Quote from: jeff37923;1122110Dude, you are the only one in this thread perpetuating the delusion that Star Frontiers is Hard Sci-Fi. It may be harder than Gamma World, but that's about it.

You seem awfully obsessed with proving it isnt, Captain Ahab. :rolleyes:

Quote from: GeekyBugle;1122112To be fair, Sci-Fi hardness is a spectrum, and placing something on one point or another might spark debate against or in favor since we're subjective beings not perfectly rational ones.

Truth be told I think it's more a matter of suspension of disbelief, how squishy it can be before you're yanked out of the fiction? And this is different for each.

The Void is about the only thing that pushes my suspension. But it is needed for an interstellar setting that wants any form of connection. Otherwise you end up with a setting like Aliens where everything is disconnected. You go off on a job light years away and by the time you return your kids grown old and died. Another trip your grandkids grown old and died. Or any sort of space travel is a one way trip. In which case all the adventue is limited to one system even if theres a larger space.

Or you limit your setting to the solar system like Buck Rogers and the cyberpunk 2020 space setting did.

Albedo is another that pushes my edge for hard fiction. No aliens. Virtually no fauna. And relatively realistic weaponry at the modern NATO level. The jump drive is there, but its a very unhealthy dimension so it is acceptable. Same really with Star Frontiers void. It takes alot of prep to make a jump which lends it more weight than alot of other systems do. And its space drives are not fantastical. Albedo does have psi powers. But like in Mechwarrior, these powers are so rare that only a handfull in the whole interstellar populace have it.

For me what breaks me out of a hard sci-fi feel is artificial gravity to make linear ships. Probably my biggest irk really as it is so over over over over-used.
psi powers that are more than empathic or precog/postcog skills. They may not be psi after all. Just really good natural body/profile reading.
Over-abundance of aliens without a darn good reason. Star Frontiers at least has the explanation that some precursor race came through and seeded the area. And the aliens races are initially relatively few. Later modules add more. But thats something nearly every sci-fi setting gets. Fans sooner or later want to add more alien races.

Quote from: Omega;1122128You seem awfully obsessed with proving it isnt, Captain Ahab. :rolleyes:

Yeah, yeah. And you seem butthurt because I'm picking on your favorite game.

Quote from: Omega;1122129The Void is about the only thing that pushes my suspension.

If going FTL after just reach 0.01C is the only thing that strains your suspension of disbelief in Star Frontiers to the point that you advocate the game as Hard Sci-Fi, then you had a crappy science education.

Quote from: jeff37923;1122132If going FTL after just reach 0.01C is the only thing that strains your suspension of disbelief in Star Frontiers to the point that you advocate the game as Hard Sci-Fi, then you had a crappy science education.

Keep dancing that tune Ahab.

Quote from: Omega;1122237Keep dancing that tune Ahab.

Awww, don't be jealous. You still have your favorite game where, "an ion drive which converts matter to energy" is Hard Science.

Instead of "hard sci-fi", I'll sometimes say "hard-to-do sci-fi" when dealing with lower tech levels while in outer space using games like Outpost Mars, Orbital, and Chthonian Stars.

Not counting the Mars Colony phase of End Times I am surprised no one has done a more hard SF setting for BRP or CoC.

Quote from: Omega;1122250Not counting the Mars Colony phase of End Times I am surprised no one has done a more hard SF setting for BRP or CoC.

The Morrow Project 3rd edition revised comes to mind. But that was eons ago.

Quote from: Omega;1122250Not counting the Mars Colony phase of End Times I am surprised no one has done a more hard SF setting for BRP or CoC.

They did - it was called Cthulhu Rising. Admittedly it has FTL, but essentially it's Aliens plus Mythos. You can ignore the Mythos pretty easily.

Also D101 games has done River of Heaven for OpenQuest, their slightly-simplified BRP. Strip out the wormholes and you are basically in Revelation Space the RPG (cited by the authors as an inspiration).

Quote from: Shawn Driscoll;1122311The Morrow Project 3rd edition revised comes to mind. But that was eons ago.

Morrow Project uses the BRP/CoC system? I thought it was its own thing? Apparently a 4th ed came out about 6 years ago?

Morrow Project still has its fans. I am not positive. But I think there was a fan made article for doing a Mars colony using Morrow Project.

Quote from: Marchand;1122345They did - it was called Cthulhu Rising. Admittedly it has FTL, but essentially it's Aliens plus Mythos. You can ignore the Mythos pretty easily.

Also D101 games has done River of Heaven for OpenQuest, their slightly-simplified BRP. Strip out the wormholes and you are basically in Revelation Space the RPG (cited by the authors as an inspiration).

Interesting, but it sounds like its a less hard SF setting than End Times.

Quote from: Omega;1122395Morrow Project uses the BRP/CoC system? I thought it was its own thing?

3rd edition does. Other editions have their own thing.