I just got back from GaryCon X, 2018.
The biggest surprise for me, by far, was realizing that I like miniatures wargaming MUCH better than RPGs.
Pics!
Steve Gallacci said much the same. He was a big fan of Civil War wargames. I believe GDWs Johnny Reb.
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1029054I just got back from GaryCon X, 2018.
The biggest surprise for me, by far, was realizing that I like miniatures wargaming MUCH better than RPGs.
I've been slowly getting drawn back into miniature wargames, though on the solitaire side. 54mm models are the bees knees. What made you come to that realization if you didn't mind me asking?
I sometimes wish for more RPGs inspired by hex-and-counter wargames as opposed to miniature wargames.
Traveller always kinda felt like that. And TFT is probably the best example of how this can work.
Quote from: Nerzenjäger;1029100I sometimes wish for more RPGs inspired by hex-and-counter wargames as opposed to miniature wargames.
Traveller always kinda felt like that. And TFT is probably the best example of how this can work.
Star Frontiers was all counters. Though they did later release a minis line (Which self destructed) TSRs Marvel Superheroes was in between, used the tri-fold standups. As did Indiana Jones RPG. 4e D&D Gamma World came with those pog things. And 2nd or 3rd ed GW introduced a wargame. Gamma Knights.
Pretty sure theres a few others out there.
Well, GURPS, HERO, Dragon Quest, Gang Busters, Boot Hill, Price of Freedom, Universe, The Fantasy Trip, at least. I think Rolemaster might fit as well.
Quote from: David Johansen;1029120Well, GURPS, HERO, Dragon Quest, Gang Busters, Boot Hill, Price of Freedom, Universe, The Fantasy Trip, at least. I think Rolemaster might fit as well.
I agree with most of these, but would love to see some that were not designed in the 70s or 80s, hence the "more" part.
Quote from: Spinachcat;1029057Pics!
I didn't take a single picture, sorry.
Quote from: RunningLaser;1029082I've been slowly getting drawn back into miniature wargames, though on the solitaire side. 54mm models are the bees knees. What made you come to that realization if you didn't mind me asking?
More later.
By miniatures wargaming... which scale, and historical, fantasy or sci-fi, and skirmish or larger than skirmish? My preference is 28-32mm skirmish, sci fi or fantasy. Sadly there are no good fantasy skirmish games right now. I could add right now, given that D&D 4e is dead. Lol. It was a skirmish game masquerading as a RPG. (Opinion. )At least none that I know of. Frostgrave is not enough to hold my attention for long. It's more of a party version of a TTG.
Oh, let's see... 40mm, both man to man and 1:20, 1:2400 ships, 1/87 armor, 15mm World War Tesla..
Modern ultra-small skirmish games don't interest me. The forces have to be large enough that you're dealing with units, not individuals. Historical aircraft games are an exception.
Quote from: RunningLaser;1029082I've been slowly getting drawn back into miniature wargames, though on the solitaire side. 54mm models are the bees knees. What made you come to that realization if you didn't mind me asking?
Short answer is that I realized I had more fun in the miniatures wargames.
Slightly longer answer; both convention RPGs and convention wargames have the situation where you have 6 to 12 people getting together for four hours or so, and many of them don't know each other. The miniatures wargamers seem to get their shit together and get on with the game, functioning as an effective team, much, much faster than the convention RPG players do.
And this includes neophytes.
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1029175Short answer is that I realized I had more fun in the miniatures wargames.
Slightly longer answer; both convention RPGs and convention wargames have the situation where you have 6 to 12 people getting together for four hours or so, and many of them don't know each other. The miniatures wargamers seem to get their shit together and get on with the game, functioning as an effective team, much, much faster than the convention RPG players do.
And this includes neophytes.
So, if I am understanding correctly, you statement stands for preferring miniatures over RPGs at
conventions. Not in general. Yes?
I'm still digesting that. I'm realizing that over the last 10 years or so, my average miniatures game has been more fun than my average RPG, either running or playing.
The really big drawback to miniatures games is the logistics, as Chirine will gladly confirm.
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1029193I'm still digesting that. I'm realizing that over the last 10 years or so, my average miniatures game has been more fun than my average RPG, either running or playing...
Well, this is something I'd love to hear more about. As you digest, I do hope you share.
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1029175The miniatures wargamers seem to get their shit together and get on with the game, functioning as an effective team, much, much faster than the convention RPG players do.
I'd say the task for the wargamers is simpler, or at least a lot more straightforward.
Yup. But I turn my miniatures wargames into roleplaying games (as I do with boardgames as well), so it all works out.
the strength of miniatures war games is that they (mostly) understand they are games, and should strive to be playable, fun, parsimonious and structurally sound. It is arguable that D&D worked best when it was a miniatures war game zeroed down to 1:1 scale, with some free style conversation on the side. It is kind of crazy how high the word count has gotten in a typical roleplaying game book. Most of them are hardly recognizable as games.
I play minis, RPGs and board games.
Here's what I notice.
Minis players have their shit together. They own their army, they bring their army and they set up their army. The objective is simple - win by killing the other guy's dudes. They have to play attention on other players' turns or they lose.
RPGers are often fucknuts. Many don't even own dice or the corebook. Many expect the GM to bring the fun and act as consumers instead of participants. For many, other peoples' turns are when they space out on the phones.
Boardgamers just show up. Half have a gazillion games. The other half just plays. They open the box, read the short amount of rules and just play the damn game. Most pay attention during every turn, but some space out.
If you have a good group of RPGers, be very thankful.
I can whip almost any RPG convention table into shape (a skill honed through much failure), but it requires effort I never need to spend at minis or board games.
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1029135I didn't take a single picture, sorry.
You are poopieboogerhead.
Alright, make words instead!! Tell us about your GaryCon! If a picture is worth a thousand words, you better get cracking.
Was anything done special in honor of the 10th anniversary of Gary's death?
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1029193I'm still digesting that. I'm realizing that over the last 10 years or so, my average miniatures game has been more fun than my average RPG, either running or playing.
The really big drawback to miniatures games is the logistics, as Chirine will gladly confirm.
Yep.
I don't have to digest the notion, though; I play neither, as Gronan can confirm, as I'm still forty years behind all of you in your gaming. (And, if I may offer an observation, I'm going to stay that way.)
As for logistics...
Ah, me. Take a moment out of your busy, busy lives, if you would and have a look at the photos of my games and game room. There's a lot of stuff, down there, and it's what I use in my games. For me, it's a point of pride to be able to astound and amaze players with a game the likes of which they've never seen before - I believe that convention / event games should be something you cant get at the FLGS or at home. Gronan and I did the same at our model railway club - you joined to get something you could not get at home. Heck, I even own a set of matched tables so I don't have to reply on the event organizers and venue. But, the downside is that it all adds up in weight and shipping space. I've been willing to pay that cost and penalty, because I think it's fun to run games that way.
Quote from: Spinachcat;1029223I play minis, RPGs and board games.
Here's what I notice.
Minis players have their shit together. They own their army, they bring their army and they set up their army. The objective is simple - win by killing the other guy's dudes. They have to play attention on other players' turns or they lose.
RPGers are often fucknuts. Many don't even own dice or the corebook. Many expect the GM to bring the fun and act as consumers instead of participants. For many, other peoples' turns are when they space out on the phones.
Boardgamers just show up. Half have a gazillion games. The other half just plays. They open the box, read the short amount of rules and just play the damn game. Most pay attention during every turn, but some space out.
If you have a good group of RPGers, be very thankful.
I can whip almost any RPG convention table into shape (a skill honed through much failure), but it requires effort I never need to spend at minis or board games.
I'm going to drop some classic 'get off my lawn' old guy crap, but I think it's true: computer rpg's took the basic concepts of D&D (etc.) and turned them into a toxic virus that destroyed the capacity of most human beings to play table top rpgs. As far as I can tell, you don't have to bring anything to the table to play most computer rpgs: you just plug in, stare at the screen, respond to a bunch of pre-programmed crap, and switch to another game if the stupid thing kills you too fast. Adventure-path dungeons with a typical modern rpg system is basically just this same experience slowed to a crawl and soaked in blathering word salad.
Quote from: Spinachcat;1029231You are poopieboogerhead.
And doing a damn fine job of it, too.
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1029054I just got back from GaryCon X, 2018.
The biggest surprise for me, by far, was realizing that I like miniatures wargaming MUCH better than RPGs.
First of my pics are up just now, here... Also, A pleasure to meet you and Jean this year!
GaryCon X Highlights from the GameDaddy;https://tamerthya.blog/2018/03/14/garycon-x-highlights/ (https://tamerthya.blog/2018/03/14/garycon-x-highlights/)
...and yes, I got in some wargaming there this year as well, and had a splendidly pleasant evening with that!
For Chirine, there was a gorgeous Tekumel minis game being run by
Victor Raymond of the Tekumel Foundation. Will have those pix up as well, ...in a day or two.
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Thank you Game Daddy!!
How's the noise level while gaming at GaryCon?
In California, I am a spoiled brat. Most of our cons have 1-2 games per room.
Quote from: Larsdangly;1029240I'm going to drop some classic 'get off my lawn' old guy crap, but I think it's true: computer rpg's took the basic concepts of D&D (etc.) and turned them into a toxic virus that destroyed the capacity of most human beings to play table top rpgs. As far as I can tell, you don't have to bring anything to the table to play most computer rpgs: you just plug in, stare at the screen, respond to a bunch of pre-programmed crap, and switch to another game if the stupid thing kills you too fast. Adventure-path dungeons with a typical modern rpg system is basically just this same experience slowed to a crawl and soaked in blathering word salad.
And let's see how you do in Subnautica where are a dropped in the middle of an ocean after a starship crash.
Look back in the day wargames and tabletop roleplaying were the only type of open world game available. Now there are more options. They are neither better or worse. They can be executed well or executed poorly regardless of form.
There is a whole class of open world free form computer games out there now like the forementioned Subnauctica. As well as the ones that more scripted. Then there is the whole multi-player combat scene. Then there is the fact that thanks to smartphone and tablets a bunch of boardgames (new and classic) have excellent software implementations that feature among other thing a pass and play option. I went to Origins two years ago and had to wait in line for check-in for an hour. During that time my friends and I played Settlers of Catan on my iPad just like if we setup a board and played.
Most rants I see are born of ignorance. Having been involved in several of the communities including MMORPGs, LARPS, PvP combat, survival games, modding, each have their own unique take but all of them have passionate gamer thinking creatively. If you were rant at a Counterstrike clan they would laugh at you. And whatever experience you had it would not compete with them in that game at first. You would have to do what they do and assemble a team, learn the tactics, and practice again and again until you are competitive. The same with the other forms of gaming.
Quote from: GameDaddy;1029253For Chirine, there was a gorgeous Tekumel minis game being run by Victor Raymond of the Tekumel Foundation. Will have those pix up as well, ...in a day or two.
Thanks! One of the two players in that game is an old friend, and he sent me a batch of photos from the game. Phil's miniatures still look great after all these years don't they? :)
I found myself in the unique position of defending Victor's borrowed scenery - he's not a miniatures gamer - to my wife, who's been involved with Tekumel for decades. She thought Phil's little jewels looked out of place in what she called "A mid-1980's Warhammer table", and thought that he could have done better. Especially, she pointed out, in comparison to what we normally field; she takes particular pride in supporting my model-building and gaming, and is already looking into hotel reservations for Gary Con XI - she's that annoyed. What particularly annoys her was that we offered the use of my collections to Victor and the Foundation years ago, and he blew us off. We're specifically set up for convention games, to a 'four table standard' (two running, two setting-up / taking down) with all the figures and scenery you'd ever need.
I'm genuinely startled by her, this morning; she's normally a pretty quiet and placid person, but the photos really set her off. :eek:
So many nerds there. So many.
Quote from: chirine ba kal;1029304I'm genuinely startled by her, this morning; she's normally a pretty quiet and placid person, but the photos really set her off. :eek:
Considering John Bobek, Dave Wesley, Ross Maker, Dave Megarry, and a number of other old time wargamers played wargames at GaryCon using tables covered with brown paper and terrain drawn on with colored markers or colored masking tape, maybe she DOESN'T want to go to GaryCon.
The terrain Victor used looked very much like what Phil put on his table, which is the whole idea.
Quote from: Spinachcat;1029262Thank you Game Daddy!!
How's the noise level while gaming at GaryCon?
In California, I am a spoiled brat. Most of our cons have 1-2 games per room.
Noise level is variable. For RPGs I ask for a private room, and because I'm me, I get one.
Quote from: Spinachcat;1029223I play minis, RPGs and board games.
Here's what I notice.
Minis players have their shit together. They own their army, they bring their army and they set up their army. The objective is simple - win by killing the other guy's dudes. They have to play attention on other players' turns or they lose.
RPGers are often fucknuts. Many don't even own dice or the corebook. Many expect the GM to bring the fun and act as consumers instead of participants. For many, other peoples' turns are when they space out on the phones.
Boardgamers just show up. Half have a gazillion games. The other half just plays. They open the box, read the short amount of rules and just play the damn game. Most pay attention during every turn, but some space out.
If you have a good group of RPGers, be very thankful.
I can whip almost any RPG convention table into shape (a skill honed through much failure), but it requires effort I never need to spend at minis or board games.
I'm starting to think you may be right. Even if miniatures wargamers don't know the game, they seem to be there to play the game, and grasp instinctively that it's a team effort.
Your "RPGers are often fucknuts" is dead on. A lot of them are there to entertain themselves, and fuck the other people at the table.
Also, I keep hearing "I got stuck in the back rank and it was boring." Well, dickweevil, nobody prevented you from saying "Hey, can we swap around so I'm not in back for a while?" Especially at conventions, a LOT of RPGers really seem to be looking to get spoon-fed.
Really, the person with the most power over your fun is you. If you are so fucking lazy or so emotionally fragile that you can't speak up for yourself, that is NOT my problem.
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1029374Considering John Bobek, Dave Wesley, Ross Maker, Dave Megarry, and a number of other old time wargamers played wargames at GaryCon using tables covered with brown paper and terrain drawn on with colored markers or colored masking tape, maybe she DOESN'T want to go to GaryCon.
The terrain Victor used looked very much like what Phil put on his table, which is the whole idea.
I know, I know. She wants to go down there and kick some scenic butt, I think. She's still cranked over the fiascos over the past few years with people promising the sun / moon / stars for trips down there and then not being able to organize their way out of a wet paper bag. Heck, I still use brown paper and colored masking tape - cheap, at Axe-man Surplus - so I don't mind. I think she just wants to show off - she's been stripping and slapping primer on her old Ral Partha 'Elfquest' and old FASA and Citadel 'Dr. Who' figures, in addition to funding the various miniatures needed for the big Braunsteins. My British card buildings have been getting eyed greedily, too.
(I would be afraid; very, very afraid. Once she gets going like this, she just does not give up. It's kinda scary, to see her going like this.)
The stuff he had was actually a lot more then Phil used to have, actually. We had The Tree on The Hill, and that was that. Heck, Phil's ashtray / salted nut can used to get pressed into service as scenery, most of the time. I have no idea why, but he just never got into scenery and terrain like he was into the miniatures themselves.
Maybe we can get him to start smoking Swisher Sweets, to get that Authentic Tekumel Atmosphere... :)
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1029375Noise level is variable. For RPGs I ask for a private room, and because I'm me, I get one.
You handsome stud, you. I swoon at the very thought of you rolling dice.
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1029376I'm starting to think you may be right. Even if miniatures wargamers don't know the game, they seem to be there to play the game, and grasp instinctively that it's a team effort.
Your "RPGers are often fucknuts" is dead on. A lot of them are there to entertain themselves, and fuck the other people at the table.
Also, I keep hearing "I got stuck in the back rank and it was boring." Well, dickweevil, nobody prevented you from saying "Hey, can we swap around so I'm not in back for a while?" Especially at conventions, a LOT of RPGers really seem to be looking to get spoon-fed.
Really, the person with the most power over your fun is you. If you are so fucking lazy or so emotionally fragile that you can't speak up for yourself, that is NOT my problem.
Agreed; seen this same thing all too many times over the years in RPGs at conventions. Which is why that lot at Gary Con VII really took me by surprise; they swapped ranks like a SWAT team on steroids, flowing through the place like a well-oiled machine. Never had seen anything like it at a convention game, myself.
It's your game; make your fun. All I'm here to do is facilitate.
Quote from: chirine ba kal;1029383You handsome stud, you. I swoon at the very thought of you rolling dice.
* flex *
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1029376I'm starting to think you may be right.
That's because I'm a font of ultimate wisdom!!
:eek:
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1029376Especially at conventions, a LOT of RPGers really seem to be looking to get spoon-fed.
I blame WotC/Paizo Organized Play format for much of this.
It's 4 hours of railroad: encounter + encounter + encounter = XP and loot, with nary a meaningful choice or challenge.
But I also believe there are a LOT of GMs who spoon-feed at home just to have a gaming group.
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1029376Really, the person with the most power over your fun is you. If you are so fucking lazy or so emotionally fragile that you can't speak up for yourself, that is NOT my problem.
What kind of sick monster advocates personal responsibility in 2018???
How dare you sir! How dare you!
GRAAAAH! * stomps on balsawood miniature Tokyo *
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I'm making it my goal to attend GaryCon next year. Do we have the dates and location yet for GaryCon next year?
Quote from: jeff37923;1029525I'm making it my goal to attend GaryCon next year. Do we have the dates and location yet for GaryCon next year?
Yes.
http://garycon.com/
More Photos from the show...
https://tamerthya.blog/2018/03/17/garycon-x-games-being-played/
Quote from: jeff37923;1029525I'm making it my goal to attend GaryCon next year. Do we have the dates and location yet for GaryCon next year?
Apparently finding rooms is a pain. After the dates for 2019 had been announced, rooms were already going quickly. My brother and friend have attended the last two years and have convinced the rest of the old gaming group to make the pilgrimage. So it appears next year will be my first as well.
Quote from: Gunslinger;1029828Apparently finding rooms is a pain. After the dates for 2019 had been announced, rooms were already going quickly. My brother and friend have attended the last two years and have convinced the rest of the old gaming group to make the pilgrimage. So it appears next year will be my first as well.
The Grand Geneva Resort & Spa which is the host site, is already fully booked for 2019. I think they can accommodate about 1,500 there comfortably. Attendance this year was over 2,300. Some of the surrounding hotels were also booked, the first & second on the recommended list,
Comfort Suites East, as well as
the Harbor Shores on Lake Geneva, which is where the
Lake Geneva Gaming Conventions and the first couple of
GaryCons were hosted. I had no trouble at all finding a really good hotel room this year in Elkhorn at the Hilton Suites for a c-note a night, about a ten minute drive from the game show. Racine, Kenosha, Janes, & Beloit all less than or about twenty minutes away have hotel rooms to spare.
I really need to check the
Timber Ridge Lodge, located right next to the
Grand Geneva, as I don't think they sold out of rooms, and they are walking distance (I mean crawling distance, for the hardcore pub/tavern crawlers), one just has to not get lost in the
Dan Patch Stables shrubbery maze there on your way back to your room there...
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1029054I just got back from GaryCon X, 2018.
The biggest surprise for me, by far, was realizing that I like miniatures wargaming MUCH better than RPGs.
They scratch very different itches for me (as do Eurogames, AmeriTrash, LARPs, video games, counter wargames).
But there really is something awesome when a good mini wargame comes together. 3D, art, history, terrain, strategy, tactics, and competition.
I have some photos I have yet to get organized. I had a lot of fun there. I believe I saw Mr. Mornard running a game that was a re-creation of the Battle of the Ice, German Teutonic Knights vs. Russian foot. I was talking to one of the players on the side and mentioned that, historically, when the Teutons charged the Russians across the frozen Lake Lämmijärv, the ice broke under the weight of their armor and horses, killing many knights and throwing the German crusaders into disarray. Anyway I walked over to chat with Dave Megarry a bit about Dungeon, and wouldn't you know, the same player came over and told me that that was exactly what happened in game! :)
I ran Teeth of the Barkash Nour, although I think I didn't allot nearly enough time for it, as the party got close to finding one tooth in a "side dungeon" but nowhere near to exploring the whole demi-plane and discovering more teeth...I think I shall rework it for convention play and either remove or foreshorten that dungeon. One character died when they incautiously stepped onto a mosaic'd floor and a 6 ton stone block squashed them to pulp. Otherwise, it was a wash: no further casualties but no teeth recovered.
I played in an off-grid game and did away with 5 "small" Iron Golems via a horn of blasting as the DM generously ruled that the horn's structural damage was sufficient to cause damage to the golems - constructs - but before we could adventure further, my ride was fading so we had to go (we were up the road at the Timber Ridge, not in the hotel proper where the con was held, a mistake I don't intend to repeat for Gary Con 2020 - can't make the '19 show).
It was great to meet so many guys from the Knights & Knaves board, been online friends with them for years, and to finally meet the balance of them in person was such a treat.
I also was an autograph hound! David S. Laforce drew a picture in my Dungeon Masters Guide, which was also autographed by Erol Otus, who is a fantastic dude, Darlene Pekul signed both the Unicorn in the front cover as well as by the succubus in the back pages, Jim Ward signed it for me too. Tom Wham drew a Snit in my Monster Manual, over by the Sphinxes (which was doubly fun for me as I did the writeup for the Sphinxes in the OSRIC book), Jeff Easley signed my later 1st edition DM's screen - Jeff Easley is AWESOME! (well they all were). I sat, or rather, stood in the room for the Artist's Panel and asked a few nerdy questions; did anything at the game table make it in to any iconic art, yes from Larry and Erol, specifically a fireball detonation and the "Mages arguing over loot" in the Basic rulebook. There was also a gentleman whose name escapes me at the moment who did some later 2e artwork, and while I don't recall his contributions he did say that he drew an image of a major character doing a spell raising someone from the dead...which, per the D&D rules, that person can't (magic user using Raise Dead or something like that), but they literally altered the game to make the painting make sense...!
Oh! Stefan from Dwarven Forge was there, I got his autograph, too.
I bought the 2017 GaryCon miniature which is the Paladin from "A Paladin In Hell" in a slightly different pose to avoid stepping on WotC's toes, I guess, otherwise he's the same (and I might try to adjust him to give him the "correct" pose...but probably not), and from Effin Cool Miniatures a Goblin that is straight out of the animated Rankin/Bass version of The Hobbit! If they'd had different poses and weapons I might have just bought 30 or 40 and done away with my current "goblins" and used those guys for D&D from now on!
Speaking of shopping, if you're in the market for metal minis, GO TO GARY CON. The prices were REALLY good. Like, ca. 1990s prices especially on Iron Wind Metals/Ral Partha figures! I was so taken with how inexpensive everything was!
Black Blade had a fantastic booth full of old-school goodness. There were a couple of second-hand vendors, one of whom had some great prices on 1e stuff, but there was less of that than I'd hoped. :/
Convention staff was super helpful, I really felt welcomed.
If you get a chance, go to GaryCon. It's a lot of fun.
The Timber Ridge Lodge is indeed on the same grounds. It's a short five minute shuttle ride away, and the shuttles run pretty much as late as you want.
Also, keep watching the hotel site. Starting in a couple of months people will start cancelling as they realize that they can't make GaryCon 2019 for one reason or another. People get rooms in the main building as late as November or December.
Quote from: thedungeondelver;1029856I have some photos I have yet to get organized. I had a lot of fun there. I believe I saw Mr. Mornard running a game that was a re-creation of the Battle of the Ice, German Teutonic Knights vs. Russian foot. I was talking to one of the players on the side and mentioned that, historically, when the Teutons charged the Russians across the frozen Lake Lämmijärv, the ice broke under the weight of their armor and horses, killing many knights and throwing the German crusaders into disarray. Anyway I walked over to chat with Dave Megarry a bit about Dungeon, and wouldn't you know, the same player came over and told me that that was exactly what happened in game! :)
:D :D :D Did you REALLY doubt I was a perverse son of a bitch?
Although Eisenstein greatly exaggerated the effect of the ice breaking. Historically that is not why the Teutonic Knights lost; they lost because they got flanked by the Mongol horse archers and shredded.
Quote from: GameDaddy;1029814More Photos from the show...
https://tamerthya.blog/2018/03/17/garycon-x-games-being-played/
Great photos, thank you!!! Those are Ahoggya on the table, by the way.
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1029860:D :D :D Did you REALLY doubt I was a perverse son of a bitch?
Although Eisenstein greatly exaggerated the effect of the ice breaking. Historically that is not why the Teutonic Knights lost; they lost because they got flanked by the Mongol horse archers and shredded.
So the ice broke. Is this an example if what they call 'immersion' in gaming? :D
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1029860:D :D :D Did you REALLY doubt I was a perverse son of a bitch?
Although Eisenstein greatly exaggerated the effect of the ice breaking. Historically that is not why the Teutonic Knights lost; they lost because they got flanked by the Mongol horse archers and shredded.
Well,
Aleksander Nevsky was never one of my favorites but that's a great, iconic scene. During the heydays of the Molotov/Ribbentrop Pact, it was illegal to show it in Russian theaters. Then once war was on it was put in heavy rotation...
I guess though that plays in to Russian propaganda; German arrogance and underestimation of the noble working class folk of the Motherland plays better to the political officers versus the Chinese coming in and saving their asses...
I really like this video series. Their naval recreations are particularly good.
[video=youtube;cvh1H0HkhI8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvh1H0HkhI8&t=151s[/youtube]
Quote from: chirine ba kal;1029863So the ice broke. Is this an example if what they call 'immersion' in gaming? :D
* snerk *
Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;1029860:D :D :D Did you REALLY doubt I was a perverse son of a bitch?
Although Eisenstein greatly exaggerated the effect of the ice breaking. Historically that is not why the Teutonic Knights lost; they lost because they got flanked by the Mongol horse archers and shredded.
One of my wargame armies (that I was moderately successful with) were the Rus (lots and lots of heavy spearmen - very effective against all the medium cavalry people tended to bring).
I think it's clear that while the light horse archers were Asiatic, they likely weren't Mongols
per se, more probably Cuman-Kipchak or somesuch.
Miniature wargames are fun, but RPGs are way better.