I'm sorry to be the bearer of bad news in case someone here still had ANY hopes the IP would be rescued by RTD, well abandon all hope:
That's rather terrible even beyond original expectations. That being said, I'll admit that despite formerly enjoying the franchise it has seemingly almost always had a notably more leftward lean than I personally have or would condone. (To be fair, though, I haven't seen much prior to the 9th doctor, so maybe earlier on things would have been somewhat different, at least compared to the more modern era of its serialization.)
Doctor always had problems with being a Gary Stu/Mary Sue, but it got progressively worse as the revival trudged onward. Making him/her the origin of the Time Lords is just plain stupid. Why? It adds nothing. Has anything changed as a result of this revelation? Nope! The show has so little respect for continuity that a game-changing revelation like that is irrelevant.
Fuck this show.
Sorry I'm having a bit of trouble keeping up. So we're now against heroes being in wheelchairs but think villains should be?
As to the main point I'm sure Doctor Who will survive Davros being able to stand up.
Quote from: Garry G on November 19, 2023, 01:59:15 PM
Sorry I'm having a bit of trouble keeping up. So we're now against heroes being in wheelchairs but think villains should be?
As to the main point I'm sure Doctor Who will survive Davros being able to stand up.
I didn't watch the video, but I searched for an article to read. (Really, OP, post a synopsis. Not everyone wants to listen to some 20 minute video for 30 seconds of information.)
The issue is that Davies said
Quotethere's a problem with Davros of old, in that he's a wheelchair user, who is evil. <snip> I had problems with that, and a lot of people on the production team had problems with that; associating disability with evil – and trust me, there's a very long tradition of this.
https://www.digitalspy.com/tv/a45880895/doctor-who-russell-t-davies-davros-change/ (https://www.digitalspy.com/tv/a45880895/doctor-who-russell-t-davies-davros-change/)
Which is just more of the irrational side of the "you aren't allowed to write certain things because they are wrong-think" mentality. And putting a sick spin on the world -- remember that old saying about how only thieves locked their sea-chests because only they thought about stealing from fellow sailors?
And if you look around, you'll probably find other leftists decrying the lack of wheelchair-bound antagonists.
Quote from: Garry G on November 19, 2023, 01:59:15 PM
Sorry I'm having a bit of trouble keeping up. So we're now against heroes being in wheelchairs but think villains should be?
As to the main point I'm sure Doctor Who will survive Davros being able to stand up.
More like that's a potential strawman, and the left apparently herein refuses to allow established villains to be disabled on the basis of woke prioritizing. I guess this current expression of the left's media influence thinks heroes should be in wheelchairs, but villains should not be. Meanwhile, this site generally tends to agree that forcing established media's compliance with questionable far left/woke ideology or tokenism in defiance of established character, lore, and cetera is usually best avoided.
Similarly, this site has brought up legit points about why in a medieval world, it doesn't typically help to be disabled. If you choose to play a disabled character, that's a choice where it should impact your play, and will likely impact the play of others at the table too. Else not only do you lose realism and simulation, but also turn meaningful backstory/build choice into something of a nothingburger, where fluff has no presence in crunch and weird illogicality during the game story proper has plenty of opportunity to ensue. Likewise, the combat wheelchair is the sort of thing that boosts ANYONE who uses it to superhuman levels, which is neither inclusive nor especially interesting, nor balanced in a mixed party. Moreover, why would a dungeon need to be wheelchair accessible? Who the hell enforces that and why is it being emphasized as an important thing for dungeons to be?
Why do we care about all that, even if let's say we may be right? Because the critiques of emphasizing dungeon wheelchair accessibility and the combat wheelchair as design choices within a game are in solid part a backlash against the left's attempt to govern and shape ideology at gaming tables through questionable alterations to established IP and expansions. Like the erasure of species as a mechanically meaningful character differentiation with respect to attributes (say strength for a gnome vs a minotaur), in order to invent and advance a racial strife agenda within the gaming community. Or deleting alignment to emphasize moral relativism. All part of a discussion around company made meta rules and in-book diatribes on what political and social opinions are valid at a gaming table, and from who. A woke agenda similarly advanced through capturing the rules and dictating allowed speakerships at conventions, and in hiring processes that actively and loudly emphasize racial or ethnic selection as though this were a virtue rather than racially discriminatory hiring practices. So none of this is unconnected to broader social trends that have the left pushing their corporate ideology onto gaming groups, media consumers, and more in ways that tend to detract not only from the IPs in question, but also the ability of the public to engage in free and open ideological debate, or to question some of the more genuinely sketchy left wing reasoning.
Quote from: Garry G on November 19, 2023, 01:59:15 PM
Sorry I'm having a bit of trouble keeping up. So we're now against heroes being in wheelchairs but think villains should be?
As to the main point I'm sure Doctor Who will survive Davros being able to stand up.
Yeah, I'm sure you can finds thousands of people saying Proffesor X shouldn't be on a Wheelchair because he's the hero.
Honestly the UK socialists aren't sending their brightest minds (if such a thing as a brilliant socialist mind even exists)
(https://i.imgflip.com/86lzzu.jpg)
Lefties are not happy with Davies actions.
Quote from: Wrath of God on November 19, 2023, 07:37:57 PM
(https://i.imgflip.com/86lzzu.jpg)
Lefties are not happy with Davies actions.
You can never appease the woke mob. Once roused, they never stop.
As to Davros, I'm not a huge Dr Who fan, but I know who Davros is. Personally, I don't think the dude getting out of his space wheelchair is an issue in a high tech society with genetic engineering and. cybernetics and whatnot.
What I do mind is the idea that having an antagonist in a wheelchair was/is a problem. It's the Darth Vader trope, he's more machine now than man. (Or whatever alien Davros is.) It's not that being in a wheelchair makes him evil. It's that he's a broken, withered husk who clings to life out of hatred.
So fuck everybody. Maybe a regenerated Davros would be a cool change. A change from his broken form to a more robust, dynamic one. But not in the Current Year when writing is subservient to assinine ideology.
For the record, I have zero issue with heroes with disabilities. I think they can be done really interestingly. My issue is the weird fetishists who want a "disabled" hero in a setting that makes no sense (paralyzed in a world with magic that can repair any wound and revive the dead), and want the hero to be mechanically unhindered by those disabilities (with a magic flying wheelchair that doubles as an invulnerable weapon platform).
Davies has missed the point about Davros, too. The point wasn't, "hurr hurr wheelchair people bad", the point was that the villain had gone to awful lengths to keep his malevolent intellect alive, that the wretched form you see in the show is the best that man can sustain through his sheer willpower and the achievements of his technology. If the guy was running around looking like an underwear model, it would remove any sacrifices he'd made.
As I keep saying. This is standard woke mentality.
"X is Bwad! But only until I want to use X! Because I have appointed myself as X's savior. Now give me money!"
There's a reason why you never swim with piranhas.
I looked at Davros, essentially a brain in a wheeled gadget, and then I looked at his Daleks, essentially brains encased in a wheeled gadget that looks similar to the base of his own vehicle. And I thought he'd made them in his own image or whatever. But if he's just another guy walking around, then the Daleks have little visual connection with him.
I guess Daleks themselves will get legs next. Being evil wheelchairs incarnate.
The BBC is distilled stupid at this point.
Then they made David's doctor gay and had him talked down to by a trans and its mother. Just before splitting him into 2 gay doctors; Tennant and the new guy. Each time the viewership has dived, wont be many left watching it soon.
Quote from: Baron on December 22, 2023, 06:50:54 PM
I looked at Davros, essentially a brain in a wheeled gadget, and then I looked at his Daleks, essentially brains encased in a wheeled gadget that looks similar to the base of his own vehicle. And I thought he'd made them in his own image or whatever. But if he's just another guy walking around, then the Daleks have little visual connection with him.
Growing up, I never thought "wheelchair" for Davros or the Daleks. I always thought "personal tank".
Quote from: Tod13 on December 28, 2023, 08:57:59 AM
Growing up, I never thought "wheelchair" for Davros or the Daleks. I always thought "personal tank".
Apparently, it can shrug off concetrated fire from several Daleks at point blank range.
Quote from: Dumastadon on December 28, 2023, 01:42:18 AM
Then they made David's doctor gay and had him talked down to by a trans and its mother. Just before splitting him into 2 gay doctors; Tennant and the new guy. Each time the viewership has dived, wont be many left watching it soon.
They went up for the Christmas special.
Quote from: Garry G on December 28, 2023, 02:55:58 PM
Quote from: Dumastadon on December 28, 2023, 01:42:18 AM
Then they made David's doctor gay and had him talked down to by a trans and its mother. Just before splitting him into 2 gay doctors; Tennant and the new guy. Each time the viewership has dived, wont be many left watching it soon.
They went up for the Christmas special.
It's up 100K from the previous episode, but well lower than the first special this year. It's also the lowest watched Xmas special
ever... almost by
half (4.9 to 7.6). It's dead, Jim...
Quote from: Eirikrautha on December 28, 2023, 10:23:23 PM
Quote from: Garry G on December 28, 2023, 02:55:58 PM
Quote from: Dumastadon on December 28, 2023, 01:42:18 AM
Then they made David's doctor gay and had him talked down to by a trans and its mother. Just before splitting him into 2 gay doctors; Tennant and the new guy. Each time the viewership has dived, wont be many left watching it soon.
They went up for the Christmas special.
It's up 100K from the previous episode, but well lower than the first special this year. It's also the lowest watched Xmas special ever... almost by half (4.9 to 7.6). It's dead, Jim...
I think it's even below Dr Karen.
I haven't see the new ones but Whittaker's last series was a giant pile of what the fuck am I even watching. Seriously, what the fuck even was that?
Quote from: yosemitemike on December 29, 2023, 02:53:13 AM
I haven't see the new ones but Whittaker's last series was a giant pile of what the fuck am I even watching. Seriously, what the fuck even was that?
I predicted Dr Karen's would be a pile of maggot infested dog shit.
I was right.
I predicted this new series would be the same or worst... I was right.
R.I.P Dr Who, we had a good run.
Quote from: yosemitemike on December 29, 2023, 02:53:13 AM
I haven't see the new ones but Whittaker's last series was a giant pile of what the fuck am I even watching. Seriously, what the fuck even was that?
"The Message".
Quote from: Omega on December 31, 2023, 02:02:54 AM
Quote from: yosemitemike on December 29, 2023, 02:53:13 AM
I haven't see the new ones but Whittaker's last series was a giant pile of what the fuck am I even watching. Seriously, what the fuck even was that?
"The Message".
It wasn't even that. It was just an incoherent train wreck of colliding storylines and characters and things happening because reasons. There was a villain called The Grand Serpent. After watching the whole season, I have no idea why he was there. There's a storyline with two star-crossed lovers searching for each other. I actually liked that story in isolation but it's awkwardly crammed in there and doesn't have much to do with anything beyond some really contrived coincidences. It's just a mess.
I don't follow the new Dr. Who very closely but I heard that they already replaced the female companion with a less white female companion. None of this surprises me as the Dr. Who reboot was one the first "for modern audiences" reboot; taking what was effectively a kid's show and making it for adults only. (a fate that Battlestar Galactica had as well).
For me, my interest in Dr Who is mainly historical, as the original series preserves 1970-80s British culture as well as the type of sci-fi that was popular before everything became a derivative of Star Wars. I don't know if anybody else watches old sci-fi for this reason.
Quote from: hedgehobbit on January 21, 2024, 11:50:58 AM
I don't follow the new Dr. Who very closely but I heard that they already replaced the female companion with a less white female companion.
She's also a lesbian because of course she is.
Quote from: yosemitemike on January 22, 2024, 02:54:34 AM
Quote from: hedgehobbit on January 21, 2024, 11:50:58 AM
I don't follow the new Dr. Who very closely but I heard that they already replaced the female companion with a less white female companion.
She's also a lesbian because of course she is.
(https://boundingintocomics.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/10/2023.10.30-09.12-boundingintocomics-653f73843e242.png?w=900)
Quote from: hedgehobbit on January 21, 2024, 11:50:58 AM
For me, my interest in Dr Who is mainly historical, as the original series preserves 1970-80s British culture as well as the type of sci-fi that was popular before everything became a derivative of Star Wars. I don't know if anybody else watches old sci-fi for this reason.
Classic Who has a place close to my heart, particularly the Tom Baker era (Jon Pertwee was also awesome in real life). I now have the entire Baker run on DVD, plus a smattering of the other Doctors.
Quote from: hedgehobbit on January 21, 2024, 11:50:58 AM
I don't follow the new Dr. Who very closely but I heard that they already replaced the female companion with a less white female companion. None of this surprises me as the Dr. Who reboot was one the first "for modern audiences" reboot; taking what was effectively a kid's show and making it for adults only. (a fate that Battlestar Galactica had as well).
For me, my interest in Dr Who is mainly historical, as the original series preserves 1970-80s British culture as well as the type of sci-fi that was popular before everything became a derivative of Star Wars. I don't know if anybody else watches old sci-fi for this reason.
The new Doctor Who was for a brief time more adult. But that changed after about season 1 and continued slowly downhill.
The original series was oft a bit silly in its presentation. But overall it was played fairly seriously till near the end of the original run.
For some interesting Sci-Fi shows came across Captain Z-ro which is a similar premise of time travelling scientist and assistants. But that show was trying to be a bit more educational. Saw one episode where they were exploring the pyramids of Egypt and was not bad really.
The current situation reminds me of the long decline of Classic Who under John Nathan-Turner, another showrunner who stayed on for way too long.
Fortunately for me, I live in the 80s.
Dr. Who has always been more of a miss than a hit, but it had its charming moments. The issue with the newer run is that it's prioritized political messaging over telling a decent story (even the Rose-Doctor storyline left me cold even though it at least developed the relationship well enough to be believable).
I tuned out after Tennant left and don't have any regrets. Maybe someday someone will retcon the travesty they've foisted on this series, or just do a spin off without the utter shite baggage.
Quote from: Zelen on February 04, 2024, 11:35:50 AM
Dr. Who has always been more of a miss than a hit, but it had its charming moments. The issue with the newer run is that it's prioritized political messaging over telling a decent story (even the Rose-Doctor storyline left me cold even though it at least developed the relationship well enough to be believable).
I tuned out after Tennant left and don't have any regrets. Maybe someday someone will retcon the travesty they've foisted on this series, or just do a spin off without the utter shite baggage.
They can retcon it all with a time travel story! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ST3YTDHRTQQ)
I used to like this show. It went down steadily with 12 even while that incarnation was great acting wise. 13 was where we got served massive garbage quality wise and it looks worse onwards. Doctor who is dead to me i guess, and i feel only apathy towards it these days.