Quote from: James J SkachDid I do that?  I mean, seriously, did I? I usually remember when I call someone an asshole and I don't recall calling you one. Not that I wouldn't, mind you.  I just like to keep track of who I've called asshole so I can later take cold, cruel revenge! on them....

You take revenge on people because you call them assholes? Get help, my man!

It was on this thread. But I was wrong, you called me a numbnuts :flameon:

Quote from: SgtSpaceWizardSo are you seriously saying that I don't remember if I used a GM screen last week or the week before etc?

Are you seriously saying that unlike the rest of humanity, you have infallible perceptions and memory?

Seanchai

This all seems to be much ado about nothing but i tell you

WHEN YOUS TWO FINALLY GET TO FUCKERY YOU WILL CUM SO HARD !

 :eek:

Quote from: Consonant DudeI can see that, but how long have you been on the internet, dude? Sean has been around for ages and I've never seen him admit that he was wrong. Not once.

I have. But since I actually think about my position before I stated it, I generally don't have to reverse course. Moreover, I don't find some guy on the Internet disagreeing to be compelling evidence that I'm wrong. As that's all the evidence that's generally provided...

Seanchai

Quote from: James J SkachI get the sense that Seanchai is averse to acknowledging the very real difference in play styles because it opens up a can of worms he doesn't want to handle.

I didn't bring up play styles because it's not germane to any argument I've made.

But if we did conclusively prove that play styles existed, what then? Their simple existence doesn't support other claims, namely that games support play styles and that 4e is bad wrong fun because it'll supposedly destroy a play style.

Quote from: James J Skach

• Yes, play styles exist.

Not in the sense you mean, no.

Seanchai

Quote from: SeanchaiAre you seriously saying that unlike the rest of humanity, you have infallible perceptions and memory?

Seanchai

Yeah. That's exactly what I said... :rolleyes:

Quote from: James J SkachI'm now convinced that either he's very mistaken and, as you say, not prepared to admit he was wrong, or purposefully trolling, as stated (originally, I think) by Aos. As such, I don't need to call him an asshole - I'll let his own posts do that for me.

Ditto what the Skachman said.

Quote from: James J Skachpurposefully trolling, as stated (originally, I think) by Aos.

It amazes me how many IL's I'm not on.

Yes, there are different play styles.  There are always different styles of roleplaying games. (eespecially when a blowdryer is involved....)


Those two need to get a room.


- Ed C.

Quote from: jgantsMy point was actually that they have the preferences and sometimes get to use them in actual play (depending on how much they have to compromise with others).  

And my point is that despite folks' stated preferences, when it comes down to it, they all pretty much play the same way.

Quote from: jgantsThat depends on how into the whole existentialism thing you want to get, now doesn't it?

I'll take that as a no.

Quote from: jgantsJust because there isn't a meaningful difference between some games (or even many games) doesn't mean there isn't a meaningful difference between any games.

Yes, some people roleplay with dead tigers.

Quote from: jgantsSurely these two activities could be easily measured?

Yes, they can be measured. And if you want to prove that there's an objective  

Quote from: jgantsSurely people are capable of remembering whether or not they make save vs death rolls?

Again, no. See your point about belief in ghosts and perception.

Quote from: jgantsClearly one instance (remembering how I game every week) is more frequent than the other (one time some guy thought he saw a ghost).

I'm not talking about one instance of seeing a ghost. I'm talking about belief in ghosts in general and folks who go on weekly or monthly ghost hunts.

On the TAPS side, we have:
Folks who firmly believe they've had multiple encounters with ghost
Beliefs that are based on recollection and perception
No hard evidence

On the play styles side, we have:
Folks who firmly believe they've had multiple encounters with ghost
Beliefs that are based on recollection and perception
No hard evidence

So, again, I put to you, is a large group of people's belief in ghost enough to prove that they exist? What about alien abductions, bigfoot, or the Loch Ness monster?

Quote from: jgantsPlus, to see a ghost you have to first believe in ghosts, and the belief will influence the perception.

Exactly! If you believe in play styles, your perceptions will be influenced and you'll see play styles. You'll remember there being differences at the table that you'll attribute to play styles.

Seanchai

Quote from: Consonant DudeYou take revenge on people because you call them assholes? Get help, my man!

It was on this thread. But I was wrong, you called me a numbnuts :flameon:

Oh...numbnuts....no I don't track that. Hell, I call everyone numbnuts, you butt nugget.

Edit: You know, it's interesting you pointed that particular thread (and post out). It's akin to the idea Seanchai has - that is everyone has been playing D&D the same way through all version over all the years. The amazing thing about that post is that you claimed if you weren't playing D&D with the comic book feel, you weren't playing it as written - so I had to go with the numbnuts.

Edit II: Changed "playing it wrong" to "not playing it as written" to be accurate.

I'll call someone an asshole. I don't mind.

Who wants it?

Quote from: SeanchaiI didn't bring up play styles because it's not germane to any argument I've made.

No, you disputed the existence of play styles when they were brought up to explain why 4e might not be the right game for some folks.  It's you who are claiming play styles do not exist to refute the assertion that the style of play more easily supported in 4e will be different from previous versions. So the existence of play styles is very important to your position.

Quote from: SeanchaiBut if we did conclusively prove that play styles existed, what then? Their simple existence doesn't support other claims, namely that games support play styles and that 4e is bad wrong fun because it'll supposedly destroy a play style.

Right - see, it means a lot. That's why it's so difficult for you to go beyond the if-they-do-exist-they-are-the-same-as-people-who-use-hamsters- or-play-with-dead-tigers level of acceptance. If they do exist, then it's valid to consider a game with respect to whether or not it adequately supports a play style for a particular individual. In this case, it's Haffrung's contention that D&D 4e is not going to support the kind of play he prefers. In order to combat that, you simply must not let play styles, and peoples' preferences for them, exist. Otherwise you actually have to debate the real issue - in what ways does a specific version of a certain game support, or not support, a given play style.

Quote from: SeanchaiNot in the sense you mean, no.

In what sense, then?

Quote from: AosIt amazes me how many IL's I'm not on.

Why would you be on mine? Are you on my Revenge! list? Did I miss the meetings again? Damn it...

Quote from: James J SkachWhy would you be on mine?

I specialize in pointless commentary.