TheRPGSite

Hi there.

Even though in recent years I've only been lurking, I've been an rpg.net member since 2003.  It used to be a really cool place to hang out and talk RPGs.  It's... not so much, now.

I know we probably don't need another thread about this, but the whole Bill Webb situation has really soured me on rpg.net and its regulars.  Up until he posted his statement, my standpoint was that if he did indeed assault someone, that needs to be addressed.  Assault - of any sort - is not acceptable.  But it sounds like it was addressed: the victim opted to not press charges for whatever reason, and whatever Bill did was addressed internally at FGG and Paizo.  Anything beyond that, is not my business, nor is it the business of any of the rpg.net regulars who were shaking the tree.  It was SJG's business, certainly, since they were entering into a business agreement with FGG, but their statement is that they looked into the situation and ultimately found it a non-issue (my words).

People are redeemable.  If someone makes a bad decision, that bad decision is addressed, and if they never make that similar bad decisions decision life goes on.  Our entire justice system is built on that belief: innocent until proven guilty.  But what's going on over at rpg.net is more like... guilty until forever because we said so, and so is anyone that the guilty party works with.  And that's not OK.

And now we have Bill's statement.  While it's so far uncorroborated (even though there are tweets alluding to his description of the events as factual, even before it was released), if it turns out to be the actual truth (which I suspect it will be, or at least closer to the truth than anything that's previously come out) then the rpg.net regulars who have been campaigning against him and SJG need to have their behavior addressed as well.  It's not OK what they've been doing, at all.  

And you know?  Even if Bill had been a skeevy creep and totally did go over the line with suggestions and innuendo and actions, it was evidently, by all accounts, addressed and dealt with.  Procedures have been put in place to insure it doesn't happen again (not going to cons, going to cons with a chaperone, etc.) so it's still none of the rpg.net regulars' business, and it's still not OK what they've been doing.  People are redeemable; Bill needed the chance to redeem himself.  Without that, he's being treated worse than hardened criminals who have paid for their crimes.  That's not OK.

So.  I'm done over there.   Seems sad to leave a place I've been a member of for so long, but I can't stand it any longer.  And the actual gaming discussed over here is more in line with the gaming that I enjoy; I really dislike PbtA and "story games" and how the GM has been neutered in those games because of "player agency" and the like.  Truth be told, one of my favorite RPGs is the FGG Swords & Wizardry Complete edition for which Stacy Dellorfano was the art director.  

Anyway, to make a long story short, I see there's a bunch of political talk over here, which I'll probably stay clear of, but it looks to be a good site for talking about the RPGs I like and the style of gaming I like.

Welcome. It is a great place to talk about games, without fear of crossing some offensive line that will get you censured or banned.

I for one welcome our chuncky Elder god.

Their is a difference in that  you will not be banned by a mod for simply not agreeing with the narrative and with made up words. The cold calculating way in which they just make a person a social psriah. They way they just would simply destroy a person professional life is disgusting .

Welcome. It's definitely different here. The only times I've seen Pundit threaten to ban someone was when they persistently kept derailing threads and going off topic after being warned to stop.

What caused me to drift away from rpg.net after being a regular reader for years wasn't politics, but rather the collective meltdown that occurred when 5e was announced.

Welcome Chunkthulhu!

...just out of curiosity, what is the SAN loss for seeing the Truffle Shuffle?  :D

Greetings!

Welcome to the forums here! I think you will find this place to be an island of sanity. Indeed, it is a tragedy that RPG.Net has become such a cesspool of tyranny. All of that SJW nonsense has been spreading rapidly to many other sites as well. I certainly enjoy a good debate now and then, but to suffer the top-down ideological tyranny than these SJW morons seek to impose is absolutely disgusting and intolerable. I'm an American, and a veteran. I have zero patience for enforced ideological group-think, and I refuse to tolerate such nonsense. It's good that you have chosen to walk away from them, sir. More people need to follow your example. Our whole society is being torn apart by these SJW thugs, and in many ways, the online world is the frontlines of this cultural war. RPGsite is a great place to discuss all kinds of RPG's, especially OSR and Dungeons and Dragons.

Glad to have you with us!:D

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Do we need a subforum for introductions from exiles?

I'm sorry, Chunkthulhu, you missed the new directive from the Committee for Proper Gaming. It's not about 'being fair', it's about 'reducing harm,' and if that means dragging this out again pour encourager les autres… well, making an omelet requires breaking a few eggs.

(No, I'm not making this up. Exaggerating, maybe, but not making it up. See the thread on RPO at TBP.)

Quote from: moonsweeper;1085098...just out of curiosity, what is the SAN loss for seeing the Truffle Shuffle?  :D

ALL YOUR SAN IS BELONG TO THE TRUFFLE SHUFFLE!  :)

Quote from: Armchair Gamer;1085107See the thread on RPO at TPB.

I've seen "TBP" around in some other threads, but I don't know the acronym.  What is TPB?

Quote from: Chunkthulhu;1085114I've seen "TBP" around in some other threads, but I don't know the acronym.  What is TPB?

  I meant TBP; it's our shorthand for RPGNet--"The Big Purple" or "The Banning Place," depending on whom you ask. :)

Quote from: Chunkthulhu;1085080Truth be told, one of my favorite RPGs is the FGG Swords & Wizardry Complete edition for which Stacy Dellorfano was the art director.  

(http://www.quickmeme.com/img/bd/bd20a579edfbf4fa5bc601aa811de5637c5e943db73410e7f5a364f87c722af6.jpg)

Welcome to theRPGsite!

Quote from: Armchair Gamer;1085116I meant TBP; it's our shorthand for RPGNet--"The Big Purple" or "The Banning Place," depending on whom you ask. :)

Ah, yeah, I meant TBP as well.  I figured it had something to do with rpg.net, just hadn't put that 2 and 2 together.  Thanks.

Quote from: S'mon;1085117(https://memegenerator.net/img/instances/60597128/blasphemy.jpg)

Welcome to theRPGsite!

Thanks!  And yeah, I know that it might be a bit blasphemous, but I think it's my twisted sense of humor which makes that edition my favorite given everything that's going on with FGG and Dellorfano and the like.

Quote from: S'mon;1085117(http://www.quickmeme.com/img/bd/bd20a579edfbf4fa5bc601aa811de5637c5e943db73410e7f5a364f87c722af6.jpg)

Welcome to theRPGsite!

Greetings!

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!:D Ah, yes, my friend! Another one of my favourite movies. Donald Sutherland is such a magnificent actor. That movie, "Invasion of the Bodysnatchers" and his acting throughout, especially with the surprise ending where he gets transformed into an evil pod-person, giving us that macabre image...I think it was from 1979. S'mon, I was what? 11 years old when I saw that movie in the theater at the time. That imagery has stayed with me for life.:D Of course, as an adult, I also have seen it as an analogy of sorts when dealing with ideologies, such as "progessivism" and "SJWism". It's prescient and powerful, even after the passage of 40 years, you know?

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Quote from: Chunkthulhu;1085080Hi there.

Even though in recent years I've only been lurking, I've been an rpg.net member since 2003.  It used to be a really cool place to hang out and talk RPGs.  It's... not so much, now.

I know we probably don't need another thread about this, but the whole Bill Webb situation has really soured me on rpg.net and its regulars.

Looks like the Webb situation turned up the heat on rpg.net a few more degrees.

(https://newmanlive.files.wordpress.com/2017/05/img_9058.jpg?w=620)

Welcome to the deep end of the pool.

Quote from: Kiero;1085104Do we need a subforum for introductions from exiles?

It seems to come in waves. Maybe a single sticky thread would be appropriate?

***

On topic: Welcome Chunkthulu! One of the concequences about free speech is that you may see threads and/or replies here that you may find very disagreeable. Due to the incessant culture war, there's a lot of contentious topics. As you say, you can just skip them.
Like you, I had my boiling point reached at rpg.net, and stopped regularly going to the site, and haven't logged in to the forum in years. It's sad and frustrating, with a dash of schadenfreude.

Quote from: SHARK;1085100Greetings!

Welcome to the forums here! I think you will find this place to be an island of sanity...

I don't know if I'd go that far.  I'd say it's more the case that the insanity on this island is usually a lot more fun rather than disturbing. YMMV. :D

It's not just that people can find redemption...

It's that the people on RPGnet are not the arbiters of *anything* to grant redemption or *anything* else. This is why engaging with them on their terms is pointless. Their terms are clearly laid out: they want all those that don't agree with or be subservient to them to be crushed.

Quote from: tenbones;1085132It's not just that people can find redemption...

It's that the people on RPGnet are not the arbiters of *anything* to grant redemption or *anything* else. This is why engaging with them on their terms is pointless. Their terms are clearly laid out: they want all those that don't agree with or be subservient to them to be crushed.

... and once again the Poobah hits on the D.O.N.G.

Quote from: tenbones;1085132It's not just that people can find redemption...

It's that the people on RPGnet are not the arbiters of *anything* to grant redemption or *anything* else. This is why engaging with them on their terms is pointless. Their terms are clearly laid out: they want all those that don't agree with or be subservient to them to be crushed.

Precisely.

According to the outraged shrieking, Webb having a chaperone from his own team is...

Proof that he's a harasser, but proof that FGG aren't taking things as seriously as they should
Useless to the point of being criminally incompetent, enabling, etc, etc, etc.
Out-fucking-rageous because who can trust a member of staff to keep him in line.

So who should it be? How do you gauge if he's repented?

They don't want the guy at conventions, yet they want him to demonstrate he's changed his behaviour. He shouldn't be allowed to roam around without a parent, yet the most sensible and efficient way of ensuring he's not alone is decried as outrageous. I mean, for fucking fuck's sake: who is going to devote a precious con resource to act as a chaperone? Who's gonna pay for a security guard to do it? The con? I seriously fucking doubt it. And even if they did, it would be a measure only fitting if he was a GoH - which he isn't allowed to be, because he's the fucking devil.

The outraged demands coming from the Purple Haired Stalinists are contradictory, impractical, and designed to make Webb fail before he's even started. The punishments they want to impose are out of all proportion to the 'crime', and they even feel they're justified in demanding them, because 'this isn't a court of law', and because ill-informed heresy and speculation by the righteous is actually more important than the truth.

Even if Bill Webb is guilty of some misdemeanour, the only way he can prove he's learned his lesson and won't do it again, is through allowing back into familiar territory with some sensible measures in place. It's what a fair and reasonable society does. But no, all the Purple Stalinist Bastards want is another fucking scalp.

Fuckers.

(*phew*. That felt good).

Welcome, and enjoy!

Edit: Side note, if anyone would like more entertainment or wants further reason never to return to TBP:

https://forum.rpg.net/index.php?threads/so-totalcon-sexism-and-safety-at-the-convention.842344/

A thread in which people are outraged at "only cishet old white men" have been invited as guests of honor, despite the fact they're just the returning GoH that have been around for years AND the organizer being a woman (who deliberately attempted to invite more women, which declined); she posts her thoughts as well.

Spoiler: it doesn't particularly work.

Quote from: BrokenCounsel;1085141The outraged demands coming from the Purple Haired Stalinists are contradictory, impractical, and designed to make Webb fail before he's even started. The punishments they want to impose are out of all proportion to the 'crime', and they even feel they're justified in demanding them, because 'this isn't a court of law', and because ill-informed heresy and speculation by the righteous is actually more important than the truth.

It's because what they really want is for him to bend the knee and grovel.

Welcome. Ya this topic was just too outrageous for me to ignore. It's a serious issue in the community at this point.

Quote from: shoplifter;1085144It's because what they really want is for him to bend the knee and grovel.

You know, I wish you were right. I wish that's all they really, truly, wanted. But they don't.

This isn't a quest for forgiveness over in Purple Haired Bastard Land; it isn't a quest to gain new converts. It's a pogrom. What the collective shit-mind of TBP actually wants is for Bill Webb to issue a statement that he's stepping down as CEO of Frog God Games, quitting the gaming industry, allowing his wife and kids to change their names so they don't have be tainted by his shame, donating every last cent has has to worthy, gender-fluid, anti-harassment causes, and going to live as hermit on a rock in the south Atlantic where he's guaranteed to die broken and alone by the time winter comes. And even that won't be enough for some of the Purple Haired Fuckers in the Puce Kremlin. They'll want pictures too, and eye-witnesses appointed by the Politically Correct Wing of the UN, report back that he died in writhing agony.

Basically, we're at fucking war.

Quote from: Antiquation!;1085142Welcome, and enjoy!

Edit: Side note, if anyone would like more entertainment or wants further reason never to return to TBP:

https://forum.rpg.net/index.php?threads/so-totalcon-sexism-and-safety-at-the-convention.842344/

A thread in which people are outraged at "only cishet old white men" have been invited as guests of honor, despite the fact they're just the returning GoH that have been around for years AND the organizer being a woman (who deliberately attempted to invite more women, which declined); she posts her thoughts as well.

Spoiler: it doesn't particularly work.

Greetings!

Indeed, my friend. I skimmed through a few pages. Geesus these people are such morons. They're pod-people, like Donald Sutherland in the movie, "Invasion of the Bodysnatchers." Totalcon is a small, regional convention that is having 25 guests of honour, all male--though one is Asian, and two are Black. But the whining, Happy Barney troglodytes are shrieking about, "Oh NO! There's no women, trans, or non-binary guests of honour!!" LOL.:D Whaa! Whaa! Whaa!

Who gives a fuck? Why is that so fucking important? I don't think it is important at all. If guest A is someone interesting and cool from the game industry, great. I don't care if they are male, female, white, yellow, black or purple. Offhand, I can't think of any women, trans, or non-fucking binary people from the "game industry" that I just desperately need to meet, or hear speak. None. I've gone all of these years, and never heard any trans or non-binary people speak about fuck all. Seldom only a few women. I don't need to, either. Is has zero fucking relevance to *my* gaming, my friends, and so on. There's nothing especially valuable or noteworthy about someone simply because they are a woman, trans, or fucking non-binary. For a convention to go out of their fucking way to desperately seek out and beg such people to come to the con as guests of honour is fucking stupid. It's entirely unnecessary. This whole glorification and fetishization of women, trans, and non-binary people is so fucking annoying, pathetic, and stupid. It really has fuck all to do with gaming and the hobby. I sure as fuck don't want to listen to any of these troglodytes speak about whatever fake propaganda they come up with as a facade to lecture everyone else there on how homophobic, transphobic, and mysoginistic everyone is. Cutting all that stupid shit out kinda narrows it down, now don't it? That's because most of these fucking troglodytes are simply ideologues. Fuck them. I have no interest in hearing them spew a bunch of diarhea propaganda to an audience. If they need to feel special, why don't these fucking morons get together and have a special Happy Rainbow Barney fuckfest convention, where *all of the guests of honour* can be sobbing women, trans, and cupcake non-binary snowflakes? Make all the topics choking full of their SJW bullshit. See how well that convention goes. I hope it would go great. Let them all wallow together in their Happy Rainbow Barney convention. Anyone who wants to go can go. Other conventions, however, don't have to fucking pander to these SJW ideologues, and let them continue to pollute and corrode, and degrade our hobby. The whole fucking identity BS is so mindless and poisonous. Fuck them.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Quote from: SHARK;1085152If guest A is someone interesting and cool from the game industry, great. I don't care if they are male, female, white, yellow, black or purple.

That's a viewpoint I share, which - for some reason I'll never understand - is a viewpoint that is really hard for some people to grok.

Quote from: SHARK;1085152Indeed, my friend. I skimmed through a few pages. Geesus these people are such morons. They're pod-people, like Donald Sutherland in the movie, "Invasion of the Bodysnatchers." Totalcon is a small, regional convention that is having 25 guests of honour, all male--though one is Asian, and two are Black. But the whining, Happy Barney troglodytes are shrieking about, "Oh NO! There's no women, trans, or non-binary guests of honour!!" LOL.:D Whaa! Whaa! Whaa!

Ha-ha! I love that movie. And yes exactly, like what, they're supposed to fucking materialize trans people and women out of thin air just to pad the ranks? Perhaps they should just close the doors of the con until we can either make more, or simply settle on extermination (or at least a nice righteous castration) for the remaining white males.

It is so odd to me that these types of opinions are almost exclusively touted by sheltered, young, American, middle-class white people who seem to think such "downtrodden" and "subjugated" (or, shit, what's that word they love using? "Minimized"? "Sidelined"?) women and ethnicities so desperately need their help and "progress" forced down their throats. It's bizarre, and unlike some alt-right conspiracy bogeyman it's ACTUALLY racist and sexist.

Quote from: SHARK;1085152Who gives a fuck? Why is that so fucking important? I don't think it is important at all. If guest A is someone interesting and cool from the game industry, great. I don't care if they are male, female, white, yellow, black or purple.

Ha, yes SHARK! Exactly this!

Quote from: SHARK;1085152Other conventions, however, don't have to fucking pander to these SJW ideologues, and let them continue to pollute and corrode, and degrade our hobby. The whole fucking identity BS is so mindless and poisonous. Fuck them.

Hear, hear. May their pendulum of cultural relevance swing back soon.

Quote from: SHARK;1085152Who gives a fuck? Why is that so fucking important? I don't think it is important at all. If guest A is someone interesting and cool from the game industry, great. I don't care if they are male, female, white, yellow, black or purple.

It's not important. They only think that shit is, because that's how they choose to define themselves, using only skin-deep traits. There's a reason on twitter it's considered a red flag when someone puts their sexuality and pronouns in their bio.

Quote from: Chunkthulhu;1085154That's a viewpoint I share, which - for some reason I'll never understand - is a viewpoint that is really hard for some people to grok.

Greetings!

Exactly, sir. Are they celebrated game designers? Accomplished authors? Brilliant artists? Yeah, I'm interested. How does any of such criteria have to do with whether they are "women, trans, and non-binary"? Hmmm...maybe because our hobby is majority male? Oh that's right, it's always been majority male. Oh, and by extension, all the famous people in it are also mostly men. This isn't some evil conspiracy. It's just normal reality. Not many women. Not many trans, or fucking "non-binary". LOL. More importantly, no, our hobby doesn't need to be hijacked and thrown into the cesspool by a bunch of SJW ideologues.

I think Chunk that the looming problem, as many have commented, we aren't dealing with normal, healthy, rational people. These are generally SJW freaks. That means most of them are emotionally and mentally damaged. It also means that they are *consumed* by politics, ideology, and their special *identity*. They are so emotionally and mentally damaged, and brainwashed, they simply cannot have a rational discussion about much of anything. I think that's why they don't "Grok" the idea, Chunk. It's because people like us are normal--we aren't consumed by SJW identity politics and ideology.:D

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Quote from: Antiquation!;1085142Welcome, and enjoy!

Edit: Side note, if anyone would like more entertainment or wants further reason never to return to TBP:

https://forum.rpg.net/index.php?threads/so-totalcon-sexism-and-safety-at-the-convention.842344/

A thread in which people are outraged at "only cishet old white men" have been invited as guests of honor, despite the fact they're just the returning GoH that have been around for years AND the organizer being a woman (who deliberately attempted to invite more women, which declined); she posts her thoughts as well.

Spoiler: it doesn't particularly work.

Heh. They should try harder, like my local con. https://breakoutcon.com/guests/

Even though its my local con, I just can't seem to work up the enthusiasm to actually go.

Quote from: BrokenCounsel;1085159Heh. They should try harder, like my local con. https://breakoutcon.com/guests/

Even though its my local con, I just can't seem to work up the enthusiasm to actually go.

With that guest list I CANNOT IMAGINE how you can resist attending! :eek:

Quote from: BrokenCounsel;1085159Heh. They should try harder, like my local con. https://breakoutcon.com/guests/

Even though its my local con, I just can't seem to work up the enthusiasm to actually go.

Whoa.

Quote from: S'mon;1085165With that guest list I CANNOT IMAGINE how you can resist attending! :eek:

Yeah. It's all a bit too X-cardy for me.

Quote from: SHARK;1085100I'm an American, and a veteran. I have zero patience for enforced ideological group-think, and I refuse to tolerate such nonsense.

Hey, SHARK

I always imagined that part of being a veteran was going through the enforced ideological group think. ;)

Quote from: BrokenCounsel;1085159Heh. They should try harder, like my local con. https://breakoutcon.com/guests/

Even though its my local con, I just can't seem to work up the enthusiasm to actually go.

Greetings!

Geesus. The only name I recognize in that whole list of people is Robin Laws. He's also probably the most sane of the bunch. The rest all sound like stuffed-animal clutching SJW freaks.

I can't imagine summoning up a deep desire to attend such a convention with these people as special guests. By reading their bios, they are into games I have no interest in whatsoever. Their special Happy Rainbow Barney ideology that they all seem to embrace and champion makes them have zero appeal for me.

I'd much rather spend a weekend with a bunch of normal gamers, some good drink, and fine cigars, and playing D and D.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

As a "person of color " myself I hate seeing forced or token diversity.  In regards to that thread fro rpgnet, it seems the only people who care about too many white males are white near males themselves.

Quote from: Shasarak;1085169Hey, SHARK

I always imagined that part of being a veteran was going through the enforced ideological group think. ;)

Greetings!

LOL!:D Well, yes, to an extent that is very true my friend. However, even the NCO's openly tell you that by volunteering, we have voluntarily surrendered or abrogated certain aspects of our rights as citizens. Such is required to organizing and running a military that is ready for war. Thinking *differently*, thinking you're special, demanding to express your opinion, or insisting that your view or choices are right, can easily get other members of the unit killed, including yourself. Secondary effects can bring about death and defeat for many, all because *one* individual decided they could sleep on guard duty, or decided they knew better about X than their NCO or Commander. All of that is to say, that there is certainly a demand and requirement of ideological, psychological, and behavior conformity that must be observed by every member of the military. That abrogation of personal freedom and rights is also some of what we veterans sacrifice by serving our nation. The government owns you!:D

Like one of my Drill Instructors told us during Boot Camp; "Yes, Recruits. Your heart may belong to Jesus, but yo' ass belongs to the Corps!"

As he proceeded to march us out to the sand pit, doing physical PT until we were in pools of sweat in the hot sun, and then made us roll around in the sand, showing us that we could become a "Sugar Cookie". Ah yes. I remember those days well, my friend!:D Funny thing too, our instructors explained to us even in the very beginning, that our training and experiences in the Marine Corps would change our souls, for our entire lives. No matter what we did, or how long we lived, a thousand little details would remain with us from being made into Marines. Good stuff, Shasarak!

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Quote from: Antiquation!;1085142Welcome, and enjoy!

Edit: Side note, if anyone would like more entertainment or wants further reason never to return to TBP:

https://forum.rpg.net/index.php?threads/so-totalcon-sexism-and-safety-at-the-convention.842344/

A thread in which people are outraged at "only cishet old white men" have been invited as guests of honor, despite the fact they're just the returning GoH that have been around for years AND the organizer being a woman (who deliberately attempted to invite more women, which declined); she posts her thoughts as well.

Spoiler: it doesn't particularly work.

Well...

Quote from: Some idiot from that thread22 white guys, 1 Asian, 2 African American.
Wow. That's really representative of the industry alright.

If the 2 women they invited had accepted, then...yeah actually, not too far off, if I had to guess.

Here's the Guest of Honor rule, you get 1 per 1000 attendees.

Beyond that, its mostly just a list of "industry people who got a free badge"

Quote from: Antiquation!;1085142Spoiler: it doesn't particularly work.

Thread is a shitshow. Watching crazycongirl try to kiss all their asses, only to get bitchslapped was particularly cringey.

Just got myself a perma for changing my Avatar to a Trump sticker. The mod was triggered enough to remove it so fragile eyes wouldn't be harmed.

Goodbye after 17 years. Nothing of value was lost. It's rather incredible how traffic has dropped over the past few years.

Quote from: Ratman_tf;1085198Thread is a shitshow. Watching crazycongirl try to kiss all their asses, only to get bitchslapped was particularly cringey.

They really, truly are insane zealots. I don't particularly enjoy using those terms against people I disagree with because I think it's generally reductive and insular, but in this case I can't help but believe that's an accurate description of these people.

Quote from: Antiquation!;1085142Welcome, and enjoy!

Edit: Side note, if anyone would like more entertainment or wants further reason never to return to TBP:

https://forum.rpg.net/index.php?threads/so-totalcon-sexism-and-safety-at-the-convention.842344/

A thread in which people are outraged at "only cishet old white men" have been invited as guests of honor, despite the fact they're just the returning GoH that have been around for years AND the organizer being a woman (who deliberately attempted to invite more women, which declined); she posts her thoughts as well.

Spoiler: it doesn't particularly work.

Why don't those retards just make their own con if they have problems with all the other ones?

Quote from: Brad;1085205Why don't those retards just make their own con if they have problems with all the other ones?

That would make too much fucking sense. But I don't think taking their ball and finding their own playground counts as "progress". They'd probably come up with some bizarre mental gymnastics for why doing so would be both racists and empowering to the male patriarchy or some such horseshit.

Quote from: Brad;1085205Why don't those retards just make their own con if they have problems with all the other ones?

VERY good question...

Quote from: Brad;1085205Why don't those retards just make their own con if they have problems with all the other ones?

Because it isn't about having a 'good' Con for them.
It is all about exercising control over others.


Welcome, shoplifter!

Oh, and I forgot: Welcome, Chunkthulhu!

I tend to prefer S&W as my favorite OSR myself, if I can't count Traveller as "old school". Although I will say that even before I knew the design team for (what I think was) the limited edition run was all female, I had notice how downright effeminate literally every single piece of art in the book is. The design of the book itself was quite nice, but that was downright jarring and was impossible to unsee once I saw it.

Quote from: shoplifter;1085199Just got myself a perma for changing my Avatar to a Trump sticker. The mod was triggered enough to remove it so fragile eyes wouldn't be harmed.

Goodbye after 17 years. Nothing of value was lost. It's rather incredible how traffic has dropped over the past few years.

Welcome!

I actually saw your ban over there when I was reading the BESM thread! LOL. At first I saw the "banned" next to your name and assumed it was because of some archaic "no pro capitalism" offence...but then I saw the RED TEXT and thought, "yup - that'll do it".

You'll find no such horseshit here.

Quote from: Brad;1085205Why don't those retards just make their own con if they have problems with all the other ones?

Why would they ever spend effort creating anything when they can simply righteously attempt to destroy others? Sorry, what I meant was they are attempting to correct social injustices affecting the West. And let's be honest, that's a good thing.

Quote from: BrokenCounsel;1085150You know, I wish you were right. I wish that's all they really, truly, wanted. But they don't.

This isn't a quest for forgiveness over in Purple Haired Bastard Land; it isn't a quest to gain new converts. It's a pogrom. What the collective shit-mind of TBP actually wants is for Bill Webb to issue a statement that he's stepping down as CEO of Frog God Games, quitting the gaming industry, allowing his wife and kids to change their names so they don't have be tainted by his shame, donating every last cent has has to worthy, gender-fluid, anti-harassment causes, and going to live as hermit on a rock in the south Atlantic where he's guaranteed to die broken and alone by the time winter comes. And even that won't be enough for some of the Purple Haired Fuckers in the Puce Kremlin. They'll want pictures too, and eye-witnesses appointed by the Politically Correct Wing of the UN, report back that he died in writhing agony.

Basically, we're at fucking war.

Yes. That's exactly correct.

Quote from: shoplifter;1085199Just got myself a perma for changing my Avatar to a Trump sticker.

And yet here, in our nightmarish alt-right hellscape of evilness, everyone is welcome to have a Bernie / Hillary / AOC avatar.

Welcome aboard!!

Quote from: Brad;1085205Why don't those retards just make their own con if they have problems with all the other ones?

Quote from: SavageSchemer;1085206They'd probably come up with some bizarre mental gymnastics for why doing so would be both racists and empowering to the male patriarchy or some such horseshit.

Given the rise of "silence is endorsement of the status quo"-type thinking in socjus circles lately, I expect that, if you asked them, you'd get something pretty much like that as your answer.  "We would be enabling and supporting the patriarchal racism of existing cons if we started our own con instead of challenging the anti-feminist elements in our community" or something.

Wokeness cannot create anything of substance or anything that can last. The Purple Jacobins can only destroy.

Quote from: Brad;1085205Why don't those retards just make their own con if they have problems with all the other ones?

But they did. Haven't you ever heard of Fancon?:D

Quote from: Chunkthulhu;1085080Hi there.

Even though in recent years I've only been lurking, I've been an rpg.net member since 2003.  It used to be a really cool place to hang out and talk RPGs.  It's... not so much, now.

I know we probably don't need another thread about this, but the whole Bill Webb situation has really soured me on rpg.net and its regulars.  Up until he posted his statement, my standpoint was that if he did indeed assault someone, that needs to be addressed.  Assault - of any sort - is not acceptable.  But it sounds like it was addressed: the victim opted to not press charges for whatever reason, and whatever Bill did was addressed internally at FGG and Paizo.  Anything beyond that, is not my business, nor is it the business of any of the rpg.net regulars who were shaking the tree.  It was SJG's business, certainly, since they were entering into a business agreement with FGG, but their statement is that they looked into the situation and ultimately found it a non-issue (my words).

People are redeemable.  If someone makes a bad decision, that bad decision is addressed, and if they never make that similar bad decisions decision life goes on.  Our entire justice system is built on that belief: innocent until proven guilty.  But what's going on over at rpg.net is more like... guilty until forever because we said so, and so is anyone that the guilty party works with.  And that's not OK.

And now we have Bill's statement.  While it's so far uncorroborated (even though there are tweets alluding to his description of the events as factual, even before it was released), if it turns out to be the actual truth (which I suspect it will be, or at least closer to the truth than anything that's previously come out) then the rpg.net regulars who have been campaigning against him and SJG need to have their behavior addressed as well.  It's not OK what they've been doing, at all.  

And you know?  Even if Bill had been a skeevy creep and totally did go over the line with suggestions and innuendo and actions, it was evidently, by all accounts, addressed and dealt with.  Procedures have been put in place to insure it doesn't happen again (not going to cons, going to cons with a chaperone, etc.) so it's still none of the rpg.net regulars' business, and it's still not OK what they've been doing.  People are redeemable; Bill needed the chance to redeem himself.  Without that, he's being treated worse than hardened criminals who have paid for their crimes.  That's not OK.

So.  I'm done over there.   Seems sad to leave a place I've been a member of for so long, but I can't stand it any longer.  And the actual gaming discussed over here is more in line with the gaming that I enjoy; I really dislike PbtA and "story games" and how the GM has been neutered in those games because of "player agency" and the like.  Truth be told, one of my favorite RPGs is the FGG Swords & Wizardry Complete edition for which Stacy Dellorfano was the art director.  

Anyway, to make a long story short, I see there's a bunch of political talk over here, which I'll probably stay clear of, but it looks to be a good site for talking about the RPGs I like and the style of gaming I like.

I can sympathize. There does seem to be something going on on rpg.net in anecdotal observation. The Mods are on a "The random beatings will continue until moral improves" bender, I've run across more people leaving the place. For here and some others. Not a flood and I have seen nothing solid to indicate its failing (whatever that means for a web forum site) but there does seem to be something shaky. People who have been posters for decades without a mod comment are racking up 4-5 RED TEXTS in a week?

Or that's just me enjoying wishing up something to enjoy some schadenfreude.

Quote from: Dimitrios;1085275But they did. Haven't you ever heard of Fancon?:D

Nope, I hadn't. A quick Google search found this link: https://www.vulture.com/2018/05/fancon-controversial-collapse.html

If that's just 10% accurate, these people are even dumber than I thought.

Quote from: Brad;1085285Nope, I hadn't. A quick Google search found this link: https://www.vulture.com/2018/05/fancon-controversial-collapse.html

If that's just 10% accurate, these people are even dumber than I thought.

Gay people are roughly 3-5% of the population. The country is 2/3 white. We need to go for an extreme minority of a minority, and then complain when it isn't financially viable because science!

Quote from: Lurtch;1085286Gay people are roughly 3-5% of the population. The country is 2/3 white. We need to go for an extreme minority of a minority, and then complain when it isn't financially viable because science!

The dumbest part is...you're gonna have LeVar Burton as a special guest. He has such a broad range of appeal that with very little marketing you could have easily filled that convention center. Instead, tell all the white virgin neckbeard Trekkies they're not welcome! Turn off the middle aged guy with the hyped up gay nonsense and he won't bring his family to see the Reading Rainbow guy! Etc., etc. Beyond fucking stupid.

Quote from: CarlD.;1085282I can sympathize. There does seem to be something going on on rpg.net in anecdotal observation. The Mods are on a "The random beatings will continue until moral improves", I've run across more people leaving the place. For here and some others. Not a flood and I have seen nothing solid to indicate its failing (whatever that means for a web forum site) but there does seem to be something shaky. People who have been posters for decades without a mod comment are racking up 4-5 RED TEXTS in a week?

Or that's just me enjoying wishing up something to enjoy some schadenfreude.

Maybe the lawsuit is pushing the SJWs over the edge kind of like the 2016 election...

If they are worried about losing their power over other people, they will only try to tighten their grip.  
They have shown that it isn't enough for them to have one group of people agree with them and another group somewhere else who doesn't really interact with them.
ALL other persons must be moved into their circle of control or removed entirely.
If the LDS (Lawsuit Derangement Syndrome :D ) has motivated them enough, this round of Purity Testing/Banning may be centered on people who try to avoid the whole mess and only concentrate on gaming.

More along the lines of "You have not shown your support and proven your rightthink, Citizen" instead of the "You must be penalized for wrongthink, Citizen" that has been the norm.

The fact that they are now hiding their behavior from the General Public is almost certainly a sign of fracturing/loss of control in their system...

I'm tempted to create an account on TBP just to be able to read some of the garbage, for the humor value if nothing else. :)

...and a big "Welcome" to anyone I may have missed!

Quote from: Brad;1085285Nope, I hadn't. A quick Google search found this link: https://www.vulture.com/2018/05/fancon-controversial-collapse.html

If that's just 10% accurate, these people are even dumber than I thought.

If they'd been remotely reasonable, like picking a moderate sized hotel for their venue, they might have been fine. Instead they decided that they could fill the Baltimore convention center in their first year.

Quote from: moonsweeper;1085290...and a big "Welcome" to anyone I may have missed!

indeed, welcome to the Island of Misfit Toys.

Quote from: moonsweeper;1085290If the LDS (Lawsuit Derangement Syndrome :D ) has motivated them enough, this round of Purity Testing/Banning may be centered on people who try to avoid the whole mess and only concentrate on gaming.

That would be huge. I suspect it would be the breaking point for a lot of posters who simply keep their heads down. And we know they're out there, they trickle into this forum regularly enough.

Welcome to the Mos Eisley spaceport of gaming forums, Chunkthulhu and shoplifter! You'll find a very much saner environment here then TBP.

Welcome Chunkthulhu!

Quote from: Dimitrios;1085275But they did. Haven't you ever heard of Fancon?:D

I want to give FanCon a pass based on ignorance, arrogance and incompetence, but my gut says FanCon ripped off their backers using identity politics as the cover for the scam.  

I still wonder where the money went and why the story vanished so nice and neatly.

Quote from: CarlD.;1085298indeed, welcome to the Island of Misfit Toys.

In the original, Santa didn't return to the Island.
https://www.nbc26.com/news/national/why-the-original-ending-to-rudolph-the-red-nosed-reindeer-was-heartbreaking

Quote from: Spinachcat;1085371In the original, Santa didn't return to the Island.
https://www.nbc26.com/news/national/why-the-original-ending-to-rudolph-the-red-nosed-reindeer-was-heartbreaking

Damn, I never knew about that.

Quote from: Spinachcat;1085371I want to give FanCon a pass based on ignorance, arrogance and incompetence, but my gut says FanCon ripped off their backers using identity politics as the cover for the scam.  

I still wonder where the money went and why the story vanished so nice and neatly.




In the original, Santa didn't return to the Island.
https://www.nbc26.com/news/national/why-the-original-ending-to-rudolph-the-red-nosed-reindeer-was-heartbreaking

Greetings!

Interesting! In 1964, too. I suppose I'm not surprised, though. Like I explained to my friend from Persia, America has always been of two minds; one mind if arrogant, proud, greedy and imperialistic. Hungry for wealth, prestige, and glory. The other mind is deeply informed through our Judeo-Christian foundation, as well as historical dynamics resulting from the very first pilgrims and settlers. That mind is righteous, humble, insular, god-fearing, and embraces a deep sympathy for the underdog, and the downtrodden. This emotional dynamism has been a result of the historical experience of many Americans being the downtrodden of Europe; those of the desperate working classes, the rejected aristocrat, farmer, worker, barbarian and Christian. All and any that the established and powerful elites of Europe looked down upon in condescension and disgust.

These two minds, these two powerful dynamics have been intertwined with our soul as a nation from the beginning, and is with us to the current day.

As for the Christmas Holiday cartoon of "Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer" and it's original sad ending, I can see why it was hurredly changed. In 1964, I can well understand the immediate impulse and sympathy for the Island of Misfit Toys, and the flood of mail such a disregard inspired. The Island of Misfit Toys is *US*, America.:D

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Quote from: Spinachcat;1085371I want to give FanCon a pass based on ignorance, arrogance and incompetence, but my gut says FanCon ripped off their backers using identity politics as the cover for the scam.  

I still wonder where the money went and why the story vanished so nice and neatly.




In the original, Santa didn't return to the Island.
https://www.nbc26.com/news/national/why-the-original-ending-to-rudolph-the-red-nosed-reindeer-was-heartbreaking

Just throwing out a bit of interesting downer trivia or is there something I missed?

Quote from: SHARK;1085397The Island of Misfit Toys is *US*, America.:D

So true. That's why my dick shoots out strawberry jelly!

Quote from: CarlD.;1085471Just throwing out a bit of interesting downer trivia or is there something I missed?

It's crazy downer trivia! How the hell did anyone watch that cut and go, "yeah, the kids are gonna be cool with Rudolph breaking his promise and Santa leaving the sad toys to die on that island!"???

Quote from: SHARK;1085172Greetings!

Geesus. The only name I recognize in that whole list of people is Robin Laws. He's also probably the most sane of the bunch. The rest all sound like stuffed-animal clutching SJW freaks.

I know Butterfield from board gaming. Freedom in the Galaxy is seeing a resurgance of interest and theres been a longstanding group of fans of the two Pandora games discussing, playing and even adding to it. Heck, I even built a to scale model of the Pandora in Minecraft.

Van Heil I know vaugly from his Usagi Yojimbo RPG way back. And Valens was in the limelight for a bit with the recent 3e Arkham Horror, changes to which didnt sit too well with some fans.

The rest are either people in gaming, or odd ones that seem to be just kinda... there... odd.

Quote from: Spinachcat;1085476So true. That's why my dick shoots out strawberry jelly!

You should really see a doctor about that.

Quote from: CarlD.;1085282I can sympathize. There does seem to be something going on on rpg.net in anecdotal observation. The Mods are on a "The random beatings will continue until moral improves", I've run across more people leaving the place. For here and some others. Not a flood and I have seen nothing solid to indicate its failing (whatever that means for a web forum site) but there does seem to be something shaky. People who have been posters for decades without a mod comment are racking up 4-5 RED TEXTS in a week?

Yeah, and the craziest part is that they don't see this as the site failing, they see it as a victory.  Somewhere in the mid-50s-pages of the "Steve Jackson refunds" thread, there's some talk about how great it is that all these long-term forum members are outing themselves as alt-right gamergaters, which allows the mods to finally purify the site by banning them.

There's not even a hint of a thought that, just maybe, the site might be on the wrong track when all these people who have track records of being reasonable are suddenly saying things have gone wrong.  (Of course, part of the reason for the absence of such suggestions is likely to be the knowledge that, if you admit to thinking such a thing, you'll be the next one on the chopping block.)

As I said many times no surprise. To be part of the rpg.net cool kids club they either never were interested in an open gaming forum . Or worse to not get banned it is a case of see/hear/speak no evil. I really cannot remotely understand  that kind of behavior.

 As a forum poster no pay or benefits of any kind one would receive at an actual job. Plenty of other rpg forums out their. Yet according to them we are the worst of either website. Then again I have seen it too often in real life and lost many good friends because I'm not a yes man.

Quote from: Spinachcat;1085476So true. That's why my dick shoots out strawberry jelly!

Dude, I told you to wrap your rascal when you were dating Shortcake...

I guess I must have passed into irrelevance over there, since I still haven't been banned. There was a time people were reporting my posts in the hopes something would prove to be "problematic" enough that I could be perma-banned. Probably helps that I doubt anyone is following what I say on Facebook either.

I walked away a few years ago after a ridiculous ban was followed by an arbitrary and capricious extension, and never looked back.

Quote from: Kiero;1085104Do we need a subforum for introductions from exiles?

I never thought I'd say this, but it wouldn't hurt.

Quote from: S'mon;1085165With that guest list I CANNOT IMAGINE how you can resist attending! :eek:

What's sad is how many of those people I consider to be close friends. It honestly feels like they've joined a cult, and I'm not sure where I stand with them anymore.

Quote from: nDervish;1085266Given the rise of "silence is endorsement of the status quo"-type thinking in socjus circles lately,

Which is just a variation of "Silence is consent", which they hate.

Quote from: Dimitrios;1085291If they'd been remotely reasonable, like picking a moderate sized hotel for their venue, they might have been fine. Instead they decided that they could fill the Baltimore convention center in their first year.

They truly believe they represent a larger group than they actually do.

Quote from: nDervish;1085502Yeah, and the craziest part is that they don't see this as the site failing, they see it as a victory.  Somewhere in the mid-50s-pages of the "Steve Jackson refunds" thread, there's some talk about how great it is that all these long-term forum members are outing themselves as alt-right gamergaters, which allows the mods to finally purify the site by banning them.

There's not even a hint of a thought that, just maybe, the site might be on the wrong track when all these people who have track records of being reasonable are suddenly saying things have gone wrong.  (Of course, part of the reason for the absence of such suggestions is likely to be the knowledge that, if you admit to thinking such a thing, you'll be the next one on the chopping block.)

And they really are trying to redefine failure as success.

Quote from: Anon Adderlan;1085991What's sad is how many of those people I consider to be close friends. It honestly feels like they've joined a cult, and I'm not sure where I stand with them anymore.

I NEVER reply to your posts but god. This hit me in the heart. I miss my friends.

Quote from: Anon Adderlan;1085991What's sad is how many of those people I consider to be close friends. It honestly feels like they've joined a cult, and I'm not sure where I stand with them anymore.

Quote from: Azraele;1085995I NEVER reply to your posts but god. This hit me in the heart. I miss my friends.

This is so true.  The biggest casualty in this culture war has been the dozens of friends I've lost over stupid BS.  People I grew up with, people I went to school with, people I've gamed with, people I've LARPed with, online gaming friends, etc.  And it's all been on their end.  Not to one of them did I say "I'm done with you," rather it's all been them deciding that all of a sudden I'm the problem with world today and cutting me out of their lives.

I just want to play silly elf games with my friends again. :(

Quote from: rgalex;1086009This is so true.  The biggest casualty in this culture war has been the dozens of friends I've lost over stupid BS.  People I grew up with, people I went to school with, people I've gamed with, people I've LARPed with, online gaming friends, etc.  And it's all been on their end.  Not to one of them did I say "I'm done with you," rather it's all been them deciding that all of a sudden I'm the problem with world today and cutting me out of their lives.

For what it's worth, I admire you for holding on until the knife came down from the other side. I've taken the excuse of fatherhood and breadwinner responsibilities to let the friendships that I didn't think would survive an honest conversation about certain topics just fade out, which is the coward's way of dealing with such things.

Quote from: nDervish;1085502Yeah, and the craziest part is that they don't see this as the site failing, they see it as a victory.  Somewhere in the mid-50s-pages of the "Steve Jackson refunds" thread, there's some talk about how great it is that all these long-term forum members are outing themselves as alt-right gamergaters, which allows the mods to finally purify the site by banning them.

There's not even a hint of a thought that, just maybe, the site might be on the wrong track when all these people who have track records of being reasonable are suddenly saying things have gone wrong.  (Of course, part of the reason for the absence of such suggestions is likely to be the knowledge that, if you admit to thinking such a thing, you'll be the next one on the chopping block.)

Well, the more frustrated angry people standing outside the velvet rope, the more exclusive and trendy the club right? :rolleyes:

Quote from: rgalex;1086009This is so true.  The biggest casualty in this culture war has been the dozens of friends I've lost over stupid BS.  People I grew up with, people I went to school with, people I've gamed with, people I've LARPed with, online gaming friends, etc.  And it's all been on their end.  Not to one of them did I say "I'm done with you," rather it's all been them deciding that all of a sudden I'm the problem with world today and cutting me out of their lives.

I just want to play silly elf games with my friends again. :(

Maybe it's a weird British thing, but I don't think I've lost a single friend over politics, never mind gaming politics. 80% of my friends are left-liberal and these days I'm right wing by UK standards, but I've never seen any "You're dead to me now" stuff from anyone I considered a friend.

Quote from: S'mon;1086020Maybe it's a weird British thing, but I don't think I've lost a single friend over politics, never mind gaming politics. 80% of my friends are left-liberal and these days I'm right wing by UK standards, but I've never seen any "You're dead to me now" stuff from anyone I considered a friend.

Same, barring a few rabidly left-wing outliers (and Corbyn loyalists), I haven't lost any friends either. Most people I know are left-of-centre, when I'm right wing.

Quote from: shoplifter;1085199It's rather incredible how traffic has dropped over the past few years.

Hmm... let's take a look at the alexa rankings.  It looks like all rpg forums are in decline.

rpg.net
[ATTACH=CONFIG]3353[/ATTACH]

therpgsite.com
[ATTACH=CONFIG]3354[/ATTACH]

enworld.org
[ATTACH=CONFIG]3355[/ATTACH]

dragonsfoot.org
[ATTACH=CONFIG]3356[/ATTACH]

Is it just me, or is the y-axis backwards on those graphs?  To me it looks like readership is going up, according to those charts.  From 25k to 40k on rpgnet, for instance.

Quote from: Chunkthulhu;1086034Is it just me, or is the y-axis backwards on those graphs?  To me it looks like readership is going up, according to those charts.  From 25k to 40k on rpgnet, for instance.

I think that is web site ranking so from 25,000th most popular down to 40,000th most popular.

Quote from: goblinslayer;1086027Hmm... let's take a look at the alexa rankings.  It looks like all rpg forums are in decline.

(...)

What about RPG Pub (rpgpub.com) and RPGGeek (rpggeek.com)?

Quote from: goblinslayer;1086027Hmm... let's take a look at the alexa rankings.  It looks like all rpg forums are in decline.

rpg.net
[ATTACH=CONFIG]3353[/ATTACH]

therpgsite.com
[ATTACH=CONFIG]3354[/ATTACH]

enworld.org
[ATTACH=CONFIG]3355[/ATTACH]

dragonsfoot.org
[ATTACH=CONFIG]3356[/ATTACH]

Forums are in decline, period.  Social media is too easy.

Bit of a tangent, can someone tell me what the fuck typing the word "vibes" over on TBP means? Is this the secular version of sending prayers via Facebook likes or some shit?

Edit: And what exactly is a "bad actor"?

Quote from: S'mon;1086020Maybe it's a weird British thing, but I don't think I've lost a single friend over politics, never mind gaming politics. 80% of my friends are left-liberal and these days I'm right wing by UK standards, but I've never seen any "You're dead to me now" stuff from anyone I considered a friend.

I haven't lost any friends, but lately I've avoided plenty of acquaintances that in an earlier time might have become at least somewhat "friendly" in a specific context, such as a gaming group.  I can't trust myself to not say something when "that guy" starts blathering, and I'm tired to being the one to diffuse the thing and get back to gaming (or whatever).  So the rest of them can game with him or me, but not both.  And usually the path of least resistance is the one chosen in such things.  Besides, I don't need them, when I've got people that don't do that to me that I can spend all my gaming time with instead.

TL,DR:  There are people and groups out there so self-unaware that it wouldn't take much before I'll be the one saying, "I'm done with you."  Sensing that, I'd rather skip the drama altogether.

Quote from: Antiquation!;1086042Edit: And what exactly is a "bad actor"?

I think it is referring to people like Nicholas Cage.  ;)

Quote from: Shasarak;1086037I think that is web site ranking so from 25,000th most popular down to 40,000th most popular.

Ooooooooooh!  Got it.  Sorry.  :D

Quote from: Shasarak;1086046I think it is referring to people like Nicholas Cage.  ;)

You take that back dammit! :p

Quote from: 3rik;1086040What about RPG Pub (rpgpub.com) and RPGGeek (rpggeek.com)?

rpgpub.com
[ATTACH=CONFIG]3357[/ATTACH]

rpggeek.com
[ATTACH=CONFIG]3358[/ATTACH]

You can look up sites here-  https://www.alexa.com/siteinfo

Quote from: Antiquation!;1086042Bit of a tangent, can someone tell me what the fuck typing the word "vibes" over on TBP means? Is this the secular version of sending prayers via Facebook likes or some shit?

Edit: And what exactly is a "bad actor"?

Your take on the word "vibes" is my take on it. That doesn't make it correct, but I suspect it to be at least close.

Quote from: SavageSchemer;1086053Your take on the word "vibes" is my take on it. That doesn't make it correct, but I suspect it to be at least close.

If so, that's embarrassing and stupid for more reasons than I can elucidate.

Quote from: Antiquation!;1086042Edit: And what exactly is a "bad actor"?

Whatever they say it is of course!

Quote from: Antiquation!;1086042Bit of a tangent, can someone tell me what the fuck typing the word "vibes" over on TBP means? Is this the secular version of sending prayers via Facebook likes or some shit?

Edit: And what exactly is a "bad actor"?

Yes, its a short hand for saying "I agree with this, I vibe with this." and isn't the secular version, more the Tumblr version. It isn't something you see a lot of except in circles that are sufficiently filled with the type of person who buys 200$ crystal healing remedies for their unvaccinated child.

A "bad actor" is someone who pretends to be invested or interested in a topic but is not genuinely interested or is doing so only to harass, exhaust, or bother someone. An example would be a man who listens to your wife complain about work while you're on a deployment, they are not actually interested in what your wife is saying and are instead playing the part for less than ethical purposes. This is commonly used to dismiss people who are trying to get information or ask questions in the same way that concern trolling, sealioning, and other terms are used to dismiss people. If you show up in a thread about bread and ask "Why do people like bread so much?" you may be labeled a bad actor as they believe that you are not sincerely interested and only want to antagonize people, especially if you continue to ask questions or they are difficult to answer.

TLDR; Its a term used to label you as a bad person and met punishment that cannot be definitively verified and exists in the mind of the claimant.

Quote from: BugbearBrigand;1086073Yes, its a short hand for saying "I agree with this, I vibe with this." and isn't the secular version, more the Tumblr version. It isn't something you see a lot of except in circles that are sufficiently filled with the type of person who buys 200$ crystal healing remedies for their unvaccinated child.

A "bad actor" is someone who pretends to be invested or interested in a topic but is not genuinely interested or is doing so only to harass, exhaust, or bother someone. An example would be a man who listens to your wife complain about work while you're on a deployment, they are not actually interested in what your wife is saying and are instead playing the part for less than ethical purposes. This is commonly used to dismiss people who are trying to get information or ask questions in the same way that concern trolling, sealioning, and other terms are used to dismiss people. If you show up in a thread about bread and ask "Why do people like bread so much?" you may be labeled a bad actor as they believe that you are not sincerely interested and only want to antagonize people, especially if you continue to ask questions or they are difficult to answer.

TLDR; Its a term used to label you as a bad person and met punishment that cannot be definitively verified and exists in the mind of the claimant.

What branch of service were you in?

Ex-Navy here.

Quote from: jeff37923;1086074What branch of service were you in?

Ex-Navy here.

Chair Force.

Quote from: BugbearBrigand;1086073...especially if you continue to ask questions or they are difficult to answer.

The part quoted apparently is also "sealioning". I think.

Quote from: BugbearBrigand;1086075Chair Force.

I've got jokes.

As an aside, one thing I noticed in the outrage thread at BP? None of the brown shirts being outraged go to that con.

Quote from: SavageSchemer;1086080The part quoted apparently is also "sealioning". I think.

Sealioning is regardless of your intention, you can mean well and still be sealioning. A bad actor always acts with percieved malice, towards the faith or towards the individual. Its a hierarchy of badness that can be hard to pick out without gazing long into the abyss and it really isn't worth it to be able to read and comprehend the innane shit it usually means. The level dip into Social Justice Wizard just for the "Read SJW" Cantrip is probably the worst build decision I've made in my life. Really tanked my BAB...

Quote from: Warboss Squee;1086081I've got jokes.

Gotta have jokes, they're required.

Quote from: BugbearBrigand;1086087Sealioning is regardless of your intention, you can mean well and still be sealioning. A bad actor always acts with percieved malice, towards the faith or towards the individual. Its a hierarchy of badness that can be hard to pick out without gazing long into the abyss and it really isn't worth it to be able to read and comprehend the innane shit it usually means. The level dip into Social Justice Wizard just for the "Read SJW" Cantrip is probably the worst build decision I've made in my life. Really tanked my BAB...



Gotta have jokes, they're required.

Sealioning is a term invented by delicate assholes who don't like being called on their shitty, worthless opinions.

Quote from: BugbearBrigand;1086087Sealioning is regardless of your intention, you can mean well and still be sealioning. A bad actor always acts with percieved malice, towards the faith or towards the individual. Its a hierarchy of badness that can be hard to pick out without gazing long into the abyss and it really isn't worth it to be able to read and comprehend the innane shit it usually means. The level dip into Social Justice Wizard just for the "Read SJW" Cantrip is probably the worst build decision I've made in my life. Really tanked my BAB.

That sounds like nuance to me.  Is that allowed?

Sealioning is merely an attempt to justify censorship where the hive mind is being legitimately challenged to offer substantive evidence, rather than hearsay and inference. In any reasoned debate, evidence and corroboration is offered in support of an argument. It might be torn to shreds or disproved, but it's offered, nonetheless.

The NuThink of SJW Stalinism can only really operate effectively by ignoring the tried and tested principles of reasoned debate and argument. It therefore needs to invent protective mechanisms for when the principles of reasoned debate and dialectic pose a credible threat to its integrity. Sealioning is the NuThink equivalent of sticking your fingers in your ears and humming 'la-la-la'. It's a diversionary tactic used to smear and then censor those who challenge the prevailing narrative. It preserves the inherent victimhood of the Nuthink, and reinforces the Confirmation Bias SJWs need to thrive.

This is the reason why SJWs so vehemently declare that standard legal principles such as 'innocent until proven guilty' don't, and shouldn't, apply in their Courts of Public Opinion. Their arguments rapidly fall apart when subjected to the standard forms of evidence, debate and proof; so all attempts to introduce these things have to be fucked in the ass with a poker.

Oh it describes a real enough phenomenon.  It's just that like all such cases it's use is ridiculously overgeneralised - and it's changed from recognition of bad faith after the fact to immediate (and convenient) assumption of bad faith.

Getting away from politics for a minute a genuine example in a rpg context would be if I said at a place like, for example TBP (where this sort of behaviour is ironically enough especially common) "I don't like dice pools"*.  You can bet that someone would then respond by stating that they can't understand why I don't like dice pools and could I please explain.  Of course any reason I give would then be attacked quickly revealing that what that poster really wants to do is have an argument where they make themselves as small a target as possible by never putting forward any position of their own.

*Actually I have no problem with dice pools.

Quote from: Warboss Squee;1086123Sealioning is a term invented by delicate assholes who don't like being called on their shitty, worthless opinions.

If we're to consider the comic it's based on (http://wondermark.com/1k62/), then #Sealioning is quite literally asking someone to justify their bigotry.

Their. Bigotry.

SJWs are completely blind to their own reasoning, and have created a culture which forbids and lexicon which prevents questioning it, which is why they can't meme and so often devolve into self-parody.

Quote from: TJS;1086132Oh it describes a real enough phenomenon.  It's just that like all such cases it's use is ridiculously overgeneralised - and it's changed from recognition of bad faith after the fact to immediate (and convenient) assumption of bad faith.

Getting away from politics for a minute a genuine example in a rpg context would be if I said at a place like, for example TBP (where this sort of behaviour is ironically enough especially common) "I don't like dice pools"*.  You can bet that someone would then respond by stating that they can't understand why I don't like dice pools and could I please explain.  Of course any reason I give would then be attacked quickly revealing that what that poster really wants to do is have an argument where they make themselves as small a target as possible by never putting forward any position of their own.

*Actually I have no problem with dice pools.

Good analogy. Sealioning like many terms* has been interpreted as incredibly binary "There is no nuance, if you do this you're being an asshole!" with a baked in assumption of bad faith as its helps those throwing out the accusation in bad faith, as a rhetorical beat stick when they're losing or abruptly decided this wasn't the hill they wanted to die on after all and need some face saving cover for their retreat.

*See "Nice Guys" for another example.

Quote from: nDervish;1085502Yeah, and the craziest part is that they don't see this as the site failing, they see it as a victory.  Somewhere in the mid-50s-pages of the "Steve Jackson refunds" thread, there's some talk about how great it is that all these long-term forum members are outing themselves as alt-right gamergaters, which allows the mods to finally purify the site by banning them.

There's not even a hint of a thought that, just maybe, the site might be on the wrong track when all these people who have track records of being reasonable are suddenly saying things have gone wrong.  (Of course, part of the reason for the absence of such suggestions is likely to be the knowledge that, if you admit to thinking such a thing, you'll be the next one on the chopping block.)

Its a really weird mindset. Had an ex-boss that was that way. I worked in the front office for 2 years, we usually had between 10-20 people in the front office. In that 2 year period he ran off 99 employees... ( was keeping tabs with a post it note on my monitor). He saw it as a badge of honor... they went backrupt

Quote from: Brad;1085205Why don't those retards just make their own con if they have problems with all the other ones?

Evil cannot create. Only pervert and destroy.

ahem... From experience what would happen is what has happened before. Their con dies in a year or two and they go right back to hitting other cons and trying to co-ops other cons.

That and of couse they are out to "save" everyone from the evil con behavior people. Dont you know? Women are afraid to go to cons as they will be raped! We have to "clean up" the cons so they feel "safe".

Its the same old rhetoric the moral guardians were using a quarter of a century ago at cons.

Quote from: BugbearBrigand;1086073Yes, its a short hand for saying "I agree with this, I vibe with this." and isn't the secular version, more the Tumblr version. It isn't something you see a lot of except in circles that are sufficiently filled with the type of person who buys 200$ crystal healing remedies for their unvaccinated child.

A "bad actor" is someone who pretends to be invested or interested in a topic but is not genuinely interested or is doing so only to harass, exhaust, or bother someone. An example would be a man who listens to your wife complain about work while you're on a deployment, they are not actually interested in what your wife is saying and are instead playing the part for less than ethical purposes. This is commonly used to dismiss people who are trying to get information or ask questions in the same way that concern trolling, sealioning, and other terms are used to dismiss people. If you show up in a thread about bread and ask "Why do people like bread so much?" you may be labeled a bad actor as they believe that you are not sincerely interested and only want to antagonize people, especially if you continue to ask questions or they are difficult to answer.

TLDR; Its a term used to label you as a bad person and met punishment that cannot be definitively verified and exists in the mind of the claimant.

Haha shit. Nice summary, thanks. And also, gross. As expected I suppose. Sorry you had to multiclass for this.

Quote from: BrokenCounsel;1085159Heh. They should try harder, like my local con. https://breakoutcon.com/guests/

Even though its my local con, I just can't seem to work up the enthusiasm to actually go.

I recognise two of the names, probably my own fault for being in a D100/RQ/HQ gaming ghetto.

However, I am amazed at how many Guests there are and how many of them are from actual plays or podcasts.

Quote from: S'mon;1086020Maybe it's a weird British thing, but I don't think I've lost a single friend over politics, never mind gaming politics. 80% of my friends are left-liberal and these days I'm right wing by UK standards, but I've never seen any "You're dead to me now" stuff from anyone I considered a friend.

Or maybe it's that they're less confident in the US, where a social media post is far less likely to be the cause of a visit from the police.

Quote from: Kiero;1086025Same, barring a few rabidly left-wing outliers

Even the few rabidly left-wing ones don't seem to reject me over politics IME. Of course if they're rabid they tend to be effed up in other ways too.

I do remember after the EU referendum, a couple American women settled in Britain who I knew got really angry on Facebook and posted "If you voted Leave, Unfriend Me Now!" - so I did. But I don't recall this from any Brits, or from my French friends either.

Quote from: Eisenmann;1086308Or maybe it's that they're less confident in the US, where a social media post is far less likely to be the cause of a visit from the police.

We do certainly live in a Social Justice tyranny. I guess there are opinions like "Tommy Robinson isn't actually racist" which are widely held but basically unsayable.

Tommy Robinson isn't racist.

Quote from: S'mon;1086314Even the few rabidly left-wing ones don't seem to reject me over politics IME. Of course if they're rabid they tend to be effed up in other ways too.

I do remember after the EU referendum, a couple American women settled in Britain who I knew got really angry on Facebook and posted "If you voted Leave, Unfriend Me Now!" - so I did. But I don't recall this from any Brits, or from my French friends either.

Not as forthright as that, but I've been quietly un-friended by two Corbynistas I know (they know him personally, being involved with the Latin American/Islington set in his constituency).

Quote from: S'mon;1086316We do certainly live in a Social Justice tyranny. I guess there are opinions like "Tommy Robinson isn't actually racist" which are widely held but basically unsayable.

Indeed we do.

Quote from: Spinachcat;1086333Tommy Robinson isn't racist.

Exactly! :D

Quote from: goblinslayer;1086027Hmm... let's take a look at the alexa rankings.  It looks like all rpg forums are in decline.

Since those are relative rankings against all websites, it only really shows they're losing ground relative to those other sites.  It's possible (though admittedly unlikely) that RPG forums are becoming more popular, but other sites are gaining popularity faster.  If raw traffic numbers are available, I would expect that to be much more interesting, as well as a more solid basis to work from.

Quote from: Antiquation!;1086042Bit of a tangent, can someone tell me what the fuck typing the word "vibes" over on TBP means? Is this the secular version of sending prayers via Facebook likes or some shit?

Isn't that sharing comfort in the form of sending each other sex toys?

Quote from: nDervish;1086389Isn't that sharing comfort in the form of sending each other sex toys?

HA! This coaxed a hearty chortle out of me.

Quote from: S'mon;1086314I do remember after the EU referendum, a couple American women settled in Britain who I knew got really angry on Facebook and posted "If you voted Leave, Unfriend Me Now!" - so I did. But I don't recall this from any Brits, or from my French friends either.

I always interpret that kind of statement as "I'm too lazy to do any work so you do it for me." So I don't.

Quote from: S'mon;1086314I do remember after the EU referendum, a couple American women settled in Britain who I knew got really angry on Facebook and posted "If you voted Leave, Unfriend Me Now!" - so I did. But I don't recall this from any Brits, or from my French friends either.

Yep, I had some British friends who posted the same sort of thing on Facebook.
Although I was living in Australia at the time and might have voted remain or Leave, but I didn't really look into it that closely at the time.
I certainly didn't like an ultimatum put to me though, so I unfriended them.
It's a but of a shame though really, several of my more left leaning friends have become butthurt crazy and demanding over the years.

Quote from: danskmacabre;1086466Yep, I had some British friends who posted the same sort of thing on Facebook.

Well with the Americans, they had acquired UK passports as an easy means to work and live anywhere in the EU. So they were pissed.

As far as I'm concerned, since they had no allegiance to Her Majesty, and had clearly taken their citizenship oaths under false pretenses, good riddance.

Quote from: S'mon;1086515Well with the Americans, they had acquired UK passports as an easy means to work and live anywhere in the EU. So they were pissed.

As far as I'm concerned, since they had no allegiance to Her Majesty, and had clearly taken their citizenship oaths under false pretenses, good riddance.

How dare you expect an immigrant to actually believe in what your country stands for! :D