The Luke Crane video I found had me thinking: Gee, haven´t heard from those folks in QUITE some time!
Is there anything happening in the "Indie Press Revolution"?
Has it penned out?
Any new developments?
If not: Good Riddance!
Quote from: SettembriniThe Luke Crane video I found had me thinking: Gee, haven´t heard from those folks in QUITE some time!
Is there anything happening in the "Indie Press Revolution"?
Has it penned out?
Any new developments?
If not: Good Riddance!
It seems to be doing just fine, Sett. Look at tBP and see. The Forge didn't die, it sent out spores and radiated.
-clash
Mmmm. On the front page, I only see a mountain witch thread.That´s on old game, no?
No new stuff it seems.
Sett,
You do not appear to be seeing the same Forge I am. I had a look at their front page and there's a bunch of active threads, with plenty about new games. (Someone there is even working up a D20 variant.) Their level of activity appears to be more dilute than theRPGsite's, but that's always been the case - their forums are so insanely diffuse that it's difficult to see which have had recent activity and which haven't.
Well, but there are no new "Revolutionary" GAMES coming out of that festering pit, no?
There's plenty of "activity" but it looks like the particular combination of smug overblown mediocrity that characterized the early-mid 2000s is now kept to it's own special circles.
And fewer people are generating moronic charts in MS Paint as well...
And no, nothing new. Lot's of rehashes.
The Indie Press Revolution website (http://www.indiepressrevolution.com/xcart/home.php) appears to have had an excellent 2007 and seems to have expanded their product line significantly. I think they are growing into a viable online store that may have some legs.
They are in a very vulnerable position; like a cult leader who predicted the coming of the space aliens one too many times without success, people are starting to see that none of the Forge's games have ended up being able to make a significant mark on the gaming world. This is a good time to present viable non-forge "indie" games that prove that even in the small press they aren't a viable medium.
On the other hand, as has been pointed out, many of the Forgers are now changing their tactics. They realize their crap games aren't going to take over the world, so they're trying harder than ever to subvert mainstream games from within.
RPGPundit
Quote from: RPGPunditThey are in a very vulnerable position; like a cult leader who predicted the coming of the space aliens one too many times without success, people are starting to see that none of the Forge's games have ended up being able to make a significant mark on the gaming world.
Oh I'd say Poison'd made a mark in the RPG scene - sort of like a bloody skid-mark on a pair of underwear.
Hmm, I wonder if it's a coincidence that Poison'd was the last big splash by the Forgites. Maybe even RPG hipsters have their limits of bad taste and creepy pretention, and privately and quietly turned their backs on the movement.
Quote from: HaffrungOh I'd say Poison'd made a mark in the RPG scene - sort of like a bloody skid-mark on a pair of underwear.
Hmm, I wonder if it's a coincidence that Poison'd was the last big splash by the Forgites. Maybe even RPG hipsters have their limits of bad taste and creepy pretention, and privately and quietly turned their backs on the movement.
Yes, the discussions of the Poison'd game certainly did seem to cause a quiet down of the average Forge supporter. Only a few apologists bothered to defend it (and people of the "so bad it's good" school of taste who swarmed to it like a Battlefield Earth movie night).
I think the Forge has been moribund for some years now, the ideas it gave birth to seem to be doing pretty well though.
I would Knife Fight a Man, Story-Games, Indie Press Revolution, Contested Ground, tons of stuff on the blogosphere, those matter, the Forge just isn't where those ideas are being pushed forward today. I think the autocratic and deeply insular nature of the board helped start that movement, but is not suitable for pushing it further forward. Ron Edwards I no longer see as remotely central to that movement, his best work is long behind him.
Also, there are many more story games about now, so it's not like the old days where a small number of enthusiasts would get excited about every new release, frequently now a new game will only get seen by a handful of them as they just can't keep up with the level of releases.
Overall though, to me the indie hobby looks in pretty good shape. Also, like minority parties in non-PR systems, their main influence is not in being adopted themselves but in influencing their larger brethren. Just as a far right or green party (where green's are minority parties) can cause a mainstream party to adopt anti-immigration or green policies to prevent vote erosion, so mainstream games adopt indie game elements (though not so much to prevent market erosion as that really isn't a factor as for reasons of fashion and designer enthusiam).
I've been distanced from the whole forge thing (never been a member), but it seems to me like somewhere along the way, the movement shifted their mantra from "everyone's right in their own way, but narritivism is more right than that hack-and-slash crap and if you aren't with us, you're against us" (AKA, the "heartbreaker" clause) to "Don't trust the GM".
Quote from: Caesar SlaadI've been distanced from the whole forge thing (never been a member), but it seems to me like somewhere along the way, the movement shifted their mantra from "everyone's right in their own way, but narritivism is more right than that hack-and-slash crap and if you aren't with us, you're against us" (AKA, the "heartbreaker" clause) to "Don't trust the GM".
Well, the former was Ron Edward's outlook, while the latter was Luke Crane's big bee in his bonnet (if I remember the discussions he participated in here right).
Sorcerer was the hot indie game in its time, but it's been utterly eclipsed by Burning Wheel (and I would say rightly so - BW is a neat, adaptable little system and it doesn't take too much work to rip out lifepaths, artha, beliefs/instincts/traits and scripted combat if you don't like 'em). Perhaps people have decided to go with what works?
Quote from: BalbinusOverall though, to me the indie hobby looks in pretty good shape. Also, like minority parties in non-PR systems, their main influence is not in being adopted themselves but in influencing their larger brethren. Just as a far right or green party (where green's are minority parties) can cause a mainstream party to adopt anti-immigration or green policies to prevent vote erosion, so mainstream games adopt indie game elements (though not so much to prevent market erosion as that really isn't a factor as for reasons of fashion and designer enthusiam).
What would those be? I see you guys talking about 'indie sensiblitys' and have no clue what you're talking about. Care to fill me in?
Thanks in advance.
Quote from: NazgulWhat would those be? I see you guys talking about 'indie sensiblitys' and have no clue what you're talking about. Care to fill me in?
Thanks in advance.
Well, D20 Conan includes a kind of fate point mechanic that you can use for editing scenes among other things, that was directly influenced by Sorceror (as in the designer personally told me so).
The new Dr Who game promises to take on board elements of storygaming too.
That said, it's a fair query as it has happened, but it ain't happened as much as the story game crowd tend to think.
I appreciate these kinds of threads that Sett & Co start. They either bring to my attention games that I sometimes miss or keep the spotlight on an aspect of the hobby I find interesting.
Regards,
David R