We've had 3 people in our group express an interest in running this baby, but the sheer amount of mapping and miniature work required seems to be putting people off.
 
Is there some way (digitally or dry-wipe board) of being able to represent the fast paced movement that combat should be, with the ease of movement that figures and maps bring?
 
Cost isnt an issue, portability is.

Just a suggestion, because I'm not a fan of the game.

If you get a dry erase roll-up map surface and several different dry erase markers, you could use one colour for the structure and terain, one colour for the bad guys (numbering them for clarity), one color for noncombatants, and one colour for the good guys (with names for clarity). Erase and reposition the drawn marks during the battle as pieces move.

Paizo sells great 'blank' grid-marked dry-erase maps that are quite portable (I draw the maps before the session starts, but if you draw fast and go easy on the details, you can do it during the game); you can get a multicolored set of markers cheaply at Wal-Mart.

Aleatools sells the 100+ polychromatic counters you'll need to mark the ever-changing conditions of combat. You seriously will need something like that, even a 5 on 5 combat can have 20 distinct conditions floating around.

There are also Dungeons and Dragons miniatures, and they work for DnD4.0, too. Each PC needs a figure; past that, just get a few dozen humanoids, 5 clones of some humanoid, 5 clones of another/undead humanoid, and a few large/giant figures, that'll cover most combats well enough.

Quote from: Doom;371867Aleatools sells the 100+ polychromatic counters you'll need to mark the ever-changing conditions of combat. You seriously will need something like that, even a 5 on 5 combat can have 20 distinct conditions floating around.

Or use the counters as minis; you can use dry-erase on 'em. Alternatively, buy a bunch of 1" wooden circles from a craft store.

But I'd skip the whole thing. Think of it in terms of abstract zones; you're either next to someone, close to them (within 5 squares), at a distance (10 squares), or far away (more than 10). You can charge if you're close or at a distance, but not if you're far away. A move action takes you from one zone to another, so you could move from "at a distance" to "close."

You'll have to skip some of the more fiddly powers, but that's not a huge loss.

For portability you need a Paizo flip mat (the best thing Paizo offers, in my opinion!) and some sheets of that craft foam that comes in sheets.

http://www.stainedglassoriginals.com/kidscraftsupplies_foamsheets2.html

Get several different colors. Cut it into 1" squares. Red is bloodied. Blue is a mark. Green is a quarry or whatever. Throw it all into a sandwich baggie.

White is for PCs and monsters. Cut it out into squares, write the name of the PC on it, or the name of the monster or a number or whatever. Clip in a dry-erase marker, and you are done.

That's a whole battlemap system that fits in a folder.


Alternately, avoid using a battlemat completely. If you managed doing this in 3E it works the same way. Rely on the descriptions and flavor text of the powers to explain what is going on.

Using a map and miniatures is actually less work then simply describing everything (because you can augment your descriptions visually). That may be the best kept secret in gaming.

Quote from: Lawbag;371863We've had 3 people in our group express an interest in running this baby, but the sheer amount of mapping and miniature work required seems to be putting people off.
 
Is there some way (digitally or dry-wipe board) of being able to represent the fast paced movement that combat should be, with the ease of movement that figures and maps bring?
 
Cost isnt an issue, portability is.

What do you mean by "sheer amount of mapping and miniature work", here? I'm guessing you're referring to the time it would take to precisely map an area on the game table, and stuff like painting miniatures, but I can't be sure.

Are you saying you do not want to use a grid while playing 4e, for instance?

How about using the maptools (http://www.rptools.net/) application on a large TV screen?

Quote from: Soylent Green;371875How about using the maptools (http://www.rptools.net/) application on a large TV screen?

Portability, alas. There's some guy who came up with a nifty projector setup, though... here it is. $800 bucks and a fair amount of sweat, plus you need to have some tools. Pretty cool stuff, though.

Quote from: Thanlis;371868But I'd skip the whole thing. Think of it in terms of abstract zones; you're either next to someone, close to them (within 5 squares), at a distance (10 squares), or far away (more than 10). You can charge if you're close or at a distance, but not if you're far away. A move action takes you from one zone to another, so you could move from "at a distance" to "close."

You'll have to skip some of the more fiddly powers, but that's not a huge loss.

I agree with Thanlis - just mentally translate 1 square = 5 feet and wing it.  At least for smaller fights.  The problem generally comes into play when you have a large amount of PCs against a large number of monsters - that you might want to break out the markers and Paizo mapsheet for.

Another form of portable miniatures I've been investing in is paper miniatures like Disposable Heroes.

It seems kinda silly to go through this much work and invest that kind of money in a strategy game that is so loaded in favor of one side.

It's not re-usable, but a bit of contact paper should take care of that, or a sheet of plexiglas:

http://www.gamingpaper.com/

Quote from: Cranewings;371907It seems kinda silly to go through this much work and invest that kind of money in a strategy game that is so loaded in favor of one side.

Seems counterintuitive to me, too.

Quote from: Cranewings;371907It seems kinda silly to go through this much work and invest that kind of money in a strategy game that is so loaded in favor of one side.

Crazy thought - maybe there's more to 4E than the battlemat?

Quote from: Fifth Element;371918Crazy thought - maybe there's more to 4E than the battlemat?

It's always a possibility.

I think the vast majority of Fantasy RPGs out there have a lot more of "besides the battlemat" elements than 4e does, however. Why not use one of them?