...this now exists.
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/334278/Sprawlrunners
I've been waiting on this for a while and it just came out.
Quote from: Alderaan Crumbs on November 06, 2020, 08:08:49 AM
...this now exists.
Have they changed the Savage Worlds rules much? It never did work well with guns.
Quote from: hedgehobbit on November 06, 2020, 08:35:57 AM
Quote from: Alderaan Crumbs on November 06, 2020, 08:08:49 AM
...this now exists.
Have they changed the Savage Worlds rules much? It never did work well with guns.
Could you clarify? I've never heard the problem.
I also am interested in this. I played a ton of Deadlands back in the day and I thought the two systems were close. I remember guns working well there.
Quote from: Manic Modron on November 06, 2020, 12:16:42 PMCould you clarify? I've never heard the problem.
From what I remember, and it's been a very long time, characters had a Parry value based on their fighting skills that was the to-hit number opponents needed. But all ranged attacks just used a target number of 4 and a character's survival was based solely on their ability to soak up damage. While this is fine for certain genre's, it doesn't really work in some genres (like cyberpunk) where characters are expected to avoid getting hit rather than being bullet sponges.
Quote from: hedgehobbit on November 06, 2020, 02:10:40 PM
Quote from: Manic Modron on November 06, 2020, 12:16:42 PMCould you clarify? I've never heard the problem.
From what I remember, and it's been a very long time, characters had a Parry value based on their fighting skills that was the to-hit number opponents needed. But all ranged attacks just used a target number of 4 and a character's survival was based solely on their ability to soak up damage. While this is fine for certain genre's, it doesn't really work in some genres (like cyberpunk) where characters are expected to avoid getting hit rather than being bullet sponges.
There are Edges, gear, and other special abilities that can increase that base 4 (or else penalizes attack rolls). I'd imagine that the cyber that jacks reflexes up to bullet-dodging levels probably puts a -2 (perhaps a -4 for the cutting edge version) on all attacks targeting the wired warrior.
Feels...meh from what I read. It doesn't feel like it really marries the systems together. It's just a list of options for characters. No GM aids, no premade creatures, no suggested rules (As mentioned before on how firearms work).
Don't start off saying 'Oh yeah I didn't want to just make games about getting fat lute for character progress' and replace it with 'get xp for character progress'.
I'm all in favor of not getting a passive bonus to dodging bullets, actually. Even in cyberpunk. Avoid getting shot the same way real people do. Don't get in the line of fire unless you have to and if you have to, use active evasion methods. Maybe wired reflexes can help you abort to dodge to get into cover or makes your serpentine run extra jiggy (no, not like that Mr Smith), but unless you are taking special actions to keep from being bullet bait.. TN 4.
This is not Savage Worlds, but definitely Shadowrun inspired: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/lowfantasygaming/lowlife-2090 (https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/lowfantasygaming/lowlife-2090)
Quote from: Manic Modron on November 06, 2020, 10:03:57 PM
I'm all in favor of not getting a passive bonus to dodging bullets, actually. Even in cyberpunk. Avoid getting shot the same way real people do.
Well, real people don't get into firefights or go on globetrotting cyberpunk adventures. All story characters have a large level of plot armor by the very nature of their success.
Quote from: Batjon on November 07, 2020, 01:25:21 AM
This is not Savage Worlds, but definitely Shadowrun inspired: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/lowfantasygaming/lowlife-2090 (https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/lowfantasygaming/lowlife-2090)
Brilliant, I liked LFG.
Didn't that guy used to post on here as Psikerlord or something?
There are tons of weapon-options in SWADE sci-fi settings that do cyberpunk just fine.
Interface Zero 3.0 will have a wide range of options, if 2.0 is any indicator (Highly recommend you look at this).
Deadlands Lost Colony - Deadlands in spaaaaace has a nice spread of gear.
Savage Rifts - is *crazytown* in types of gear and scalability.
As for the passive target numbers. Well abstractly just like in CP2020, ranged target numbers are fixed by range. So 4 for close range, and penalties stack for Medium, Long, and Extreme. Just like CP2020, you're expected to use cover, even laying flat, or whatever, plus use edges and gear. It plays out pretty deadly (with more saving graces than CP2020).
So I'm not sure what you mean by "not handling weapons well" because if you wanna take the cybernetics from say Savage Rifts, and start using it in your game, you could be effecting powers like Deflect which levels -2/-4 (on a raise) on top of having gear that gives ranged attacks another -2 on top of that, making you *incredibly* hard to hit. I mean it's real super-heroic non-realistic type stuff. But it depends what you're going for.
On it's face? It uses the same abstractions as CP2020 - which is DC = Range +Modifiers. That's a pretty well accepted standard for me. Everything else is in the details of the system.
Quote from: hedgehobbit on November 06, 2020, 02:10:40 PM
Quote from: Manic Modron on November 06, 2020, 12:16:42 PMCould you clarify? I've never heard the problem.
From what I remember, and it's been a very long time, characters had a Parry value based on their fighting skills that was the to-hit number opponents needed. But all ranged attacks just used a target number of 4 and a character's survival was based solely on their ability to soak up damage. While this is fine for certain genre's, it doesn't really work in some genres (like cyberpunk) where characters are expected to avoid getting hit rather than being bullet sponges.
Presumably there are modifiers for various conditions during the firefight. In which case this is EXACTLY the same as SR3. Only difference, maybe, is the Combat Pool allowing you to try to dodge in SR.
Might have to check this out then. Can always use a new version of rules for SR.
Honestly, even though I dropped from the KS of Interface Zero because Gunmetal went full BLM... Interface Zero is a good product and it *totally* can do Shadowrun with little difficulty.
The Psionics rules are effectively the Magic rules. And any overt magic you need, can be pulled from the SWADE Core or any other SW product. All you need is the Shadowrun fluff - and play.
How would Savage Rifts handle Shadowrun?
Anyone try that out in actual play?
Quote from: Batjon on November 07, 2020, 01:25:21 AM
This is not Savage Worlds, but definitely Shadowrun inspired: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/lowfantasygaming/lowlife-2090 (https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/lowfantasygaming/lowlife-2090)
Bummer that I missed that KS! Looks good.
Anybody know when it's going public? Hopefully with POD!
Interface Zero has always had a pretty consistent political slant. The primary Big Bad in the setting were the North American Coalition: a state run by the worst elements of the Religious Right. IZ 2.0 was pretty good, however about avoiding coming across as SJW'y and keeping the values of the setting humanist. Making the bad guys Bible-thumping authoritarian Puritans was a great creative decision, I think. Most of the gamers I I know hate Fundies almost as much as SJWs. I in particular have bitter memories of the Satanic Panic. I lost hundreds of dollars and hundreds of hours of paint-work worth of Warhammer figures to that particular episode.
I quite liked that its one of the few RPG Cyberpunk settings to integrate elements from Blade Runner by having Replicants as a player race. Again, Replicants are slaves, and slavery being pretty fucking evil is something I think most people can agree on.
Same with Psychics aka Zeeks. I with more settings with magic/supers had "You have to hide your powers because most people hate and fear you" as a limiting factor.
However, in this day and age it might be too close to reality for a lot of people and I can respect that.
Interface Zero 3.0 however is shaping up to be a total dumpster fire. It's a story very much in the vein of Secret Empire or the Star Wars Sequel trilogy: it's the author having an extended temper tantrum over 2016, but coming out 5 years too late. Basically the NAC conquered the rest of the Balkanized American states, so the PCs are "le Resistance" and must "bash the fash" blah blah you get the idea.
It's honestly kind of pathetic and it's already going to be dated before it even comes out. Time will tell if David Jarvis goes back to the drawing board like he should, but I don't think so. The release is already 3 years delayed, and Jarvis' track record is not good. He embraced BLM then when faced with EPIC blowback walked back his stance.
Fortunately, when I requested my money back he refunded my Kickstarter contribution without a complaint so that was good.
Overall, I'd recommend sticking to IZ 2.0 or just avoiding it entirely.
To get back on topic, I do like the look of Sprawlrunners. I'll probably check it out.
Yeah I was all in on IFZ3.0... then it went into SJW hell... and I pulled out my money.
I agree that most American's generally dislike fundamentalism, because fundamentalism regardless of its angle tends to be so narrow in conception and understanding it goes against the entire concept of what America stands for.
Social Justice *is* the new fundamentalism.
I never bought into the narratives of IFZ2.0 but there is plenty to dig into that's of interest. The race choices, the Zeek issue, the conception of the Net and how players can be "netrunners" and still be active in the party, among other things was well done.
But yeah... the new iteration? Blergh.