Quote from: One Horse Town;346462You're not seriously comparing Koltar to Obi Wan are you?

Muhammad, I read that as Obi Wang !

Regards,
David R

Quote from: aramis;346520I only do cinematic... full range of dice is a turn off for me.

I only do Cinematic because I recently discovered that Classic is now too much work for too little reward in comparison, for me, anyway.

Since we're sharing anecdotal evidence of 4e's supposed demise, here's a reality check from another store owner.
http://blackdiamondgames.blogspot.com/2009/11/rpg-market-share.html

Quote from: Deadline247;346751Since we're sharing anecdotal evidence of 4e's supposed demise, here's a reality check from another store owner.
http://blackdiamondgames.blogspot.com/2009/11/rpg-market-share.html

I said a dropoff in sales and interest at my store that I've ntoiced.

 Didn't say anything about a "demise".

 More like a plateau or leveling off of interest and a rise in those interested in PATHFINDER and 3.5.

The 4th edition D&D will probably coast for quite awhile.


- Ed C.

I've never been sure if this "meant" anything important but...

'round these parts, the local game shops and used bookstores that get (or stock) 1e AD&D books and modules?  The stuff flies off the shelves.  I can generally guarantee that if a store in question has it one day, the next it'll be gone...

Now does that mean that the stuff is still super popular?  Does it mean that "eBay speculators" are snapping it up to sell as SUPER RARE MUST L@@K BiN $75.00 on eBay?  Does it mean that I only notice it because it is 1e stuff and it moves no faster or slower than old Larry Niven paperbacks and bagged issues of Life magazine?  

Dunno.  It's just a thing I've noticed, though.

Quote from: thedungeondelver;346753I've never been sure if this "meant" anything important but...

'round these parts, the local game shops and used bookstores that get (or stock) 1e AD&D books and modules?  The stuff flies off the shelves.  I can generally guarantee that if a store in question has it one day, the next it'll be gone...

Now does that mean that the stuff is still super popular?  Does it mean that "eBay speculators" are snapping it up to sell as SUPER RARE MUST L@@K BiN $75.00 on eBay?

My favourite used bookshop has had a 1e PHB on the shelf for 6 months because it won't sell on Ebay.

Quote from: Hairfoot;346754My favourite used bookshop has had a 1e PHB on the shelf for 6 months because it won't sell on Ebay.

And that's why I say "I'm not sure if it 'means' anything".

It's probably just a local phenomenon.

I'm sure there's probably places where there's virtually no traffic on the stuff at all (as you note, your FLUBS has had a 1e PHB for six months).

One used bookstore nearby has several 1E AD&D books and modules on the shelves, sitting there for almost a year.

I'm also in Australia.  Shipping might be prohibitive.

This is my bit of anecdotal evidence (my first post here, BTW

Last November I attended the "Comics & Games Fair" in Lucca, Italy - one of the biggest gaming fairs in Europe. They sold both 4E books and 3/3.5E books - the latter at a discount.

I and a friend of mine were looking for the 3E "Draconomicon". On the second day of the fair it was "sold out", but the dude at the stall told us that a new shipment was expected for the day after. So, at the end of the third day, we checked the stall again, only to learn that during the day the new shipment of books had come and gone.

"All the 'Draconomicons' you got today are already gone?"
"Yes, all FOURTY of them"

Well, since my friend was actually interested in the interior art, exp. the one by Lockwood (she is a comic book artist), I suggested her to check the 4E edition Draconomicon (which was sold at full price). She browsed the book and then she ran screaming for the hills. Let's say that 4E art is not something to learn from.

And the same happened with many other 3/3.5E books, and even books from older editions (all of them, it must be said, brand new). Some books (like 3E Forgotten Realms Setting) sold like diamonds priced as peanuts. My final comment was that "4E made former edition books cheaper, but also made people to realize how much they are worth..."

We ended up buying 'Draconomicon' via Amazon.com - which, at the end of the day, was not a bad move, given the value of the dollar vs. the euro. I ordered some other books, too. But, as of now, I'm fearing that if I wish to buy all the books I'm interested in, I will have to rush...

Full disclosure: I've dropped 3e to embrace 4e wholeheartedly, no regrets. Having said that 3e had some spectacular books for it that 4e has yet to match. The Draconomicon, in addition to the entire "monster-type" line (the undead book, the Drow book, etc), were some of my favorites. I only have a couple of the "environment" books, Cityscape and Dungeonscape, but they are quite nice as well. I can see why many of 3e's books are in such high demand and can go for quite a price.

Quote from: Reckall;346778Let's say that 4E art is not something to learn from.

Really?  I think that's one of the better things about the books, IMO.  I don't remember 3e art being anything spectacular.  In fact a lot of it was downright horrible.

Quote from: Peregrin;346816Really?  I think that's one of the better things about the books, IMO.  I don't remember 3e art being anything spectacular.  In fact a lot of it was downright horrible.

3E art, like everything else, had hit and misses. But both the general graphic design and the art in some "key" books (like, as Pete noted, the "monsters" books) were very cool. Some books resembled "scientific" tomes from the Renaissance. And in the early 3E times WotC had a good pool of artists to draw from.

The only 4E books I physically have are the two Forgotten Realms setting. The cover art is good, but the interior art... Boy! Splashes of painfully bright colors masking crude drawings (not to talk about the embarassing quality of the maps - something beyond understanding). And the layout and general graphic design are something I could do with Photoshop (and I'm not a graphic designer :rolleyes:).

I only browsed other 4E books, but I was never hit by the overall quality art (a skin impression is that, like text, art in 4E is more sparse, too). The two Draconomicons doesn't even start to compare. Every then and now I find something interesting in the 4E related art (a friend of mine showed me an elven citadel in the woods, in a recent "Dragon" which was very beautiful both in concept and tecnique) - but these findings, at least IMHO, are rarer in 4E than in 3E.

Quote from: Hairfoot;346383A big change would suggest 4E wasn't as popular as its supporters claimed back in 2009.

What do you mean? Its still 2009. How do you look back on 2009? I only started playing D&D with this new edition. I think you are seeing trends and things that arent really there just because you dont like the new edition.

Someone is missing the pointed sarcasm.  It's all right -- it's the Internet and it's sometimes hard to tell these things without code flags.

!i!