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Call of Cthulhu 7e quick start rules: Anyone tried them out yet?

Started by Akrasia, August 01, 2014, 01:24:10 AM

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RPGPundit

#45
August 05, 2014, 08:35:25 PM
Quote from: K Peterson;774357Nope. Read through them; was very disappointed by the design choices they made; didn't have any desire to run it for my group.

What choices didn't work for you?
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K Peterson

#46
August 05, 2014, 11:11:35 PM
Quote from: RPGPundit;776384What choices didn't work for you?
Well, using the list of changes I provided above as examples:

  • I don't like the Bonus and Penalty dice. To me, it's a stupid dice trick shamelessly borrowed from 5e. Maybe it's a great thing in 5e, but it seems like an odd fit with CoC. Broad task resolution modifiers are my preference.

  • The change to the Luck attribute - It's not mentioned in the CoC7e Quickstart, but rather here: http://theunspeakableoath.com/home/2012/07/inside-call-of-cthulhu-7th-edition/. Luck can now be used as a pool to temporarily increase your skill level during skill checks. And, players can push rolls - re-roll at the risk of more dire consequences. Combine the two mechanics together... watch skill roll failure drop dramatically??

  • Connections refreshing Luck - This reminds me of something from Trail of Cthulhu. Pillars, or something?

  • Task Resolution success levels - This bothers me the least. But, it's annoying to see a character sheet loaded with extra columns so you can mark success levels for every skill. http://www.chaosium.com/call-of-cthulhu-7th-edition-character-sheet/
(P.S. I should note that in my prior post I confused luck with the push mechanic. It's been a while since I looked at the 7e Quickstart. I'd forgotten that they were separate).

Warthur

#47
August 06, 2014, 05:57:57 AM
Quote from: K Peterson;776427
  • The change to the Luck attribute - It's not mentioned in the CoC7e Quickstart, but rather here: http://theunspeakableoath.com/home/2012/07/inside-call-of-cthulhu-7th-edition/. Luck can now be used as a pool to temporarily increase your skill level during skill checks. And, players can push rolls - re-roll at the risk of more dire consequences. Combine the two mechanics together... watch skill roll failure drop dramatically??
I see this as a matter of "giving them enough rope". Drag down your Luck enough, and bad luck will ensue more and more often. Push and fail, and your situation will only get more desperate. I think it suits the Lovecraftian worldview quite well to make the characters wonder just how far they want to go out on a limb before scurrying back to the comparative safety of the familiar.
I am no longer posting here or reading this forum because Pundit has regularly claimed credit for keeping this community active. I am sick of his bullshit for reasons I explain here and I don\'t want to contribute to anything he considers to be a personal success on his part.

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K Peterson

#48
August 06, 2014, 11:05:03 AM
Quote from: Warthur;776525I see this as a matter of "giving them enough rope". Drag down your Luck enough, and bad luck will ensue more and more often. Push and fail, and your situation will only get more desperate. I think it suits the Lovecraftian worldview quite well to make the characters wonder just how far they want to go out on a limb before scurrying back to the comparative safety of the familiar.
Understandable.

For me, the Sanity mechanic itself emulates that worldview sufficiently. It acts as the rope that PCs can hang themselves with. Dive into the knowledge and experiences that the Mythos exposes you to, and your situation will get more desperate. Shy away from the true knowledge, and you scramble back into the familiar and safe - at the cost of not uncovering the mystery, or slowing down the threat.

Standard skill tests... I guess I don't see the need to have the worldview modeled there as much. At least, not with 2 game mechanics that nearly guarantee success during every skill test. It's a little too meta for me.

Warthur

#49
August 06, 2014, 11:06:37 AM
Quote from: K Peterson;776583Standard skill tests... I guess I don't see the need to have the worldview modeled there as much. At least, not with 2 game mechanics that nearly guarantee success during every skill test. It's a little too meta for me.
You are assuming that people will use Luck and Pushing every skill test and I can tell you for a fact that as far as Pushing is concerned at least that is simply not the case.
I am no longer posting here or reading this forum because Pundit has regularly claimed credit for keeping this community active. I am sick of his bullshit for reasons I explain here and I don\'t want to contribute to anything he considers to be a personal success on his part.

I recommend The RPG Pub as a friendly place where RPGs can be discussed and where the guiding principles of moderation are "be kind to each other" and "no politics". It\'s pretty chill so far.

jhkim

#50
August 06, 2014, 11:14:51 AM
Quote from: Warthur;776584You are assuming that people will use Luck and Pushing every skill test and I can tell you for a fact that as far as Pushing is concerned at least that is simply not the case.
Yeah, I haven't observed that at all in my 7e game using the Quick-start rules. Players are really wary of pushing because the consequences are terrible.

There is no spending of luck in the Quick-start, so I'm assuming that was an idea that was abandoned in the design process.

jcfiala

#51
August 06, 2014, 11:45:01 AM
Quote from: K Peterson;776427Well, using the list of changes I provided above as examples:

  • I don't like the Bonus and Penalty dice. To me, it's a stupid dice trick shamelessly borrowed from 5e. Maybe it's a great thing in 5e, but it seems like an odd fit with CoC. Broad task resolution modifiers are my preference.

Out of curiosity, is it borrowed from 5ed?  I know the quick start has been out for a year, which means they had to have written this before that - when did 5th edition first start floating around advantage and disadvantage dice?
 

Dimitrios

#52
August 06, 2014, 11:50:10 AM
One of the most common things I've heard people say in praise of CoC over the years is "The system gets out of the way". I think 7th edition will be fine as long as the Chaosium folks didn't become so enamored of clever mechanics that they made the system obtrusive

K Peterson

#53
August 06, 2014, 12:34:28 PM
Quote from: Warthur;776584You are assuming that people will use Luck and Pushing every skill test and I can tell you for a fact that as far as Pushing is concerned at least that is simply not the case.
Perhaps not. It depends on whether your players are inclined to gamble on a regular basis.

K Peterson

#54
August 06, 2014, 12:40:47 PM
Quote from: jcfiala;776596Out of curiosity, is it borrowed from 5ed?  I know the quick start has been out for a year, which means they had to have written this before that - when did 5th edition first start floating around advantage and disadvantage dice?
The pdf of the CoC7e Quickstart that I have is from August of 2013. I think that is the correct 'release' date. That mechanic wasn't referenced in some 2012 articles that I've read (like the Unspeakable Oath one).

I'm not that tuned into the various 5e playtest packages that came out last year. But, I think that they started coming out in early 2013? Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

It seems to be more than a little coincidental.

Warthur

#55
August 06, 2014, 12:47:43 PM
Quote from: K Peterson;776616Perhaps not. It depends on whether your players are inclined to gamble on a regular basis.
Well, if you gamble a lot in a Lovecraftian universe then you get your face eaten on a regular basis. I don't see the problem.
I am no longer posting here or reading this forum because Pundit has regularly claimed credit for keeping this community active. I am sick of his bullshit for reasons I explain here and I don\'t want to contribute to anything he considers to be a personal success on his part.

I recommend The RPG Pub as a friendly place where RPGs can be discussed and where the guiding principles of moderation are "be kind to each other" and "no politics". It\'s pretty chill so far.

crkrueger

#56
August 06, 2014, 01:08:13 PM Last Edit: August 06, 2014, 01:38:27 PM by CRKrueger
Quote from: K Peterson;776583Understandable.

For me, the Sanity mechanic itself emulates that worldview sufficiently. It acts as the rope that PCs can hang themselves with. Dive into the knowledge and experiences that the Mythos exposes you to, and your situation will get more desperate. Shy away from the true knowledge, and you scramble back into the familiar and safe - at the cost of not uncovering the mystery, or slowing down the threat.

Standard skill tests... I guess I don't see the need to have the worldview modeled there as much. At least, not with 2 game mechanics that nearly guarantee success during every skill test. It's a little too meta for me.

That meta level is the whole point - the "awareness" of being in a Cthulhu story and being able to pull back out of your character and make choices not as the character to make the gameplay seem more like a Cthulhu story.

Which is why for me and mine, El Flusho de Mucho Gusto!
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Philotomy Jurament

#57
August 06, 2014, 03:33:03 PM
Quote from: Akrasia;776201They seem fine to me, and I certainly can envision situations in a CoC game where they would come up.
Yeah, that seems okay to me, too.
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The Butcher

#58
August 06, 2014, 05:05:20 PM
I see nothing specifically emulative of HPL's writing in the "pushing your Luck" mechanic.

I have nothing against gimmicky mechanics, but I truly don't see the point of this one.

jcfiala

#59
August 06, 2014, 05:27:50 PM
Quote from: The Butcher;776743I see nothing specifically emulative of HPL's writing in the "pushing your Luck" mechanic.

I have nothing against gimmicky mechanics, but I truly don't see the point of this one.

Well, to be fair, there's nothing specifically emulative of HPL's writing in giving stats to Cthulhu, or having lists of spells, or having campaigns.  Some degree of the original work has to be eased up on in order to make it a RPG.  

In any case, given that the luck wasn't in the quickstart, I'm not going to worry if it's useful or not until I find out if it's actually in the game.
 
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