That's the question: what do y'all think?
RPGPundit
I'm for it, Pundit. I feel awkward posting a shill thread - like the one announcing FtA! - anywhere else, even if I know it's welcome from most folks here.
-clash
Erm...yes!! :D
I only wonder if it will get any views. You might as well post to your kid sister's blog than post something on RPGNet's ads/open forum (although their PR mailing service is quite nice). To me, I think it helps small press pubs (like me) to have people see a new product release right on theRPGsite's front page. The only other thing you regularly see there seems to be reviews and there aren't enough of those coming in to make the page change often enough for my tastes. Maybe I'm in the minority, though.
Pete
Quote from: pspahnI only wonder if it will get any views. You might as well post to your kid sister's blog than post something on RPGNet's ads/open forum (although their PR mailing service is quite nice). To me, I think it helps small press pubs (like me) to have people see a new product release right on theRPGsite's front page. The only other thing you regularly see there seems to be reviews and there aren't enough of those coming in to make the page change often enough for my tastes. Maybe I'm in the minority, though.
Pete
I agree as well with this. I also agree with Clash that I sometimes feel uncomfortable posting some threads about my own games (I used the Shaolin Squirrel Dice example before) in the RPG forum. I would be concerned that such a forum would get no interest though and thus low views.
I guess I am in favor of it as long as we can occasionally post discussion threads in RPG. I would break it up like this
O.k. for RPG Open
- Posts about covers
- Posts about discussing the game internals
- Posts about dice and supplements
Not O.k. for RPG Open
- Ads soliciting sales of goods
- Announcements of events to support your products
The upside would be making it a forum for publisher ads as well as game gatherings, players searching for players, publisher events and the like.
That;s my take on it at least.
Bill
Quote from: HinterWeltI agree as well with this. I also agree with Clash that I sometimes feel uncomfortable posting some threads about my own games (I used the Shaolin Squirrel Dice example before) in the RPG forum. I would be concerned that such a forum would get no interest though and thus low views.
I guess I am in favor of it as long as we can occasionally post discussion threads in RPG. I would break it up like this
O.k. for RPG Open
- Posts about covers
- Posts about discussing the game internals
- Posts about dice and supplements
Not O.k. for RPG Open
- Ads soliciting sales of goods
- Announcements of events to support your products
The upside would be making it a forum for publisher ads as well as game gatherings, players searching for players, publisher events and the like.
That;s my take on it at least.
Bill
None of which, I'm sorry to say Bill, adresses Pundit's concern. He's saying that these are, essentially, stealth posters trying to post about their games and/or bring attention to story games without actually doing so.
It's the reason you and clash and others are not really an issue. You guys don't do that stuff, you talk about your games straight up.
If I had my way, I would have argued all of those posts belonged in Theory, as in the particular case of Luke, it was a discussion of GM Fiat for the most part. If he wanted a thread about BW, he could have a BW Q&A in RPG. it might be a good time to talk about splitting threads again...
Quote from: James J SkachNone of which, I'm sorry to say Bill, adresses Pundit's concern. He's saying that these are, essentially, stealth posters trying to post about their games and/or bring attention to story games without actually doing so.
It's the reason you and clash and others are not really an issue. You guys don't do that stuff, you talk about your games straight up.
If I had my way, I would have argued all of those posts belonged in Theory, as in the particular case of Luke, it was a discussion of GM Fiat for the most part. If he wanted a thread about BW, he could have a BW Q&A in RPG. it might be a good time to talk about splitting threads again...
Jim,
Not sure I follow you. Pundit was asking if we thought a ads/promos forum was a good idea. Provisionally, I said yes. He said nothing about dealing with dishonest posters.
Bill
I'd not object to something like that, as an semi-related aside I am somewhat amazed at how much people use their sig's here to sell things. I guess I've never been to a forum where people have had much to sell.
Quote from: HinterWeltJim,
Not sure I follow you. Pundit was asking if we thought a ads/promos forum was a good idea. Provisionally, I said yes. He said nothing about dealing with dishonest posters.
Bill
No, you're right Bill. I read that into the question. My bad.
I think the ads/promo sticky thread is the best route, following Bill's approach. But if those who have things to sell think an entire sub-forum would be better - well, I would say they know better than I.
Quote from: James J SkachNone of which, I'm sorry to say Bill, adresses Pundit's concern. He's saying that these are, essentially, stealth posters trying to post about their games and/or bring attention to story games without actually doing so.
The way I see it, if we had an ads section, people could post their legitimate full-blown shills in there; and I could also use it (instead of the less-appropriate Off Topic) as a place to dump stuff I suspected of being Storygames promotion.
Hell, that might even be killing two birds with one stone, because having those controversial threads on there would mean people would actually GO to the subforum (unlike similar subfora on other sites, that become ghost towns in terms of viewing), so that it woudln't be an utter waste of time to post a promotion there!
RPGPundit
Quote from: RPGPunditThe way I see it, if we had an ads section, people could post their legitimate full-blown shills in there; and I could also use it (instead of the less-appropriate Off Topic) as a place to dump stuff I suspected of being Storygames promotion.
I'm not too up on the dishonest posters issue, so I don't think I understand what's being targeted. I was assuming an ad/promo forum would replace the Submit News Article feature that appears on the front page. If that's not the case, my comments don't mean a lot. If that is the case, is there any way to tie it the submit news article feature into the new forum so that a legitimate product release still gets front page billing, but the actual thread linking to it appears in the ads/promo forum? But again, I'm not sure if I understand what this is all about.
Pete
Quote from: pspahnI'm not too up on the dishonest posters issue, so I don't think I understand what's being targeted. I was assuming an ad/promo forum would replace the Submit News Article feature that appears on the front page. If that's not the case, my comments don't mean a lot. If that is the case, is there any way to tie it the submit news article feature into the new forum so that a legitimate product release still gets front page billing, but the actual thread linking to it appears in the ads/promo forum? But again, I'm not sure if I understand what this is all about.
Pete
Again, I like this idea.
Good suggestion Pete. It is a nice middle ground.
Bill
I'm not too sure that'd be feasible. On the one hand, because I'm not sure if this could be done, and on the other hand because if it could be done I'm not sure if it could be done in such a way that the Storygame-driven threads I might move to "promo" would NOT end up in the front page news (that would kind of defeat the purpose of moving them, wouldn't it?).
RPGPundit
Quote from: RPGPunditI'm not too sure that'd be feasible. On the one hand, because I'm not sure if this could be done, and on the other hand because if it could be done I'm not sure if it could be done in such a way that the Storygame-driven threads I might move to "promo" would NOT end up in the front page news (that would kind of defeat the purpose of moving them, wouldn't it?).
RPGPundit
I am a clueless tech guy, but what I was thinking was that the post links from the News Article Feature to the ad/open forum (instead of the Article Comments forum like it does now), but not the other way around. I'm assuming if you post a new thread in article comments forum, it doesn't show up on the front page, but I've never tried it. Not that theRPGsite owes small publishers anything, but it would be nice for those of us who have gotten used to the way things work around here.
QuoteGood suggestion Pete. It is a nice middle ground.
Thanks, Bill. I occasionally come up a useful suggestion or two, especially where it affects my own self-promotion and/or sales. :)
Pete
Quote from: RPGPunditI'm not too sure that'd be feasible. On the one hand, because I'm not sure if this could be done, and on the other hand because if it could be done I'm not sure if it could be done in such a way that the Storygame-driven threads I might move to "promo" would NOT end up in the front page news (that would kind of defeat the purpose of moving them, wouldn't it?).
RPGPundit
It would be like RPG.Net and their promo system. If you post to the front page, a thread gets started in the ads promo section. If someone starts a thread or one gets moved to ads/promo then nothing happens.
That said, I imagine it is up to Brett how much time he would want to spend coding an interface like that.
Bill
I'm trying to decipher this but I'm not understanding. Can you outline the process?
Quote from: pigames.netI'm trying to decipher this but I'm not understanding. Can you outline the process?
The "submit a news item" funtion that propagates to the Articles forum would instead point to a "Ads/Promos" forum. That is really all they are talking about. Instead of the Articles forum it would drop the thread in the newly created Ads/Promo forum.
Make sense?
Bill
That shouldn't be a problem, except that it would dump all stories into the same forum. This includes blogs and reviews.
Quote from: pigames.netThat shouldn't be a problem, except that it would dump all stories into the same forum. This includes blogs and reviews.
Hmm, not sure that would work out then...
I'll keep thinking about this option for now.
RPGPundit
I just found a workaround. I can set it so that the person submitting the story can choose between posting it the Article Comments forum or an Ads/Promo forum.
I think we should be openly biased:
"Forganista"-Games must use the ad/promo section. Pundit detects which games must go there.
All others can shill away at the regular section.
That´s respecting free speech but also a mechnism of support for regular games on the marketplace of ideas.
If there´s a double standard, then let it be open and for everyone to see.
After the latest flashmob attack, I think those who abstain from flahmobbing and equally infrastructure damaging tactics should be treated preferentially.
EDIT: lukes recent and open threat of using "terror"-tactics convinces me even more that people abstaining from such things should get preferential treatment.
My opinion is to advise as few forums as possible. The more traffic to each forum, the better. Even if they're really shill threads, let them shill. The way to become an opinion-making forum is not to push everything into subforums but to hash through anything that isn't outright spam in the main forums. I don't mind some subdivision - game design from regular game decision, off-topic from RPG discussion, etc. But, when the balance is either way, I'd rather side with not subdividing.
On the other hand, the Q&A threads probably should be in the game design forum, not off-topic.
Having an Ad subforum could be useful, but OTOH I'm wary of having way too many subforums.
Most people will not tune in to a channel that runs commercials 24/7. Likewise most people will not give an ads/promotion forum much traffic. As such it would be practially useless for anyone looking to promote something. Instead of posting threads that will get moved and then no longer seen, people will have to hock their wares inside other threads, keeping the post on topic enough that they can't be called out for pointless marketing.
In other words, you can create it, but it may have a reverse effect from what you're looking for.
Advertising should go where it belongs. Either it's own forum, or just flat out deleted.
I don't come to any webforum to read press conferences and spam. I stopped posting on Evil Avatar because of all the rampant shilling, including from the moderators.