Well...there was Dribby. He always had chrs that were miles better than anybody else's. Never got caught at it, though. The sole piece of evidence was that somebody saw him through a window rolling up chrs by himself and rerolling the dice.

Another friend of mine used to say that he could control dice with his mind. Then he got upset when I wouldn't tell him what he needed to roll. I argued that if he really could control the dice with his mind (which I didn't believe), it would be cheating to do so.

It fucking pisses me off. I like the dice to mean something if I plan on rolling them at all. Otherwise, I'd play or run a diceless game.

Two of the people in our monday group cheat all of the fucking time and it irritates me.
It's become to the point where I want to see what the GM will do to save my PC and the whole party when I critical fumble at the worst possible time.

I can understand why some GMs feel the need to save a PC from certain death at times, but I appreciate the randomness of dice based systems enough to let PCs and NPCs die at inopportune times.

~~~

Last friday was my first session running D&D 4e. One of the players is a notorious "cheater" and when he decided to use the "roll" option of determining attributes I wanted to see him roll. He asked why and I simply said, why not, I just don't want you fudging dice.
He got pissed off. Like, really pissed. (it's funny now, but it wasn't then...)
I let it go and focused on the other players while he was 'rolling'.
His rolls ended up being: 16, 16, 16, 17, 17, 18.

Why do people do this???

Quote from: Nihilistic Mind;240424Why do people do this???

Because they're lacking something in their lives?

One of my players uses half sized dice that are mottled green and blue with dark red numbering.  They are impossible to read from any distance, and roll significantly above average.

Also, getting him to give me a legible and readable copy of his character is like pulling teeth from a hen.

It gets on my nerves.  A lot.

I've thought about giving my player the benefit of the doubt, but it's eating away at my fun, so we'll see.

I just don't see why it's so hard to accept that your character performed poorly once in a while... Are they afraid of being teased for that '1' they would have rolled on a sneak attack?

Sometimes failing is ok...

(Yeah, I'm bitter...)

Maybe my experience is a bit atypical but I can't remember a group I've GM'd for that didn't have at least one or two players who cheated on their dice rolls. A few examples being:

The Guy who had a white d20 with none of the numbers inked in so you couldn't see the number rolled if you were more than 2 feet from the die.

The Guy who could roll the dice and snatch them up the instant they seemed to be stopping rolling and then call out what number he'd got, no one else had time to see they'd stopped, let alone add them up.

The Guy who had a bag of weighted dice, pretty obvious in the way they wobbled all over the place before rolling maximum most of the time.

The Guy who rolled his dice, left them openly on the table and called out what number he'd got while the players on either side of him made comments like 'Another 20?! Strange how that looks like a 4 from here', etc.

And finally my favourite the guy who would deliberately fumble in low risk situations and then balance it out by critting during any major showdowns, he felt that somehow he was balancing his characters karma!

There have been others, but these were some of the more extreme one.

How did I handle it? Just got on with the game, made allowances for it, and made sure any random badstuff that happened to the party landed mostly on the cheats! Live by the dodgy die, die by the dodgy die!


Vadrus

Quote from: Vadrus;240441The Guy who had a white d20 with none of the numbers inked in so you couldn't see the number rolled if you were more than 2 feet from the die.

Check.

Quote from: Vadrus;240441The Guy who could roll the dice and snatch them up the instant they seemed to be stopping rolling and then call out what number he'd got, no one else had time to see they'd stopped, let alone add them up.

Check.

Quote from: Vadrus;240441The Guy who had a bag of weighted dice, pretty obvious in the way they wobbled all over the place before rolling maximum most of the time.

Haven't noticed that yet so can't confirm it.

Quote from: Vadrus;240441The Guy who rolled his dice, left them openly on the table and called out what number he'd got while the players on either side of him made comments like 'Another 20?! Strange how that looks like a 4 from here', etc.

Check.

Quote from: Vadrus;240441And finally my favourite the guy who would deliberately fumble in low risk situations and then balance it out by critting during any major showdowns, he felt that somehow he was balancing his characters karma!

Haven't seen this one yet... Lol.

Quote from: Vadrus;240441How did I handle it? Just got on with the game, made allowances for it, and made sure any random badstuff that happened to the party landed mostly on the cheats! Live by the dodgy die, die by the dodgy die!

I let it go too, but I feel it's unfair to the other players who are being honest... As a player, it gets to me to see someone next to me roll a one and call out a nineteen.

Thankfully, I wait till I'm outside of the game to vent about it. Next thing I know I'll be using a GM screen and fudging dice myself... tsk, tsk, tsk. *shakes head*
I'm just kidding of course. Instead, I'll use my handy laptop dice roller...
Alright, i'm still kidding... But I'm also running out of ideas.

Quote from: Nihilistic Mind;240424I like the dice to mean something if I plan on rolling them at all. Otherwise, I'd play or run a diceless game.

Speaking of diceless gaming, using specifically coloured glass beads as tokens for miracle point pools renders cheating more or less impossible in Nobilis anyway. And since in diced games even I as the GM make all the rolls in plain sight (and if the rest of the group doesn't have any idea why the situation there and then might call for a roll, well, that just serves as a little reminder that something unexpected may be taking place in the background), this problem never really comes up.

I've had two players that cheated.  One in D&D who couldn't stand his player not kicking ass.  He pushed the rules, creating barely legal prestige classes and sometimes causing at table arguments.  Once I saw him quickly reroll when the DM wasn't looking.

The other one was in my PBeM GURPS game.  He rolled so well that eventually I added up all his rolls and did some statistics, concluding that the odds of him rolling as he did were something like 1 in 10,000,000.  He didn't mind not kicking ass, but he couldn't stand losing.

If all the players want to play that way, there are systems that empower the players to control outcomes.  Spirit of the Century is a great solution for that.  And it does fit the genre to some degree.  Unfortunately, most players like living with risk and won't cheat themselves, so they find it unfun when one other player cheats.  That's really the problem.

I just work to make sure that either success or failure of any roll will be interesting.

If you're saying "Oh man, I hugely want to swing over that pit, because falling down into glue-trap and spending the rest of the game trying to get out while other people have fun would suck" then there's a big motivation to cheat if the roll goes bad:  It's your potential fun in the rest of the session on the line.

If you're saying "Oh man, I do want to swing over that pit, but if I fall into the unending void and Dragonette has to come flying down to save me while the gnome archers try to ping us with bolts that'd be so cool too" then you're more motivated to roll the dice and see what happens.

But then, it's possible that this means I'm not playing properly

Quote from: TonyLB;240472But then, it's possible that this means I'm not playing properly

That would be true.

On the subject at hand, haven't had a cheater in a very long time. They wouldn't last long. All die rolls including most GM ones are done in the open.

Die rolls, including GM die rolls, are generally done in the open.

Not always though, because nobody in my group cheats (as far as I know anyway).  Certainly last Monday the GM couldn't see from where he was sitting what I was rolling, though it was technically in the open, but given I rolled subpar damage every fucking round I doubt he had much concern I was massaging the numbers.

Every round, for Christ's sake.  Thankfully, the GM was rolling even worse else it would have got very nasty for us indeed.  I doubt he was cheating either.

Personally, I'd be disappointed by someone cheating, after all we could play Buffy or WFRP or SW or any number of games with mechanics to allow players to affect the rolls so it's not as if we couldn't address it if someone wanted some way to avoid boring or adverse outcomes.  Cheating is a form of dishonesty, and dishonesty in a gaming context seems pretty uncool to me.

Incidentally, I don't much care if the odd roll results in a boring outcome, a game is more than the sum of its moments, one briefly boring outcome is hardly critical in a three hour session.

I roll everything in the open, so neither GM nor players cheat.

I think the last cheater I had in my group was my little brother 10 years ago or so. Of course he was 12 then so he is excused ^^

I don't fudge, but rolling in the open doesn't necessarily make fudging impossible for the GM, what do they need to roll?  What modifiers are they applying?  GMs can roll in the open and still fudge should they wish to.

Me, I don't wish to, too much work leaving aside many other quite serious issues.

I announce the roll they need/ play games where it is obvious.