Quote from: FingerRod on June 23, 2021, 07:01:39 PM
Why do you recommend miniature? With all of this SW talk, I dusted off my SWADE copy and I am planning to run a one shot this weekend. Was going to go TotM, but now I'm curious.

It feels more natural for my group and a lot more fun whenever we bring the system up (albeit bit more hassle to setup). My opinion of it after playing with TotM and semi-Mini campaign, I think the devs, at least when starting out, wanted to make a game similar to a skirmish wargame (i.e. Mordheim), but with more option of it as a RPG. So rather than running it like a traditional RPG's structure, it feels like it was made to run with a series of 'mini skirmish battles" with in-between scenes of drama (in hindsight maybe that's why the devs emphasize a 'plot point campaign' rather than a sandbox style).

Also for somethings it makes more sense or its easier to understand in a mini format. For example, one of my players got a new appreciation for reach weapons when hitting people in elevation with a 3D model (also you can push people off for extra damage).   

Quote from: 234ne on June 23, 2021, 11:18:59 PM

Quote from: FingerRod on June 23, 2021, 07:01:39 PM
Why do you recommend miniature? With all of this SW talk, I dusted off my SWADE copy and I am planning to run a one shot this weekend. Was going to go TotM, but now I'm curious.

It feels more natural for my group and a lot more fun whenever we bring the system up (albeit bit more hassle to setup). My opinion of it after playing with TotM and semi-Mini campaign, I think the devs, at least when starting out, wanted to make a game similar to a skirmish wargame (i.e. Mordheim), but with more option of it as a RPG. So rather than running it like a traditional RPG's structure, it feels like it was made to run with a series of 'mini skirmish battles" with in-between scenes of drama (in hindsight maybe that's why the devs emphasize a 'plot point campaign' rather than a sandbox style).

Also for somethings it makes more sense or its easier to understand in a mini format. For example, one of my players got a new appreciation for reach weapons when hitting people in elevation with a 3D model (also you can push people off for extra damage).   

That is interesting. Thank you. I may have to bring my battlemat book out of storage.

  Just to address some of the comments about Pinnacle being woke,  I have been reading the SW rendition of Monster Hunters International, and its all toxic masculine gun porn for a good deal of it.  So pronouncements of woke may well be a good bit premature.

Quote from: oggsmash on June 25, 2021, 08:41:54 PM
  Just to address some of the comments about Pinnacle being woke,  I have been reading the SW rendition of Monster Hunters International, and its all toxic masculine gun porn for a good deal of it.  So pronouncements of woke may well be a good bit premature.

Have you seen the recent bit about some fans complaining about the cover art for their Atlantis Kickstarter. In 2021, it's no longer OK for Splugorth to have their genetically engineered warrior women clones wearing one piece swimsuits into battle.

Quote from: oggsmash on June 25, 2021, 08:41:54 PM
  Just to address some of the comments about Pinnacle being woke,  I have been reading the SW rendition of Monster Hunters International, and its all toxic masculine gun porn for a good deal of it.  So pronouncements of woke may well be a good bit premature.

Sadly, thats because thats a licensable thing. MHI doesn't have anything to do with Pinnacle. And yeah them bending the knee to the outrage mob for the cover has me angry.

Quote from: HappyDaze on June 25, 2021, 10:17:16 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on June 25, 2021, 08:41:54 PM
  Just to address some of the comments about Pinnacle being woke,  I have been reading the SW rendition of Monster Hunters International, and its all toxic masculine gun porn for a good deal of it.  So pronouncements of woke may well be a good bit premature.

Have you seen the recent bit about some fans complaining about the cover art for their Atlantis Kickstarter. In 2021, it's no longer OK for Splugorth to have their genetically engineered warrior women clones wearing one piece swimsuits into battle.

Well while there's not a lot of skin in the game (not sure that matters much, I don't recall Palladium Rifts being full of scantily-clad ladies...

As for the Splugorth's Grrl-Hitsquad, they're represented in Savage Rifts. I mean granted the art isn't as good as Parkinsons... but whattya gonna do? It's Keith Motherfuckin Parkinson.

Quote from: Shrieking Banshee on June 26, 2021, 01:14:45 AM

Quote from: oggsmash on June 25, 2021, 08:41:54 PM
  Just to address some of the comments about Pinnacle being woke,  I have been reading the SW rendition of Monster Hunters International, and its all toxic masculine gun porn for a good deal of it.  So pronouncements of woke may well be a good bit premature.

Sadly, thats because thats a licensable thing. MHI doesn't have anything to do with Pinnacle. And yeah them bending the knee to the outrage mob for the cover has me angry.

  I know, but Larry Correia is literal Kryptonite to SJW types.  Pinnacle allowing SW to be used for it gives me some glimmer there.

Quote from: oggsmash on June 26, 2021, 02:22:22 AM
  I know, but Larry Correia is literal Kryptonite to SJW types.  Pinnacle allowing SW to be used for it gives me some glimmer there.

I know. I don't get the sense that pinnacle are SJWs. Just that they are buying into the stage 1 SJW pitch:
Please be more inclusive to us, we will buy your stuff more.

That pitch has Suckered in so many with nice sounding platitudes.

Quote from: oggsmash on June 26, 2021, 02:22:22 AM
  I know, but Larry Correia is literal Kryptonite to SJW types.  Pinnacle allowing SW to be used for it gives me some glimmer there.

  They also linked to a blog post of his in the latest newsletter. I'm surprised I haven't seen any outrage about that from the Usual Suspects.

Ive been running savage worlds for a few years now as my main system of choice. I'll say alot of the detraction on this thread is wrong. I mean, i'm not gonna knock someone for liking or not liking a game its a matter of preference but most of the reasons given seem to be from someone who didnt really give the game a fair shot or didn't understand certain aspects of the rules.

As for savage pathfinder... I have mixed feelings about it. On one hand I hate paizo, and their sjw bullshit. Also the class edges undermine the freeform character creation system by shoe horning you into a certain playstyle and while you can forgo the class edges you will miss out on things like Epic Modifiers for powers. On the other hand the Fantasy companion is several editions out of date and most of stuff in there is either updated to be in the core rulebook or no longer in the game. Good for magic items, bestiary and some edges.

As for removing the CSA I was a pretty big critic of it, Shane Hensley's post cleared things up a little bit but thats how sjw bullshit always starts. It always starts small, and snowballs from there. Make no mistake stage 1 cancer is the best way to describe it, a small tumor. More and more sjw types have been migrating into various SW groups, and if they didn't exist i'd probably just dismiss removing the csa as who cares. It never added much to my games, but it served as a constant reminder that you were in a different timeline or version of earth. Now with them gone, you can effectively also dissolve the Coyote Federation and the other native american faction, and it makes future timelines alot less of a hassle to justify. Like Deadlands Noir.

Quote from: 234ne on June 23, 2021, 11:18:59 PM

Quote from: FingerRod on June 23, 2021, 07:01:39 PM
Why do you recommend miniature? With all of this SW talk, I dusted off my SWADE copy and I am planning to run a one shot this weekend. Was going to go TotM, but now I'm curious.

It feels more natural for my group and a lot more fun whenever we bring the system up (albeit bit more hassle to setup). My opinion of it after playing with TotM and semi-Mini campaign, I think the devs, at least when starting out, wanted to make a game similar to a skirmish wargame (i.e. Mordheim), but with more option of it as a RPG. So rather than running it like a traditional RPG's structure, it feels like it was made to run with a series of 'mini skirmish battles" with in-between scenes of drama (in hindsight maybe that's why the devs emphasize a 'plot point campaign' rather than a sandbox style).

Also for somethings it makes more sense or its easier to understand in a mini format. For example, one of my players got a new appreciation for reach weapons when hitting people in elevation with a 3D model (also you can push people off for extra damage).   

I've never been able to make ToM work well with SW as soon as a couple of antagonists are involved. I needed minis with explicit distances.

how is it different from D&D? Inches were part of those measuring of the tabletop like SW. Adjudication of the blast-effects? That's the only thing I can think of that takes basic ruling.

Quote from: tenbones on June 29, 2021, 07:32:06 PM
how is it different from D&D? Inches were part of those measuring of the tabletop like SW. Adjudication of the blast-effects? That's the only thing I can think of that takes basic ruling.

Blast effects have a sidebar that makes them super easy in TotM.

Between grid and TOTM there is also 'general distances'. Where you have a basic sketch detailing where crap is.

Quote from: HappyDaze on June 29, 2021, 08:30:42 PM

Quote from: tenbones on June 29, 2021, 07:32:06 PM
how is it different from D&D? Inches were part of those measuring of the tabletop like SW. Adjudication of the blast-effects? That's the only thing I can think of that takes basic ruling.

Blast effects have a sidebar that makes them super easy in TotM.

Oh I have no problem with ToM in any game I play. I was just asking why Pencilboy was having problems.

I think the Blast Templates are pretty easy to get without the need for the Battlemat. But I do understand that ToM doesn't come easy to a lot of players, which may be the case here.