Bloody hell, Kiero, that's a really neat solution to the chain of command problem! (For those that see it as a problem.)

Running a Firefly game (using a sci-fi hack of BoL, naturally - for us) I've found in play that the Captain had the last say in any decisions, but as the crew worked for shares of profits (just like pirates IRL) they had a voice in decisions about where to go next, what jobs to take, etc. Obviously this all depends on your players. Some just prefer for their PC to have total freedom to act as they desire.

I seem to recall that pirate captains in the 17th and 18th centuries had the right to instant obedience only when their ship was in action. Otherwise they had to persuade their crews to follow a course of action. Captains recognised as competent and successful could expect to get their way without any discussion out of combat. However, less successful or forceful captains would need to win the crew over to their decisions. Those failing, could expect to loose their position and be replaced.

For anyone considering a more historical game set in the classical world and interested in using BRP, it might help to check out Paul Elliott's Warlords of Alexander. Not sure if it covers naval action, but the author has a real love of the period and it is free from his website! Based on RQ2, I think.

An inspiration for 17th century games can be found in 'The Adventures of Captain Alonso de Contreras' - translated by Philip Dallas - Paragon House, 1989. It is a translation of Contreras's autobiography. At 15 he joins the Spanish army, and soon is aboard a galley, fighting the Turks. He ends up as a mercenary, and later a Knight of Malta. (He even briefly fights Sir Walter Raleigh.)

Quote from: Gruntfuttock;909498I seem to recall that pirate captains in the 17th and 18th centuries had the right to instant obedience only when their ship was in action. Otherwise they had to persuade their crews to follow a course of action. Captains recognised as competent and successful could expect to get their way without any discussion out of combat. However, less successful or forceful captains would need to win the crew over to their decisions. Those failing, could expect to loose their position and be replaced.

That aligns with my recollection of the general pirate SOP.

Quote from: Christopher Brady;909437So, if nothing else, I have learned a few things about ships from this thread and what to expect and how to fix them.  I will be incorporating these things in my next Pirates of the Spanish Main campaign for flavour at the very least.

I honestly thank you all.

That may be the most inspiring and surprising post that I have read since I have joined this site.

Quote from: Gruntfuttock;909499For anyone considering a more historical game set in the classical world and interested in using BRP, it might help to check out Paul Elliott's Warlords of Alexander. Not sure if it covers naval action, but the author has a real love of the period and it is free from his website! Based on RQ2, I think.

It's a good sourcebook for the Hellenistic era, but I don't remember there being much specifically about naval elements in there.

Quote from: RavenswingI think we can agree that when it comes to the premise that RPGs Seldom Get Medieval Exactly Right, Harn is almost always the great outlier.

Quote from: Elfdart;909330Who cares?

People who find such things interesting.

Quote from: Kiero;909488Not necessarily. If the PCs are the owners, then the captain is actually subordinate to them, even if they're the one directing the crew.

There is still someone in charge.  What they have objected to isn't any sort of authority.  It's one player's character having authority over the others.  I am just telling you what my players have said when I proposed such games.  They were uninterested for that reason.  If you want to argue the point, take it up with them.  There were only two exceptions and they were both games where the PCs made up the entire ship's complement and no one was in charge.  In both cases, they had stolen the ship and none of them were the legitimate owner or captain.  One was a group of ex-Star Fleet officers who had stolen a Kilingon Bird of Prey and gone freebooting.  Another was a group of supers who had stolen a prototype warp ship and taken off with it to adventure.

Quote from: yosemitemike;909464No ship of any size operates without some sort of hierarchy.  Any way you slice it, someone is in charge whether you call that person the owner or the captain.  Even on a 25 foot sailboat, people have assigned roles and someone is in charge.  The players I have known just don't like the idea.

One way to play it is to let the PCs be passengers who hire the ship. The captain and crew go about their business making sure the ship goes from Point A to Point B and the PCs are free to do as they like, provided they don't hinder the crew. If the ship has an encounter, the PCs can interact with it; if the ship is attacked they can help fight off the enemy. Players who aren't a pain in the ass might want their characters to crew the ship (perfectly doable with hired hands and loyal retainers) instead on NPCs, while the special snowflakes do what special snowflakes do.

Quote from: Bren;909425I'd expect that schooners do have a wheel. But if it's a schooner[1] than it's not a medieval ship. Though it might be a large beer served in Lawrence, KS[2] in a rounded glass with a short stem. But then it wouldn't be very likely to have a wheel.

[1] If that was a joke Chirine, it went over my head like a...well like something bigger than a hat, 'cuz I have a large noggin.

[2] Yes, I can read Wikipedia too, but the only place I've ever heard a beer glass called a schooner was in Lawrence.

I'm sorry; I was making an allusion to my time spent afloat as a deckhand in a vintage sailing ship, albeit a small one, in answer to the poster I quoted. I have also been aboard a number of historical sailing ships, including several from the 'Age of Sail' and several of the medieval replicas. I also had the opportunity to read through the several hundred volumes that Dave Arneson had in his library on the subject under discussion. I had thought that this experience and research might qualify as an answer to the poster's question about GMs who had information on the subject, but I may very well have been mistaken.

Quote from: chirine ba kal;909559I had thought that this experience and research might qualify as an answer to the poster's question about GMs who had information on the subject, but I may very well have been mistaken.

You may have been mistaken, but I sorta doubt it.  I may have been obscure. I was making a joke and, as the Brits say, taking the piss out of you -- as a schooner is a sailed ship that (along with a fast catamaran) is the antithesis of medieval naval technology.

Quote from: Bren;909560You may have been mistaken, but I sorta doubt it.  I may have been obscure. I was making a joke and, as the Brits say, taking the piss out of you -- as a schooner is a sailed ship that (along with a fast catamaran) is the antithesis of medieval naval technology.

No problem.

Quote from: flyingmice;909302I absoutely agree. Most GMs are lazy ass mofos. They want more of the same stuff they have always done - easy, predictable, and safe. The vast majority of GM stuff from publishers is "Here's more of what you wanted before, with slight variations to catch your players off guard, but not different enough to challenge you." So, the answer to "Why isn't there more maritime adventuring going on?" is "Because it would require me to actually do something I never did and make my players do something they never did, and I can't be arsed."

Quote from: Bren;909360That is a very cynical thing to say. I don't say you are wrong, but you are cynical.

Quote from: flyingmice;909390I'm a very cynical person. It's why I am so very cheerful all the time.

-clash

Me too! It's the secret to cheerfulness! The secret to life is joy!

And I'm more cynical about material existence than I am about humanity! So company among humanity is to me a gas!