Quote from: ArtemisWyrm on September 08, 2021, 03:46:27 PM

Quote from: slocum on September 08, 2021, 03:44:29 PM

Quote from: brettmb on August 31, 2021, 05:52:49 PM
Stop with the politics and keep to the topic.

This entire post is political. I guess everyone needs more irony in their diet.

No you are making it political. Keep on topic.

Other than pointing out that a post that grades companies by their politics is political, I haven't commented on this thread.

Quote from: PonchoGoblin on September 08, 2021, 03:33:18 PM
...
I mean he just says "oh my game has people of color, so I belong in the enemy list" which is some pretty smooth-brained logic. I'd put him in the green list, he doesn't put his politics in his games, particularly his newer works. Likewise you can have a "genderqueer polyamorous unicorn furry" or whatever you want, just don't push politics in your game or put "if you voted or believe this then you deserve to die or not play my game". Stark difference. That's actually why I was thinking Arc Dream and some others would be yellow, there isn't much politics in the game/company, just the people behind the work are woke idiots. My 2 cents

Edit: I also think he's wrong that it's an enemies list, and that many people have enemies lists, his "side" or whatever included. Once again, it's a think before you buy list

Gotta love the "new" members with their concerns... helpfully pointing out important things for us to notice. So nice of them... ROTFL!


IMHO - Wick should not be on the list at all.

Here's why:

He sold the rights to the games he made that were big names.

Nobody plays his other games.

He's no longer relevant in the hobby.


In fact a great case can be made to take all irrelevant game designers companies off the Red listing.

i.e. They are too irrelevant and obscure to be worth mentioning:

Arcanist Press -  Who??
Gay Spaceship Games/April Kit Walsh - Evil hat listing covers them...
Old Skull Publishing/Diogo Nogueira (Sharp Swords and Sinister Spells) - One rando who the SJW's don't even promote...

I would leave on some of the outright racists like MYFAROG just so people can see what company they keep...

Making it a bit more about the green listings. IMHO

Another example.

The lists grades companies on behaviour, not politics. You might see not being shitty to your customers as political, but its not.

Quote from: ArtemisWyrm on September 08, 2021, 04:00:27 PM
The lists grades companies on behaviour, not politics. You might see not being shitty to your customers as political, but its not.

THIS.

That almost all the companies in the RED listing seem to have a certain political bent is not Ocule's fault.

They defined themselves by their Actions.

In this video, a game designer is gaslighting us by calling it an "enemies list" and then basically saying the left would never do such a thing.  Ha!

https://youtu.be/shc-APo2XoU

Quote from: Ghostmaker on September 08, 2021, 03:16:50 PM
Oh, fuck OFF with you, HappyDerp, you pussy.

This is exactly what I read about a while back. When non/anti-SJWs starting pulling out the same tools to whack SJW knuckles, expect the infiltrators and quislings to clutch their pearls and cry about how terrible it is when we do it.

Greetings!

Exactly, Ghostmaker! *Laughing* Look at all the Quisling pussies crying! Tools are tools. Whatever brings victory. The Quisling pussies can join the "Lose Gracefully" morons.

The SJW's hate it when people think for themselves nd refuse to swallow the Marxist jello. The List doesn't cancel anyone, and it doesn't tell anyone not to buy from X company. It provides information so that a gaming consumer can understand where their money goes, and what kind of companies and creators their money supports. Notice how eager people are to be signed up on the GREEN list?

The Marxist, Rainbow shoggoths love being on the Red List. GOOD! Let the whole world see how they hate normal gamers, how they don't want Conservative customers, how they like to ram politics down everyone's throat, and how they hate people that VOTED FOR THE GOD EMPEROR!!!! It is good for the world to see! They should be PROUD!

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Quote from: ArtemisWyrm on September 08, 2021, 04:00:27 PM
The lists grades companies on behaviour, not politics. You might see not being shitty to your customers as political, but its not.

You don't like their behavior, because it impinges on your politics. But I'll take your word for it: you have no idea what being political means.

Quote from: Ocule on September 08, 2021, 03:03:19 PM
Reluctance is justified, because of one time he went full Karen? Fuckin please. I've tried to be as impartial is possible, i'm still human. And the only reason I even kept up a red category is because it seemed people here believed it was helpful. Are you just trying to be contrarian or do you have a point?

Not just that one time, he also, as I posted right under that, bounced Venger from his discord due to pressure over people calling Venger "transphobic". And my point is that Tenkar is being kept off this list for purely political reasons, undermining the credibility of the entire thing.

We don't need to regard the opinions of those who are working in bad faith. Don't like it? Make your own list.

Quote from: Jaeger on September 08, 2021, 03:58:10 PM

Quote from: PonchoGoblin on September 08, 2021, 03:33:18 PM
...
I mean he just says "oh my game has people of color, so I belong in the enemy list" which is some pretty smooth-brained logic. I'd put him in the green list, he doesn't put his politics in his games, particularly his newer works. Likewise you can have a "genderqueer polyamorous unicorn furry" or whatever you want, just don't push politics in your game or put "if you voted or believe this then you deserve to die or not play my game". Stark difference. That's actually why I was thinking Arc Dream and some others would be yellow, there isn't much politics in the game/company, just the people behind the work are woke idiots. My 2 cents

Edit: I also think he's wrong that it's an enemies list, and that many people have enemies lists, his "side" or whatever included. Once again, it's a think before you buy list

Gotta love the "new" members with their concerns... helpfully pointing out important things for us to notice. So nice of them... ROTFL!


IMHO - Wick should not be on the list at all.

Here's why:

He sold the rights to the games he made that were big names.

Nobody plays his other games.

He's no longer relevant in the hobby.


In fact a great case can be made to take all irrelevant game designers companies off the Red listing.

i.e. They are too irrelevant and obscure to be worth mentioning:

Arcanist Press -  Who??
Gay Spaceship Games/April Kit Walsh - Evil hat listing covers them...
Old Skull Publishing/Diogo Nogueira (Sharp Swords and Sinister Spells) - One rando who the SJW's don't even promote...

I would leave on some of the outright racists like MYFAROG just so people can see what company they keep...

Making it a bit more about the green listings. IMHO

Actually I quite like that idea Jaeger, make it people that are big (ish) that actively participate, as opposed to people such as John who wrote something years ago but now doesn't even have the license for it. As for green listings, a good portion of the OSR could be on it, but then the "actively making content" moniker should apply to all. Hell, I pointed out to John that asking to be put on it means he is admitting he is no better than Varg.

As I said before, I haven't even read any of John Wick's stuff since 7th Sea 1e, so I guess I was unaware he was pushing political slant.

   I have a little bit of advice for people wanting further explanation about a list being made.  If you screech at someone about hating them and finally start slapping them,   you do not get to be surprised if you end up spitting teeth.   It seems if it is that upsetting, just go to your own yard and play if you can not get along with the kids from another yard.   Pretty simple.

Quote from: Tubesock Army on September 08, 2021, 01:53:10 PM

Quote from: Ocule on September 08, 2021, 01:47:57 PM

Quote from: therealjcm on September 08, 2021, 01:40:41 PM

Quote from: Ocule on September 08, 2021, 01:23:46 PM
The real question is though, do I include creators that are so small i doubt their own mothers even know they still exist?

If you start trying to track every mentally ill twatter who ever "sold" 10 copies of their pwyw supplement on drivethru then I think the list would lose some of its value. Maybe a requirement that they have at least a single copper bestseller before inclusion or some other criteria would be useful.

Yeah, there needs to be a minimum bar to keep it relevant.

Quote from: Tubesock Army on September 08, 2021, 01:43:28 PM
Still Waiting for Erik Tenkar to be placed on the Red List for the "anti-consumer behavior" (which is specifically listed by the list's author as enough to keep one out of both the Green and Yellow Lists) of getting a product pulled from OBS for content he didn't like. As I pointed out earlier, Tenkar was called out vociferously on this very forum.

Also look how upset the SJWs are lol
https://www.redbubble.com/i/t-shirt/On-The-Red-RPG-List-by-CogswellDesign/88048921.XNZKR

I need more information on Tenkar before putting him on the list i've seen conflicting information about him. Also that is freakin hilarious, thats like being proud your restaurant couldn't pass a health inspection and wearing it like a badge of honor. Big mad

Bro, I literally linked the thread on here where everyone was decrying his actions. You're not trying very hard. Here it is again. YOU made the list. YOU set the terms. Is "anti-consumer" behavior criteria for getting into the red list? If not, you need to edit what you wrote.

https://www.therpgsite.com/pen-paper-roleplaying-games-rpgs-discussion/acab-erik-karen-tavern-gets-obs-module-taken-down/

And here is Venger's blog post complaining about getting booted from Tenkar's Discord over, among other things, his "coming out" as trans-tentacle or whatever the fuck. How much evidence do you need? To the Red List with him!

https://vengersatanis.blogspot.com/2019/03/whats-opposite-of-humble.html

There are multiple people on the Green list that have done something that could place them on the Yellow list. Those lists should be for people with patterns of behavior, although I do agree that the bar for entry on any of these lists might be too low. And some people on the Yellow list (Reaper Miniatures for example) should be on the green list. Tenkar has generally seemed to stay neutral on the whole political drama with the exception of this one incident, and this incident was the result of him taking our ideas too far and believing that political statements should have absolutely no place on the front page of a storefront, which basically crosses the line into censorship. People on the Red list have a pattern of bad behavior.

Once again, I wish to state that this problem could be easily solved by introducing a separate list for neutrals and Anti-SJWs. Removing the Yellow and Red list is a valid idea, but as I said, some of the names on the Yellow list should be moved to the hypothetical neutral list with a footnote about the mentioned incidents, and yes, Tenkar should be on the neutral list with a footnote that he did delve into censorship this one time. Or perhaps we reimagine the list as Anti-SJWs, true neutrals, and neutrals who have done something unsavory in the past.

The Rules
"Power is not only what you have but what the enemy thinks you have."
"Never go outside the expertise of your people."
"Whenever possible go outside the expertise of the enemy."
"Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules."
"Ridicule is man's most potent weapon. There is no defense. It is almost impossible to counterattack ridicule. Also it infuriates the opposition, who then react to your advantage."
"A good tactic is one your people enjoy."
"A tactic that drags on too long becomes a drag."
"Keep the pressure on."
"The threat is usually more terrifying than the thing itself. "
"The major premise for tactics is the development of operations that will maintain a constant pressure upon the opposition."
"If you push a negative hard and deep enough it will break through into its counterside; this is based on the principle that every positive has its negative."
"The price of a successful attack is a constructive alternative."
"Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it. "


  Seems like if everyone plays by the same rules, things might get shaken up a bit.

Quote from: hoshisabi on September 07, 2021, 11:12:34 PM
Excellent, and your list can also help provide me and other SJW folks the same benefit, as you're providing a list of games made by people who hate us and which ones don't.

I guess if you're the "Silence is Violence" type then certainly, but that's not reality.