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Starfinder release day. Whatcha think?

Started by Ratman_tf, August 18, 2017, 02:12:52 AM

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Tetsubo

#180
September 17, 2017, 11:53:09 AM
Quote from: TrippyHippy;993143Yes. However the WoD IP that they created still does exist, and has enough public interest that a new crew has invested in buying White Wolf anew. We will know how popular that IP remains with the release of Vampire 5th edition. The comparative question is, were Paizo to fold, how much interest would there be in keeping Pathfinder alive?

Seeing how many third party Pathfinder products exist, I imagine it would last for decades. Thanks to the 3.5 SRD we have how many OSR clones? If the PSRD remains in place, people will use it for a very long time.

Justin Alexander

#181
September 18, 2017, 12:35:30 AM Last Edit: June 23, 2018, 02:04:13 AM by Justin Alexander
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RPGPundit

#182
September 20, 2017, 03:40:23 AM
Quote from: Tetsubo;993190Seeing how many third party Pathfinder products exist, I imagine it would last for decades. Thanks to the 3.5 SRD we have how many OSR clones? If the PSRD remains in place, people will use it for a very long time.

How many 3.x D20 third party products are still being published?
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Tetsubo

#183
September 20, 2017, 08:08:12 AM
Quote from: RPGPundit;994190How many 3.x D20 third party products are still being published?

How many third party OSR products are being created thanks to the SRD *right now*? The entirety of your beloved OSR wouldn't exist were it not for the SRD. A *whole* lot of people really love the D20/PF system. We are legion. Pathfinder isn't going anywhere soon. No matter how much you may wish it otherwise.

TrippyHippy

#184
September 20, 2017, 09:40:50 AM
Quote from: Tetsubo;994219How many third party OSR products are being created thanks to the SRD *right now*? The entirety of your beloved OSR wouldn't exist were it not for the SRD. A *whole* lot of people really love the D20/PF system. We are legion. Pathfinder isn't going anywhere soon. No matter how much you may wish it otherwise.
Sounds like you're the one trying to convince us, not the other way round.
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Ulairi

#185
September 20, 2017, 09:42:15 AM
Quote from: Biscuitician;992547Do you hear yourself?

"ultimate destiny"?

Vampire wasn't succesful because people couldn't find a preferrable version of DnD to play instead. It was successfull because it appealed to a mood or a zeitgeist. You might not like the game, that's fine, but don't bullshit us.

WW aren't irrelevant. They have a product, you don't like it. That's not irrelevance.

White Wolf in the 90's were selling hundreds of thousands of copies of each book they released. They aren't doing that anymore. White Wolf is much more on the level of where Palladium is today. They have a market but are no longer a dominate market force.

Ulairi

#186
September 20, 2017, 09:44:06 AM
Quote from: Tetsubo;994219How many third party OSR products are being created thanks to the SRD *right now*? The entirety of your beloved OSR wouldn't exist were it not for the SRD. A *whole* lot of people really love the D20/PF system. We are legion. Pathfinder isn't going anywhere soon. No matter how much you may wish it otherwise.

Are you guys though? Just looking at the Pathfinder organized play movement there has been a significant decrease. How much of Pathfinder's success is due to folks like you, that love 3E, or to the fact that 4E was a failure and people ran away from it?

I do think that Pathfinder compatible product will be released for years to come because there is a sizeable group of folks and for smaller publishers they can sell fewer copies (especially with pdfs) and be okay. I don't think Paizo as a company is ever going to get back to their position they held prior to 5E.

TrippyHippy

#187
September 20, 2017, 09:56:28 AM
Quote from: Ulairi;994230White Wolf in the 90's were selling hundreds of thousands of copies of each book they released. They aren't doing that anymore. White Wolf is much more on the level of where Palladium is today. They have a market but are no longer a dominate market force.
White Wolf haven't technically released a book for near enough a decade. The Onyx Path released stuff since then, but due to the changing hands of ownership, White Wolf have effectively been on a hiatus and haven't been in the market at all. As such, you can't make any comparison in recent years to any other company - we will know a lot more about their true status in the gaming market next year when they release a new edition of Vampire.
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Willie the Duck

#188
September 20, 2017, 10:29:30 AM
I think there will be a market for what I will call the 3e D&D experience for quite some time to come. In particular the system mastery/'I-get-to-spend-my-downtime-between-gaming-sessions-pouring-over-options-for-my-next-character bit. If PF disappears, than either 3pp will continue the trend, or a new system will pop up (or something like Radiance will receive a resurgence).

Still, 5e does this stuff "well enough" that I imagine the 3e experience market will continue to decline unless Piazzo can keep reestablishing it with stuff like Starfinder.

Charon's Little Helper

#189
September 20, 2017, 10:51:54 AM
Quote from: TrippyHippy;994235The Onyx Path released stuff since then, but due to the changing hands of ownership

Plus - haven't all of their releases been POD rather than traditional publishing?  Their prices are high and I don't know if they're even in any FLGSs.

TrippyHippy

#190
September 20, 2017, 03:54:04 PM
Quote from: Charon's Little Helper;994243Plus - haven't all of their releases been POD rather than traditional publishing?  Their prices are high and I don't know if they're even in any FLGSs.
Yep. They've raised lots of money through Kick-starters, and are top sellers on a lot of items in PDF/POD, but they effectively are removed from any mainstream retail sales for the last decade (or just under). There is obviously a market out there for their game IPs, but until White Wolf puts themselves back into the market proper, we don't know how big that market is compared to D&D, Pathfinder, Star Wars et al.
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Tetsubo

#191
September 20, 2017, 03:59:33 PM
Quote from: TrippyHippy;994229Sounds like you're the one trying to convince us, not the other way round.

If stating reality is an attempt at 'convincing', than yep I am.

jcfiala

#192
September 20, 2017, 04:32:15 PM
Quote from: RPGPundit;994190How many 3.x D20 third party products are still being published?

Well, let's see.
1) There's Pathfinder and it's various spinoffs, of course.
2) There's Mutants and Masterminds.
3) As best as I can tell from googling, Dungeon Crawl Classics is based off of the SRD.

And then as someone else has pointed out, there's plenty of OSR games that spin off of the SRD to one degree or another, such as Lamentations of the Flame Princess, which seems to be doing very well for itself.
 

TrippyHippy

#193
September 20, 2017, 05:10:14 PM
Quote from: Tetsubo;994321If stating reality is an attempt at 'convincing', than yep I am.
Opinion and reality are not the same thing, and the more you try and convince people that your opinion is reality, the more anxious you come across.
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TrippyHippy

#194
September 20, 2017, 05:12:53 PM
Quote from: jcfiala;994337Well, let's see.
1) There's Pathfinder and it's various spinoffs, of course.
2) There's Mutants and Masterminds.
3) As best as I can tell from googling, Dungeon Crawl Classics is based off of the SRD.

And then as someone else has pointed out, there's plenty of OSR games that spin off of the SRD to one degree or another, such as Lamentations of the Flame Princess, which seems to be doing very well for itself.
M&M still operates within the OGL, but is largely it's own thing these days. The rule system has moved away from being the same as D20 I think.
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