Quote from: CRKrueger;751629Didn't Pundit specifically say that an online chargen pdf and/or chargen website was not what he was talking about?

Having a free online pdf of chargen rules does not preclude a free widely distributed chargen booklet. In fact they should have both for maximum coverage.

Quote from: Omega;7514871: WOTC suffers this alot more than people suspect.

You have no idea.

Quote from: Dodger;751581It's 11 days and only to stores in the Wizards Play Network.

Really, you're nitpicking me over that? Really?

Quote from: Mistwell;751579"(!!!)Approx 15% of the D&D Player's Handbook will be free on WotC site to cover the basics of building characters for those getting Starter Sets. [EDIT: @thalmin mentioned the rules will be for BASIC characters (emphasis from the WotC rep)]"

Not what I was hoping for - still chargen rules in the Player's Guide, and a free app.

Sorry, but who actually stated this, and where?  It wasn't Mike Mearls, I assume?

In any case, I can say this is a very underwhelming way of stating things that are planned.   Its like they intentionally chose the dumbest or least uplifting way of stating things.

RPGPundit

Quote from: Dodger;751636Or do what Margaret Weis Productions have done.

As I understand they have a core system (codex) that they adapt, aka chaosium, to a specific licensed property. Once the license is done, they move on to the next line.

They specialize in creating interesting experience around licensed properties with a somewhat common system between them. Chaosium has been successful with something similar for a long time.

Quote from: Saplatt;751645So you would have paid $20 for the basic character creation rules?

i would have paid that to see what entry-level 5e turned out to be, to get an idea of "what the kids are playing these days" etc.  my idea of a starter set is moldvay basic--which did not say "play only these characters from levels 1-3 (5 in the case of 5e)."  it's a usable introduction with plenty of room for beginning adventures.  hate to use the term that's been tossed around, but only pregens = crippleware, period.  

hells, a WoW starter account is free, and lets you play whatever you want up to level 20.  not "choose from one of these 5 characters to try."  

but hey, i don't have a group, so not like i would've actually blown the $150 or whatever for all 3 books.  they wouldn't have got more that $20 outta me anyway.

Quote from: Haffrung;751584Releasing book after book of content geared at players - and the rules-heavy char op mode of play it encouraged - is what made me walk away from D&D in the 3E era. I find it encouraging that 5E will be a game that's simple enough where players don't need to buy books, and where most of the published content will be aimed at DMs.

Precisely. Ultimately, what you want is products aimed at DMs that will allow the game to maintain some sanity.  When you orient your line toward players you get the "Book of Amazing +5 Swords" followed up by "The Book of More Amazing +10 Swords".

Quote from: RPGPundit;751652Sorry, but who actually stated this, and where?  It wasn't Mike Mearls, I assume?

In any case, I can say this is a very underwhelming way of stating things that are planned.   Its like they intentionally chose the dumbest or least uplifting way of stating things.

RPGPundit

This was just someone reporting what was mentioned at another event - not the text of the announcement itself.

Quote from: Warthur;751589Pundit, was this the thing you were expecting that'd make us feel more excited about the Starter Set?

The only way I can honestly answer this is to say "I don't know..."

If it is what this guy (some WoTC guy??) is talking about, then it is the absolute most underwhelming way possible to explain the news, and I would go so far as to accuse it of being inaccurate.

Its so off-mark from what I've heard that I wonder if this isn't just something different, some stopgap no one bothered to tell me about.

Quote from: Bobloblah;751632You know, all this coy double talk is probably driving an awful lot of traffic on this site...

If I could just say everything I know, I would. Instantly. And I think that it would be best for WoTC, too.

Quote from: Mistwell;751651Really, you're nitpicking me over that? Really?

Look, you're going to have to come up with something better than pointing at a pre-existing programme to back up your "They're leaving chargen out of the Starter Set to help retail stores" theory.

Quote from: RPGPundit;751655Precisely. Ultimately, what you want is products aimed at DMs that will allow the game to maintain some sanity.  When you orient your line toward players you get the "Book of Amazing +5 Swords" followed up by "The Book of More Amazing +10 Swords".

I also think that GMs are largely who you need to inspire because game masters are the ones who start games and keep them going.

If it's confirmed as a PDF then I'm satisfied. Most of the rulebooks I use these days are PDFs or printouts of PDFs. Most kids capable of digesting D&D these days are fully capable of reaching a PDF. Furthermore, I can't help but squint in bemusement at anyone who would find printing out a free PDF to include with a box set to be too onerous for their gamer purity.

As far as I'm concerned, this was an acceptable move, and if Pundit is right then it isn't even the whole story yet.

Quote from: RPGPundit;751660If I could just say everything I know, I would. Instantly. And I think that it would be best for WoTC, too.

No doubt.

Quote from: beeber;751639they lost another old-timer (as in moldvay basic era).  i would've tossed down $20 for a look at the starter--but no chargen inside is a dealbreaker.  

sure, i'll check out the free online stuff when they post it.  but WotC won't get any of my chump change, either :idunno:

I find your username hilariously appropriate to the whining. You can add the god damn character generation rules to the fucking box set for fucking free. FREE. You can customize the pre-gens or make a whole slew of them yourself. The box set is now TWELVE. FUCKING. DOLLARS. ON Amazon!!!! That's less than I spent to see Godzilla in that fancy new fuck cares all RDX whatever format at Regal. I mean fuck a mega dungeon backwards riding a My Little Pony are you fucking kidding me? At this point, anyone bitching about "there's no character generation IN the boxed set is a deal breaker" is so THICK in the head it's pretty obvious you had no intention of liking the new game anyways.

I mean for fucks sake, I'm not a fan of WOTC, or D&D for that matter and everything I've seen so far gives me (a non fan, non D&D player) hope that they got it right. And yet, there's what 15 or 20 grog-tards here that are so fucking rage-blind that WOTC didn't stick their childhood fantasy of a game into a pretty box and play with thier pee-pees with it that they have to stop by and inform us WOTC lost them as a customer because "I didn't get what I wanted" BOO HOO. Holy Christ. This thread is how many pages now and still some ding dong has to roll in like a recently released patient from the prison halfway house and declare his/her inane complete misunderstanding.

Look. It's really fucking simple. The box set was not designed to be a "complete game" in and of itself. The whole LINE is supposed to be a complete game. They didn't cater to your cheap miserable ancient grogtardia nonsense because the $100 they COULD have made off the lot of you was hardly worth it. Nor will it every be. Instead, they are creating a game that will have a broader appeal and support a business model that actually works. Not some fucking stupid "oh god save our little hobby because my dick is wrinkled" non-profit geriatric AARP article on page 27 of the magazine. An actual fucking business plan. It doesn't include you. Or the other dozen pee-hole whining morons who are going to be playing some goddamn $5 OSR spin off anyways (probably pirated to boot).

TL: DR - You are a fucking idiot. Go back into your basement and play your stolen OSR games with your stuffed recently departed cat.