Quote from: Chris24601;1089176What I said... again... is that the mechanics suck at emulating heroic fantasy because (capitalized for emphasis) RECOVERY RATE OF HIT POINTS in early editions of D&D were based entirely on the ordinary troops and didn't scale for the heroes and superheroes.

Ah I see, however the above wasn't in he post you wrote that I quoted from.

Quote from: Chris24601;1089176But instead of actually fixing this legit problem in implementation where a hero needs four times longer to recover from the same proportionate injury as a ordinary troop, they offloaded the problem onto clerical healing and magic potions and had it pick up the slack... then added niche protection and made an institution out of it on top so that divine magic became the only way for a party to quickly regain its fighting strength... despite an utter lack of divine healing magic in the source material it was drawing from in moving from wargame to fantasy role-playing game..

This sentiment is why I take issue with your ideas. It shows a lack of understanding of the history of the mechanic. It wasn't developed for niche protection. It was developed based on how Gygax viewed the fantasy genre. It fine you don't agree with Gygax's view and don't like D&D because it doesn't reflect your view. But it not a problem.

And understanding the history of the game leads to solutions that allow one to keep the rules recognizably D&D, and emulate Game of Thrones better,

I have found through playtesting is that the solution is as simple as keeping the number low. The same as they were presented in the 3 LBB. Bumping up natural healing a bit, have enough of a skill system to add variety to what a character are good at. And ditching the magic system in favor of a brand new system that reflect how Martin views the supernatural.

Quote from: Ratman_tf;1089197Perhaps that specific example. But we have plenty of examples of people going along with terrible ideologies and committing atrocities. I think it did take a Hitler to galvanize Germany, but I also think that many people could have taken that role.

And that brings up ordinary people who resisted the German ideology, and were a single person making a historial difference.

There could have been a revanchist aggressive Germany with a fascist type ideology without it being the Most Evil Thing Evee. So I agree with Trond.

On topic, rather than lay out a future timeline I typically have a few general ideas, and I often roll for the results of off camera actions "4 in 6 Daenerys wins" rather than just "Daenerys wins". I find this helps with the living world feel.

Quote from: Alexander Kalinowski;1089146Well, now we're on a system level and I think that leads us away from the thread subject. I said above all I needed to say about it: "I can't play early GoT Sandor Clegane or Bronn if I constantly need healing potions or a cleric to recover my lost hitpoints. I'm no longer self-reliant." As such, it's more precise to state that I am aiming at emulating genre by means of emulating genre worlds.

Sure, spend a couple of weeks on the Quiet Isle to quote an example from the book. Or wake up a few days after the Battle of the Blackwater to quote another. Starting with the 3LBB D&D always had a natural healing rate.

Playing out all of the interactions that could happen in your game world seems like an awful lot of work for not much return.

Quote from: Shasarak;1089228Playing out all of the interactions that could happen in your game world seems like an awful lot of work for not much return.

Which why one uses their knowledge and experience with the setting and genre to selectively focus on that which is relevant and interesting.

Quote from: estar;1089232Which why one uses their knowledge and experience with the setting and genre to selectively focus on that which is relevant and interesting.

That was not the impression that I got from the video.

Quote from: Shasarak;1089234That was not the impression that I got from the video.

Some people have the ability to track this more than others. One should go with whatever level they find fun and enjoyable. That what I mean by selectively focus.

Quote from: Alexander Kalinowski;1088962I am glad to see, however, that trying to emulate fiction more closely is getting traction on gamers' minds these days.

Pffft.

Quote from: Shasarak;1089234That was not the impression that I got from the video.

You misinterpreted then. Even GRR Martin can't cover EVERYTHING that happens in his world.

For off stage events what matters is the big stuff that impacts the PCs, like who wins a battle or war between an enemy faction and a neutral or allied faction - if the enemy win they may come for the PCs next.

Quote from: estar;1089200Sure, spend a couple of weeks on the Quiet Isle to quote an example from the book. Or wake up a few days after the Battle of the Blackwater to quote another. Starting with the 3LBB D&D always had a natural healing rate.

I think there is a case for both 1 hp/day and for 1 hp/level/day.

Personally I like 5e Long Rest = 1 week and you're recovered. Works for heroic play. Of course irl recovery from wounds is weeks, months, or never.

I am not keen on 4e long rest = 6 hours = full recovery, it tends to feel more cheesy than cinematic.

Quote from: S'mon;1089271I think there is a case for both 1 hp/day and for 1 hp/level/day.

Personally I like 5e Long Rest = 1 week and you're recovered. Works for heroic play. Of course irl recovery from wounds is weeks, months, or never.

I am not keen on 4e long rest = 6 hours = full recovery, it tends to feel more cheesy than cinematic.

I currently use 1 hp/day + con bonus + physician ability check bonus. However I seen your suggestion work as well as the alternative work. I think what important is for the referee to come up with a way that consistent with their view of the setting and stick to their guns. There is a lot of things about fantasy and other genres that arbitrary decisions. The only time I feel there is an issue if you make a rule or ruling thinking it mean one thing but actual play reveals it has completely different implications.

For example you have low hit points, low magical healing, and low recovery and now the PCs are gunshy about risking themselves on adventures. Passing up opportunities in favor of "sure" things.

Quote from: estar;1089200Sure, spend a couple of weeks on the Quiet Isle to quote an example from the book. Or wake up a few days after the Battle of the Blackwater to quote another. Starting with the 3LBB D&D always had a natural healing rate.

As per my memory:
Pre-Cleganebowl Sandor Clegane got seriously wounded only once in his adventures - against Brienne of Tarth, which left him close to dying. How about Jon Snow? He was only once wounded so seriously that he needed recovery - by Ygritte. Not really a combat situation. (His death happened also in a non-combat situation.) He fought wights, wildings, white walkers, undead bears and dragons, renegade crows, as well as Ramsay and his army. Only other somewhat more serious wound he received in all of that was a stab by Karl Tanner in the thigh. It did not seem to impact him for long. I don't recall Bronn ever getting seriously wounded from the top of my head (he got poisoned though). Brienne seems to get by without much injury also (she's big and well-armored). Teenage Mutant Ninja Arya gets infamously stabbed by the Waif but other than that she doesn't seem to require much healing either. Jaime gets his hand chopped off outside of combat and he's getting seriously injured by Euron in combat.

These characters can operate more independently than PCs because they don't require healing all that often. And all their minor scrapes and bruises seems to be purely cosmetic: they don't impose detectable penalties on their performance nor do they tend to make them drop dead or K.O. during the fight.

Quote from: Alexander Kalinowski;1089409These characters can operate more independently than PCs because they don't require healing all that often.

Bracers of Defense (Important to Plot) AC -10

Quote from: Alexander Kalinowski;1089409These characters can operate more independently than PCs because they don't require healing all that often. And all their minor scrapes and bruises seems to be purely cosmetic: they don't impose detectable penalties on their performance nor do they tend to make them drop dead or K.O. during the fight.

That kind of sounds like they were using DnD Hit Points, characters that dont get detectable penalities on their performance.

Quote from: Spinachcat;1088851Pundy, are you a fan of the Birthright rules/setting? When you do high level political intrigue, what rules do you use?

I know Kevin Crawford's Godbound and his Exemplars & Eidolans has a social influence system, but I haven't used those in actual play yet.

I was never a huge fan of Birthright, actually. It just didn't click with me.

For High Level Political Intrigue, I mostly like to roleplay it. The extent of how  much I want to mechanize this is evident in my rules for "Noble House Management" found in Dark Albion, and reprinted in a more setting-neutral way in RPGPundit Presents #27: Simple Domain Management & Mass Combat.