W. Chanter, who has been sharing some strong opinions on his Youtube livestreams about all this, is going to be on my channel and we'll be debating a variety of topics related to this article and certain accusations he's made at Grimjim. Should be interesting no matter how it goes.

Raggi made an intelligent comment about this whole affair:
https://youtu.be/tlkFS-fpgIs?si=GQqNuzoi_T5y_yL6

 :( I feel demotivated to continue spelunking this dungeon. I surface to count my loot and carouse with it to gain XP.  8) Best of luck, intrepid explorers! The greatest treasure from here was the friends we made along the way.  ;D

Quote from: KingOfUmbar on February 01, 2024, 01:23:42 PM
You don't even need to ask, because Zak posted it on his blog: https://dndwithpornstars.blogspot.com/2023/09/im-going-to-break-some-news-about-new.html

The guy who posted it on Reddit (sombodystoleme (https://www.reddit.com/user/sombodystoleme)) is either a Zak sockpuppet or one of his dicksuckers, because his only posts are related to Zak drama.

I am curious what Zak's connection with Clio is.

Zak deleted his blog post. Unsure why exactly he did that.

Quote from: RPGPundit on February 04, 2024, 08:12:34 PM
So tomorrow night at 8pm Eastern, on my Youtube, I'll be doing something I haven't been able to do for a long time. Maybe times really are a' changing, because for the first time in at least a decade a leftist wants to debate me, on the topic of this article. Assuming I figure out the tech parts, C. W. Chanter, who has been sharing some strong opinions on his Youtube livestreams about all this, is going to be on my channel and we'll be debating a variety of topics related to this article and certain accusations he's made at Grimjim. Should be interesting no matter how it goes.

Fair warning, he seems to be an actual lunatic.

Quote from: KingOfUmbar on February 05, 2024, 08:42:18 AM
Zak deleted his blog post. Unsure why exactly he did that.

Why do you think...

Quote from: GRIM on February 05, 2024, 09:40:56 AM

Quote from: RPGPundit on February 04, 2024, 08:12:34 PM
So tomorrow night at 8pm Eastern, on my Youtube, I'll be doing something I haven't been able to do for a long time. Maybe times really are a' changing, because for the first time in at least a decade a leftist wants to debate me, on the topic of this article. Assuming I figure out the tech parts, C. W. Chanter, who has been sharing some strong opinions on his Youtube livestreams about all this, is going to be on my channel and we'll be debating a variety of topics related to this article and certain accusations he's made at Grimjim. Should be interesting no matter how it goes.

Fair warning, he seems to be an actual lunatic.

So, a true leftist.

Quote from: Brad on February 05, 2024, 10:20:53 AM

Quote from: KingOfUmbar on February 05, 2024, 08:42:18 AM
Zak deleted his blog post. Unsure why exactly he did that.

Why do you think...

I'm not saying it was because of me but...

I took one look at his postings and was slapped in the face with the fact that he literally committed a crime and confessed to it with his post.  His victim was nice enough to call it a loss and let it go.  I called him out on it in this thread.  (His post is #105 and mine is #110, both on page 8 )  This was after I mentioned that he would be smart to shut the fuck up and ride the wave.  (Reply #53)

Several people called him out for being a shithead that both violated a contract and attempted to cancel someone.  He brought all this attention to himself by posting his own "evidence." 

(I'm an anonymous user on a message board so I don't think I individually am responsible for Zak realizing he fucked up and pulling the posts.)

Quote from: GeekyBugle on February 05, 2024, 10:53:47 AM

Quote from: GRIM on February 05, 2024, 09:40:56 AM

Quote from: RPGPundit on February 04, 2024, 08:12:34 PM
So tomorrow night at 8pm Eastern, on my Youtube, I'll be doing something I haven't been able to do for a long time. Maybe times really are a' changing, because for the first time in at least a decade a leftist wants to debate me, on the topic of this article. Assuming I figure out the tech parts, C. W. Chanter, who has been sharing some strong opinions on his Youtube livestreams about all this, is going to be on my channel and we'll be debating a variety of topics related to this article and certain accusations he's made at Grimjim. Should be interesting no matter how it goes.

Fair warning, he seems to be an actual lunatic.

So, a true leftist.

I would remind you that I'm probably the most left-wing person you've ever encountered. No, I mean conspiracy theories and bizarre UFOlogy nonsense crazy.

Quote from: Coffeecup on February 05, 2024, 04:00:34 AM
Raggi made an intelligent comment about this whole affair:
https://youtu.be/tlkFS-fpgIs?si=GQqNuzoi_T5y_yL6

When do we get Taylor Swift to comment on the issue?

Quote from: Ratman_tf on February 05, 2024, 11:25:27 AM

Quote from: Coffeecup on February 05, 2024, 04:00:34 AM
Raggi made an intelligent comment about this whole affair:
https://youtu.be/tlkFS-fpgIs?si=GQqNuzoi_T5y_yL6

When do we get Taylor Swift to comment on the issue?

AI is already ontop of that.

Quote from: GRIM on February 05, 2024, 11:22:52 AM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on February 05, 2024, 10:53:47 AM

Quote from: GRIM on February 05, 2024, 09:40:56 AM

Quote from: RPGPundit on February 04, 2024, 08:12:34 PM
So tomorrow night at 8pm Eastern, on my Youtube, I'll be doing something I haven't been able to do for a long time. Maybe times really are a' changing, because for the first time in at least a decade a leftist wants to debate me, on the topic of this article. Assuming I figure out the tech parts, C. W. Chanter, who has been sharing some strong opinions on his Youtube livestreams about all this, is going to be on my channel and we'll be debating a variety of topics related to this article and certain accusations he's made at Grimjim. Should be interesting no matter how it goes.

Fair warning, he seems to be an actual lunatic.

So, a true leftist.

I would remind you that I'm probably the most left-wing person you've ever encountered. No, I mean conspiracy theories and bizarre UFOlogy nonsense crazy.

Wrong, I know personally a few socialists and communists and one honest to God neo-nazi.

Quote from: BadApple on February 05, 2024, 11:21:55 AM

Quote from: Brad on February 05, 2024, 10:20:53 AM

Quote from: KingOfUmbar on February 05, 2024, 08:42:18 AM
Zak deleted his blog post. Unsure why exactly he did that.

Why do you think...

I'm not saying it was because of me but...

I took one look at his postings and was slapped in the face with the fact that he literally committed a crime and confessed to it with his post.  His victim was nice enough to call it a loss and let it go.  I called him out on it in this thread.  (His post is #105 and mine is #110, both on page 8 )  This was after I mentioned that he would be smart to shut the fuck up and ride the wave.  (Reply #53)

Several people called him out for being a shithead that both violated a contract and attempted to cancel someone.  He brought all this attention to himself by posting his own "evidence." 

(I'm an anonymous user on a message board so I don't think I individually am responsible for Zak realizing he fucked up and pulling the posts.)

It would be a shame if someone had archived and screengrabed the evidence in order to not allow the Cancel Pig to hide his sins.

Quote from: THE_Leopold on February 05, 2024, 11:50:09 AM

Quote from: Ratman_tf on February 05, 2024, 11:25:27 AM

Quote from: Coffeecup on February 05, 2024, 04:00:34 AM
Raggi made an intelligent comment about this whole affair:
https://youtu.be/tlkFS-fpgIs?si=GQqNuzoi_T5y_yL6

When do we get Taylor Swift to comment on the issue?

AI is already ontop of that.

Lots of things are on top of AI Taylor Swift.

Quote from: Coffeecup on February 05, 2024, 04:00:34 AM
Raggi made an intelligent comment about this whole affair:
https://youtu.be/tlkFS-fpgIs?si=GQqNuzoi_T5y_yL6

Well, I appreciate the positive, "forgive and forget" attitude by the end of the video, but I disagree.

I'm not giving money directly to people I despise or that despise me, for any reason.

For example, I support people regardless of their stance on immigration, but if they go out of their way to proclaim all immigrants or all latinos are criminals they can never have my support.

And I don't like supporting people that I suspect to have committed serious crimes, participated in hate mobs, etc.

(I might still read MAR Baker because he is dead anyway).

Of course, if they REPENT, CHANGE THEIR WAYS and ASK for forgiveness, I might change my mind in many cases.

I believe in forgiveness, really do; "And forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive them that trespass  against us." This is extremely important.

But I don't think it means just ignoring all wrongdoings for people that are unrepentant.

[edited].

Quote from: Eric Diaz on February 05, 2024, 12:05:01 PM

Quote from: Coffeecup on February 05, 2024, 04:00:34 AM
Raggi made an intelligent comment about this whole affair:
https://youtu.be/tlkFS-fpgIs?si=GQqNuzoi_T5y_yL6

Well, I appreciate the positive, "forgive and forget" attitude by the end of the video, but I disagree.

I'm not giving money to people I despise or that despise me, for any reason.

For example, I support people regardless of their stance on immigration, but if they go out of their way to proclaim all immigrants or all latinos are criminals they can never have my support.

And I don't like supporting people that I suspected to have committed serious crimes or participated in hate mobs.

Of course, if they REPENT, CHANGE THEIR WAYS and ask for FORGIVENESS, I might change my mind in many cases.

Likewise if you are conservative, liberal, gay, straight, etc.

(I might still read MAR Baker because he is dead anyway).

He is saying that if we ignore them they'll go away, someone needs to show him how that worked for the last couple of decades.

Edited my comment because it was a bit confusing.

"And forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive them that trespass against us."

Forgiving is good, simply pretending it didn't happen is disingenuous - especially as it continues to happen.

That said, I don't organize boycotts or call for them, I just "boycott" people on my own. In most cases, however, this isn't even "boycott" because I'm not interested in their products anyway.

[Another reason to consider if these things are effective at all. They could be in some cases. For Raggi, for example, I might disagree with one thing or two but not enough to stop liking LotFP. And none of the accusations these people made against him ever made me want to stop buying, playing, reviewing, etc. If he was seriously accused of burning churches or stabbing people, I simply wouldn't be interested in LotFP stuff anymore].

Quote from: Eric Diaz on February 05, 2024, 12:05:01 PM

Quote from: Coffeecup on February 05, 2024, 04:00:34 AM
Raggi made an intelligent comment about this whole affair:
https://youtu.be/tlkFS-fpgIs?si=GQqNuzoi_T5y_yL6

Well, I appreciate the positive, "forgive and forget" attitude by the end of the video, but I disagree.

I'm not giving money directly to people I despise or that despise me, for any reason.

For example, I support people regardless of their stance on immigration, but if they go out of their way to proclaim all immigrants or all latinos are criminals they can never have my support.

And I don't like supporting people that I suspect to have committed serious crimes, participated in hate mobs, etc.

(I might still read MAR Baker because he is dead anyway).

Of course, if they REPENT, CHANGE THEIR WAYS and ASK for forgiveness, I might change my mind in many cases.

I believe in forgiveness, really do; "And forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive them that trespass  against us." This is extremely important.

But I don't think it means just ignoring all wrongdoings for people that are unrepentant.

[edited].

I separate art and artist. So it could be the biggest douchebag ever but if the product is good I will still buy it.
Otherwise I couldn't watch movies with Tom Cruise or movies made by Weinstein.

Quote from: Coffeecup on February 05, 2024, 02:37:52 PM

Quote from: Eric Diaz on February 05, 2024, 12:05:01 PM

Quote from: Coffeecup on February 05, 2024, 04:00:34 AM
Raggi made an intelligent comment about this whole affair:
https://youtu.be/tlkFS-fpgIs?si=GQqNuzoi_T5y_yL6

Well, I appreciate the positive, "forgive and forget" attitude by the end of the video, but I disagree.

I'm not giving money directly to people I despise or that despise me, for any reason.

For example, I support people regardless of their stance on immigration, but if they go out of their way to proclaim all immigrants or all latinos are criminals they can never have my support.

And I don't like supporting people that I suspect to have committed serious crimes, participated in hate mobs, etc.

(I might still read MAR Baker because he is dead anyway).

Of course, if they REPENT, CHANGE THEIR WAYS and ASK for forgiveness, I might change my mind in many cases.

I believe in forgiveness, really do; "And forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive them that trespass  against us." This is extremely important.

But I don't think it means just ignoring all wrongdoings for people that are unrepentant.

[edited].

I separate art and artist. So it could be the biggest douchebag ever but if the product is good I will still buy it.
Otherwise I couldn't watch movies with Tom Cruise or movies made by Weinstein.

Fair point.

While I usually don't watch movies that preach hatred upon me, I never checked the credits for Weinstein.

Maybe the difference is that RPGs are usually from a single author; I'm not sure I'd buy and RPG if "by Varg Vikernes" is on the cover.

Or maybe is because RPGs are so niche that I think I can make a very small difference (unlike Tom Cruise movies).

Not sure, but this is what I do.

Quote from: Coffeecup on February 05, 2024, 02:37:52 PM

Quote from: Eric Diaz on February 05, 2024, 12:05:01 PM

Quote from: Coffeecup on February 05, 2024, 04:00:34 AM
Raggi made an intelligent comment about this whole affair:
https://youtu.be/tlkFS-fpgIs?si=GQqNuzoi_T5y_yL6

Well, I appreciate the positive, "forgive and forget" attitude by the end of the video, but I disagree.

I'm not giving money directly to people I despise or that despise me, for any reason.

For example, I support people regardless of their stance on immigration, but if they go out of their way to proclaim all immigrants or all latinos are criminals they can never have my support.

And I don't like supporting people that I suspect to have committed serious crimes, participated in hate mobs, etc.

(I might still read MAR Baker because he is dead anyway).

Of course, if they REPENT, CHANGE THEIR WAYS and ASK for forgiveness, I might change my mind in many cases.

I believe in forgiveness, really do; "And forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive them that trespass  against us." This is extremely important.

But I don't think it means just ignoring all wrongdoings for people that are unrepentant.

[edited].

I separate art and artist. So it could be the biggest douchebag ever but if the product is good I will still buy it.
Otherwise I couldn't watch movies with Tom Cruise or movies made by Weinstein.

On the whole, I have no issue with someone having a different opinion from me so I have no problem doing business with those I disagree with.  However, that's no what's at stake here.

Olivia Hill and gang tried to destroy people and companies unless they paid proper tribute to her court judging everyone else on moral ground that she didn't hold herself to.  Go back and read the article in the OP and realize that is what they were doing to many people in the TTRPG industry and with that level of honesty.  It wasn't ma matter of having a different view and clashing, it was a targeted campaign of social and economic terrorism to bring the TTRPG industry to heel and rid it of undesirables. 

If a game is being made by a person that has the intent to use that money to further goals that are against me or my best interests then I'm not buying, and I would recommend  that you consider this position as well.

@BadApple
Cruise is a high-ranking member of Scientology. His earning and fame support a vile organisation preying on the weak and desperate, destroying lifes and families.

Weinstein used his money and influence to rape and abuse women. The more success he had the more influence he got and the easier it became for him to commit his crimes.

So if Olivia Hill, Zak S... had a good product I would buy it.

Quote from: Coffeecup on February 05, 2024, 04:00:34 AM
Raggi made an intelligent comment about this whole affair:
https://youtu.be/tlkFS-fpgIs?si=GQqNuzoi_T5y_yL6

Now THAT is the op-ed I needed.

Do I agree with Raggi's conclusions? No. I think the broader problem is that the internet is effectively a mess of fiefdoms where the authorities on any one platform is too busy protecting their own political power to serve the whole of the community. The way you respond to this is to create moral authority, mostly in the form of structured victim advocacy.

Now, I understand creating moral authority with...this bunch is a hella hard thing to do, but hard and impossible are not the same thing.

Quote from: GRIM on February 05, 2024, 11:22:52 AM
I would remind you that I'm probably the most left-wing person you've ever encountered.

And a mad bastard. But we kinda like you.  ;D

Quote from: Coffeecup on February 05, 2024, 03:18:24 PM
@BadApple
Cruise is a high-ranking member of Scientology. His earning and fame support a vile organisation preying on the weak and desperate, destroying lifes and families.

Weinstein used his money and influence to rape and abuse women. The more success he had the more influence he got and the easier it became for him to commit his crimes.

So if Olivia Hill, Zak S... had a good product I would buy it.

I haven't watched a Tom Cruise movie since I learned of his involvement with Scientology for precisely those reasons.  As far as Harvey Weinstein, I had no idea who he was until the news broke and he hasn't made a movie since.

I'm not calling for a general boycott, I'm just saying shop as an informed consumer. 

Funny thing about the Weinstein thing.  I can find evidence that his older victims were setting up his younger victims.  Either they are all a bunch of snakes or it's less a victim thing and more of them knowingly paying a sex tax.  I suspect there's a lot less difference between these actresses and OF girls aging out of the game than they let on.  All in all, Hollywood disgusts me and I'm sad that so many things I loved are tied to these people.  I pretty much stopped watching movies and TV altogether. 

Quote from: BadApple on February 05, 2024, 05:08:10 PM
As far as Harvey Weinstein, I had no idea who he was until the news broke and he hasn't made a movie since.

Funny thing about the Weinstein thing.  I can find evidence that his older victims were setting up his younger victims.  Either they are all a bunch of snakes or it's less a victim thing and more of them knowingly paying a sex tax.  I suspect there's a lot less difference between these actresses and OF girls aging out of the game than they let on.  All in all, Hollywood disgusts me and I'm sad that so many things I loved are tied to these people.  I pretty much stopped watching movies and TV altogether.

Weinstein is in prison. A handful of movies (like Kevin Smith's Dogma) are stuck in purgatory because he is in prison and owns the distribution rights. I think it is fair to assume nearly every pretty girl that was in a Miramax film went along with the casting couch and then allowed others to be abused by keeping their silence.

Quote from: KingOfUmbar on February 05, 2024, 08:42:18 AM
Zak deleted his blog post. Unsure why exactly he did that.

Zak? Deleting evidence? Inconceivable!

Should be easy enough to find discussions about it on #Reddit though, as it was posted to... 410 different communities.

Quote from: RPGPundit on February 04, 2024, 08:12:34 PM
C. W. Chanter,

...

Who?

Quote from: VengerSatanis on February 04, 2024, 04:35:25 PM
I will confirm the most important part of this (or any other) story... yeah, it was me.  I originated #TwatGate  You're welcome.

Bad actors bragging about harassing and defaming other creators.

Zak bragging about breaching his contracts.

And now you bragging about this.

The embarrassing confessions never end.

Roman Polanski is a POS tht should be rotting in a jail cell, but The 9th Gate is an incredible movie, and practically a perfect CoC adventure brought to the big screen.

Quote from: Grognard GM on February 05, 2024, 11:38:18 PM
Roman Polanski is a POS tht should be rotting in a jail cell, but The 9th Gate is an incredible movie, and practically a perfect CoC adventure brought to the big screen.

Sounds about right to me.

Is Evil Genius games caught up in this kerfuffle?   Did they not respond to the wardrums of the mob quick enough or are they instead guilty of wrongthink?  I just saw multiple people, some with various unnatural hair colors, posting and reposting other public resignations from the company over "ethical" reasons supposedly.   

edit:  Nevermind.  Looks like it's more likely to be a garden variety AI/blockchain use protest quitting.  I didn't realize the industry was in such a solid shape that employees (whether freelance or permanent) could afford to quit a paying gig but so be it.   False alarm regardless.

Quote from: RNGm on February 07, 2024, 11:40:58 AM
edit:  Nevermind.  Looks like it's more likely to be a garden variety AI/blockchain use protest quitting.  I didn't realize the industry was in such a solid shape that employees (whether freelance or permanent) could afford to quit a paying gig but so be it.   False alarm regardless.

Well, the industry is always in the shitter, but a steady paycheck doesn't do you much good when Florida has been turned into a series of islands, either. Crypto mining has essentially erased all the energy efficiency gains of the last two decades in two years, and I have yet to see evidence that blockchain is is anything other than an invitation to set your wallet and the deed to your house on your front porch in a REALLY GOOD COMBINATION SAFE.

For legal reasons, we're unlikely to ever get full details of the reasons for why everyone is not working there. However, I've seen some people researching articles to talk about what we do know.

Quote from: pawsplay on February 09, 2024, 06:03:23 PM

Quote from: RNGm on February 07, 2024, 11:40:58 AM
edit:  Nevermind.  Looks like it's more likely to be a garden variety AI/blockchain use protest quitting.  I didn't realize the industry was in such a solid shape that employees (whether freelance or permanent) could afford to quit a paying gig but so be it.   False alarm regardless.

Well, the industry is always in the shitter, but a steady paycheck doesn't do you much good when Florida has been turned into a series of islands, either. Crypto mining has essentially erased all the energy efficiency gains of the last two decades in two years, and I have yet to see evidence that blockchain is is anything other than an invitation to set your wallet and the deed to your house on your front porch in a REALLY GOOD COMBINATION SAFE.

For legal reasons, we're unlikely to ever get full details of the reasons for why everyone is not working there. However, I've seen some people researching articles to talk about what we do know.

"Muh Climate Change!"

1: Go tell it to China & India
2: Stick to gamming topics you trolling cunt
3: Go suck a "feminine" penis you deranged lunatic.

Quote from: pawsplay on February 09, 2024, 06:03:23 PM

Quote from: RNGm on February 07, 2024, 11:40:58 AM
edit:  Nevermind.  Looks like it's more likely to be a garden variety AI/blockchain use protest quitting.  I didn't realize the industry was in such a solid shape that employees (whether freelance or permanent) could afford to quit a paying gig but so be it.   False alarm regardless.

Well, the industry is always in the shitter, but a steady paycheck doesn't do you much good when Florida has been turned into a series of islands, either. Crypto mining has essentially erased all the energy efficiency gains of the last two decades in two years, and I have yet to see evidence that blockchain is is anything other than an invitation to set your wallet and the deed to your house on your front porch in a REALLY GOOD COMBINATION SAFE.

For legal reasons, we're unlikely to ever get full details of the reasons for why everyone is not working there. However, I've seen some people researching articles to talk about what we do know.

Thanks for the update and maybe someone will "leak" some info since they're likely under NDA regardless.   As for Florida, it's just returning to it's natural state after we artificially drained half of it for amusement parks.  :)

No off topic posts in this thread please. Off-topic posters will face punishment.