Quote from: Warthur;750617There's two PCs on the PHB (front) cover though...

I'm not seeing the second one - I'll have to find a larger image.

The characters should be easy to see because there's no DUNGEONS & DRAGONS on the front of the covers.

Quote from: Mark Plemmons;750619I'm not seeing the second one - I'll have to find a larger image.

Cleric is centre left, fighter is bottom right.

Thanks! I found him now - or at least his head. Doesn't change my opinion of disliking the scene, but I stand corrected on the number of characters. It's actually 1.25, not 1.  

I most likely will buy the starter set, but only after I look at it in the local B&N a few times and read initial reviews. I rarely do impulse purchases any more.

Here's a little change to the layout I might suggest:

Quote from: aspiringlich;750625Here's a little change to the layout I might suggest:

I like this a lot better!

Quote from: Mark Plemmons;750622Thanks! I found him now - or at least his head. Doesn't change my opinion of disliking the scene, but I stand corrected on the number of characters. It's actually 1.25, not 1.  

You can see his head, both arms, and torso, so I'd say at least 1.5.

By comparison, the first two basic sets only included 2 characters (or 1 for Holmes if we go with the "lower half of the body is 0.5" standard, and 1.95 for Moldvay if we assign a score of 0.05 to a dainty foot). Mentzer Red Box unquivocally only has 1 character. The OD&D box only had 1 character, as did the latter-day printings of the 1E Player's Handbook. 2E's player's handbook had two guys in its early printings and 3 guys in the reformatted later printings, 4E's had two PC types. The early printings of the 1E PHB had that gorgeous cover art displaying no less than 6 - 6!!! - PCs, though they weren't so much facing dangerous odds as clearing up after themselves. Meanwhile, 3E had no people on the cover at all.

So, by the "multiple characters facing dangerous odds" metric, the new PHB is about as good as Holmes or Moldvay or the original 2E and 4E covers. It's beaten out by the 2.5 PHB cover, mind - but that's one of the most ass-ugly core rulebook covers the line has ever suffered under. And 2E, 2.5E and 4E don't really give an idea of what odds these guys are facing - they might be perfectly safe! The barbarian kicking down the door might be complete overkill!

CONCLUSION: By the standards of "multiple characters facing dangerous odds", the new PHB ranks amongst the best cover art Dungeons & Dragons has ever seen, and takes its place in the triumvirate alongside Holmes and Moldvay.

I joke because I love. I just find it amusing that people are lining up to pan the artwork when D&D has always had cover art which was a bit of an acquired taste. I'm sure there'll be folks decades down the line who are nostalgic for these covers just as there are people who get tear-eyed at the sight of Erol Otus' work - heck, there's already people who fetishise the 3E covers and I confess that my heart surges whenever I see the original 2E cover. (Who are those horsemen? Where are they riding? What thrilling mission are they undertaking?) I humbly suggest that if the PHB cover looks substantially worse than predecessors, that's the lack of nostalgia talking. I can vaguely see the point of the "multiple characters facing dangerous odds" model, but equally I think cover art is so incidental to this game's success as to be a sideshow. "Boss fight" artwork didn't stop people from quickly and enthusiastically grasping what the Red Box was all about.

Quote from: Warthur;750630CONCLUSION: By the standards of "multiple characters facing dangerous odds", the new PHB ranks amongst the best cover art Dungeons & Dragons has ever seen, and takes its place in the triumvirate alongside Holmes and Moldvay.

I joke because I love.

And I'm not disagreeing with your numbers, I just think they could have done a lot better with a different scene. The PHB cover looks more like a MM cover to me. And is the cleric flying? There are just lots of little bits about it that I don't care for. Your mileage may vary.

Eh.

At the end of the day, it doesn't matter what us hobbyists with decades of experience think - we already know D&D and have already mostly decided what we think about it. What matters is what 12 year olds think. I think most 12 year olds, if you offered them a book or a box with the covers we've seen, would snatch it out of your hands so fast you'd break your wrist.

WotC needs to speak with their copy editor. To keep bi-lines in the same singular inflection (as with the PHB), it should read "Everything a Dungeon Master needs to weave legendary stories for the world's greatest roleplaying game".

https://scontent-a-dfw.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/t1.0-9/10313383_10152396043486071_5167317756165026174_n.jpg

The things I'm excited about in the lineup are the adventures by Kobold Press. Wolfgang Bauer has demonstrated more imagination in his adventures than your typical boilderplate WotC stuff. Thank god they're not going to the well once again with Mearls or Perkins.

As for the staggered roll-out, it makes perfect sense. Starter set lets the curious dip their toes in. The PHB, along with the first of the adventures, gives you enough to start playing for many weeks. The MM and DMG come along later to expand the scope to generating your own content.

And having worked in the writing industry, the gap between publication of the core books is of tremendous benefit to ensuring they're properly laid out, proofed, and printed. A year from now, nobody will remember or care that the release was staggered. But they would remember and care if the books were full of errata.

As for the price, you have several options:

• Mildly curious? Starter set for $20. Make up characters. Play a few sessions.
  
• Want to try more? PHB + adventure for $80. Now you can play for at least a couple months.
  
• Whole hog? PHB + MM + DMG = $150 (or $210 with both adventures). You're set for the better part of a year, and much longer if you make your own content.
  

Quote from: Haffrung;750637And having worked in the writing industry, the gap between publication of the core books is of tremendous benefit to ensuring they're properly laid out, proofed, and printed. A year from now, nobody will remember or care that the release was staggered. But they would remember and care if the books were full of errata.

As long as the staggering does the indicated job of severely reducing errata then its more than worth it.

Quote from: Haffrung;750637As for the price, you have several options:

• Mildly curious? Starter set for $20. Make up characters. Play a few sessions.
  
• Want to try more? PHB + adventure for $80. Now you can play for at least a couple months.
  
• Whole hog? PHB + MM + DMG = $150 (or $210 with both adventures). You're set for the better part of a year, and much longer if you make your own content.
  

I can deal with the core book prices, no biggie.

A $30.00 module?  I don't think so.

Quote from: Exploderwizard;750646I can deal with the core book prices, no biggie.

A $30.00 module?  I don't think so.

The modules are 100 pages long or so, I think.  I have been playing AD&D modules with 5e, or my own.  I haven't played any of the WoTC ones, so I don't know how long they are.  Is the page count reflective of a large adventure, like the T1-4 compilation, or is it reflective of a bunch of battlemaps that represent few encounters?

That to me makes the difference.  I'm OK paying $30 for a module that is large and encompasses a lot of detail.  I'm not so OK with paying $30 for a module that doesn't have a lot of content other than pretty maps.

Quote from: Exploderwizard;750646A $30.00 module?  I don't think so.

Let's be realistic here...module prices are about the same as they've always been when you adjust for inflation. I randomly picked out a module from my bookshelf, A2 - Secret of the Slavers Stockade. 40 pages, original cover price (still on there!): $5.95. That would be around $16 in 2014 money. The DMG would be over $50 adjusted for inflation.

So, yeah, I don't want to spend $30 on a module, either, but they've always been overpriced.