Resource thread for weird and interesting historical details that could make for a more interesting fantasy setting.
One great source of 'huh, they built that WHEN??' is Ancient Inventions book (and series), showing the amazing gynecological instruments available to ancient Romans (not surpassed until about 150 years ago?), stone age bikinis, and much more.
Other stuff:
Olive oil fraud has been a big market for organized crime from the current day to ancient Rome, and ancient Rome had government bodies dedicated to stamping it out.
Fire protection rackets have been a problem in both 19th century New York City and, again, ancient Rome.
(Ancient Rome also had iced drinks, fast food stalls, and many other lesser-known features of 'modern' urban civilization)
One that's bouncing around my head at the moment is the ancient Roman idea of 'evocatio'... where they'd put on a big show of tempting away the tutelary god of an enemy... promising it worship and entertainments. Usually to demoralize a besieged enemy.
The idea of 'stealing' an enemy's god... his protection... like bargaining with mercenaries to switch sides in battle... mercenary gods selling themselves to the highest bidder... gives me some fun ideas for shaman/priest/cleric-types.
Also, the idea of covering idols to punish them... for bad crops, bad weather, etc. I can see some PCs running afoul of locals when they're spotted lifting the drapes on a roadside shrine to some god who has been put in time-out.
That reminds me... in early Mesopotamian culture you'd have a god per city. (Which is common to a whole bunch of early civilizations)
But, even moreso... the priests kept the true name and icons of that god hidden in the temples. Because they didn't want the enemies to learn how to properly invoke the god and tempt the god into betraying the city.
Quote from: Will;788019But, even moreso... the priests kept the true name and icons of that god hidden in the temples. Because they didn't want the enemies to learn how to properly invoke the god and tempt the god into betraying the city.
Interesting. I just finished a horror novel that centered on a cult trying to keep the visage of their fertility god out of the public eye... for fear of losing its favor and their proprietary strain of wheat.
A fun slant... adding ancient idols and occult secrets as targets of modern industrial espionage.
Quote from: Will;788019That reminds me... in early Mesopotamian culture you'd have a god per city. (Which is common to a whole bunch of early civilizations)
But, even moreso... the priests kept the true name and icons of that god hidden in the temples. Because they didn't want the enemies to learn how to properly invoke the god and tempt the god into betraying the city.
Civic gods were very common in the region. An interesting idea that was common at the time was that if your city ascended that your civic god had as well, for instance the rise of Babylon as a power saw its patron Marduk rise to the top of his pantheon.
For gaming purposes you could say that the struggles among the gods have a real effect on the fortunes of those areas that worship them and that an upsurge of worshippers can have a positive effect on a god.
Quote from: Simlasa;788017One that's bouncing around my head at the moment is the ancient Roman idea of 'evocatio'... where they'd put on a big show of tempting away the tutelary god of an enemy... promising it worship and entertainments. Usually to demoralize a besieged enemy.
The idea of 'stealing' an enemy's god... his protection... like bargaining with mercenaries to switch sides in battle... mercenary gods selling themselves to the highest bidder... gives me some fun ideas for shaman/priest/cleric-types.
Also, the idea of covering idols to punish them... for bad crops, bad weather, etc. I can see some PCs running afoul of locals when they're spotted lifting the drapes on a roadside shrine to some god who has been put in time-out.
He, don't tell my players, but it is one of the really big bad things troglodytes (a big cathegory, including kuo-toa, bullywugs, doppelganger and even aboleth) are doing.
They drive the gods of the surface insane with nonsential worship. Not even I am sure whether they do it on purpose.
They are batshit insane, in case you didn't catch that.
Graffiti is endemic to human culture, and ancient graffiti routinely said things like "Livia is a whore," "Posthumus loves to bugger gladiators" and "Samnos' wine shop serves the best food."
One of my favorite bits of real history is the political structure of the Inca Empire. If I understand correctly (which I may not, I'm hardly and expert) it goes like this:
When an emperor dies his body is mummified and parked in his old palace with all of his descendants except for his eldest son. While the eldest son gets to be emperor and builds a new palace, the rest of the descendants get to live in a nice palace and get supported by revenue from the lands that that emperor had conquered.
Then the new emperor had to build a new palace and conquer more land so that all of his descendants except for his eldest son would get a palace to live in and revenue to support them.
As you can imagine things got pretty unwieldy after a while and in certain cases there were conclaves of dead emperors where all of the dead mummified emperors met to discuss important stuff with their descendant/priests interpreting for them.
Quote from: Daztur;788158As you can imagine things got pretty unwieldy after a while and in certain cases there were conclaves of dead emperors where all of the dead mummified emperors met to discuss important stuff with their descendant/priests interpreting for them.
Well, shoot. New role for mummies and liches beyond lurking in a dungeon, waiting to be slain by adventurers.
Tulips - from Amsterdam.
You couldn't really make it up. They were the i-phone of their day. You really don't need them, but we'll persuade you that you do. Oh, by the way, if you're short on the payments on your rent, we'll accept tulips as part payment.
Alas, the tulip bubble will burst, oh yes, it will.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulip_mania
iPhones of its day?? Hahahaha.
(Posted from my iPhone)
Quote from: One Horse Town;788170Tulips - from Amsterdam.
You couldn't really make it up. They were the i-phone of their day. You really don't need them, but we'll persuade you that you do. Oh, by the way, if you're short on the payments on your rent, we'll accept tulips as part payment.
Alas, the tulip bubble will burst, oh yes, it will.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulip_mania
You gotta be shitting me. Gotta love history, you can't make that up.
Quote from: One Horse Town;788170Tulips - from Amsterdam.
Scott Nicholson made a board game about it: Tulipmania 1637 (http://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/33732/tulipmania-1637)
It is little news that forested, riparian environments are prime habitats for humans, but with a little research, one also finds coincidentally the almost universal religious appreciation of trees with sacred groves, benign tree spirits, etc.; from those groups (except Happy Tree Friends).
Quote from: dragoner;788176It is little news that forested, riparian environments are prime habitats for humans, but with a little research, one also finds coincidentally the almost universal religious appreciation of trees with sacred groves, benign tree spirits, etc.; from those groups (except Happy Tree Friends).
Yes. The Tree of Life/World-Tree cosmological concept is an incredibly widespread incredibly ancient idea.
Quote from: CRKrueger;788174You gotta be shitting me. Gotta love history, you can't make that up.
It's not even an isolated incident. When peppercorn started coming back from the East Indies it was worth more than its weight in gold.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/OlderThanTheyThink/Technology
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/OlderThanTheyThink/Other
My favourite bit is the Ancient Greek vending machine for holy water. Show this to anyone who complains that Ardraken's Refreshment Simulacrum (http://www.somethingawful.com/dungeons-and-dragons/wtf-wondrous-items/8/) in your dungeon is "anachronistic" and "hurting verisimilitude".
Quote from: SimlasaInteresting. I just finished a horror novel that centered on a cult trying to keep the visage of their fertility god out of the public eye... for fear of losing its favor and their proprietary strain of wheat.
A fun slant... adding ancient idols and occult secrets as targets of modern industrial espionage.
Ramsey Campbell's
Ancient Images?
Quote from: Steerpike;788786Ramsey Campbell's Ancient Images?
Yup.
My reading group didn't really care for it, it's not really 'horror' IMO... but I thought there were some really interesting ideas in it.
It started me working on a game setting where corporations have tutelary gods/occult patrons ala the book's Redfield/Staff O' Life... ancient rituals as corporate traditions, human sacrifice, corporate sculpture versions of Stonehenge, enchanted water coolers (like the special bread in Ancient Images)... teams of agents, some of who are not human, either as a standing force or as specialists pulled from the ranks who are then possessed by minion spirits (PCs)... making it a bit transhumanist, maybe.
Prehistoric horror/fantasy with a veneer of steel and glass.
Quote from: SimlasaYup.
My reading group didn't really care for it, it's not really 'horror' IMO... but I thought there were some really interesting ideas in it.
It started me working on a game setting where corporations have tutelary gods/occult patrons ala the book's Redfield/Staff O' Life... ancient rituals as corporate traditions, human sacrifice, corporate sculpture versions of Stonehenge, enchanted water coolers (like the special bread in Ancient Images)... teams of agents, some of who are not human, either as a standing force or as specialists pulled from the ranks who are then possessed by minion spirits (PCs)... making it a bit transhumanist, maybe.
Prehistoric horror/fantasy with a veneer of steel and glass.
Cool ideas. Have you read Charles Stross's Laundry novels? They kind of marry water-cooler culture, espionage, and horror together.
I didn't mind
Ancient Images - there were some tense passages - but I felt that the scarecrow/guardians eventually started to lose their menace; if they're so scary, it feels like they should have been able to off Sandy, and after awhile the whole "then she saw a thin man watching her from the roadside... must be a workman, oooooh!" stuff got a
little overplayed. I thought the bits in and around Redfield were quite creepy, though, especially the three women and the ale/bread.
Quote from: Steerpike;788799I thought the bits in and around Redfield were quite creepy, though, especially the three women and the ale/bread.
Yep, they were the scariest part of the book.
I know of The Laundry but it hadn't occurred to me in this context... but yeah... I should go dig into that a bit, thanks!
Quote from: One Horse Town;788671It's not even an isolated incident. When peppercorn started coming back from the East Indies it was worth more than its weight in gold.
With the notable difference that pepper was actually good for something. On the other hand, Tulipmania was outstanding because it was a fad; it was an obsession for something that had no inherent utility.
Its like the difference between the huge value of high-end computer devices and the 90s comic-book pricing bubble. They're not the same thing.
Quote from: RPGPundit;789522With the notable difference that pepper was actually good for something. On the other hand, Tulipmania was outstanding because it was a fad; it was an obsession for something that had no inherent utility.
Its like the difference between the huge value of high-end computer devices and the 90s comic-book pricing bubble. They're not the same thing.
Sure. However, it still stands as an example of a small thing that doesn't spring immediately to mind making a large difference to an economy.
Quote from: Simlasa;788797Yup.
My reading group didn't really care for it, it's not really 'horror' IMO... but I thought there were some really interesting ideas in it.
It started me working on a game setting where corporations have tutelary gods/occult patrons ala the book's Redfield/Staff O' Life... ancient rituals as corporate traditions, human sacrifice, corporate sculpture versions of Stonehenge, enchanted water coolers (like the special bread in Ancient Images)... teams of agents, some of who are not human, either as a standing force or as specialists pulled from the ranks who are then possessed by minion spirits (PCs)... making it a bit transhumanist, maybe.
Prehistoric horror/fantasy with a veneer of steel and glass.
It already somewhat exists I am afraid - check out Kult.
Quote from: RPGPundit;789522With the notable difference that pepper was actually good for something. On the other hand, Tulipmania was outstanding because it was a fad; it was an obsession for something that had no inherent utility.
The cost of the pepper could be argued to well exceed it's value as a spice.
I wouldn't put tulip mania in quite the same category of fads as pet rocks and beanie babies. The rare types of cultivated tulips had the utility possessed by all good or great art - beauty, rarity, and uniqueness.
Commodities bubbles, that's exciting game stuff.
Found on Project Gutenberg. Clearly, one of the great men of history and a good example of how cultures get cross-pollinated with each others aspects.
Quote from: All About CoffeeOn August 13, 1683, Kolschitzky donned a Turkish uniform, passed through the enemy's lines and reached the Emperor's army across the Danube. Several times he made the perilous journey between the camp of the prince of Lorraine and the garrison of the governor of Vienna. One account says that he had to swim the four intervening arms of the Danube each time he performed the feat. His messages did much to keep up the morale of the city's defenders. At length King John and his army of rescuing Poles arrived and were consolidated with the Austrians on the summit of Mount Kahlenberg. It was one of the most dramatic moments in history. The fate of Christian Europe hung in the balance. Everything seemed to point to the triumph of the crescent over the cross. Once again Kolschitzky crossed the Danube, and brought back word concerning the signals that the prince of Lorraine and King John[Pg 50] would give from Mount Kahlenberg to indicate the beginning of the attack. Count Starhemberg was to make a sortie at the same time.
The battle took place September 12, and thanks to the magnificent generalship of King John, the Turks were routed. The Poles here rendered a never-to-be-forgotten service to all Christendom. The Turkish invaders fled, leaving 25,000 tents, 10,000 oxen, 5,000 camels, 100,000 bushels of grain, a great quantity of gold, and many sacks filled with coffee—at that time unknown in Vienna. The booty was distributed; but no one wanted the coffee. They did not know what to do with it; that is, no one except Kolschitzky. He said, "If nobody wants those sacks, I will take them", and every one was heartily glad to be rid of the strange beans. But Kolschitzky knew what he was about, and he soon taught the Viennese the art of preparing coffee. Later, he established the first public booth where Turkish coffee was served in Vienna.
This, then, is the story of how coffee was introduced into Vienna, where was developed that typical Vienna café which has become a model for a large part of the world. Kolschitzky is honored in Vienna as the patron saint of coffee houses. His followers, united in the guild of coffee makers (kaffee-sieder), even erected a statue in his honor. It still stands as part of the facade of a house where the Kolschitzygasse merges into the Favoritengasse, as shown in the accompanying picture.
The source is All About Coffee, by William H. Ukers, copyright 1922, and so now public domain. For those dedicated coffee drinkers, the link is:
http://www.gutenberg.org/files/28500/28500-h/28500-h.htm
Quote from: dragoner;789563Commodities bubbles, that's exciting game stuff.
Its interesting setting flavor and could lead to some unusual encounters and events especially the PCs try to take advantage of the market. Protecting, importing, smuggling, stealing, cons. There's allot of potential.