Quote from: Tristan on May 09, 2025, 03:05:10 PM

Quote from: SHARK on May 08, 2025, 06:27:46 PMGreetings!

Yeah, Jason! "Race as Class" just seems very dumb to me, and limiting. I know Basic D&D is all the rage with the OSR now, but I have mixed feelings about Basic D&D. It's an ok game set, though I think AD&D is superior. I like AD&D for many reasons, though one outstanding attribute is opening up to greater degree of complexity and options than Basic D&D, while not going to the same deep end for example as Rolemaster.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

I don't have a problem with the idea of 'race as class' but I do prefer how ACKS does it with racial classes.
On one hand, we don't want players to treat demi-humans/whatever as just humans in funny suits, but then they essentially are as they have the same jobs, ideals, outlooks, etc. as humans. Race as class may be monolithic but it was one way of showing that humans were 'different'.

Racial classes as mentioned at least give some variety but can still add some kind of differentiation between the groups instead of oh look, elf cleric, elf thief, dwarf cleric. AD&D tried to keep some of that with multi-classing and those limits (Half-Orc cleric/assassin, etc.).

Modern D&D has thrown all of that out the window.

Quote from: Brad on May 09, 2025, 04:32:37 PM

Quote from: SHARK on May 08, 2025, 06:27:46 PMYeah, Jason! "Race as Class" just seems very dumb to me, and limiting.

That's because you're a jarhead. Get with the program, Shark. Race-as-class is superior for enforcing stereotypes and, in my opinion, allows non-humans to seem slightly more alien in the sense that they have a cohesive identity.

In all seriousness though, I think for certain kinds of games limiting some races to a simple archetype is good if you're trying to create a humanocentric game. AD&D sort of did this by basically forcing some races into some classes (Halfing Thief, MAYBE FT), but then OA threw that out the window to some degree. D&D 3 said fuck that, and then demihumans basically became nothing more than humans with funny faces. So while it can be limiting for sure, I think it cuts down on a lot of the dumb crap that came afterwards. If tieflings were ONLY allowed to be rogues, for instance, how many would you actually see in the average D&D 5 game?