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Pen & Paper Roleplaying Central => Pen and Paper Roleplaying Games (RPGs) Discussion => Topic started by: Pierce Inverarity on July 26, 2007, 01:34:57 AM

Title: Help Me, For I Have Won Hackmaster...
Post by: Pierce Inverarity on July 26, 2007, 01:34:57 AM
...on ebay. For a song.

What can I look forward to here? (I've read most rpg.net reviews.)

I've never read KotDT, but I know what it is. That's probably enough to "get" it?

I know AD&D 1E pretty well.

Anything to look out for? Rules issues, whatever? I won both the player's and the GM guide. Those are huge tomes--any sections not/absolutely worth reading? If I'm not planning on GMing HM, should I even read the GMG, or would that spoil the fun/terror?

I have a hunch I will really like HM--it sounds like a game that's both serious and not, as opposed to just silly, which would be boring.

Getting a chance to play it will be another matter... sigh... but I couldn't resist.
Title: Help Me, For I Have Won Hackmaster...
Post by: Koltar on July 26, 2007, 02:25:30 AM
According to customers who have played it - it plays a LOT like AD&D 2/e.

 However the sense of humor in it is VERY "Tongue-in-Cheek". Still very playable tho.

When the store I work at first opened there was cute dark haired girl that LOVED the game. It was amusing that her introduction to RPGs was basically designed as a friendly parody of D&D.  She was what might be considered a "Perky Goth", she referred to herself as a Christian Goth.

 I did get her to play with my GURPS:TRAVELLER group as a "guest" player ...she had a good time with that too.

 Most people I met who have played it said they had a good time or they had fun with it.

- Ed C.
Title: Help Me, For I Have Won Hackmaster...
Post by: RPGPundit on July 26, 2007, 04:07:23 AM
It actually plays a lot closer to AD&D 1st edition, Koltar.  given that its a direct homage to that product.

RPGPundit
Title: Help Me, For I Have Won Hackmaster...
Post by: Kyle Aaron on July 26, 2007, 04:21:20 AM
And given that they bought the rights to 1st ed so they could write Hackmaster...! Basically it reads like a gonzo house-ruled version of AD&D, like you'd have done when you were a kid. Stuff like Honor (play along with class and alignment as a prerequisite to rising in levels) are much like many house rules I've seen, and other stuff like the HM Smackdown Table (for when players diss the GM) is just a rules-version of unofficial policy of such players.

It's been said there are basically two ways you play Hackmaster - as "nostalgic for when I was 12 and playing AD&D 1st ed," or "Dark Ages Paranoia."

I've found that to be true, though if an individual game group plays it long enough, they may go from one to the other...

Of course now I got back my AD&D1e copies, so I wouldn't need the Hack to play like that.
Title: Help Me, For I Have Won Hackmaster...
Post by: Melan on July 26, 2007, 04:34:16 AM
One of the main features of Hackmaster is the proliferation of rules minutiae. If you like games with very heavy mechanics, HM is one of those. If you don't, it is still a fun and pleasant read.
Title: Help Me, For I Have Won Hackmaster...
Post by: Sosthenes on July 26, 2007, 06:33:58 AM
If you're not GMing, then you _aren't fucking allowed_ to read the GMG.

I tried playing a round of HackMaster, and it didn't altogether run too bad. It was a quick session, when not enough players showed up. We decided to roll with the flow and choose races and classes according to the dice rolls.
Let me say this: The character creation system suffers from the stupendously bad organisation of the whole product, but the results are pretty nice if you don't go overboard with the sillyness. Even then you'll end up worse than a GURPS powergamer, but it can be fun. Just stay away from the major physical flaws. We ended up with a Fairy Magic-User called "Daisy" who fluttered around in a pink dress with frills and ribbons, a half-orc assassion with a very happy family life and a Grel ("grunge elf") berserker. Then we went on a Quest for the Unknown (I managed to buy the intro adventure, too).

Which was a mixed blessing. Quasqueton, the dungeon, is a rather old-fashioned dungeon that tries to cram as much as possible on a map sheet, resulting in many useless rooms and corridors.
Nevertheless, it was quite funny. The additional rules compared to AD&D 1E really make a difference, we especially liked the roll-over damage and the bonus XPs for maximum hurt ;)

We had some hang-ups with the dungeons, and our current mood doesn't seem to fit the AD&D nature -- most of our house rules tend to soften the D&D 3E class distinctions. So AD&D 1E and its close relatives are probably a bit too old-fashioned right now. And humor aside, the organisation of the player's guide is really a bit too haphazard.
I have high hopes for the next edition, now that the license is gone. This will come to a blow to lots of die-hards on the Kenzer forums, who mainly play HM as a AD&D 1E substitute, though.

If I'd manage to play it again, I would go on a copying-spree and note down several tables from the books, maybe even make a small, concise mini-players's guide. And I'd completely free the (rather decent) skill system from the level system, thus allowing the players to customize all the menial background stuff as much as they want, but keep the heroic details bound to levels -- which they'll gain rather slowly.
Title: Help Me, For I Have Won Hackmaster...
Post by: newtmonkey on July 26, 2007, 06:46:35 AM
I haven't had a chance to play this yet (I'm still reading through the Player's Handbook... they are huge books!) but at the very least it's a great read.

Here's a great campaign log some group put up that captures a lot of the atmosphere of the game:

http://descarte.pbwiki.com/Hackmaster (http://descarte.pbwiki.com/Hackmaster)

Their style of play seems a lot more like "Dark Ages Paranoia" (good description Kyle) than simply AD&D nostalgia (which is fine too).

The system is actually really neat but there's a ton of stuff to keep track of.  It's like AD&D plus Unearthed Arcana plus some stuff from 2nd edition.  And then a ton of house rule stuff and maybe a little influence from Rolemaster.