The Chaosium situation has made me realise something: that game company that makes or made products you love, that you try to be patient with, but which seems ham-fisted, uncommunicative, or clueless. Maybe they just plain suck. Maybe they are run by people that you really wouldn't like if you knew them, who really don't care or actively sneer at their fan base.
I just realised that two of my "favorite" companies are basically like that. Great legacies. But the current management just plain sucks and are killing their own product lines.
That's all. Does that count as a rant?
Don't be coy. Who and why?
I prefer not to be specific, as it's hard to make specific allegations without evidence. I mean, how could you have made specific allegations that Charlie Krank had siphoned off money from the Chaosium Kickstarters? That's what seems to have happened. And regarding the companies I have in mind, I don't think they're profiting in such a way, but I feel stupid for thinking that their release schedule of one sub-standard book per year and total lack of communication means that they're beavering away on stuff behind the scenes. They're checked out, working a day job and watching TV, and in reality the future of the game lines belongs to the fans.
I've been bitchy about all things Mongoose for years now... some real crimes, some imagined... but I'm pretty sure I'm never buying anything from the ever again.
Oh... and Games Workshop of course... but that party boat is full up.
Eh, if they suck, they won't be in business anymore, that's how I look at it. I may not like them personally, but that's just a me thing.
Margaret Weiss puts out some stuff that's really to my taste, but they can't negotiate a license properly for the life of them. Their licenses are set up in such a way that once the license ends, they aren't allowed to even sell digital copies of the products they already wrote and had approved anymore. This has affected Smallville and Marvel Heroic, and is likely to affect Leverage, Firefly, and more down the road.
Counterexample: Eden Studios. Their Buffy and Angel licenses ended years ago, but they are still allowed to sell digital copies of the products that made it through approvals. We'll probably never get Military Monster Squad or Tea & Crossbows, but we'll never have to worry that the core books or The Magic Box(really expensive sometimes if you find it in print) will ever be unavailable to interested fans.
FASA/Red Brick -- I don't even know what's going on with this company. They had a great thing going, and then due to the terms of their agreement with Mongoose/Flaming Cobra they put out a hurried "new edition" that really wasn't different enough to even qualify as such(3e). It was basically Classic w/ a free PDF supplement worked into the main Discipline rules and a cleaned up Talent list. Nice but . . . not a new edition by any means. Then the lackluster Cathay books(not bad or anything; just mediocre) that were their first real attempt at all-new content. Then the aborted 3e Revised, Pathdinder-compatible, and Savage Worlds-compatible editions. And now a 4th Edition w/ just a stupid logo. Again, as seems to be the case for them, it's not bad . . . just generic-looking and uninspired. I just don't know . . .
Then there's the hardcore SJW brigade. I'm not sure if this applies to the companies they work for as a whole, but Cam Banks, Topher Gerkey, and Fred Hicks all annoy the crap out of me sometimes. I've followed(and unfollowed) all of them on G+ at some point. I even agree with them on some things, but when I do disagree, I know better than to say anything because I've seen how they've reacted to other people who have done so before. They often jump right to ascribing the worst possible motives to people who disagree with them, which is just uncharitable. It's like it doesn't even cross their mind that someone can be well-versed in philosophy, metaphysics, metaethics, theology, or other applicable fields and simply come to a different conclusion than one of them. Or that people who are truly caring and well-intentioned could possibly still disagree with them. I won't refuse to buy product from them if it's something I like, and I doubt I'd have any problem playing in a game with any of them, but getting that stuff(especially the way they talk to dissenters) in my online feeds . . . no.
This subject comes up a few times.
Steve Jackson Games: This one goes way back to around 2000 when they started acting the internet bully. Over the years its been sporatic. But they keep showing their true face enough to leave the impression that something is really not right over there. The last gag being telling someone that they are not allowed to resize some Ogre counters for personal private use. Really? Couple of former artists for SJG didnt have anything nice to say about them either.
Stronghold: This one is pretty recent, but made me go back and look at their past actions in a new light. Not a RPG company. But they are a game company and they seem to like to "doctor" their re-releases ratings over on BGG by over-writing the game they are reprinting, even when the games are different. Setting up a false impression. Then the whole Dark Moon debacle. ugh. Minor compared to others but still annoying.
Palladium: The epic tales of how things go down working with Palladium is legendary. I have a huge manuscript for a cancelled game that I was the art director for that the writer just said "Fuck this!" quit gaming totally and handed me the whole damn thing.
Hasbro and White Wolf was the big surprise. Id have never thought that a big company like that would stoop so low as to rip off designers.
And a couple of others for things not mentionable in public for various reasons. NDAs help to hide some of the dirty deeds.
And dont get me started on designers and artists! Argh!
What designers did Hasbro rip off?
Quote from: RPGPundit;836357What designers did Hasbro rip off?
Two freelancers were the ones I met who mentioned that working with Hasbro ended with them getting ripped off. Which isnt surprising as for a time, possibly even now, Hasbro had a submission setup where you had to pay THEM just to look at your game, EACH TIME. They reject it and tell you to tweak this or that? Kiss another 200$ goodby. One stated that they took his design and didnt pay him. Neither went into detail for obvious reasons.
FFG is another with a not exactly stellar rep. The whole Wings of War to X-Wing mess. Aside from that and some sort of issue with Warhammer FRPG, I dont think there has been any bad behavior from FFG. They tend to be fairly laid back and used to post regularly to BGG about projects and answer questions.
Couple of publishers have ripped off artists. SJG, Atlas and GOO I know artists personally who stated that they never got payed or never got their full payment till they leaned on the publisher.
Then there is the ongoing train wreck of Game Salute who has run at least one RPG. The reboot of venerable Villains & Vigilantes. Its gone into same dead space holding pattern as most other Game Salute games do. Ready to print-working on it-ready to print-working on it-you get the idea. Only a year of this now. Oh. And The designer and GS both voted up their own game over on RPGG. Really? Yeah really.
Green Ronin used to have a rep for poor customer service at cons. But was otherwise fine by all accounts.
Privateer Press had notoriously horrible warehouse customer service. Of which I experienced personally. But if you could bypass that and actually get someone higher ups attention then they were really great about fixing problems. But their warehouse CS was anything but.
Outlaw Press: How do you categorize this one?
Quote from: Christopher Brady;836181Eh, if they suck, they won't be in business anymore, that's how I look at it.
Unfortunately, that's not how it works. A game company can be perpetually late with releases, over-promise, under-deliver, copy-and-paste huge chunks of old games and pretend it's "new", run a shitty kickstarter, and even suffer a Crisis of Treachery, yet remain in business for decades.
Quote from: Ddogwood;836393Unfortunately, that's not how it works. A game company can be perpetually late with releases, over-promise, under-deliver, copy-and-paste huge chunks of old games and pretend it's "new", run a shitty kickstarter, and even suffer a Crisis of Treachery, yet remain in business for decades.
Yeah, pretty much this. Much as I love Kevin Siembieda's creations and admire his
chutzpah, his lack of professionalism is inexcusable.
The truth of the matter is: Palladium can't edit a book worth shit and recycles its own content like it's going out of style. Nothing ever gets playtested, the power creep is a joke and several books can't even offer a GM a decent map.
If it wasn't for the core of fanatics that gobble up everything he releases, and even bailed out the company (admittedly a cool thing to do). he might be holding himself to higher standards nowadays. Classic case of nerds ruining something for everyone.
How is anything "ruined" for you or me? Don't like it, don't buy it. Don't imagine you have the right to tell someone else how to run his business simply because it's not to your taste. That's a big nerd pastime right there.
Quote from: Matt;836414How is anything "ruined" for you or me?
How is a child 'spoiled' by giving it everything it wants and never telling it it's wrong?
Similar to how George Lucas might have put out better product if anyone around him was willing to say, "No George, I think that's an awful idea... don't do it!"
Quote from: Matt;836414How is anything "ruined" for you or me? Don't like it, don't buy it. Don't imagine you have the right to tell someone else how to run his business simply because it's not to your taste. That's a big nerd pastime right there.
1. Haven't bought a Palladium book in over 15 years.
2. Of course, Kevin is above all criticism. After all he
runs a business. :rolleyes:
Hey Geek Eclectic. I had the same experience w/ Fred Hicks and Cam Banks. I said just one or two sentences of my own opinion on the Strange/American Indian controversy and they both wrote me multi-paragraph, super emotional SJW stuff. They do not like people to have different opinions from them.
Quote from: Matt;836414Don't imagine you have the right to tell someone else how to run his business simply because it's not to your taste. That's a big nerd pastime right there.
Um. I think we DO have a right to tell someone how to run their business when they are literally robbing the customers or the people working for them.
Do you think it was Chevaliers right to take all the money and instead of paying the designer and artist or making a game. He bought a new house, then bought movie filming gear, higher'd actresses, while telling everyone that the money was gone and sorry. No game and he'll get around to repaying them whenever. Well the FTC didn't think he had the right.
Some small company which name i forget, produced at least a couple monsterbooks and such for Pathfinder system. They used a friend of mines art without permission. He partly does that for living, so it's a bummer.
Not that I'd bought anything from them anyway...
Edit - It was Adamant Entertainment and the book Fell Beasts vol III, page 9. They have now retracted the pdf from DriveThru and RPGnow.
Quote from: Simlasa;836416How is a child 'spoiled' by giving it everything it wants and never telling it it's wrong?
Similar to how George Lucas might have put out better product if anyone around him was willing to say, "No George, I think that's an awful idea... don't do it!"
And now he no longer owns the IP he created. Sounds like my statement stands.
Quote from: RPGPundit;836357What designers did Hasbro rip off?
Elizabeth Magie?
Quote from: TristramEvans;836455Elizabeth Magie?
That was Parker Brothers. Hasborg merely assimilated them into the collective.
Quote from: Christopher Brady;836448And now he no longer owns the IP he created. Sounds like my statement stands.
It's not like it was taken away from him because he misused it... or that if he'd chosen to continue making Star Wars movies the fans would have stayed away. Some of those SW fans would have kept buying tickets even if it was just George acting stuff out on his own with hand puppets.
So... really nothing to do with your statement.
Quote from: GeekEclectic;836191FASA/Red Brick -- I don't even know what's going on with this company. They had a great thing going, and then due to the terms of their agreement with Mongoose/Flaming Cobra they put out a hurried "new edition" that really wasn't different enough to even qualify as such(3e). It was basically Classic w/ a free PDF supplement worked into the main Discipline rules and a cleaned up Talent list. Nice but . . . not a new edition by any means. Then the lackluster Cathay books(not bad or anything; just mediocre) that were their first real attempt at all-new content. Then the aborted 3e Revised, Pathdinder-compatible, and Savage Worlds-compatible editions. And now a 4th Edition w/ just a stupid logo. Again, as seems to be the case for them, it's not bad . . . just generic-looking and uninspired. I just don't know . . .
You know it's bad when the line developer tells people to not quote the rulebook and instead go by the designers opinion of the rule.
Quote from: Ddogwood;836393Unfortunately, that's not how it works. A game company can be perpetually late with releases, over-promise, under-deliver, copy-and-paste huge chunks of old games and pretend it's "new", run a shitty kickstarter, and even suffer a Crisis of Treachery, yet remain in business for decades.
As long as creditors don't run it into the ground, they keep paying for their business license and stay good with the IRS, of course they can continue. But if they get lots of negative reviews, they will have a harder time prospering.
The more people who write sensible reviews, the more likely the untalented will not prosper.
Companies I don't care about ethic-wise seem to go stagnant on their own and their product releases amount to a trickle after awhile.
Quote from: Sommerjon;836459You know it's bad when the line developer tells people to not quote the rulebook and instead go by the designers opinion of the rule.
Which by the way happened between myself and Rob Schwalb in "interpreting" the critical hit rules for impact weapons in WFRP2.
Black Industries / Green Ronin had a pretty good run with it though, I think.
Since I started this thread as kind of incoherent venting, how about this as a concrete example:
Hero Games doesn't put up PDF previews for their products, on either DriveThru/RPGNow or their own store.
Almost every other company I have seen uses the preview functionality on DriveThru. Customers expect it, and use it as a primary decision-making tool.
Furthermore, at their own store Hero doesn't list page counts for PDFs. No previews, no page counts. Just a paragraph about the product, a price, there you go. Essentially, the only people who would buy on those terms are those who from word of mouth have already made the decision to buy.
Have any of you had experience with selling online? How many sales do you think they are losing by these practices? I am involved with online shopfronts, and I would estimate Hero Games are reducing their PDF sales by 30-50%.
And rather than being harried for time or whatever, I think that current staff just don't care. It's insane.
Quote from: GeekEclectic;836191Cam Banks, Topher Gerkey, and Fred Hicks all annoy the crap out of me sometimes ... They often jump right to ascribing the worst possible motives to people who disagree with them, which is just uncharitable.
Surprised to hear you say that about Banks. I was an early and loud critic of the
Serenity RPG (for a bunch of reasons), and on more than one forum Banks handled my oft-caustic criticisms with grace and class.
Quote from: Christopher Brady;836448And now he no longer owns the IP he created. Sounds like my statement stands.
Look, man, if you're going to start cherrypicking facts far out of their obvious context in search of momentary Internet forum wins, folks are going to discount anything you say. Lucas no longer owns the IP not because he fucked up, but because he was pushing seventy, intended to slow down, and sold out for a metric ton of money and the second largest private shareholding in one of the world's most profitable conglomerates. Sounds like your statement is flapping in the breeze without its drawers.
Quote from: The_Shadow;836501Hero Games doesn't put up PDF previews for their products, on either DriveThru/RPGNow or their own store.
Almost every other company I have seen uses the preview functionality on DriveThru. Customers expect it, and use it as a primary decision-making tool.
Quite a few do not put up PDF previews for one reason or another. Even now it is the norm rather than the exception. Over time I think more will unless something goes wrong sufficiently to burn companies on the idea. Unlikely. I have heard accounts of at least three though that stopped putting out rules previews after various dicks wrote them saying essentially "Thanks for the free game. Now I dont have to buy it."
This on top of a few that will yank free PNPs of games that they pick up for publication. During submissions I've had a couple publishers state that they will not look at games submitted that are online as previews, PNPs, WIPs, etc. No clue why. (Aside from possibly so there is no prior evidence if they decide to rip you off.)
Hasbro and a couple of other publishers though are regularly putting the rules to their games up so you can have a look.
Quote from: Omega;836512Quite a few do not put up PDF previews for one reason or another. Even now it is the norm rather than the exception. Over time I think more will unless something goes wrong sufficiently to burn companies on the idea. Unlikely. I have heard accounts of at least three though that stopped putting out rules previews after various dicks wrote them saying essentially "Thanks for the free game. Now I dont have to buy it."
This on top of a few that will yank free PNPs of games that they pick up for publication. During submissions I've had a couple publishers state that they will not look at games submitted that are online as previews, PNPs, WIPs, etc. No clue why. (Aside from possibly so there is no prior evidence if they decide to rip you off.)
Hasbro and a couple of other publishers though are regularly putting the rules to their games up so you can have a look.
Not talking about free games here...typically the previews on DriveThru are the first 6 pages or so, including title page and table of contents, and usually only 2-3 pages of actual content. Of course the contents of each preview can be completely controlled by the publisher if they don't want to give away too much. It's not brain surgery, and it's the norm on DriveThru, in fact I would say 95% of publishers on that site use the feature.
Quote from: The_Shadow;836518Not talking about free games here...typically the previews on DriveThru are the first 6 pages or so, including title page and table of contents, and usually only 2-3 pages of actual content. Of course the contents of each preview can be completely controlled by the publisher if they don't want to give away too much. It's not brain surgery, and it's the norm on DriveThru, in fact I would say 95% of publishers on that site use the feature.
In this day and age, it's just expected to see a preview page or two to see the game layout. Maybe a table of context, too. Page count is very important to know when buying. 12 pages comes to about 8 pages of actual rules.
What do you think of the on-going trend now to offer games with a "pay what you want" for them? Otherwise known as given away the core rules for an RPG and then charging for the setting and splat books.
Quote from: The_Shadow;836518It's not brain surgery, and it's the norm on DriveThru, in fact I would say 95% of publishers on that site use the feature.
I thought that was automatic on DriveThru? So the previews is something that the publisher sets up themselves?
Quote from: Omega;836522I thought that was automatic on DriveThru? So the previews is something that the publisher sets up themselves?
Yes.
Quote from: Omega;836522I thought that was automatic on DriveThru? So the previews is something that the publisher sets up themselves?
It's automatic, but you (the publisher, that is) can disable it or specify different page ranges.
The default setting is pages 3-9 for the quick preview, and 2-7 for the sample download.
Quote from: Omega;836522I thought that was automatic on DriveThru? So the previews is something that the publisher sets up themselves?
I'm pretty sure it's a matter of checking a couple of boxes on the publisher interface on OneBookShelf.
Quote from: Shawn Driscoll;836521What do you think of the on-going trend now to offer games with a "pay what you want" for them? Otherwise known as given away the core rules for an RPG and then charging for the setting and splat books.
PWYW seems to be a good idea for the smaller publishers. I guess it allows you to put out stuff that normally would be free, and those who want to can throw a few coins in the jar. I'd be interested to see the metrics of how it works out in practice.
I have no problem with paying $10-$20 for a pdf though. Design Mechanism charge $25 for RQ6, and why the hell not? It's a premium quality product, in terms of game quality if not expensive art. And if you don't want to pay, there's also a cut down but fully playable version.
There are probably too many people willing to put out their labors of love for next to nothing, so a few great games get put into the same bucket as the myriad products that are free because no-one would download them otherwise.
Then there's Monte Cook making his name (or remaking it) by using a big art budget to dress up what might otherwise be middling-exciting games. People buy in to the appearance of quality, even if they have to drop more dollars. It's a good strategy.
But to get back to the spirit of this thread: Hero Games' current active-duty staff (this doesn't include the heroic Steve Long) suck. Ah. Feels better.
Quote from: Matt;836414How is anything "ruined" for you or me? Don't like it, don't buy it. Don't imagine you have the right to tell someone else how to run his business simply because it's not to your taste. That's a big nerd pastime right there.
Not just a big nerd pastime. This is default human nature in general. (ie. Monday morning quarterback, etc ....).
In practice, it takes a lot of discipline to recognize this type of behavior in one's own self and keeping one's mouth shut.
Quote from: The_Shadow;836536Then there's Monte Cook making his name (or remaking it) by using a big art budget to dress up what might otherwise be middling-exciting games. People buy in to the appearance of quality, even if they have to drop more dollars. It's a good strategy.
Sounds like how the world functions in general. ;)
The real world equivalent of overusing CHA, with INT and/or WIS being "average" or dump stats.
Quote from: ggroy;836549Not just a big nerd pastime. This is default human nature in general. (ie. Monday morning quarterback, etc ....).
In practice, it takes a lot of discipline to recognize this type of behavior in one's own self and keeping one's mouth shut.
Except that if you do not speak up about bad business practices then those bad business practices will likely continue or get worse. And businesses are accountable for their actions and can be brought to task for it.
But yeah sure. Lets no one talk about how so-n-so company robbed customers or treated customers or workers like dirt. Its THEIR business and they can run it how they want. Who are we to tell them not to grind up a worker in a machine for an hour? Nope. Not us. Its THEIR business and they can run it how they want.
Quote from: ggroy;836549In practice, it takes a lot of discipline to recognize this type of behavior in one's own self and keeping one's mouth shut.
So if you're a regular in my restaurant and I decide to start urinating in your pudding you would just quietly stop coming there to eat... not raise a ruckus, not warn your friends? Let them decide for themselves if they like piss in their pudding?
The_Shadow, I don't think you're being quite fair regarding Hero Games' use of the Preview option. A lot of the products do have previews, and for those that don't, it appears to be a technical matter--the ones I see that are lacking them are the ones being sold in ZIP format. (And a lot of those had previews on the Hero Games site that are now defunct links, alas.) Mostly that's the older products; the one recent exception is Fantasy Hero Complete, which bundles a lot of extras into the ZIP file.
Now, that's probably a bad marketing decision, but with the company down to 1-3 people, I can see why updating the electronic format of their older products isn't a top priority.
Quote from: The_Shadow;836536Then there's Monte Cook making his name (or remaking it) by using a big art budget to dress up what might otherwise be middling-exciting games. People buy in to the appearance of quality, even if they have to drop more dollars. It's a good strategy.
Not arguing the point (shiny
does sell and I think this is what, say, Chaosium should be doing with CoC; I own the French version of CoC and it's a thing of beauty). But why do you feel Monte's games are "middling"?
Quote from: The Butcher;836408The truth of the matter is: Palladium can't edit a book worth shit and recycles its own content like it's going out of style. Nothing ever gets playtested, the power creep is a joke and several books can't even offer a GM a decent
I see what you did there
:)
...ending?
Quote from: Ravenswing;836502Surprised to hear you say that about Banks. I was an early and loud critic of the Serenity RPG (for a bunch of reasons), and on more than one forum Banks handled my oft-caustic criticisms with grace and class.
What issues did you have with the
Serenity RPG? I'm not saying the game didn't have issues, it certainly had a lot, but I'm just curious as to what you saw.
Quote from: AaronBrown99;836596I see what you did there
:)
...ending?
Oops. Serves me right for posting drunk. :o I stand by my assessment, though.
In vino veritas.
And Disney, Jobs, Edison, Bell, and Carnegie were all complete asses. Welcome to the real world.
Quote from: Old One Eye;836677And Disney, Jobs, Edison, Bell, and Carnegie were all complete asses. Welcome to the real world.
One would be hard pressed to find a significant historical figure who wasn't a bastard in some way. Ghandi was a wife beater. Martin Luther King cheated on his. Winston Churchill was a racist, sexist pig. JFK was a massive tool. CSLewis was one of the worste "born again" Christian apologists on the planet. Charles Dickens was a massive dick to his wife. Lovecraft buttered his toast on the wrong side. Most of the Founding Fathers were slavers, and in some cases, rapists. Abraham Lincoln didnt actually give that much of a crap about the slaves.
Christopher Lee, OTOH, was a fucking badass. I'm still reeling from that death.
Quote from: SionEwig;836649What issues did you have with the Serenity RPG? I'm not saying the game didn't have issues, it certainly had a lot, but I'm just curious as to what you saw.
It took them until the fourth printing to include a character sheet and an index. The lack of trading rules and guidelines, given that wheeling and dealing formed the plot of damn near every episode of the show, was downright negligent. There were four times as many pages devoted to full-page full-color still photos of the
Serenity crew (eight) than there were to
space combat – more space was devoted to how to arm and armor your ship than in what to do with it. The prices on the same were also ridiculous, and the authors' claim that they were based on real-world examples didn't survive ten minutes' worth of fact checking. So many pages were wasted on puffery and pretty production values, and I hated the space wasted on the Aces & Eights ship and crew: one of the fundamental elements of the 'Verse is scarcity. If all you want is generic space adventure with rich crews on ships dripping with weapons, sheesh, Traveller's been doing that for thirty years.
Universal was a bitchier license holder than most, and the authors were under some constraints, but they had no business releasing a product so deficient in gaming basics. It took me and my group all of 15 minutes to pitch it and use
GURPS instead to play
Firefly.
Quote from: Ravenswing;836702It took them until the fourth printing to include a character sheet and an index. The lack of trading rules and guidelines, given that wheeling and dealing formed the plot of damn near every episode of the show, was downright negligent. There were four times as many pages devoted to full-page full-color still photos of the Serenity crew (eight) than there were to space combat – more space was devoted to how to arm and armor your ship than in what to do with it. The prices on the same were also ridiculous, and the authors' claim that they were based on real-world examples didn't survive ten minutes' worth of fact checking. So many pages were wasted on puffery and pretty production values, and I hated the space wasted on the Aces & Eights ship and crew: one of the fundamental elements of the 'Verse is scarcity. If all you want is generic space adventure with rich crews on ships dripping with weapons, sheesh, Traveller's been doing that for thirty years.
Universal was a bitchier license holder than most, and the authors were under some constraints, but they had no business releasing a product so deficient in gaming basics. It took me and my group all of 15 minutes to pitch it and use GURPS instead to play Firefly.
Based entirely on your description, I suspect that non-gamers looking for one of those movie-atlas book thingies were more of a target audience than gamers looking for a ttrpg.
Quote from: Old One Eye;836714Based entirely on your description, I suspect that non-gamers looking for one of those movie-atlas book thingies were more of a target audience than gamers looking for a ttrpg.
Thats too often the case with licensed RPGs that pay so much for the license that its only the idea that drawing in fans of the IP rather than relying on the rpg hobby that makes the game potentially financially viable. This leads to emphasizing the sourcebook/fan mag aspect of the project over the game itself in a lot of instances.
Quote from: TristramEvans;836717Thats too often the case with licensed RPGs that pay so much for the license that its only the idea that drawing in fans of the IP rather than relying on the rpg hobby that makes the game potentially financially viable. This leads to emphasizing the sourcebook/fan mag aspect of the project over the game itself in a lot of instances.
Say what you will of Palladium. But one thing they excelled at was intigrating the series sourcebook aspects with the game aspects for the TMNT and Macross/Robotech stuff.
Quote from: Omega;836721Say what you will of Palladium. But one thing they excelled at was intigrating the series sourcebook aspects with the game aspects for the TMNT and Macross/Robotech stuff.
Yeah, tho in those cases it helped they picked things that didn't have hugely popular IPs (their TMNT game predated the cartoon/action figure explosion).
Quote from: TristramEvans;836723Yeah, tho in those cases it helped they picked things that didn't have hugely popular IPs (their TMNT game predated the cartoon/action figure explosion).
Robotech was a pretty hot deal to have snagged. In the US it was the most well known anime for a while and Macross has been going on and off in Japan ever since.
Chaosium...I will never buy another product from them ever. I specifically mean their online store; I will be happy to purchase new products from Amazon or the FLGS, but their store? Fuck that. Zero customer service, had to contact AMEX to get a refund after literally a month of non-response. No thanks, Jeff.
Maybe it'll be better now that the original crew is back, but someone else can be the goat on the pyre...
Quote from: Omega;836580Except that if you do not speak up about bad business practices then those bad business practices will likely continue or get worse. And businesses are accountable for their actions and can be brought to task for it.
But yeah sure. Lets no one talk about how so-n-so company robbed customers or treated customers or workers like dirt. Its THEIR business and they can run it how they want. Who are we to tell them not to grind up a worker in a machine for an hour? Nope. Not us. Its THEIR business and they can run it how they want.
Speaking up is what gives "voting with your wallet" any chance to have any bite, and even then it's generally not enough. Some game companies do dissolve from awful management, but some don't.
Of course, when there are good games coming from crummy companies, that creates a dilemma.
With games, hopefully the creative people gravitate to the better companies. The evil companies try hard to sell themselves as the best option, though (sometimes before turning around and betraying said creative people...).
Quote from: Skarg;836790Speaking up is what gives "voting with your wallet" any chance to have any bite, and even then it's generally not enough. Some game companies do dissolve from awful management, but some don't.
Here's the thing, most companies do not care who says what on what forum. What they do care is how much money that comes in. And as long as people pay for a product, then you're telling them that it's OK to keep on trucking.
QLI and Evil Hat are two companies I have sworn off in the past due entirely to non-existent and/or belligerent customer support.
These days, I am having more fun with Kickstarter projects and free stuff than store shelf stuff, so I can't say that I even register the various company drama anymore. If somebody makes something I like, I will give them cash.
As for Palladium and Kevin, here's my deal. I've met Kevin a few times and I really like the guy, we resonate for whatever reason, but then I read about the latest Crisis Du Jour and I am WTF? and I can't cheer on bad decisions (like what got revealed in the latest 17 page apology over the Robotech Kickstarter), but I personally have to respect the guy (not asking you to respect him, just me) because (a) he keeps on kicking 30 years later and (b) whenever I read through his RPG stuff, I get jazzed and inspired, even if I don't plan to use it RAW.
I don't get jazzed or inspired by most RPG stuff I read. Kevin's got some whacky voodoo and I like it!
Quote from: TristramEvans;836678One would be hard pressed to find a significant historical figure who wasn't a bastard in some way. Ghandi was a wife beater. Martin Luther King cheated on his. Winston Churchill was a racist, sexist pig. JFK was a massive tool. CSLewis was one of the worste "born again" Christian apologists on the planet. Charles Dickens was a massive dick to his wife. Lovecraft buttered his toast on the wrong side. Most of the Founding Fathers were slavers, and in some cases, rapists. Abraham Lincoln didnt actually give that much of a crap about the slaves.
So...men were/are sexist pigs, and in the past slavery was condoned. While much of this is true, it's sad that the contemporary focus on these things separates us from virtually all great human achievements. There is barely a great artist, scientist, leader or anyone else in the history books that your teenage daughter won't wrinkle up her nose at as a sexist homophobe.
And I don't believe that she and her enlightened peers are necessarily leading us into a better future. While saying the right things about the evils of sexism, etc, we remain passive consumers, and the nasty wife-beaters will generally still make all the running, as long as they hide it better. Because their nasty side is linked to the drive to achieve that makes them rule nations and invent iPhones.
Something is off with this aspect of contemporary culture. We're like a newly Christianised Roman empire that can barely bring itself to acknowledge the achievements of the past, because they were all pagans. And we know better now.
But this is all another discussion.
Evil Hat beyond a doubt. They threaten DriveThruRPG to take down a product they didn't like. Which while I am at it DriveThruRPG is shit for caving in to that threat.
Quote from: Snowman0147;836957Evil Hat beyond a doubt. They threaten DriveThruRPG to take down a product they didn't like. Which while I am at it DriveThruRPG is shit for caving in to that threat.
Uh? What product was that?
Quote from: Dirk Remmecke;837074Uh? What product was that?
Some guy tried making a card game making fun of pro vs anti gamer gaters. It was seen as "problematic" by Evil Hat and so drivethrurpg pulled it.
Quote from: GeekEclectic;836191Margaret Weiss puts out some stuff that's really to my taste, but they can't negotiate a license properly for the life of them. Their licenses are set up in such a way that once the license ends, they aren't allowed to even sell digital copies of the products they already wrote and had approved anymore. This has affected Smallville and Marvel Heroic, and is likely to affect Leverage, Firefly, and more down the road.
Counterexample: Eden Studios. Their Buffy and Angel licenses ended years ago, but they are still allowed to sell digital copies of the products that made it through approvals. We'll probably never get Military Monster Squad or Tea & Crossbows, but we'll never have to worry that the core books or The Magic Box(really expensive sometimes if you find it in print) will ever be unavailable to interested fans.
That EDEN Studios deal sounds so utterly, utterly out of the way of the ordinary that I can't believe it. That is not the way merchandising licensing works, whether for movies, or comic book characters, or else.
As a licensee you (usually) obtain a limited license that allows you to sell (or rather produce) your derived stuff for x years (with or without a much shorter sell-off period after that). What media that license covers - print, PDF, e-book - is subject to the contract. Fantasy Flight Games apparently doesn't have the rights to e-books of the Star Wars RPG.
And electronic "books" are the same as physical books, with regards to the license.
And rightfully so - a licensor's interest is to eventually find a new licensee. But no one would be interested in obtaining a new license if the former licensee is still allowed to sell his stuff. (Having old merchandise stuck in the channel, either at distributor warehouses, store shelves, or in the secondary market, is bad enough.)
I wonder who is paying royalties to the licensor of Buffy and Angel for each copy that is sold via DTRPG... (or maybe EDEN still
has a digital license and just doesn't believe in the viability of another print run?)
Also...
Quote from: GeekEclectic;836191they can't negotiate a license properly for the life of them.
In the field of big IP there is not much wiggle room for negotiations. Usually it's
"take it or leave it - we don't really need the measly extra visibilty an RPG line gives us (since it caters to already existing fans of our franchise) and we also don't really need the extra workload of approving 100+ pages of content you invented/extrapolated from our franchise - per month".
Quote from: Iron_Rain;837077Some guy tried making a card game making fun of pro vs anti gamer gaters. It was seen as "problematic" by Evil Hat and so drivethrurpg pulled it.
So it wasn't even a product that was based on one of Evil Hat's games, such as FATE? (Like, a "Book of Erotic FATEs"?)
Wow. Just wow.
Quote from: Dirk Remmecke;837080That EDEN Studios deal sounds so utterly, utterly out of the way of the ordinary that I can't believe it. That is not the way merchandising licensing works, whether for movies, or comic book characters, or else.
As a licensee you (usually) obtain a limited license that allows you to sell (or rather produce) your derived stuff for x years (with or without a much shorter sell-off period after that).
Also...
In the field of big IP there is not much wiggle room for negotiations. Usually it's "take it or leave it - we don't really need the measly extra visibilty an RPG line gives us (since it caters to already existing fans of our franchise) and we also don't really need the extra workload of approving 100+ pages of content you invented/extrapolated from our franchise - per month".
1: Correct. It is very rare to get these and usually it only happens when the IP holder doesnt think that little detail through. I have no less than four IPs that I can do work on in perpetuam. Once because the IP holder quit, handing me the whole damn thing. Three because there was no cut off clause. I stopped work on those when things went off kilter and out of respect for the IP holders. But if I so desired I can reprint the RPG books. That is utterly and absolutely rare.
2: And when that time limit runs out. You are screwed if you have any unsold product. The whole Lord of the Rings fiasco with Iron Crown and/or Decipher?
3: Totally true. The IP holder is usually allowing it as a sort of paid advertising. Except that they get paid rather than the host. Others do it because it sounds fun, or you had a good sales pitch. My first bif IP deal was done soley on confidently pitching the concept of a type of game that had never been tried before.
4: One of the big problems with IP deals is that they are notoriously fickle. I have seen deals pulled at the proverbial eleventh hour when the product was near to completion or actually ready to ship. Ive seen deals cut off mid stride. And certainly deals that ended because the IP holder wanted more money than they were getting already.
Quote from: Snowman0147;836957Evil Hat beyond a doubt. They threaten DriveThruRPG to take down a product they didn't like. Which while I am at it DriveThruRPG is shit for caving in to that threat.
Evil Hat is the culprit, here.
DriveThru is just looking out for their bottom line. They stand to lose more money from Dick Hat followers than they gain from selling a product that few people know about. It's just business.
James "Grim" Desborough published a GamerGate card game (http://www.therpgsite.com/showthread.php?t=31183)
I don't know much of his stuff, but I do enjoy the SLA Industries stuff he edited or co-authored. He probably gained more from the press than he lost.
Quote from: Bloodwolf;837093Evil Hat is the culprit, here.
DriveThru is just looking out for their bottom line. They stand to lose more money from Dick Hat followers than they gain from selling a product that few people know about. It's just business.
James "Grim" Desborough published a GamerGate card game (http://www.therpgsite.com/showthread.php?t=31183)
I don't know much of his stuff, but I do enjoy the SLA Industries stuff he edited or co-authored. He probably gained more from the press than he lost.
I get that Grim courts outrage, but considering the stuff that DriveThru has on the shelves, like a tentacle rape game I think it is, going after a GG based mockery game is petty as fuck.
Fortunately, I don't care for their products anyway, so not giving EH money was a simple decision.
Quote from: Omega;8370854: One of the big problems with IP deals is that they are notoriously fickle. I have seen deals pulled at the proverbial eleventh hour when the product was near to completion or actually ready to ship. Ive seen deals cut off mid stride. And certainly deals that ended because the IP holder wanted more money than they were getting already.
And Marvel seems to be quite bad about this--there are products for all three licensed RPGs that were ready to go but never saw the light of day (or, in MWP's case, only got a very limited release as PDFs).
In a really freakish inversion. Privateer Press signed a movie deal with Paramont or some other big company to make a movie out of Monsterpocalypse. Then near immediately ceased development of the game and went near dead silent on the subject. They produced it for a time after. But then even that stopped and a whole line ended in mid-stride.
Common theory is that the movie deal somehow included some clause that the company could not produce their own game. Which sounds absurd. But in the end the game is DOA.
Quote from: Old One Eye;836714Based entirely on your description, I suspect that non-gamers looking for one of those movie-atlas book thingies were more of a target audience than gamers looking for a ttrpg.
It's certainly possible. As it turned out, my
GURPS Scarlet Pimpernel sold -- the GURPS collection completists aside -- less well to gamers than to fans of the books or the movies, because I'd written the only (effective) concordance to the series that ever hit print, and the gamebook spread by word of mouth.
Quote from: Warboss Squee;837097I get that Grim courts outrage, but considering the stuff that DriveThru has on the shelves, like a tentacle rape game I think it is, going after a GG based mockery game is petty as fuck.
Fortunately, I don't care for their products anyway, so not giving EH money was a simple decision.
They specifically targeted him because its Desborough and he's top on the list of people they despise. There are even other gamergate-related games, that no one has a problem with being there. This was entirely about who wrote it, and who was demanding he be censored.
I think that the fundamental problem is that gamers are creators and not necessarily businessmen. Like painters or sculptors, they most likely have a passion for making things and may have zero talent for marketing and running a business. I think you could see this as early as TSR in the 1970's, where the company had a lot of cool ideas but didn't know a lot about mailorder and printing and other aspects of company development. (Not to pick on TSR, understand, but I'm using them as an example.) The ability to develop a cool idea into a RPG isn't the same skill set as knowing about finance, investment, hiring a qualified CEO, stock and inventory, and so on.
When you look at the quantity of game companies that have come and gone over the decades, it's a staggering list. While there are some that never hit it big at all, there are quite a few like TSR (D&D, Gamma World, Top Secret, Star Frontiers...) and Game Design Workshop (Traveller) and West End Games (Star Wars, TORG, Indiana Jones, Ghostbusters, Paranoia...) that looked like juggernaut companies that couldn't possibly fail but then did. Sometimes one or two poor decisions caused massive collapse and company downfall.
The other thing is that I think game designer people tend to be less timeline oriented than many other folks. Some professions stick tightly to a schedule, but creation is harder to channel. A good game needs time to ferment in playtest, re-write, and so on, but a tight schedule tends to lead to a "get it out on time even if it's not ready" mentality.
I'm no expert. It just seems like a pattern.
Quote from: finarvyn;837929Sometimes one or two poor decisions caused massive collapse and company downfall.
How many of them were operating with enough funds to absorb the blow of a failure?
I see plenty of botched projects from major corporations... and I've got no faith they're all run by geniuses... but those losses generally get absorbed because other profits are so high. For a little company like Chaosium every project is more of a gamble.
Quote from: TristramEvans;836678Christopher Lee, OTOH, was a fucking badass. I'm still reeling from that death.
(http://weknowmemes.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/baddest-man-in-the-world.jpg)
He released another one in his nineties. Everyone else's DNA is made of AGTC, his was made of AWESOME, absolute badass.
Quote from: Ravenswing;836502Surprised to hear you say that about Banks. I was an early and loud critic of the Serenity RPG (for a bunch of reasons), and on more than one forum Banks handled my oft-caustic criticisms with grace and class.
You were questioning his game mechanics not his religion.
Quote from: Simlasa;837931How many of them were operating with enough funds to absorb the blow of a failure?
I see plenty of botched projects from major corporations... and I've got no faith they're all run by geniuses... but those losses generally get absorbed because other profits are so high. For a little company like Chaosium every project is more of a gamble.
Sometimes the blow is too big to absorb. Iron Crown and/or Decipher I believe took some massive hits when they had to junk product ready to sell that they could not because their IP deals fell apart. It is one thing to have a product that is not selling well. At least you are recovering some of the money gradually. It is a totally different matter to have sunk resources into a product that you now cannot sell at all.
Other companies work on the pattern you describe of having a very fine margin from one project to the next. Any blow to sales or miscalculation can be hard to bounce back from.
And quite a few companies bled themselves out trying to cash in on the CCG craze and that lead to more than a few of them crashing. Some well before the CCG craze puttered out around 2000.
Seriously, "reeling" from the death of a guy in his 90s??
Quote from: RPGPundit;838327Seriously, "reeling" from the death of a guy in his 90s??
Not one of your most well-thought out statements.
Heres another one Id never let touch my money.
Castle Nystul.
Mike Nystul is the son of Brad Nystul, as in
Nystul's Magic Aura from D&D.
Heres the rundown over on RPGG. Weird tuns of events.
QuoteMike Nystul ran out of money for not one, not two, but three Kickstarter projects:
Infinite Dungeons ($16,018)
Axes and Anvils ($35,038)
Cairn ($24,157)
And then he tried to do an IndieGoGo campaign to raise funds for his company (which failed).
Without delivering on any of the projects, in March 2013 Nystul announced that he was completely out of money. He refuses to provide an accounting. We know that some freelancers were paid for their work, and there are claims that a bunch of money was lost on "Dwarf Con" (a convention promised as a $30k stretch goal on Axes & Anvils).
Infinite Dungeons was bailed out by D3 Adventures, and Cairn was partially rescued by Ross A. Isaacs.
Nystul continues to maintain that he'll deliver everything "somehow, some way."
Current Status as of February 2015:
Infinte Dungeons is back in Nystul's hands.
Axes & Anvils design has been turned over to Andrew Shields, and a playtest document has been produced. This is still being done under Castle Nystul.
The Book of Cairn was published by Ross A. Isaacs of SoulJar games. He has offered vouchers to backers for a POD physical version (backer has to pick up shipping). Nystul is still responsible for a number of stretch goals.
He also, unfortunately, tried to do a GoFundMe for miniature terrain (which was removed shortly after it went live).
Addendum: D3 Adventures had to bail on the Infinite Dungeon due to various problems with picking it up.
Quote from: RPGPundit;838327Seriously, "reeling" from the death of a guy in his 90s??
I was quite sad when I heard he died. Probably not "reeling" for me, but I understand the feeling and sentiment.
He was an icon and a big part of my childhood watching horror movies late at night.
I appreciate he had a long and probably good life, but it's OK to be sad about someone dying that's a kind of hero figure.
I felt the same when Terry Pratchett died, also a big part of my reading material and general "figure" that was always (well mostly) there writing stuff that I liked.
Quote from: Omega;838547Heres another one Id never let touch my money.
Castle Nystul.
As a fan of The Whispering Vault I'm sad to hear that Mike Nystul has gotten himself such a bad rep.
Another tempted by the heady mix of hubris and Kickstarter.
Quote from: Simlasa;838565As a fan of The Whispering Vault I'm sad to hear that Mike Nystul has gotten himself such a bad rep.
Another tempted by the heady mix of hubris and Kickstarter.
I'd say that if it ended with the first one. But two more? And two more after that that failed? That is a-lot of hubris. But yeah, something sure went wrong there and his rep is pretty shot to heck. Too bad as it seemed well intentioned at first and its possible he did the second to pay for the first. Wouldnt be the first time. Game Salute has made a business model of that stunt.
Quote from: CRKrueger;837970You were questioning his game mechanics not his religion.
(scratches his head)
Dude, unless I was posting on an open religion/philosophy discussion forum, anyone who questioned my faith would -- beyond about a post or two -- get a "I believe what I believe, and if for some reason passing my understanding that's a problem for you, go fuck yourself" for an answer. There are subjects upon which the most mild-mannered among us will go off.
Quote from: TristramEvans;838341Not one of your most well-thought out statements.
I thought Lee was awesome, I even did a blog post about him. But its silly to lament a death from someone who lived both so long and so well.
I think it implies a disconnection from the reality of death; I mean, if the death of a 93 year old man comes as a shock to you, it has to be because you really don't think of death as something that happens to everyone...
Quote from: RPGPundit;839004I thought Lee was awesome, I even did a blog post about him. But its silly to lament a death from someone who lived both so long and so well.
I think it implies a disconnection from the reality of death; I mean, if the death of a 93 year old man comes as a shock to you, it has to be because you really don't think of death as something that happens to everyone...
Or its silly to think that the loss of someone who has been around forever is not going to effect someone. A person can get kinda used to them being around and the absence can be jarring. And some people just take any sort of death badly for one reason or another.
Back on topic. FGU seems to have an odd see-saw of a rep. Sounds like working for them was at times problematic. But at other times they just had problematic designers.
Quote from: RPGPundit;839004I thought Lee was awesome, I even did a blog post about him. But its silly to lament a death from someone who lived both so long and so well.
I think it implies a disconnection from the reality of death; I mean, if the death of a 93 year old man comes as a shock to you, it has to be because you really don't think of death as something that happens to everyone...
Also not one of your more thoughtful comments.
Sure "shock" is not a word I would use to describe my response. But someone else's feelings about loss are not about me. And the world is not a better place for your sharing of your emotional response to someone else's shock. Your need to continue commenting about someone else's feelings of loss displays a disconnection from ordinary human compassion. It's the sort of behavior that makes people say, "Wow. That was a stupid thing to say" or "Hey, Pundit, I guess you haven't come as far from your self absorbed younger self as you thought" or just "Don't be such a dick."
Quote from: Omega;839022Back on topic. FGU seems to have an odd see-saw of a rep. Sounds like working for them was at times problematic. But at other times they just had problematic designers.
I have no knowledge of FGU. But regarding RPG companies in general, one thing I think a lot of people either don't understand or easily forget is that all RPG companies either are very small or were very small companies. Small companies don't have depth. To use the inevitable sporting analogy for talking about business...small companies don't have a deep bench. Often they have no bench at all and many of them can't even field a full team. This is compounded by the fact that many people who work in the "industry" do that as some.combination of a labor of love, a hobby, or a part-time job.
So screw ups and mistakes will occur in ways they won't in a larger company that has a full-time person for contracts, human resources, management, project management, editing, shipping, order fulfillment, or what have you. An RPG company is a lot more like the mom and pop, non-chain restaurant or shop round the corner than to some fancy, high end gourmet place or a standardized franchise or outlet that is part of a big national chain.
Quote from: Bren;839075But regarding RPG companies in general, one thing I think a lot of people either don't understand or easily forget is that all RPG companies either are very small or were very small companies. Small companies don't have depth. To use the inevitable sporting analogy for talking about business...small companies don't have a deep bench. Often they have no bench at all and many of them can't even field a full team. This is compounded by the fact that many people who work in the "industry" do that as some.combination of a labor of love, a hobby, or a part-time job.
So screw ups and mistakes will occur in ways they won't in a larger company that has a full-time person for contracts, human resources, management, project management, editing, shipping, order fulfillment, or what have you. An RPG company is a lot more like the mom and pop, non-chain restaurant or shop round the corner than to some fancy, high end gourmet place or a standardized franchise or outlet that is part of a big national chain.
Lies, all lies! In fact, I hope to expand my RPG manufacturing facilities to a second card table very soon! ;)
Adding to that, many RPG publishers lack business and/or interpersonal skills, and frequently have to work outside their area of expertise. But the salary, benefits, and access to the company jet make it totally worth it. :cool:
Quote from: Vanquishing Leviathan;839103Adding to that, many RPG publishers lack business and/or interpersonal skills, and frequently have to work outside their area of expertise. But the salary, benefits, and access to the company jet make it totally worth it. :cool:
Yeah no one would believe the quantity of blow, hookers, and European sports cars available to the average RPG publisher.
As fucked up as Western Death-culture is, I'm just waiting to call his death a "tragedy", or for someone to say his life was 'cut short by smoking'.
Quote from: RPGPundit;839141As fucked up as Western Death-culture is, I'm just waiting to call his death a "tragedy", or for someone to say his life was 'cut short by smoking'.
No a 'tragedy' is when your local football team loses a game. :rolleyes:
Quote from: Bren;839143No a 'tragedy' is when your local football team loses a game. :rolleyes:
Touche!
I don't know if there are any specific game companies I think just "suck" per say.... (Well Adamant Entertainment, but it's unfair of me to say so, as I've never bought anything from them, just based off my personal experiences with Garatha Skara)
But I do have to say I think many of the writers in the industry suck because of their personal conduct.
Mainly those who have drank the SJW kool-aid.... Which is a shame, because I probably agree with them on 95% of their personal politics...
But then again, it's the Heretics who are more despised than the Heathens. The majority of conservative and right wing gamers and designers don't tend to have a personal problem with those who disagree with their politics..
But god damn..you question identity politics with your fellow Liberals, next thing you know they're dragging you to a stake to burn you as a witch.
I still even like some of the products these individuals put out, I just think they're really shitty people in the end.
There have been crummy designers since nearly the get go. They might design well. But they act like scum, or at least jerks.
Quote from: Orphan81;839455I don't know if there are any specific game companies I think just "suck" per say.... (Well Adamant Entertainment, but it's unfair of me to say so, as I've never bought anything from them, just based off my personal experiences with Garatha Skara)
Adamant has actually made some really nice products over the years, which makes the whole thing even more unfortunate.
Quote from: Orphan81;839455But then again, it's the Heretics who are more despised than the Heathens. The majority of conservative and right wing gamers and designers don't tend to have a personal problem with those who disagree with their politics..
But god damn..you question identity politics with your fellow Liberals, next thing you know they're dragging you to a stake to burn you as a witch.
That's why the right loses, every time. Because they are happy to discuss opinions and beliefs, then invite their opponents to a BBQ. At which time the leftists proceed to stab them and cook them for dinner.
Quote from: The_Shadow;839498That's why the right loses, every time. Because they are happy to discuss opinions and beliefs, then invite their opponents to a BBQ. At which time the leftists proceed to stab them and cook them for dinner.
Yep, It's like when Christie worked with Obama after Sandy and nobody on the right ever had a bad thing to say about it or continued to hold it against him to this day.
There's plenty of partisan assholery to go around on both sides, so let's not turn a pleasant thread about ripping on game companies into a political debate.
Quote from: Orphan81;839455The majority of conservative and right wing gamers and designers don't tend to have a personal problem with those who disagree with their politics..
Which companies and designers are openly conservative or libertarian? Steve Long, Sandy Petersen, "Lizard" and possibly Ken Hite are the only ones who come to mind immediately, and the closest I've seen to a company as a whole taking such a stand is Troll Lord Games' open support for the US military and allies.
By contrast, Wizards of the Coast's D&D department, White Wolf, Paizo, Green Ronin, and Evil Hat all seem to be fairly vocally left-wing. (D&D's official Facebook feed changed their avatar to a couatl miniature on the day Obergefell was proclaimed, although they changed it back a day later.)
Quote from: Orphan81;839455Mainly those who have drank the SJW kool-aid.... Which is a shame, because I probably agree with them on 95% of their personal politics...
Same here, but every time I see a reaction from either grouping, I think of part of the Revenge of the Sith crawl: "There are heroes on both sides. Evil is everywhere."
I don't buy from Evil Hat, though. The suppression of the Gamer Gate card game is on them alone. Also they provide a publishing outlet to Lorraine Williams' Office's own Shannon Appelcline.
I also don't buy from GMS, but who really does anymore?
I do buy from Green Ronin occasionally, but Nicole Lindroos really needs to stop flogging the dead horse of True20. Someone used the OGL as written (to make a true20 SRD) and she still whines about it to this day. You guys already killed the line, and it's been a decade now, so give it a fucking rest.
Chaosium, I had issues with in the past, but my recent experiences with them have been good.
I've had excellent customer service from Monte Cook Games and Pinnacle. I'm cheerfully broke because of them.
Quote from: Armchair Gamer;839523Which companies and designers are openly conservative or libertarian? Steve Long, Sandy Petersen, "Lizard" and possibly Ken Hite are the only ones who come to mind immediately, and the closest I've seen to a company as a whole taking such a stand is Troll Lord Games' open support for the US military and allies.
I'm fairly certain that Flying Buffalo's Rick Loomis is more conservative than most, though a number (perhaps most) of the people he works with are left-centre.
Pinnacle has been supportive of the US Military, but otherwise have kept their politics very close to their chest (which is the wisest move designers can make).
Quote from: Armchair Gamer;839523Which companies and designers are openly conservative or libertarian? Steve Long, Sandy Petersen, "Lizard" and possibly Ken Hite are the only ones who come to mind immediately, and the closest I've seen to a company as a whole taking such a stand is Troll Lord Games' open support for the US military and allies.
By contrast, Wizards of the Coast's D&D department, White Wolf, Paizo, Green Ronin, and Evil Hat all seem to be fairly vocally left-wing. (D&D's official Facebook feed changed their avatar to a couatl miniature on the day Obergefell was proclaimed, although they changed it back a day later.)
James Raggi is certainly socially libertarian, though I couldn't say as far as his economics.
Alexander Macris is a pretty big deal in conservative/libertarian circles, though he doesn't really put much of it into his games.
I'm a Thelemite, which is a kind of mystical libertarian, you could say, and I write for a conservative website.