Now I've seen it all.

Ah - at first I was going to ask if it's Rape Culture, but it seems it's the usual suspect, the Playboy Monster.

If Philip K. Dick lived today, he'd write a novel about a man wrongfully imprisoned by Thought Police for wanking to his imagination of a naked woman, as he has committed a crime of objectification. It'd be later revealed that he is a transsexual and was imagining himself as a woman, and would in the end be paid hush money by the government.

I just love this split in modern feminism - on one axis you have those attacking Putin with titties (making him basically laugh at the prospect of free, young, tender boobs), on the other you have those women who are acting as if they should all be wearing burkas. First ones are then acting surprised when they get the shaft for public nudity (I'm all for relaxing laws on public nudity, scum that I am, but well - dura lex sed lex), while the others protest minor indignities (that can hardly be even constructed indignities), while ignoring the notions of true misogonysts such as hardcore salafists and wahabists. I'll lower myself to the same level and retort - is that too hard that I like women so much, that I do in fact love looking at you? Why am I compared to a women - beating scum, because I try to appreciate beauty? Then again, naked women on every page corner is a bit tacky.

Edit: This thread is really a gift that keeps on giving, and I'm just at page 3!

Quote from: EmprintHere is the kind of thing that I wish would appear in the outlines for more RPGs.

This is pulp fantasy, which means we make real statements about things. This is non-asshole pulp fantasy, so we make statements we’d actually be comfortable making to our friends.

We take this humanism and we hardboil it and we give it a sword and we tell it the satrap closed the mine and ran off with the wages. Inclusion doesn’t mean we don’t have conflict. It means we don’t justify real-world hardship with in-setting conflict or silencing.

Can somewhat explain this to me? I'm not being ironic here, I truly do not understand this babble.

Quote from: TristramEvans;646560the Riddle of Steel is now a "storygame"? how's that work?

Kruger means the remake, I believe.

I really like the classical "baiting" in this thread, and it's quite a wonder that the author didn't get banned. The sad truth is, that if anyone starts accusing you about this War on Women (and unless you are a women beater or some sort of a pimp, whether literal or metaphorical, etc. etc.), whether it's sexism or objectivism or promoting rape culture, you need to walk away. Because any argument you may give, any joke you'd try to crack, will just be turned against you. And once you fall into that trap once, there's no escape. As much as it is tempting to respond to such an accusation, you just need to say "No I do not", or say nothing at all, and walk away.

the Riddle of Steel is now a "storygame"? how's that work?

good to see the usual suspects involved along side a bunch of the entitled morons who cant actually read anything that doesnt agree with the idea they've already reached the guy should just stop bothering to post there coz he isnt gonna make the harpies stop wailing about their usual bollocks.

Edit: what the fuck is concern trolling exactly? and why is is a bannable offence?

This thread has truly disgusted me. The man has bent backwards, and for what? A vague promise of a few dollars? To sell one's vision for golden bars, I can understand, but for a mess of pottage? Then again, it may be one big switcheroo (seeing as he artfully dodged, in the end, the boo boo about page corners or w/e), to sucker - punch the SJW crowd out of their 5$, in which - well, I prefer when lowly demagoguery is done for golden bars, but I'll also understand if it's done for a pint.

Quote from: Broken-Serenity;646562Edit: what the fuck is concern trolling exactly? and why is is a bannable offence?

Concern trolling came from politics and has basically been twisted and turned beyond all recognition into "I don't like what you're saying".

What is WAS was a way to describe Rush Limbaugh giving democrats advice (or Micheal Moore telling the republicans what the "need to do to regain support from X".) and the like. Disingenuous advice from your ideological opponents. Basically all advice that goes, "what you really need to do is be more like us and agree with everything we say, then you'll win for sure!"

You can kind of see how the concern crusade uses it in that they think that anyone who disagrees with any tiny little part of their beliefs is a died in the wool baby eating monster and therefore must be their opponent (especially the cardinal sin of saying, "Hey, you think maybe we're going a bit overboard here?"). So anytime anyone raises a concern it's ipso facto trolling. And they needed a name for it, and they're kinda dull, hence they took "concern trolling".

An ACTUAL example of concern trolling would be going into a decidedly anti-necked people game and saying, "I'm worried that this game won't get a lot of traction in the mainstream, you should really consider putting a necked chick on every other page to boost sales." Of course the example doesn't really work but that's kinda the point...

Also: that's a tacky border and since when is The Riddle of Steel a storygame?

Quote from: TristramEvans;646560the Riddle of Steel is now a "storygame"? how's that work?

Take TRoS, "streamline" the combat and add mechanics such as "Limelight" and, I shit you not "Scene Request".

"Concern trolling" didn't used to be merely be a disingenuous person pretending to raise concerns.  Their concerns were deliberately hyperbolic to make a position seem disreputable to fence-sitters.

They would be "concerned" about things that aren't actually going on at all most of the time in order to make it seem to outsiders that they were.  Opposition could dig up posts from a concern troll trying to address "issues" in a movement that may not exist, and would make reference to events in a forum or Internet community that never actually happened, but because they can now be referenced by outsiders in the form of a concern trolls posting history they take on a life of their own.

Example:  By the way, I think that Piestro's antisemitism is really uncalled for; especially since it's pretty much never on topic.  I'm glad the mods deleted those posts but I don't understand why he's still allowed to post here if he's just going to keep doing it when he knows the mods are asleep and won't be around to clean it up for hours.  It makes the site look bad and has to make people wonder why the mods would even want someone like that posting here.

There are other tactics, but it's basically all passive-aggressive character assassination.  The "netroots" et al made it mean anyone who isn't fully on board with the Vanguard Party's platform is a kulak destined for the concern troll gulag, which actually has nothing to do with concern trolling since it's more or less just a naked disagreement with established dogma.  

Pretending to be a supporter of a position you don't support to walk it back among real supporters isn't even really concern trolling.

Purple offended? Storygames you say? Ban baiting and banning from a  collection of unemployables seeking validation through an anonymous online existence, eh?



You know you read that in Morgan Freeman's voice.

So much fremdschamen in these threads combined. Jesus, insecure are we.

Quote from: Wolf, Richard;646582"Concern trolling" didn't used to be merely be a disingenuous person pretending to raise concerns.  Their concerns were deliberately hyperbolic to make a position seem disreputable to fence-sitters.

They would be "concerned" about things that aren't actually going on at all most of the time in order to make it seem to outsiders that they were.  Opposition could dig up posts from a concern troll trying to address "issues" in a movement that may not exist, and would make reference to events in a forum or Internet community that never actually happened, but because they can now be referenced by outsiders in the form of a concern trolls posting history they take on a life of their own.

Example:  By the way, I think that Piestro's antisemitism is really uncalled for; especially since it's pretty much never on topic.  I'm glad the mods deleted those posts but I don't understand why he's still allowed to post here if he's just going to keep doing it when he knows the mods are asleep and won't be around to clean it up for hours.  It makes the site look bad and has to make people wonder why the mods would even want someone like that posting here.

There are other tactics, but it's basically all passive-aggressive character assassination.  The "netroots" et al made it mean anyone who isn't fully on board with the Vanguard Party's platform is a kulak destined for the concern troll gulag, which actually has nothing to do with concern trolling since it's more or less just a naked disagreement with established dogma.  

Pretending to be a supporter of a position you don't support to walk it back among real supporters isn't even really concern trolling.

I think both your version and Piestrio's are right - I myself understood the term as he described. It is basically a catch - all phrase, because you can basically "counter" any argument with it. I mean, for example, were someone to say in that mess of a topic "why are you objectifying men as alphas? I don't look like Schwarzeneger, I want to see some plumpy, pox - ridden adventurers." you'd be shouted down as "concern trolling" because sexism against men ain't a thing (except y'know, the whole notion of "sex sales" is basically sexist towards men)

PS - hey lay off kulaks. I had two in family, greatuncle and grandgrandfather. One got executed by the Provisionals in '47, one subjected himself to threats and joined the Polish version of kołchoz.

Quote from: Kanye Westeros;646631So much fremdschamen in these threads combined. Jesus, insecure are we.

On the contrary, I am so secure I don't mind showing the picture of my cock to strangers. Here:

Quote from: The Traveller;646629Purple offended? Storygames you say? Ban baiting and banning from a  collection of unemployables seeking validation through an anonymous online existence, eh?

It's a bit more this time, really. Makes for quite a chilling read, when you see how much a small minority can change one's vision.

Quote from: CRKrueger;646570Take TRoS, "streamline" the combat and add mechanics such as "Limelight" and, I shit you not "Scene Request".

"Limelight and Scene Request"

Ok, why the !@#*^ can't that be part of roleplay?

Why do you need mechanics for that?

Quote from: Bill;646667"Limelight and Scene Request"

Ok, why the !@#*^ can't that be part of roleplay?

Why do you need mechanics for that?

Because you want structured, OOC control of the narrative.

Quote from: Wolf, Richard;646582Example:  By the way, I think that Piestro's antisemitism is really uncalled for; especially since it's pretty much never on topic.  I'm glad the mods deleted those posts but I don't understand why he's still allowed to post here if he's just going to keep doing it when he knows the mods are asleep and won't be around to clean it up for hours.  It makes the site look bad and has to make people wonder why the mods would even want someone like that posting here.
.

Holy hell, that describes Sage Genesis to a "T".  Any time someone disagrees with him, he pulls out the "I really like this site and community, and your posting style really doesn't gel well and I think you'd get along a lot better with everyone at this great site if you changed how you posted."

But since he's on the same side as Kai, he never gets warned for it.

Quote from: CRKrueger;646702Because you want structured, OOC control of the narrative.

Yesssss....silly Players...you are my puppets!

So wrong