Is fucking awesome.

The 40k ruleset might be creaky, but this is one of the best rpg books i'm (still) reading.

How much more black could this crusade be, and the answer is none more black.

Elaborate, man.

Or better still, write a review!

Black Crusade is just a part of the awesome that is 40krp.

If you're having trouble with DH, just say fuck it and run BC.  Cuz really, nothing matters.

Had thought about picking this up when it was launched, but didn't end up doing so.  I'm kinda overloaded with 40K books right now, and no active campaigns using them.

Quote from: The Butcher;519188Elaborate, man.

Or better still, write a review!

I haven't finished it. I read rulebooks very slowly. Not by choice I might add.

I think the core of what I like - ghaving not played it (though I really would like to) - is that it's written from the heretic perspective and is it's own thing (as opposed to a supplement for, say, DH). The melding of Marines and HUmans is done well and without a billion pages to do it and the character types are solid. Obviously you don't start off piss weak like in DH, but that's necessary anyway. Humans have an edge through an ability that makes them a bit sharper and begin with more xp. Plus Necrons and Dark Eldar.

I hope I can run it at some point in the near future, but that would require players who are familiar with the setting so as to go straight to the heretic perspective while understanding what that means. For people unfamiliar with the Imperium I think it might lose something.

Quote from: Blackhand;519189Black Crusade is just a part of the awesome that is 40krp.

If you're having trouble with DH, just say fuck it and run BC.  Cuz really, nothing matters.

I came very close last week, but was too tired to follow through. How that would go down I don't know - it might work out better. However i've chopped and changed games before and always got burned for it. People fear change. They fear Tzeentch.

Why not subtley build it into the campaign that way by the time they realise their not working for the imperium anymore it'll be too damn late to do anything about it, easiest way is have the inquistior they owrk for become corrupted without them knowing about it.

Black Crusade is cool, but a lot of the powers ran into a 4e-style "fluff written to match effects" problem.

You know, with the Imperium of Man being as nasty as it is, it shouldn't be that hard to pitch the forces of Chaos as the good guys.

They just need better PR.

Imagine Tzeentch on one of those Obama-style election posts with the word CHANGE in all caps in the bottom where HOPE used to be.

I have it. There is some stuff that I'd change a bit (Story entering the game mechanics more and more, although the Infamy Rating is cool), but generally - a very good product, if only as a villain's workshop.

Any opinions on how suitable it might be for one on one play (1 GM, 1 Player)?

I like the other WH40K games, but my gaming situation does hamper plans to jump into them.  Rogue Trader is the most appealling game, but strikes me as very difficult to run satisfactorily in a one on one setting.  Deathwatch similarly, but not as severely, seems to require a filled out group, although I've been thinking a solitary marine working as a sort of lone avenger might work.  

What archetypes in Black Crusade might work in a teamless game?  If any.

Quote from: Gabriel2;519327Any opinions on how suitable it might be for one on one play (1 GM, 1 Player)?
... What archetypes in Black Crusade might work in a teamless game?  If any.

I think Black Crusade would be specifically one-on-one friendly if it was centered on rising career of an apostate. It all starts small with the character (obviously disgusted with the Imperium for one reason or another) joining a cell and slowly being introduced into the world of heresy: stealing information, fostering discontent, committing acts of sabotage, etc. Each success the character has is a thrill followed by the growing awareness that as hard as the Imperium is to be a part of, it is that much harder to be outside of it.

It's a great set up for intense cat and mouse games and if the player has the ambition, which is kind of the point of Black Crusade IMO, it will get that much more fun when the roles start to switch.

Quote from: Gabriel2;519327Any opinions on how suitable it might be for one on one play (1 GM, 1 Player)?

I like the other WH40K games, but my gaming situation does hamper plans to jump into them.  Rogue Trader is the most appealling game, but strikes me as very difficult to run satisfactorily in a one on one setting.  Deathwatch similarly, but not as severely, seems to require a filled out group, although I've been thinking a solitary marine working as a sort of lone avenger might work.  

What archetypes in Black Crusade might work in a teamless game?  If any.

I would have assumed that, like DH, BC would be better suited (of the 4 games) to running with fewer players. BUt I have to say that I don't think that's the case. Certainly you can bump up the starting player's xp level easily enough. It might be easier with BC as it's beyond the scope of the Imperium which portions out knowledge and power very tightly. I have 2 DH players and while it might be that they are much much weaker than starting BC characters there is a need for a greater mix of skills. All of the archetypes are relatively self reliant - they are meant to be in order to survive as heretics. It's just each focuses on something different. A solitary marine is a lot more doable than the loyalist counterpart with DW. I think the Forsaken archetype has the notion of a 'chaos biker of the outer wastes' as some kind of badass marine on a jetbike doing his thing el solo.

So i've almost finished the rulebook, and have read the setting section.

Perhaps I was a bit spoiled by the colourful names for locations within this mindbending realm: the warpstorm, eye of terror analogue, that is the Screaming Vortex, but most of the places (which are by no means all. its huge), are basically 'fucked up ecosphere, the people are tribal savages fighting each other all the time'. There isn't, for instance, a single world given over to the traitor legions (as, say, a homeworld in the style of the loyalist chapter homes, like Fenris or Ultramar).

it isn't bad at all, but the potential for awesome I suspect is so high that any attempt to codify any part of the setting (and there may be a more in depth book or books down the line, in the vein of Edge of the Abyss). But I don't think it matches the sheer awesomeness of the Koronus Expanse, reading that gave a real feel of a journey through a hazardous passage fraught with danger (there's no mention of the weird dreamveil from RT that lures navigators into either of the storms the passage goes through in BC) into an unknown realm with the merest civilised footprint. Of course the Koronus Expanse is just as valid a setting for BC as the Vortex or Calixis.

I've finished the book now, though I haven't read the adventure in the back.

Looks like the necron stats came out right before GW redesigned their culture. A bit rough, but can't really blame FFG for that. Don't know about the Dark Eldar stuff and I don't know how much the recent codex changed them either.

Other than Harlequins there are no actual other Eldar stats which is a shame because they are mentioned a couple of times in the setting: the Vortex is supposedly born of Maiden Worlds that got fucked up when Slaanesh got invented. They also appear in a couple of entries: the old pirate empire that ruled the planet Sacgrave got wasted by the Eldar.

Other than that the adversaries section seems reasonable, though it will never be enough for me. I hunger.

On the whole if you hate these games this won't change your mind. it's not that different ruleswise. I never minded the career paths in the other books. Their omission doesn't simplify things because instead while players can choose what they like, the costs are determined by their allegiane to the chaos gods (all skills/talents/characteristics are aligned to the chaos gods or chaos 'undivided', which is neutral).

Getting around the Vortex isn't really covered in much detail, especially given the nature of the warp. There isn't a 'chaos navigator' option or suite of powers.

What does annoy me, a-fucking-gain, is FFG's slipshod editing and haphazard approach to the franchise. The book isn't filled with mistakes, but those it has are annoying and stupid (the Renegade starting package is fucked up but not unsalvageable). I actually have emailed them twice, sent them two tweets, and asked a rules quesiton through the official channels they provide, as well as asked on their forums. Not a single whisper, nothing. If this was my company someone would be getting their fucking P45. This is inexcusable. Though there are some answers (except the Renegade), their site STILL hasn't published an official errata. It's 6 months on!

FFG need to get their act together big time. There is a new adventure book coming out for Rogue Trader that will feature the Dark Eldar. Cool! Not so cool is that it also provides character creation options for them so that I will have to buy the thing if I want those rules (and of course I do, because I'm a good little archon).