Quote from: CRKrueger;396447Yeah, they go out of their way to say "Oh no, this isn't really Forge stuff, the GM has the final say", but C'mon, shared narration is a type of narrative control technique, even if the GM or other players can veto.

Oh I forgot. Everything is about the imaginary pundit/forge war. Gotcha.

Carry on.

Quote from: Saphim;396449Oh I forgot. Everything is about the imaginary pundit/forge war. Gotcha.

Carry on.

No, thats just what CrKrueger fixated on in my comments.

@ Krueger - I don't read website descriptions while walking around the store and checking things/straigtening them out and such. My initial impession before purchasing was based just on what was printed on the back of the package and my past experiences with PAIZO usually making very nice products.

After reading the suggestion cards in the pack it seems this more along the lines of the gaming equivalent of "Hamburger Helper". In this case the hamburger is whatever game you have aleady and these cards are there to help give asmidgeon of variety or spice thiongs up - but still controlled and rationed out by the GM.


- Ed C.

Still don't have the answer to the question of -

 Have any of you guys bought these yet?

-OR-

Have you seen them used in play yet?



- Ed C.

Quote from: Saphim;396449Oh I forgot. Everything is about the imaginary pundit/forge war. Gotcha.

Carry on.

Whoa, look at that dodge.  So I guess you're just one of those guys that can't admit you jumped the gun and were wrong. Gotcha.

Gotta love the Pundit strawman, poor thing must be in tatters by now it gets used so much.

As you said, there's a whole lot of "suggest" in there.  They mention 5 or 6 times that both players and GMs can use these cards, and they also repeat again and again that the GM has final say.  The second paragraph is basically saying the same thing 4 different ways.  Why are they going well out of their way to hammer the point home that the GM has final say?

The answer is, because they want to sell these things to people who want to use them as a GM idea booster and to people who want to use them in a shared narrative format, so they want to make sure that everyone knows for sure that it's not solely a narrative tool.

Quote from: Koltar;396451Still don't have the answer to the question of -

Answer to original post...
Yes, they have popped up at the FLGS.

No, I have not bought them yet.  I may, if I see a preview card and like it.

Yes, if I had them, I would use them as Hamburger Helper, not during an actual session unless the game itself had a mechanism for bringing them in, like FantasyCraft's Perks.  I could see popping one of these out as a Perk.

So we know what we're talking about here.







And while we're on the topic of Pathfinder...

Boy I wish the movie was as badass as that poster.

It seems a lot like the Action/Master Deck from West End Games old Masterbook system, doesn't it?
They could be used both for subplotting ("Character has some vested interest in the situation") and to give bonuses on actions ("add +3 to action value of Dexterity").

And to answer the original question - No, I haven't seen them; don't think they've made it across the pond yet, but I certainly think that they would add an interesting dimension to a classic D&D/Pathfinder game and if I am ever gonna run such a game I would consider using them... and they look rather neat.

Quote from: DKChannelBoredom;396459It seems a lot like the Action/Master Deck from West End Games old Masterbook system, doesn't it?

I was thinking the old Whimsy cards from the old Ars Magica gang (Lion Rampant, wasn't it?)

Sampling by John Kim:
http://www.darkshire.net/jhkim/rpg/systemdesign/cards/whimsycards.html

I think someone played the unexplained event card on the game of my life yesterday when my car window exploded.

Quote from: Caesar Slaad;396462I think someone played the unexplained event card on the game of my life yesterday when my car window exploded.

That was me, sorry.  It was either that or discard from my hand and effectively lose a turn.

!i!

Quote from: CRKrueger;396455Whoa, look at that dodge.  So I guess you're just one of those guys that can't admit you jumped the gun and were wrong. Gotcha.

Gotta love the Pundit strawman, poor thing must be in tatters by now it gets used so much.

No, I'm not dodging anything. I just don't see anywhere anything that suggests to me that this is actually a tool of shared narrative control and not (like I mentioned above) something that isn't already happening at most tables (albeit with fancy cards) AND I am bored of the constant tries to shoehorn stuff into easy to understand boxes.

Quote from: Saphim;396484No, I'm not dodging anything. I just don't see anywhere anything that suggests to me that this is actually a tool of shared narrative control and not (like I mentioned above) something that isn't already happening at most tables (albeit with fancy cards) AND I am bored of the constant tries to shoehorn stuff into easy to understand boxes.

My regular players and I already had a minor version of this going on for years. We use 3 by 5 or 4 by 6 cards and write important notes or side notes back and forth bnetween the GM and player on these.

Originally it was just to initiate stuff that a player wanted to do on her or his own that wasn't really the group's business but it still made sense for the game. OR sometimes I would use a card to tell a player something thatr only her character had detected or remembered because of a roll I did behind the GM screen.
 Using 3 by 5 cards this way was often easier than getting up or calling the player over to do the whispering in the ear moment that many game sessions often have.

Aftaer a while, players started using these card communications with me to offer ideas or suggestions or to add backstory to their characters. I would up having to keep the cards in 3-ring binder with the group's regular campaiugn log because so many important bits of detail had been discussed on these cards.
In some weays these PAIZO cards are just overly-formalized vbersions of when my players would suggest things via 3 by 5 or 4 by 6 cards. The difference is my players had suggestions that were specifically connected to the campaign that we were doing.


- Ed C.

Quote from: Koltar;396485My regular players and I already had a minor version of this going on for years. We use 3 by 5 or 4 by 6 cards and write important notes or side notes back and forth bnetween the GM and player on these.

Originally it was just to initiate stuff that a player wanted to do on her or his own that wasn't really the group's business but it still made sense for the game. OR sometimes I would use a card to tell a player something thatr only her character had detected or remembered because of a roll I did behind the GM screen.
 Using 3 by 5 cards this way was often easier than getting up or calling the player over to do the whispering in the ear moment that many game sessions often have.

Aftaer a while, players started using these card communications with me to offer ideas or suggestions or to add backstory to their characters. I would up having to keep the cards in 3-ring binder with the group's regular campaiugn log because so many important bits of detail had been discussed on these cards.
In some weays these PAIZO cards are just overly-formalized vbersions of when my players would suggest things via 3 by 5 or 4 by 6 cards. The difference is my players had suggestions that were specifically connected to the campaign that we were doing.


- Ed C.

That's already pretty sophistacted what you got going there.
I think, that every group has something like that going, you talk about the game, you say what you think would be cool, others agree and it happens or they disagree and it doesn't happen.
If THAT is shared authority, then every RPG on the planet is a storygame.

In the case of my old campaign a player would often say something like this :

PLAYER: "Did you read what I wrote in the middle of the card I gave you ?"

ED/ME: "Yes, I read the whole card."

PLAYER: "Well? Is it going to happen? "

ED: "Maybe, maybe not... but it is very much under consideration. You have an interesting idea there. It might not be tonight's game tho."

PLAYER "Okay...cool"

Then she smiles because she got the idea that I was seriously coinsidering the 'whatever-it-was' that she had suggested.

There was one time That suddenly I had an NPC do something and say a bit of dialogue that was very obviously from a player's idea bit. When she noticed, she had a shocked pleased look on her face and after the game she was telling the other players:
  "He got that from me!! Ed  used an idea I had from a few weeeks ago.."

 She was pleased and surprised  at the same time in the game. Did a similiar idea moment with her husband's character one time.


- Ed C.