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Other Games, Development, & Campaigns => Other Games => Topic started by: oggsmash on November 28, 2018, 04:37:33 pm

Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: oggsmash on November 28, 2018, 04:37:33 pm
I have been trying to find the time to get more involved in 40K.  I bought the box set of rules and the Dark Vengeance starter set  a few years ago....to have GW release a new edition of rules and it sort of rubbed me the wrong way.  But recently, I looked around the net a bit more because I was noticing release after release of what looked to be (and are, I bought a few) interesting takes on board game and skirmish game versions of 40k.   It seems they are under new management, and people felt the 8th edition was a good idea and made the game better.   So I guess my question is, what to the long timers think of the newer game?  How about all the new releases?
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: Chivalric on November 28, 2018, 05:43:11 pm
Rules are fine.  I don't play competitively.  Massive amount of new players and new releases means the secondary market is really good.  Loads of used stuff available.  Friend just scored 50 minis for $40 on Craigslist.

I'm playing on Saturday.  My Inquisitor, acolytes and true scale marines are all converted from used parts:
(https://i.imgur.com/dFF5OOS.jpg)
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: Spinachcat on November 28, 2018, 08:28:59 pm
Chivalric, those look awesome! Kudos on the scaling!

Oggsmash, to be gnashing ones teeth is the surest sign of a GW fan. Yes, I know we're all supposed to be praising the new Messiah CEO, but I've been a 40k player since Rogue Trader came out. I only buy on the secondary market, in fact I don't paint or assemble, so I buy fully painted minis with good paint jobs for the same price as if I bought an unassembled box.

As for the new rules? Meh, they seem fine. Nothing notably good or bad jumped out at me while playing demos of the new edition.
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: Arkansan on November 29, 2018, 03:52:39 am
8th edition is a fine rule set as far as 40k goes, and Kill Team is a pretty decent skirmish game. The new models in the Blackstone Fortress game are brilliant.

Personally though, I'm sort of over GW. The edition treadmill drives me nuts, and the hobby is designed to be a massive money sink. I play 8th and KT, but I'm really enjoying playing with other rule sets, primarily Nordic Weasel Games "Renegade Scout" which is sort of a retroclone of Rogue Trader but cleaned up and smoothed out. Renegade Scout also happens to have info on how to convert unit profiles from each edition of 40k to it. I've also been playing some smaller (3-5 models per side) games of Laserburn which was the predecessor to 40k, though a very different system.

It's kind of freeing to be out of the GW thing. I buy my models where I want which opens up tons of new options as there is lots of great 28mm sci fi out there, and I'm not worried about which codex is broken this edition and what the incessant player base bitching has gotten changed in the latest FAQ.
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: Spinachcat on November 29, 2018, 03:58:13 am
Quote from: Arkansan;1066530
I've also been playing some smaller (3-5 models per side) games of Laserburn which was the predecessor to 40k, though a very different system.

Love to hear your thoughts on Laserburn!
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: Arkansan on November 29, 2018, 04:46:41 am
It's really a pretty neat little system. It kind of straddles the line between Skirmish game and RPG. It's a percentile based system that comes with a built in setting (which is proto 40k) but could easily be used for whatever sci fi setting you wanted.

It's just a little bit fiddly in that you roll to hit, roll for location, roll for penetration, that kind of thing. I streamlined it a bit by removing the roll for location by making the ones places on the percentile die determine hit location on your to hit roll. Speeds things up quite nicely.

It's deadlier than 40k as far as gun play goes, unless wearing power armor anyone in the open is subject to getting cut to ribbons. However melee still plays a role.

The stat line is simple, Weapon Skill (ranged), Initiative, and Combat Skill (melee). There are also optional skills that allow special abilities for instance "Nerves of Steel" allows a figure to ignore suppression.

The turn system is mixed, meaning that players act based on the intiative level of their figures.

It's a little fiddly, but honestly no worse than most RPG's or other wargames I've played and after a game or so the basics flow pretty quickly.

Fun fact the game was later reorganized and published in White Dwarf magazine as "Confrontation" the original Necromundan skirmish game.
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: Chivalric on November 29, 2018, 04:07:13 pm
Quote from: Arkansan;1066530
The edition treadmill drives me nuts, and the hobby is designed to be a massive money sink.

The key for me has been building a gaming group and not being reliant on games with strangers.  If 9th or 8.5 or something sucks, we'll definitely re-evaluate rather than just following along.  During 6th and 7th we used totally different rules (SuperSystem, FUBAR, Grimdark Future and other OnePageRules.com games).  8th is like the bare minimum quality needed for me to play a GW published set of rules and if they slip, I'll go back to alternate rules.  Speaking of which:

Quote
I play 8th and KT, but I'm really enjoying playing with other rule sets, primarily Nordic Weasel Games "Renegade Scout" which is sort of a retroclone of Rogue Trader but cleaned up and smoothed out. Renegade Scout also happens to have info on how to convert unit profiles from each edition of 40k to it.

I've enjoyed Weasel's WW2 rules, so I'll definitely check that out.  I've been a fan of his work since the "Fast & Dirty" days before he was oublising.
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: oggsmash on November 29, 2018, 07:53:47 pm
I have played a bit of frostgrave for a slight subject change, any chance anyone here has tried Scrappers? Osprey's post apoc skirmish game?  GW I have to say has some great miniatures for table top gaming even if you dont play their games.  I am eyeing kill team for getting my group to give it a try, but I think they may be a bit put off my assembling and painting miniatures.
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: RandyB on November 30, 2018, 07:16:40 am
Quote from: oggsmash;1066468
I have been trying to find the time to get more involved in 40K.  I bought the box set of rules and the Dark Vengeance starter set  a few years ago....to have GW release a new edition of rules and it sort of rubbed me the wrong way.  But recently, I looked around the net a bit more because I was noticing release after release of what looked to be (and are, I bought a few) interesting takes on board game and skirmish game versions of 40k.   It seems they are under new management, and people felt the 8th edition was a good idea and made the game better.   So I guess my question is, what to the long timers think of the newer game?  How about all the new releases?

Not a 40K long timer, though I do remember the original Warhammer 40,000: Rogue Trader (aka 1e). I recently dove in, buying a few minis and the basic rules. Then Kill Team released. :)

Recommendations:

1. Use the lore. Enjoy the lore. Don't become OCD about the lore. :)
2. If you aren't playing in tournaments, you have a lot more room for creativity. Third-party models and bits, whatever. Only your fellow players can set limits. If they're asinine about their limits, find someone else. Or get Blackstone Fortress and play that solo.
3. Speaking of Kill Team. Smaller play area, smaller forces, faster games, neat campaign rules. Point #2 applies here as well. And if you can't gin up a freeform RPG campaign using Kill Team, turn in your OSR card. ;)
4. 8th edition itself is apparently streamlined vs. previous. The basic rules fit on about 10 pages. The rest is details. :) (Special cases abound, of course.)
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: Arkansan on November 30, 2018, 11:00:08 pm
Quote from: Chivalric;1066626
The key for me has been building a gaming group and not being reliant on games with strangers.  If 9th or 8.5 or something sucks, we'll definitely re-evaluate rather than just following along.  During 6th and 7th we used totally different rules (SuperSystem, FUBAR, Grimdark Future and other OnePageRules.com games).  8th is like the bare minimum quality needed for me to play a GW published set of rules and if they slip, I'll go back to alternate rules.  Speaking of which:



I've enjoyed Weasel's WW2 rules, so I'll definitely check that out.  I've been a fan of his work since the "Fast & Dirty" days before he was oublising.

Here's a link to a a well narrated and edited game of Renegade Scout

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5eSlETsQ-fs (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5eSlETsQ-fs)
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: Slambo on December 11, 2018, 02:53:08 am
I'm a huge 40k fan. Recently been building an adeptus custodes army. I can't get enough of it. My first experience with 40k was the Dawn of War. Deathwatch, was my first experience with someone getting triggered (I have a friend who basically always wants to play some kind of "Sexy" character, and even though space marines are super sexy, he wanted to be a sexy female something). I can't describe why I like it, but I've had a lot of fun playing ever since I got the Dark Vengeance box.
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: Spinachcat on December 11, 2018, 05:22:30 am
I'll bite. Why was Sexy Weirdo dude "triggered" by Deathwatch? Doesn't it have rules for Sisters of Battle? They have powered boob armor.

Also, tell us more about your army. Why Adeptus Custodes vs. the other options?

I been a 40k player since the original Rogue Trader so I understand the lure of the game. I play mostly Tyranids, but I've fielded lots of old school Space Marines, especially in Kill Team games.
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: Slambo on December 12, 2018, 01:14:24 am
Quote from: Spinachcat;1068200
I'll bite. Why was Sexy Weirdo dude "triggered" by Deathwatch? Doesn't it have rules for Sisters of Battle? They have powered boob armor.

Also, tell us more about your army. Why Adeptus Custodes vs. the other options?

I been a 40k player since the original Rogue Trader so I understand the lure of the game. I play mostly Tyranids, but I've fielded lots of old school Space Marines, especially in Kill Team games.


No, Datk Heresy has rules for sisters but not deathwatch, and really the reason he got upset was that i told him no. He REALLY didnt take it well. I think he really bought into the "you can do literally anything" promise some people make about RPGs. Sisters are the Chamber Militant of the Ordo Hereticus, Deathwatch is for the Ordo Xenos.

I chose custodes mainly cause i think they look cool. Im not super competitive, so that didnt play a fqctor, but the new Jetbikes are really what sold me. Ive been meaning to get a telemon dread to add to the army too. I used to play Dark Angels and at the beginning of 8th feilded a ton of Hellblasters, but honestly i prefer meele armies for some reason. I also like thqt transporting a custodes army is super easy cause theres only a few of them. Contrary to what some might think from the anecedote above, i do enjoy that its never actually said that there arent female custodes anywhere in the lire that i could find, so im considering getting some female heads (they all look the same in armor anyway)
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: Spinachcat on December 12, 2018, 03:30:23 am
I'd have no problem tossing a Sister of Battle into a Deathwatch team. She's be a bit underpowered compared to the major chapter marines, but considering the crossover between Xenos and heretical cults, she's be useful for investigations.

The Custodes jet bikes look awesome! I also like melee armies (thus Tyranids) and Custodes make a good choice for that. I used to play a very melee oriented demon army (back when you could do field only demons).
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: RandyB on December 12, 2018, 10:24:06 am
Quote from: Spinachcat;1068301
I'd have no problem tossing a Sister of Battle into a Deathwatch team. She's be a bit underpowered compared to the major chapter marines, but considering the crossover between Xenos and heretical cults, she's be useful for investigations.


Awesome idea, especially for an RPG campaign. Will remember.
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: Slambo on December 12, 2018, 12:20:28 pm
Quote from: Spinachcat;1068301
I'd have no problem tossing a Sister of Battle into a Deathwatch team. She's be a bit underpowered compared to the major chapter marines, but considering the crossover between Xenos and heretical cults, she's be useful for investigations.

The Custodes jet bikes look awesome! I also like melee armies (thus Tyranids) and Custodes make a good choice for that. I used to play a very melee oriented demon army (back when you could do field only demons).

TBH it was my first time GM-ing anything and i had no idea what the sister stats looked like. I do like the sisters, and when i started u wanted to try them too (but the models are expensive and hideous, and now i dont like the revamoed acts of faith system they previewed.)

I also remember watching a battle report when custodes first came out where some allarus custodes took like 100 or so attacks from a genestealer cult army without losing a model and then slapped them to death with their axes. Another freind of mine also did an "If the Emperor Had a Text to Speech device"  game using Maid RPG of all things. I was at work so i didnt play...but apparently it worked pretty well.
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: Omega on December 13, 2018, 12:18:06 am
Also note that some of the prominent Assassin characters are female. The one in the comics was and I believe the one in the bard game is too. Callidus was I believe the group she was from? Its been 2 decades.
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: Slambo on December 13, 2018, 06:28:11 am
Quote from: Omega;1068374
Also note that some of the prominent Assassin characters are female. The one in the comics was and I believe the one in the bard game is too. Callidus was I believe the group she was from? Its been 2 decades.

Yeah callidus assasains are mostly female cause poly morphine works better on women (and they're pretty cool.) Statting them would be weird though. But there are also female eversor assassins, which tend to slice through  SM, but eversor can only fight, roleplay is impossible.
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: oggsmash on January 07, 2019, 10:58:43 pm
Yeah I went down the 40K hole I guess.  Between gifts and gift cards and gift money, I now have the Dark Imperium box set, Blackstone Fortress, Kill Team Rogue Trader, Kill Team core rules, Kill Team Commanders to add to the Dark Vengeance set I got a few years ago and some Tyrannids.    Now to get my game group to at least play some kill team. But just in case, I am going to a WH40k Game group meeting tomorrow.  I look forward to seeing and maybe playing a bit.
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: Spinachcat on January 08, 2019, 04:01:40 am
Looking forward to your thoughts on Blackstone Fortress!
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: CRKrueger on January 08, 2019, 08:46:49 pm
In a Deathwatch campaign there's one predominant role that Imperial females can fill without any retcon shenanigans...

The Inquisitor, one of the highest ranking, most powerful characters that exist.
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: Spinachcat on January 09, 2019, 03:42:23 am
Good point. No reason you couldn't have a female Inquisitor. There are a few mentioned in Dark Heresy 1e. Didn't buy 2e so can't comment there.

But I'm actually surprised Sisters of Battle aren't assigned to Deathwatch teams.
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: Delete_me on January 11, 2019, 01:42:05 pm
Quote from: Spinachcat;1071067
But I'm actually surprised Sisters of Battle aren't assigned to Deathwatch teams.


In lore, that which the Deathwatch Kill Teams go up against tend to slaughter... juuuuust about everything that's not a completely transhuman nightmare.

Now, in the Deathwatch RPG, a Sister can actually hold up decently well (if she's brought up to the 10 or 13K experience, whatever the start is for Deathwatch, she can actually end up being a bit stronger overall).
Title: Warhammer 40k players/fans
Post by: Snowman0147 on January 12, 2019, 02:44:48 pm
If she has a certain cloak she would gain unnatural toughness x2.  In short becoming as tough as a space marine.  I think it is in Blood and Martyers supplement of Dark Heresy 2.0.