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An open letter from an American

Started by mattormeg, October 14, 2006, 09:45:36 AM

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RPGPundit

Quote from: droogThe working class has no country.

Thank god for that! Imagine how badly it would smell!

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Mr. Analytical

Quote from: J ArcaneJust a nitpick, but I can't say as I've ever heard Custer referred to as a hero.  I've seen more mockery in my lifetime than anything.

  He was considered a hero before he died and for a little while after he died too, until sanity took over.  Deadwood addresses the idea quite nicely.

  Even today he's considered more of a fool than a genocidal butcher and ethnic cleanser, which is what he basically was.

mattormeg

Folks here in the states still think Custer was an idiot. I've never seen an episode of Deadwood, but I personally don't know a soul who thinks of him as hero material.

Same thing with Bufallo Bill, since we're talking about legendary figures of the Wild West. I live in a rural state with tons of hunters, and even we learned in school how wasteful and despicable he was.

fonkaygarry

Manifest Destiny hasn't done too well with a century of perspective between us and it.

EDIT:  And yes, there is a song about the Battle of New Orleans.  "1820 and we took a little a trip/along with General Jackson/down the mighty Mississip'..."
teamchimp: I'm doing problem sets concerning inbreeding and effective population size.....I absolutely know this will get me the hot bitches.

My jiujitsu is no match for sharks, ninjas with uzis, and hot lava. Somehow I persist. -Fat Cat

"I do believe; help my unbelief!" -Mark 9:24

Mcrow

Quote from: mattormegFolks here in the states still think Custer was an idiot. I've never seen an episode of Deadwood, but I personally don't know a soul who thinks of him as hero material.

Same thing with Bufallo Bill, since we're talking about legendary figures of the Wild West. I live in a rural state with tons of hunters, and even we learned in school how wasteful and despicable he was.

Custer may be the worst war criminal in US history. In the end, he got what he deserved.

ColonelHardisson

Quote from: Settembrini@Mattormeg: There is a Johnny Horton song about the British in New Orleans, isn`t there?

Quote from: fonkaygarryEDIT:  And yes, there is a song about the Battle of New Orleans.  "1820 and we took a little a trip/along with General Jackson/down the mighty Mississip'..."

The Johnny Horton version goes "In 1814 we took a little trip/along with Colonel Jackson down the mighty Mississipp'" Actually, here are the lyrics in their entirety:

In 1814 we took a little trip
Along with Colonel Jackson down the mighty Mississip.
We took a little bacon and we took a little beans
And we caught the bloody British in the town of New Orleans.

[Chorus:]
We fired our guns and the British kept a'comin.
There wasn't nigh as many as there was a while ago.
We fired once more and they began to runnin' on
Down the Mississippi to the Gulf of Mexico.

We looked down the river and we see'd the British come.
And there must have been a hundred of'em beatin' on the drum.
They stepped so high and they made the bugles ring.
We stood by our cotton bales and didn't say a thing.

[Chorus]

Old Hickory said we could take 'em by surprise
If we didn't fire our muskets 'til we looked 'em in the eye
We held our fire 'til we see'd their faces well.
Then we opened up with squirrel guns and really gave 'em ... well

[Chorus]

Yeah, they ran through the briars and they ran through the brambles
And they ran through the bushes where a rabbit couldn't go.
They ran so fast that the hounds couldn't catch 'em
Down the Mississippi to the Gulf of Mexico.**

We fired our cannon 'til the barrel melted down.
So we grabbed an alligator and we fought another round.
We filled his head with cannon balls, and powdered his behind
And when we touched the powder off, the gator lost his mind.

[Chorus]

Yeah, they ran through the briars and they ran through the brambles
And they ran through the bushes where a rabbit couldn't go.
They ran so fast that the hounds couldn't catch 'em
Down the Mississippi to the Gulf of Mexico.
"Illegitimis non carborundum." - General Joseph "Vinegar Joe" Stilwell

4e definitely has an Old School feel. If you disagree, cool. I won\'t throw any hyperbole out to prove the point.

Mystery Man

All I have to say is, if you're from Nebraska and you're not a Husker fan...you're some sorta communist man.

Go Big Red!
 

fonkaygarry

Bill Callahan has sucked what joy there once was out of Nebrasky football.
teamchimp: I'm doing problem sets concerning inbreeding and effective population size.....I absolutely know this will get me the hot bitches.

My jiujitsu is no match for sharks, ninjas with uzis, and hot lava. Somehow I persist. -Fat Cat

"I do believe; help my unbelief!" -Mark 9:24

Mcrow

Quote from: fonkaygarryBill Callahan has sucked what joy there once was out of Nebrasky football.

Since the Huskers have pretty well sucked the last few years (though not bad this year it seems), life must really stink Nebraska. Without football to talk about, what else it there?:)

Mystery Man

Quote from: McrowSince the Huskers have pretty well sucked the last few years (though not bad this year it seems), life must really stink Nebraska. Without football to talk about, what else it there?:)

Hey, around here Husker football is a way of life. ;)

They're back and getting better. Bill Callahan had to come in and pick up the pieces of Frank Solich running our team into the ground. He had a couple years there where he was still having to deal with Solich's recruits but now things are looking up. They won their 800th game last Saturday (the fourth program in history), the record is better than the past few years at 6-1 overal and 3-0 in the Big 12, and as of today they've moved up to 17th in the AP and 16th in the coaches poll! I think Texas is going to have their hands full this weekend.

I do miss the smash mouth, ram the ball down the field, running game under Osborn though.
 

fonkaygarry

As a Sooner fan, it would be an early Christmas present if the Huskers managed to

BEAT TEXAS

Oops, slip of the tongue...
teamchimp: I'm doing problem sets concerning inbreeding and effective population size.....I absolutely know this will get me the hot bitches.

My jiujitsu is no match for sharks, ninjas with uzis, and hot lava. Somehow I persist. -Fat Cat

"I do believe; help my unbelief!" -Mark 9:24

Mystery Man

Quote from: fonkaygarryAs a Sooner fan, it would be an early Christmas present if the Huskers managed to

BEAT TEXAS

Oops, slip of the tongue...


You and me both! I got a funny feeling Texas is going down. These are the types of games I have to watch alone....
 

algauble

Quote from: JimBobOz...
But in the end, most people of the world are not offended by another country unless it comes and bothers them. ...

Basically, it's the price you pay for being top dog. The other dogs will growl at you. So either toughen up and take it, or step down and let someone else be top.....

I think this is the heart of the matter.  Anti-american criticism and sentiment is a result of American power and foreign policy (for the most part, anyway).  Even if you don't agree with those policies, you might find some of the criticism offensive.  Especially if it's carelessly worded or overly generalized. People who make blanket attacks at Americans for our country's actions, however, well [hyperbole] "either you're with us, or you're with the terrorists" [/hyperbole].

But I wouldn't really come to this site for political discussion.

re: Custer: what everybody else said.  More a footnote than a hero.

@Balbinus:  the Dresden Dolls are pretty infectious in their way, aren't they?

GRIM

Quote from: algaubleI think this is the heart of the matter.  Anti-american criticism and sentiment is a result of American power and foreign policy (for the most part, anyway).  Even if you don't agree with those policies, you might find some of the criticism offensive.  Especially if it's carelessly worded or overly generalized. People who make blanket attacks at Americans for our country's actions, however, well [hyperbole] "either you're with us, or you're with the terrorists" [/hyperbole].

I think that's reasonably accurate. Also the septics tend to get a bit more huffy, even the amiably lefty and unconventional ones, when you criticise the US. I think there's a much stronger undercurrent of nationalism and patriotism than a lot of people (mostly us Europeans) are comfortable with.
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RPGPundit

Quote from: algaubleI think this is the heart of the matter.  Anti-american criticism and sentiment is a result of American power and foreign policy (for the most part, anyway).  Even if you don't agree with those policies, you might find some of the criticism offensive.  Especially if it's carelessly worded or overly generalized. People who make blanket attacks at Americans for our country's actions, however, well [hyperbole] "either you're with us, or you're with the terrorists" [/hyperbole].

One most excellent moderate muslim scholar recently commented on that statement.  He said "the world's moderate muslims hear things from the president like "either you're with us or you're with the terrorists", and they think to themselves.. "well, I'm not with YOU, so..." "

Its an example of the most utterly unproductive thing Bush could have said to the muslim world. "Either you agree with everything I, George Bush, am saying and doing, or you're a friend of the terrorists".  The average muslim will look at that and say "gee, i guess i'm a friend of the terrorists then, because I sure as fuck aren't going to give you carte blanche, asshole.."  :idunno:

RPGPundit
LION & DRAGON: Medieval-Authentic OSR Roleplaying is available now! You only THINK you\'ve played \'medieval fantasy\' until you play L&D.


My Blog:  http://therpgpundit.blogspot.com/
The most famous uruguayan gaming blog on the planet!

NEW!
Check out my short OSR supplements series; The RPGPundit Presents!


Dark Albion: The Rose War! The OSR fantasy setting of the history that inspired Shakespeare and Martin alike.
Also available in Variant Cover form!
Also, now with the CULTS OF CHAOS cult-generation sourcebook

ARROWS OF INDRA
Arrows of Indra: The Old-School Epic Indian RPG!
NOW AVAILABLE: AoI in print form

LORDS OF OLYMPUS
The new Diceless RPG of multiversal power, adventure and intrigue, now available.