What the tin says, I'm developing a game, one of the classes is The Gadgeteer, so far so good I've managed to make it not a wizard in disguise. BUT
And that's a big BUT, I'm hitting a wall of suck developing the gadgets.
Gadgets have to comply with the rule of cool while not violating the following:
Gadgets have to fall into one of : Existent, Plausible, Possible, Fantastic
The GM can of course rule out whatever.
Existent are the cheaper/fastest to develop/build while Fantastic are the other extreme.
Reliability goes the same way, Existent being the more reliable of all and Fantastic the least reliable.
Level 0/1 Gadgets examples:
Caltrops, Smoke Grenade, Flash Bang, Stroboscopic light... All Existent (withing the setting presuppositions)
Level 1/2 Gadget Examples: Glue Grenade, Parachute/Glide Cape/Trenchcoat...
And so on.
Since I'm aiming for a Pulpish feel, Gadgets need not be deadly, the Character will have proficiency and access to guns.
Oh my God I want to play this character class so badly.
What time/technology level are you targeting? From pulpish I'm guessing maybe up through mid-20th-century? Or later?
Spitballing:
Night vision goggles, tuning the plausibility/fantastic as desired
X-ray goggles, see through walls
Mechanical spy bug -- a tiny physical bug, with a mic and a transmitter, remote controlled
Short distance/low altitude jetpack (think Rocketeer)
Batman's utility belt - grappling hook, boomerang/throwing stars, sleep gas canisters
Super-defib - bring a recently deceased party member back to life, maybe
Short-range teleporter - high chance of failure? or fritzing out? prone to overheating?
Can't wait to see what you come up with. :D
Quote from: insubordinate polyhedral;1128838Oh my God I want to play this character class so badly.
What time/technology level are you targeting? From pulpish I'm guessing maybe up through mid-20th-century? Or later?
Spitballing:
Night vision goggles, tuning the plausibility/fantastic as desired
X-ray goggles, see through walls
Mechanical spy bug -- a tiny physical bug, with a mic and a transmitter, remote controlled
Short distance/low altitude jetpack (think Rocketeer)
Batman's utility belt - grappling hook, boomerang/throwing stars, sleep gas canisters
Super-defib - bring a recently deceased party member back to life, maybe
Short-range teleporter - high chance of failure? or fritzing out? prone to overheating?
Can't wait to see what you come up with. :D
Pulpish because I'm setting the action on the 1980's and keeping the tech mostly within Existent thru Possible nothing too fantastic,
But I'm planing a supplement/Appendix for playing in the 1920's-1950's and maybe more close to current year tm
Night vision/ X-Ray Googles, Jetpack/Rocketpack, Utility belt (Of course!)
Super-defib... Could be, but not like the bringing back from the dead in traditional D&D, maybe it has a time limit between the character dying and being able to bring it back?
Teleporter... Maybe at the higher levels?
So far the classes are : Soldier, Detective, Urban Legend, Gadgeteer, Mystic/Illusionist (the latter being a stage magician) and maybe Martial Artist.
Think playing The Shadow, The Spider, Black Bat, Green Lama, The Spirit, Dick Tracy, but in the 80's
No alignment, instead Ethos/Motivation : Revenge, Protect, Uphold the law.
I might include stuff to be able to play not The Phantom (The Ghost who Walks), Not Tarzan, and other classes at a latter date.
Will hit you up to playtest it ;)
Instead of pulp I think you may be actually meaning Street level crime fighters.
The Question has his featureless mask that also changes his hair colour.
Night Thrasher had body armor, and a weaponized skate board. (and a few other gadgets)
The Ted Kord version of Blue Beetle had a vtol craft and a flash gun to dazzle foes or emit a airblast to push close combatants.
Technically Captain America as he is just a very fit human armed with an indestructible trick shield and a suit of ballistic scale mail.
Moon Knight had a helicopter/vtol, crescent shaped throwing blades and sometimes fighting sticks originally. And a series of disguise personas.
Besides his super powers Spiderman also his web shooters and tracking bugs tuned to his spider sense, and a few special purpose suits and web fluids to combat villains with strange powers.
Iron Man might be another example. Especially from the 60s to 80s where his suit was very advanced, but not yet bordering on magic.
Or The Shield from Impact, he had a high tech suit and shield. Though that one and Iron Man might be stretching it a bit too much.
Quote from: Omega;1129029Instead of pulp I think you may be actually meaning Street level crime fighters.
The Question has his featureless mask that also changes his hair colour.
Night Thrasher had body armor, and a weaponized skate board. (and a few other gadgets)
The Ted Kord version of Blue Beetle had a vtol craft and a flash gun to dazzle foes or emit a airblast to push close combatants.
Technically Captain America as he is just a very fit human armed with an indestructible trick shield and a suit of ballistic scale mail.
Moon Knight had a helicopter/vtol, crescent shaped throwing blades and sometimes fighting sticks originally. And a series of disguise personas.
Besides his super powers Spiderman also his web shooters and tracking bugs tuned to his spider sense, and a few special purpose suits and web fluids to combat villains with strange powers.
Iron Man might be another example. Especially from the 60s to 80s where his suit was very advanced, but not yet bordering on magic.
Or The Shield from Impact, he had a high tech suit and shield. Though that one and Iron Man might be stretching it a bit too much.
Yes, street level vigilantes, but with a pulpish feel to it. So no Iron Man, you might get one major Gadget as a vehicle or a jet/rocket pack but nothing like that.
Thanks for reminding me of The Question (I shouldn't have the need owning all his comics), Rocket powered SkateBoard (YES!) Kord's Gun, Thanks!, Cap's Shield, yes it fits. Throwing Blades and Fighting Sticks already there. Web Shooters = Grappling Gun + Glue Grenade So, already there. Spidey's tracking bugs... Yes, but how do they work without spider sense? a receiver? So normal tracking bugs?
Iron Man nope, The Shield on the other hand yes.
I'm not gonna make an extensive Gadgets list, but a few (a dozen maybe) examples of each level and have players/GM come up with their own.
Thank you very much my friend.
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Some more.
The Rocketeer: A jet pack and sometimes a pistol. Has a friend with an autogyro.
Daredevil: ignoring the powers theres his billy club which also acted as a grappeling hook and could be disguised as his walking cane.
Black Widow: Originally had wrist shooters with an electrostunner or grappelling line. Also belt had detatchable mini grenades.
Torpedo: Flight suit and turbine assisted punches. Also visor enhanced to detect aliens disguised as humans.
Hawkeye and Green Arrow: Dozens of trick arrows. Gas, explosive, tazer, grappelling line, riccochet, flame retardant foam/spray, glue, etc. Quite a few were relatively doable too without stretching the tech too hard.
And another fringe one.
Yellowjacket and Wasp: Shrinking gas, ant control helmet, and mechanical flight wings, or in Wasps case bio-tech wings, when small and a bio-electric zap.
Doc Savage. More the earlier stories than the later.
I'm not really a comic book guy, but Bond movies might have some good ideas for gadgets (mostly "plausible " or "possible") from the 60s, 70s, 80s and beyond.
And if you want to introduce some silliness and humour, there's always the "spoof spy movie" genre.....Some amazingly stupid gadgets there
Btw as I said, not a comic book guy and maybe this should not be right up my alley at all but it sounds like a surprisingly fun idea, so best of luck with this.
Quick question, is the gadgeteer someone who has one or two trademark gadgets, or is it the boffin/crafting type who can devise and build almost anything as needed for a mission?
Spy shows certainly fit sometimes. Though originally 007s stuff was more mundane other than the various trick cars. Wrist mounted dart gun from Moonraker for example comes to mind as a relatively do-able gadget from later when they had at least one gadget per movie. Then it went back to more mundane again during the Brosnan era mostly and all the superscience was in the villains hands.
For the pseudo-spoof type there is Matt Helm. Delayed blast button grenades. A belt that turned into a sword when wet, a gun that shots backwards when set just so, and a few others.
Not a genre that I'm all that conversant in, but aren't some of the "possible" or "fantastic" grade items merely more plausible items that are concealable (or at least highly portable) and/or a little better than normal engineering would suggest? So you might have, for example, a climbing line that spools out of a relatively small container and will support the hero, when in reality such a line would be too thin to use safely or not strong enough.
Or is that mainly the difference between "possible" and "fantastic", where "possible" is something that would appear to work if you don't let the engineers critique it?
Quote from: Omega;1129140Spy shows certainly fit sometimes. Though originally 007s stuff was more mundane other than the various trick cars. Wrist mounted dart gun from Moonraker for example comes to mind as a relatively do-able gadget from later when they had at least one gadget per movie. Then it went back to more mundane again during the Brosnan era mostly and all the superscience was in the villains hands.
For the pseudo-spoof type there is Matt Helm. Delayed blast button grenades. A belt that turned into a sword when wet, a gun that shots backwards when set just so, and a few others.
Yes! Matt Helm! Super cheesy but so much fun. Dean Martin playing almost a parody of himself. Loved those.
Just thought of another one.
Dick Tracy. Two way wrist radio (later a wrist videophone).
Quote from: Zirunel;1129138Btw as I said, not a comic book guy and maybe this should not be right up my alley at all but it sounds like a surprisingly fun idea, so best of luck with this.
Quick question, is the gadgeteer someone who has one or two trademark gadgets, or is it the boffin/crafting type who can devise and build almost anything as needed for a mission?
That's a good question, and one I haven't yet answered, for the pulpish feel it could be both under the right circumstances : The Scientist but with a twist is your Wizard in DnD, just a couple of trademark gadgets plus some "scientific" tricks is the more pulp, unless you're going for Doc Savage and he's a Paragon.
I'm leaning towards a couple of trademark gadgets plus maybe some smaller more mundane gadgets (caltrops, smoke grenades, etc)
What do you guys think?
@ Omega, Zirunel, RandyB Those are all great sugestions, thank you very much, keep it coming if you can/want
Quote from: Steven Mitchell;1129141Not a genre that I'm all that conversant in, but aren't some of the "possible" or "fantastic" grade items merely more plausible items that are concealable (or at least highly portable) and/or a little better than normal engineering would suggest? So you might have, for example, a climbing line that spools out of a relatively small container and will support the hero, when in reality such a line would be too thin to use safely or not strong enough.
Or is that mainly the difference between "possible" and "fantastic", where "possible" is something that would appear to work if you don't let the engineers critique it?
Lets see, how do I explain my idea?
Lets say it's set in the 80's
Existent: Cassette recorder
Plausible: Mini Cassette recorder (lets say half the size)
Possible: Micro Cassette recorder (1/4 the size)
Fantastic: 3mm thick 6 centimeter diameter Quartz crystal disk with the storage capacity of a million cassettes.
Current year:
Existent: Smart Watches
Plausible: Smart Watches twice as powerful
Possible: Smart Watches 4 times as powerful
Fantastic: Smart Watches as powerful as existing supercomputers
It's the rule of cool tempered by immersion breaking stuff. Off course it's all relative to the setting and the level of handwavium you as the GM want to allow in the game.
The Soldier and The Prowler roll to see if they get one minor gadget or some sort of limited mystic power or nothing, this power could be innate or powered by some trinket, a ring... The minor Gadget could be a Grappling Gun, a Shield, a bullet proof suit, something like that.
The Mystic gets no Gadget and the Gadgeteer gets no Mystic power.
The Gadgeteer rolls or chooses his starting Gadgeteer weapon:
Bow, Cross Bow or Grappling Gun, gets the proficiency needed for it in order to get a +1 when using it.
I might make separate progression tables for each, or just the one with some toys with a generic name so it can be applied to all.
Everybody can get Martial Arts as a skill, but only The Soldier and Prowler can get to the black belt, and only The Mystic can use Chi powers?
Quote from: GeekyBugle;1129184@ Omega, Zirunel, RandyB Those are all great sugestions, thank you very much, keep it coming if you can/want
Batman. Utility belt.
Any hero with a utility belt.
Some were one and done. They had XYZ gadgets stocked and that never changed.
Others were prep based. They loaded out the belt with things they thought might need for a specific sortie.
The original Cyborg novels that 6 Million Dollar Man was based on.
2 artificial legs allowing him to run a faster (at about olympic level) and without tiring.
1 artificial arm with a 1-shot dart gun in the hand. Used mostly as a bludgeon.
1 artificial eye that in the first book housed a small camera. Cant see with it. Think in one of the later books it is replaced with a 1-shot laser.
Part of skull replaced with steel plate.
1 rib replaced with radio transmitter.
In the books his artificial limbs were not at superhuman levels like in the TV series.
Quote from: GeekyBugle;1129184@ Omega, Zirunel, RandyB Those are all great sugestions, thank you very much, keep it coming if you can/want
Sorry I can't think of any gadget ideas but not because I m not willing to help. Maybe When it's time to talk supplements?
When Omega brought up Matt Helm that really crystallized for me what I was already thinking, that a tongue-in-cheek 60s approach could be seriously fun. And with stylish retro art, maybe even quite successful too? I am also interested in your idea of a 1920s-1950s take. Although again, my thoughts may run more to screwball comedy than a serious approach, and that may not be where you want to go with this. Anyway, more than willing to chat about this any time. I do think there is potentially a lot of fun to be had here.
Oh. Having said that, there's The Prisoner. Big floppy balloon things that pursue and capture without killing. Of course, with The Prisoner you leave tongue-in-cheek behind and enter the realm of surreal and psychedelic mind-games.
Quote from: GeekyBugle;1128846Pulpish because I'm setting the action on the 1980's and keeping the tech mostly within Existent thru Possible nothing too fantastic,
If it's the '80s, somebody needs to have a talking car. Or motorcycle. Or helicopter.
Quote from: Zirunel;1129501Sorry I can't think of any gadget ideas but not because I m not willing to help. Maybe When it's time to talk supplements?
When Omega brought up Matt Helm that really crystallized for me what I was already thinking, that a tongue-in-cheek 60s approach could be seriously fun. And with stylish retro art, maybe even quite successful too? I am also interested in your idea of a 1920s-1950s take. Although again, my thoughts may run more to screwball comedy than a serious approach, and that may not be where you want to go with this. Anyway, more than willing to chat about this any time. I do think there is potentially a lot of fun to be had here.
Not sure I'm up to the skill level needed for a tongue in cheek approach for anything, my humor tends to get 3 reactions : Don't get it, hate it and me, love it.
Plus I would need to brush up on my 60's spy movies, and the TV Batman Show won't find it's way in any of my writings ever.
But I see no reason why a GM couldn't make his own gadgets that are tongue in cheek.
Quote from: smcc360;1129627If it's the '80s, somebody needs to have a talking car. Or motorcycle. Or helicopter.
That's science fiction, not within what I'm trying to do, but I see no reason for a crafty GM not being able to work it in there.
Quote from: GeekyBugle;1129703That's science fiction, not within what I'm trying to do, but I see no reason for a crafty GM not being able to work it in there.
Actually the 70s and 80s had a few high tech heroes whos vehicles were advanced but do-able within limits.
Knightrider: overlooking the AI for now there is these things. Bullet proof, battering ram. Jet assist leaps. Mobile forensics analysis. In a way it harkens back to...
Speed Racer/Mach GoGoGo: an anime from the mid 60s. The car had various high tech gadgets. Bullet proof windshield with canopy, extendable buzzsaw blades, remote controlled RC flying camera, and piston jacks that allowed the car to make limited leaps, deployable ATV treads, and limited submersibility. Various features added over the course of the series.
Street Hawk: Much like the above two, but a motorcycle. Bulletproof, computer assist turbo boost and jet assist leaps, laser, and a few other gadgets. The bike and suit needed alot of maintenance.
Airwolf: Bulletproof, turbo boost. Otherwise armed with just improved versions of tech from the prior decade my dad would have been familliar with as a on board combat engineer. such as the vision tracking targeting assist.
Salvage 1: Junk salvagers using a tail landing rocket for various services. Asimov was the science advisor for the show. They mostly used it as an air transport and only went into space I think twice. Essentially a flashy transport for the ground crew. Something akin to the German Focke-Wulf Triebflügel,, Convair XFY Pogo, or Lockheed XFV 'Salmon' would fit too.
Quote from: Omega;1129716Actually the 70s and 80s had a few high tech heroes whos vehicles were advanced but do-able within limits.
Knightrider: overlooking the AI for now there is these things. Bullet proof, battering ram. Jet assist leaps. Mobile forensics analysis. In a way it harkens back to...
Speed Racer/Mach GoGoGo: an anime from the mid 60s. The car had various high tech gadgets. Bullet proof windshield with canopy, extendable buzzsaw blades, remote controlled RC flying camera, and piston jacks that allowed the car to make limited leaps, deployable ATV treads, and limited submersibility. Various features added over the course of the series.
Street Hawk: Much like the above two, but a motorcycle. Bulletproof, computer assist turbo boost and jet assist leaps, laser, and a few other gadgets. The bike and suit needed alot of maintenance.
Airwolf: Bulletproof, turbo boost. Otherwise armed with just improved versions of tech from the prior decade my dad would have been familliar with as a on board combat engineer. such as the vision tracking targeting assist.
Salvage 1: Junk salvagers using a tail landing rocket for various services. Asimov was the science advisor for the show. They mostly used it as an air transport and only went into space I think twice. Essentially a flashy transport for the ground crew. Something akin to the German Focke-Wulf Triebflügel,, Convair XFY Pogo, or Lockheed XFV 'Salmon' would fit too.
Well, high tech vehicles are already in my to do list, or a table for you to build them to be precise. But none will start anywhere close to KIT as per the gadgets, those will have to be added on latter. I mean no fucking AI. Bullet proof, guns, rockets, caltrop, oil, smoke launchers, etc. adding a jet/rocket costs extra and way too much for the average player to be able to afford it before level 10 maybe 20.
Because I want it pulpish, so I'm thinking of vehicles at the Black Beauty level tops. The vehicle is a tool not a character.
Quote from: GeekyBugle;1129734Well, high tech vehicles are already in my to do list, or a table for you to build them to be precise. But none will start anywhere close to KIT as per the gadgets, those will have to be added on latter. I mean no fucking AI. Bullet proof, guns, rockets, caltrop, oil, smoke launchers, etc. adding a jet/rocket costs extra and way too much for the average player to be able to afford it before level 10 maybe 20.
Because I want it pulpish, so I'm thinking of vehicles at the Black Beauty level tops. The vehicle is a tool not a character.
The original from the serial was borderline SF as it could easily attain speeds in excess of 200mph with its special chemical plant. The TV series version is probably doable outside the occasional fantastical gadgets. The night vision system was extant well before the 60s for example.
As for the Mach 5. Its bullet proof within limits. The saw blades were probably the only real push into the fantastical due to their power. Unlike other special cars it was not invincible.
Adding vehicles to the street-level crimefighting suggests that there must be criminals out there with equally tricked out rides for these folk to take on.
Oh and two more super rides.
The rig from The Highwayman: Overall just a very sturdy rig with some bulletproofing. But the real treat was that the cab was also a helicopter. The series though quickly transitioned into straight up sci-fi. Think at various points it had a laser cannon and a cloaking device. Been a few decades so not sure on that.
Blue Thunder: A fairly mundane combat helicopter with stealth and surveillance hardware.
Quote from: Omega;1129876The original from the serial was borderline SF as it could easily attain speeds in excess of 200mph with its special chemical plant. The TV series version is probably doable outside the occasional fantastical gadgets. The night vision system was extant well before the 60s for example.
As for the Mach 5. Its bullet proof within limits. The saw blades were probably the only real push into the fantastical due to their power. Unlike other special cars it was not invincible.
Adding vehicles to the street-level crimefighting suggests that there must be criminals out there with equally tricked out rides for these folk to take on.
Oh and two more super rides.
The rig from The Highwayman: Overall just a very sturdy rig with some bulletproofing. But the real treat was that the cab was also a helicopter. The series though quickly transitioned into straight up sci-fi. Think at various points it had a laser cannon and a cloaking device. Been a few decades so not sure on that.
Blue Thunder: A fairly mundane combat helicopter with stealth and surveillance hardware.
Not Pulp because it's a new character but pulpish in the feel: The Rocketeer
He's the type of gadgeteer I'm going for, a gun toting crimefighter with a very powerful gadget. Or a few but not really powerful nor fantastic.
Other Crimefighters will have some type of "mystic" power, again keeping it within the pulp limits, not really superheroes, Think The Shadow before they made him kinda professor X. Or some magic powers, but again nothing really major small things because they all use some sort of weapon, be it guns, swords, boomerangs, etc.
Yeah was thinking of the pre-Professor X iteration of the Shadow as well. I grabbed some of the radio plays and in at least one he was using long distance telepathy.
As for the Rocketeer. I have a few issues. The flight pack is not all that powerful a power. Its more a travel mode from A to B. Aside from occasionally doing a flying tackle/ram he was mostly a ground level combatant with fists and rarely the gun.
Which is akin to my comment prior on vehicles that are essentially just travel props and not actually used for battle. Or rarely used so. Essentially what Green Hornets car was in the serial.
Something to consider heavily with this is just how prevalent guns are. Fur pulp style street level crime fighting you either have to keep the guns to a bare minimum, or have some way a non-ranged hero can walk into such encounters and not get shot. Not everyone is as agile as characters like Daredevil for example. Things like lots of cover and stuff the hero can use to their advantage.
Quote from: Omega;1130245Yeah was thinking of the pre-Professor X iteration of the Shadow as well. I grabbed some of the radio plays and in at least one he was using long distance telepathy.
As for the Rocketeer. I have a few issues. The flight pack is not all that powerful a power. Its more a travel mode from A to B. Aside from occasionally doing a flying tackle/ram he was mostly a ground level combatant with fists and rarely the gun.
Which is akin to my comment prior on vehicles that are essentially just travel props and not actually used for battle. Or rarely used so. Essentially what Green Hornets car was in the serial.
Something to consider heavily with this is just how prevalent guns are. Fur pulp style street level crime fighting you either have to keep the guns to a bare minimum, or have some way a non-ranged hero can walk into such encounters and not get shot. Not everyone is as agile as characters like Daredevil for example. Things like lots of cover and stuff the hero can use to their advantage.
Hiding in shadows, "invisibility" (hypnotizing people into not seeing you), smoke grenades, plus everybody gets a gun. And if I can, copy the FNF gunfight rules from Cyberpunk.
Also get the drop on the baddies, and of course lots of cover, not difficult since it takes place in cities.