Quote from: Krimson;977131GMO crops in North America are comprised from Alfalfa for animal feed, Canola, Cotton, Corn, Soya bean and Sugar beet. I think the Arctic Apple was recently approved as well. It's ridiculously easy to avoid using these products.

Hardly. If you think it's easy to avoid corn and soy, you may not be reading the ingredients carefully when you buy ... just about everything (including specifically Gaming Snacks).

I have a friend who is extremely alergic to corn and corn derivatives. The stuff is everywhere and under a bunch of names that do not include "corn".  I presume the situation is similar for soy.

Quote from: DavetheLost;977788I have a friend who is extremely alergic to corn and corn derivatives. The stuff is everywhere and under a bunch of names that do not include "corn".  I presume the situation is similar for soy.

Yep, including (in the U.S.) "natural flavoring", for example, commonly derived from soy.

That is, in Gaming Snacks specifically, among other foods.

Quote from: abcd_z;975598Yup.  Here's a copy of a 1974 review of D&D.

Second-to-last paragraph:  

Beyond the problems involved in play (find an intrepid referee), the other discouraging factor is price.  These booklets are roughly comparable to "The Courier" in physical quality, but at $3.50 each are priced rather high.  Worse, all three are necessary.  Graphics, considering the format, are decent, with some excellent illustrations, but some space could have been saved without compromising appearance.

I understand where you are coming from but you need to remember how much the value of the dollar has changed in the last 43 years.
At that time you could still get A cup of coffee for A dime.

Quote from: kosmos1214;977920I understand where you are coming from but you need to remember how much the value of the dollar has changed in the last 43 years.
At that time you could still get A cup of coffee for A dime.

Heh.  

So more evidence that games are actually getting -cheaper-?  I mean, a cup of coffee (not fancy Starbucks, just run of the mill stuff) will cost you... let's say a buck.  A thousand percent increase, right?  So $3.50 becomes $35, and $35 for a "booklet" -is- obscene*... except you can spend $35 for a hardback book off of Amazon with better full color art and paper than any RPG in the 70s could dream of!

(*actually, there -are- some high end books out there that cost that and more.  And without the prices of deep discounters to help offset costs, those prices can drive a book out of the realm of general use.  Except PDFs are still cheap, and even cheaper if you pirate them first to see if they're worth buying)

Again, the issue with anything is not price, but value. In my gym, a client's mother said training would be too expensive - she smokes a pack a day, which in Australia is $30. So that $210pw. My gym is $38pw. She can spend $210 to make herself sick, but can't spend $38 to make herself well. She sees value in smoking, but does not see value in lifting. Now, what you value is up to you. But the issue is not the price. My gym could be $100 or $1 and it wouldn't change her decision. She blows her money on other stuff, not on gym.

Likewise, most of us blow our money on something. Few are so constrained that they must count pennies merely to be able to eat, and people that constrained won't be discussing it on the internet - they can't afford it! So if you are here, you have spare cash to blow, the only question is on what?

Which is why I said: if you use it to game, the rpg book is excellent value. Had I bought the PHB, DMG and MM as the 1e reprints, here in Australia they might have been $150 in all. Considering only my most recent campaign, we played it for 4-5 months, but missed some weeks - it was at least 15 sessions in all, though. That's $10 a session. But each night I went into the city I bought a burger ($10) or Schnitz meal ($20) and snacks for the group ($10). So even just using the books for one short campaign, I still spent more than twice as much on food I didn't need (I could have had dinner at home) as on the books themselves.

And this is a pretty common pattern among gamers. Thus my comment: the issue is not price but value.

And of course, I have played and will play much more than just that short campaign. In fact I have the first copies I ever got back in 83-84, I've since bought a few PHBs off ebay to hand around to players, and replace my original PHB which after more than three decades of use has had the pages come away from the cover.

If you actually game with the books, then they are pretty good value. If you just like to sit and look at your books, they are of dubious value. Which is, of course, part of why we call people like the OP a BNG, a Bitter Non-Gamer. He doesn't actually want to game, just to complain about it.

Quote from: san dee jota;978176Heh.  

So more evidence that games are actually getting -cheaper-?  I mean, a cup of coffee (not fancy Starbucks, just run of the mill stuff) will cost you... let's say a buck.  A thousand percent increase, right?  So $3.50 becomes $35, and $35 for a "booklet" -is- obscene*... except you can spend $35 for a hardback book off of Amazon with better full color art and paper than any RPG in the 70s could dream of!

(*actually, there -are- some high end books out there that cost that and more.  And without the prices of deep discounters to help offset costs, those prices can drive a book out of the realm of general use.  Except PDFs are still cheap, and even cheaper if you pirate them first to see if they're worth buying)

Ehh? If coffee was a dime and is now a dollar it is a 10x increase. That gaming book or supplement that was originally 3.50 is currently going for an average of $35 on Ebay. I know, i have been tracking prices on D&D whitebook since about last Thanksgiving. The newer Games are not actually getting cheaper. The full white D&D 74 bookset was originally $10, now it is going for $300 or almost 30x what it originally sold for. You can still get the books without the original box for $100 putting it back in that 10x category.

Now you can get a new set of D&D 5e books for $120 @ $39.95 each. That does not include any adventure, by the way, just the core 5e books PHB, MM, DMG. So it is 12x original price. Cost of printing and shipping is up, so the profit margin is down on the newer books. The older books don't cost more, because they are more expensive to produce,  ...they cost more, because there are fewer books.

So this is really a supply issue unrelated to inflation as there is a very high demand for the original White Bookset, and according to my research, there is an extremely high demand (and extremely high prices ranging from 6x to 50x original price, and even more in some rare cases), for any original D&D Basic Books published before 1980.

Now the new game are not any less expensive. The New Games are actually more expensive, once you factor in the adventure supplements like Curse of Strahd, Hoard of the Dragon Queen, and such. as well as the fashionable add-on products such as spell cards, and fantasy map grids, and such.

The old game is actually getting much more expensive, as being out of print, it is becoming more and more rare as portions of the original booksets decompose, ...are lost, ...are stolen, ...are damaged, or the pages are torn by accident by clumsy gamers (cooffffffeeeee spillll AAAAIIiiiiiiieeeeeee! .... Mah dog ate my 0D&D book, the varmint!!!...)

Let's see...theTraveller boxed set was how much in 1977? Anybody know? Now, I didn't get mine new as it was given to me by my sister's boyfriend who, I guess, didn't want it anymore,  but whatever he paid, it's pretty close to zero spread out over 40 years of use.  RPGs are only "expensive" if you are buying them to play one time only. Otherwise they are one of the cheapest pastimes I can think of.

D&D 5th Edition is only expensive if you go with both physical books and D&D Beyond.

Quote from: Dumarest;978241Let's see...theTraveller boxed set was how much in 1977? Anybody know? Now, I didn't get mine new as it was given to me by my sister's boyfriend who, I guess, didn't want it anymore,  but whatever he paid, it's pretty close to zero spread out over 40 years of use.  RPGs are only "expensive" if you are buying them to play one time only. Otherwise they are one of the cheapest pastimes I can think of.

Yes, like D&D. The original Traveller little black boxed set was $10. Then very shortly after the initial release it was bumped up to $12.

Quote from: GameDaddy;978227Ehh? If coffee was a dime and is now a dollar it is a 10x increase. That gaming book or supplement that was originally 3.50 is currently going for an average of $35 on Ebay. I know, i have been tracking prices on D&D whitebook since about last Thanksgiving. The newer Games are not actually getting cheaper. The full white D&D 74 bookset was originally $10, now it is going for $300 or almost 30x what it originally sold for. You can still get the books without the original box for $100 putting it back in that 10x category.

At that point we're not talking about inflation.  Some of those have reached collectors' item status.

Quote from: GameDaddy;978227Now you can get a new set of D&D 5e books for $120 @ $39.95 each. That does not include any adventure, by the way, just the core 5e books PHB, MM, DMG. So it is 12x original price.

It's $103.68 for all three books this morning on Amazon, so each one is averaging... just under $35.   Which is close enough to 10x original price.

Quote from: Charon's Little Helper;978275At that point we're not talking about inflation.  Some of those have reached collectors' item status.

Eh? ...I use those books at my gaming table to run D&D games.

Quote from: GameDaddy;978450Eh? ...I use those books at my gaming table to run D&D games.

But my kids aren't going to use them as an introduction to the hobby.

The person running this website is a racist who publicly advocates genocidal practices.

I am deleting my content.

I recommend you do the same.