Just to comment on ghost rock in Deadlands, it is not just a macguffin. If you read the hell on earth book of the deadlines series it was revealed how ghost rock was created, who did it and why. It also revealed that ghost rock had an ultimate goal, which it attained in Hell on Earth.

I now return you to the Horus and Jeff show...

Quote from: Schwartzwald;983516Just to comment on ghost rock in Deadlands, it is not just a macguffin. If you read the hell on earth book of the deadlines series it was revealed how ghost rock was created, who did it and why. It also revealed that ghost rock had an ultimate goal, which it attained in Hell on Earth.

I now return you to the Horus and Jeff show...

Agreed. A McGuffin is something that exists solely to push the plot along. Ghost rock has very real uses for the players. It's a part of the plot, certainly, but it also serves as currency in a lot of places and will be essential for using mad science. Or you might have a group that ignores it entirely. So it definitely doesn't qualify for McGuffin status.

Quote from: Schwartzwald;983516Just to comment on ghost rock in Deadlands, it is not just a macguffin. If you read the hell on earth book of the deadlines series it was revealed how ghost rock was created, who did it and why. It also revealed that ghost rock had an ultimate goal, which it attained in Hell on Earth.

I now return you to the Horus and Jeff show...

Quote from: Brand55;983518Agreed. A McGuffin is something that exists solely to push the plot along. Ghost rock has very real uses for the players. It's a part of the plot, certainly, but it also serves as currency in a lot of places and will be essential for using mad science. Or you might have a group that ignores it entirely. So it definitely doesn't qualify for McGuffin status.

MacGuffinite, which has a different definition than a MacGuffin.

Quote from: jeff37923;983560MacGuffinite, which has a different definition than a MacGuffin.

Had to look it up since that's a much more obscure reference, but it's still not true for two main reasons. First, ghost rock is found all over the place. The west coast has a ton of it, absolutely, but it's hardly the only source. From what I read, MacGuffinite needs to only be available "out there" and thus be the motivating factor for people to go to a place. Second, the push westward was driven by a number of issues, the largest of which was probably the competition between the USA and CSA for more land, resources, etc. Ghost rock was just one part of that, albeit a really big piece. And then you also had plenty of normal folks looking to make new lives for themselves, and the west offered them the best chance for that.

A good way to think of ghost rock is to look at gold in our real history. It certainly played a huge part in the westward expansion of the US, but it was hardly the single driving force responsible for causing the country to expand ever westward. Ghost rock is a bit more important to the Deadlands reality than gold was to ours, but the setting specifically draws parallels between the two.

Quote from: Brand55;983569Had to look it up since that's a much more obscure reference, but it's still not true for two main reasons. First, ghost rock is found all over the place. The west coast has a ton of it, absolutely, but it's hardly the only source. From what I read, MacGuffinite needs to only be available "out there" and thus be the motivating factor for people to go to a place. Second, the push westward was driven by a number of issues, the largest of which was probably the competition between the USA and CSA for more land, resources, etc. Ghost rock was just one part of that, albeit a really big piece. And then you also had plenty of normal folks looking to make new lives for themselves, and the west offered them the best chance for that.

A good way to think of ghost rock is to look at gold in our real history. It certainly played a huge part in the westward expansion of the US, but it was hardly the single driving force responsible for causing the country to expand ever westward. Ghost rock is a bit more important to the Deadlands reality than gold was to ours, but the setting specifically draws parallels between the two.

Well, at least you bothered to look it up, which is a step more than the others.....

Here's the clincher for me about why Ghost Rock is MacGuffinite. The Deadlands setting, metaplot and all, could not exist without it.

Quote from: jeff37923;983560MacGuffinite, which has a different definition than a MacGuffin.

Is hair spliting a dexterity based skill or a perception based one?

Quote from: jeff37923;983589Well, at least you bothered to look it up, which is a step more than the others.....

Here's the clincher for me about why Ghost Rock is MacGuffinite. The Deadlands setting, metaplot and all, could not exist without it.

You can "win" your argument all you want to. I still will not think of or refer to ghost rock as a mcguffin, mcguffinite, mcguffinium or anything similar and there's nothing you can do about it.

Quote from: Schwartzwald;983608You can "win" your argument all you want to. I still will not think of or refer to ghost rock as a mcguffin, mcguffinite, mcguffinium or anything similar and there's nothing you can do about it.

*tag* your in

Quote from: Schwartzwald;983607Is hair spliting a dexterity based skill or a perception based one?

Yes.

Quote from: Schwartzwald;983608You can "win" your argument all you want to. I still will not think of or refer to ghost rock as a mcguffin, mcguffinite, mcguffinium or anything similar and there's nothing you can do about it.

That's cool.

Quote from: HorusArisen;983609*tag* your in

Who is sick at your home? Are they getting better?

Me which is why I'm being an argumentative wank.

Less feverish and vomiting I concede you have a viewpoint, I don't agree with it but it's there.

Quote from: HorusArisen;983618Me which is why I'm being an argumentative wank.

Less feverish and vomiting I concede you have a viewpoint, I don't agree with it but it's there.

We don't agree on much, but I do hope you get well soon.

Quote from: jeff37923;983861We don't agree on much, but I do hope you get well soon.

Thanks

Yeah, hope you start feeling better soon. Feeling ill blows and it never makes me particularly charitable, so props for even staying remotely civil.

Jeff, I can see your point though I do disagree for the reasons I listed in my last post. For those that prefer less of the gonzo weirdness, I've actually recommended rolling back the timeline a bit to before mad science spreads widely and swapping gold in for ghost rock like in the real world. You end up with a setting that's a bit more like our history but still has the horror western flavor. It's not wildly different, but some of the parts that people really don't like are missing.

Quote from: XX;982154I think he just rolled an 8 on the rpgsite post generation table. It's right between #7 "I'm not wasting my money on that when I've already got (game published in 1d6+1973)" and #9 "I'm not wasting my money on a game full of (Roll 1d3: 1 PC, 2 SJW, 3 political) crap".

Not every entry on the table is about spending money. #3, for example, is "players today just don't have any imagination and might as well just play a (roll a d4: 1 video, 2 board, 3 card, 4 coin-flipping) game!"

Best post in a while. Hilarious.