The default setting for 5E, or are Greyhawk and FR dead?

thedungeondelver · January 11, 2012, 10:13:12 AM

Quote from: Benoist;503392Absolutely, hence my understanding your feeling on the question. But the original Grey Box is more of a blank slate. It's a good setting, really. It's afterwards with the modules and add-ons that it became completely stupid. And don't get me started on the Times of Troubles, Spellplague and reboots.

OK; I mean, I never had the Grey Box so I'm out of the loop on exactly when the FR turned to crap.

I will say I enjoyed the first Baldur's Gate game, though!

beeber · January 11, 2012, 10:46:27 AM

Quote from: jibbajibba;503409my take as noted before woudl be a default setting of FR that was the basic vanilla setting.
Tie the rule expansions to other setting so Grey hawk might be an advanced magic setting for example.

I woudl go on to leveage the suces sof the MTG block rotation model to have a new settign each year that had mechanical changes (but was compatible with the whole) so new races or classes for example woudl be tied to new settings.
The living FR equivalent woudl carry on down teh basic content only path with new living settigns on a rolling annual model with new rules tied to that setting.

Standard play groups coudl just grab stuff from anywhere and mix and max as you like.

I might well leverage the art and work done for Mtg blocks which also have their own settings as a context for an inspiration of the annual D&D setting. So looking at MtG specifically you just finished a Mirrodin block where the settign was theMirrodin and the game play was about an invasion of the pheryxians. So you have cat warriors, elephant men, living machines, fallen elves the idea of a massive forest called the tangle full of poisonous beasts etc.
You can tie that to a D&D setting that uses a bunch of new mechanisms etc. and delivers the 'treadmill' of stuff. But this time you can totlaly miss out a whole setting or just ignore the lot.
Back in the DDI skills, feats, classes, spells, monsters etc are tied to a setting so if a DM says I am playign a Mirrodin game everyone knows what is in and what is out.

The fact that these settings are already designed for MtG means that a lot of the up front design work is done for you and you have a feel and a some economies of scale and cross referencing of the player base.

For those that don't want to use the settings you can issue occassional summary books gathering rules across settings by theme but also they are already in the DDI. Also of course you can play in the generic FR setting with just he base game.

i never understood why WotC didn't do just that--all they'd have to do is stat that stuff up and bingo, instant supplement treadmill as you've said. have your company's divisions work together for the greater profit, etc.

Tahmoh · January 11, 2012, 11:06:24 AM

I dont mind FR being the default setting myself as it just means i get to find new and imaginative ways to kill drizzt and elminster all over again

I would have gone with mystara or eberron myself though as niether has a ton of baggage connected to them and mystara could use a new edition or heck just the old stuff reprinted again.

RPGPundit · January 11, 2012, 07:40:33 PM

FR is the default setting for D&D, whether anyone likes it or not. Its not my personal favorite D&D setting (that'd be Mystara) but its by far the best known.

The real question is indeed, can they REALLY set it up so "you can play any era" or is it more practically going to be "we'll be supporting a particular era, and you can theoretically play in any other but you'll get no real help from us"?

RPGPundit

Benoist · January 11, 2012, 07:50:44 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit;503777The real question is indeed, can they REALLY set it up so "you can play any era" or is it more practically going to be "we'll be supporting a particular era, and you can theoretically play in any other but you'll get no real help from us"?

Correct.

Let's say they create a campaign setting or box with multiple maps. Big sections for each big era of the realms, and Grey Box like gazetteers within each section. At the end, the entirety of the content of the sourcebook "the Grand History of the Realms". That might be something to behold right there.

Benoist · January 11, 2012, 07:52:41 PM

Quote from: thedungeondelver;503421OK; I mean, I never had the Grey Box so I'm out of the loop on exactly when the FR turned to crap.

I will say I enjoyed the first Baldur's Gate game, though!

I loved the Baldur's Gate games. They've been inspirations for my games from time to time, actually. This is great stuff.

I wish I could show you the Grey Box. It's really a nice boxed set without strings attached. You can do a lot with it without feeling Ed Greenwood rubbing Elminster's dick in your face.

Aos · January 11, 2012, 07:59:43 PM

Quote from: Benoist;503785I wish I could show you the Grey Box. It's really a nice boxed set without strings attached. You can do a lot with it without feeling Ed Greenwood rubbing Elminster's dick in your face.

That's only because the pages are coated with Rohypnol. The truth will come to you later, in your dreams.

Pseudoephedrine · January 11, 2012, 08:10:23 PM

All four eras means four times the supplements to sell, most of which can just be recycled flavour text with new stats.

crkrueger · January 11, 2012, 09:27:21 PM

Quote from: thedungeondelver;503382FR was a big step towards Story Railroad (a trip that Dragonlance began at the same time), and the host of Mary Sue characters Greenwood put in it left me absolutely flat. I mean, weren't there modules where Elminster would literally just show up and save the characters' asses? And it was recommended?

No man, 1st Edition Forgotten Realms was gold. FR1-6 supplements were good (a couple of the second edition ones were good two, like the Mulhorand and Dwarf one). Of course Time of Troubles, no Demons and Devils and all the other 2E bullshit was crap, but the original stuff was awesome.

ggroy · January 11, 2012, 09:34:15 PM

Quote from: CRKrueger;503832No man, 1st Edition Forgotten Realms was gold. FR1-6 supplements were good (a couple of the second edition ones were good two, like the Mulhorand and Dwarf one). Of course Time of Troubles, no Demons and Devils and all the other 2E bullshit was crap, but the original stuff was awesome.

Ever use the 1E Waterdeep box set?

thedungeondelver · January 11, 2012, 10:35:45 PM

Quote from: Aos;503789That's only because the pages are coated with Rohypnol. The truth will come to you later, in your dreams.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbxsmcT7GOk

I was kind of torn as to whether to go with this one or the version by Coil. I think the original suits nicely.

thedungeondelver · January 11, 2012, 10:37:23 PM

All kidding aside, I'll take y'alls word on the FR matter. I don't know what's in the early FR material because I can't know. I open the grey boxed set...then...its like missing time.

(oh god aos was right)

danbuter · January 11, 2012, 10:59:37 PM

I love the idea of Forgotten Realms as the main setting. Honestly, it should be the ONLY setting. Publishing multiple settings does not work, as seen by TSR. Different eras is a really cool idea. If they are smart, the first book will be around the time right after 3e, before the spellplague. That would bring back a lot of people.

RPGPundit · January 12, 2012, 01:53:21 PM

Quote from: danbuter;503890I love the idea of Forgotten Realms as the main setting. Honestly, it should be the ONLY setting. Publishing multiple settings does not work, as seen by TSR.

I think that's an "old economy" way of thinking. Also, the very nature of how many different versions and editions and settings are being bought regularly prove that this is not strictly true. The only way its true is when someone says "hmm, I could either buy greyhawk or FR, I'll pick one". But if they were never ever going to buy your setting A in the first place, selling them Setting B is NOT competing with yourself, it is getting a new customer you'd never have had otherwise.

RPGPundit

Ancientgamer1970 · January 12, 2012, 02:11:32 PM

Quote from: Benoist;503785I loved the Baldur's Gate games. They've been inspirations for my games from time to time, actually. This is great stuff.

I wish I could show you the Grey Box. It's really a nice boxed set without strings attached. You can do a lot with it without feeling Ed Greenwood rubbing Elminster's dick in your face.

The Greybox is awesome material.

Greyhawk was total horsecrap.