You're not paying attention to the concerns of the original poster; you're really just looking for attention yourself.

All you've done is move things from player-vs.-GM to group-of-players-vs.-GM. And on top of that you've created a dynamic where the GM isn't just extorting points from the player, but turning the player into a beggar vis à vis the rest of the group.

At this point I'm inclined to think the whole idea of using points for this sort of thing is, well, pointless. If the player has points then he gets what he wants and the points become irrelevant (and i am more thanw illing to bet in any fate style game points are not hard to come by). If he doesn't then we go back to the player havign few options and being disappointed and not being able to do what he wants. Well that serves no purpose. So make the GM just have the last word, the way Feng Shui does. If it's reasonable, thematically appriopriate for the baseball bat to be there - if it makes the moment more enjoyable - then points are irrelevant; we know what the decision should be.

Quote from: Ghost Whistler;371991So, in a bar room brawl in an action movie style setting (ie feng shui), there are no baseball bats that could conceivably be found by a pc after he gets thrown over the bar (for instance) unless the GM explicitly says there are. If the players suggest there might be, or even ask if there is one he can grab, then there can't be because that would mean altering the universe.

Maybe if they'd asked for a magic cyborg dragon, perhaps.

The player can always ask about clarification about what he sees, assuming the GM isn't going to describe absolutely everything in the room from the beginning.

RPGPundit

I think FATE points are a good mechanic to encourage player creativity, if used properly. Are they essential? No.

RPGPundit

Pundit, I think the issue is whether the GM has already thought of absolutely everything in the room from the beginning. And if not, how they determine on the fly whether something is in the room.

For me I'm willing to accept that a player may have a point when they say "There could conceivably be a baseball bat behind the bar." My fault, I didn't think of that beforehand, it doesn't mean there isn't one.

So now I can either decide, or I can put it to some kind of rule or mechanic.

Personally there are some things I dislike deciding on the fly, so I'd rather roll dice. Maybe I enjoy being surprised, or I find decisions fatiguing, or I think I might inadvertently railroad the players with biased decision-making.

Conversely I don't believe things should always go the players' way just because they thought something could happen. Like, "The bar owner's a WWII vet, it's a rough neighborhood, maybe he has a live grenade behind the counter." Yeah, that's possible in a gonzo setting. Doesn't mean it's true every time someone thinks of it.

Still, given I'm willing to roll dice for it, the idea is conceivable, it's not emulation-shattering.

So if the game has some kind of fate point mechanic, I'd be okay with letting players spend them to affect the dice roll. I don't think I'd let them call the results, though.

I would generally prefer as GM to just make the call myself, in order not to ruin the sense of immersion.

RPGPundit