Quote from: Rum Cove;665254In quantity or quality?

In your case, quantity.

Sorry, you did kind of leave yourself open to that one.

Quote from: Benoist;665249There is NO line. It's a spectrum, like between RPGs and wargames, which doesn't mean the distinction doesn't exist, or isn't useful. It's been pointed out over and over. Why is this canard still showing up?

I think everyone agrees with you on this Ben. But a line is still being drawn  between forums. Therefore, it is natural to ask the question (and want an answer to) at what point on that spectrum games get separated.

To give an example, even though you consider TOR not to be an RPG, do you agree it has at least some (if not, many) RPG elements? As such, isn't it logical to want to be able to discuss this game in a forum where RPGers are likely to see it?

To give another example, TBZ was stated as being a storygame on the pretence of a single mechanic (in a 700 page RPG) - the death box. This was in face of a number of TheRPGSite posters (including a number of those who not even Pundit suspects are Swine agents) who had actually read TBZ and thought it was much more akin to a traditional RPG. When I wanted to discuss the comparisons between WFRP's Fate points and TBZ's death box, I decided that I would get much better responses elsewhere than this site's Other Games forum.

When you add this to Pundit's (the ultimate arbiter here of what games get separated) abusive mod actions, weird insinuations and mouth frothing paranoia, its no wonder that there is a reluctance to use the Other Games forum. FWIW I get that Pundit actually wants this whole thing to go away and that he knows that the Other Games forum is a joke. Though you won't believe me, I actually don't give a shit. This is his site, after all. But there is no doubt in my mind that everyone sees through the pretence that these issues are somehow being addressed and in some cases it is driving away posters of substance from TheRPGSite.

Quote from: Skywalker;665298When I wanted to discuss the comparisons between WFRP's Fate points and TBZ's death box, I decided that I would get much better responses elsewhere than this site's Other Games forum.

You very well might. That's no skin of my back.
I don't feel a need to encourage "posters of substance" for Storygames any more than I feel like I want to encourage a lot of posts about Advanced Squad Leader.

This site has a focus, and its Regular RPGs.  That said, for the umpteenth time, no one is stopping anyone from posting about all kinds of storygames in the Other Games forum.  Shit, one would think it ideal for those who don't like my contributions, since I almost never participate in any discussion in Other Games.

RPGPundit

Quote from: RPGPundit;665318This site has a focus, and its Regular RPGs.

In what subsection does The One Ring belong?

Quote from: RPGPundit;665318This site has a focus, and its Regular RPGs.

This issue with this though is the perception (whether accurate or not) that this site's focus is actually on RPGs that Pundit approves of.

Quote from: Skywalker;665322This issue with this though is the perception (whether accurate or not) that this site's focus is actually on RPGs that Pundit approves of.

Only because certain propagandists have been constantly trying to put forward that utterly erroneous impression.

Start threads on the main board about games like Savage Worlds, which I don't care for; or Exalted or Vampire, which I actively dislike. See if they get closed or sent to Other Games.  They won't, because they're on topic.

Quote from: RPGPundit;665331Start threads on the main board about games like Savage Worlds, which I don't care for; or Exalted or Vampire, which I actively dislike. See if they get closed or sent to Other Games.  They won't, because they're on topic.

The distinction between RPGs that you don't care for and RPGs you dislike because you consider them "story games" is most often one of your own making.

Quote from: Skywalker;665332The distinction between RPGs that you don't care for and RPGs you dislike because you consider them "story games" is most often one of your own making.

Repeating that over and over again doesn't make it true.

I agree fully with Dan here. Let me share a thought, anyway.

The first thing it must be noted is: this is a privately owned place, therefore the owner can inplement any rule he wishes, and it's fair even if we users do not like them. The Pundit would be well within his rights to decide that any discussion about any game he does not like is verboten, and there is nothing to reproach there. He pays the bills, so he has the right to enforce any ruling he wants regarding the contents of the site.

The second thing is that, given that this is a privately owned place, not very unlike an extension of the owner's place, he has the right to boot anyone for any reason. He does no need to apologize or justify anything. If he decided tomorrow to ban all Spaniards because he does not like us, it would be perfectly fair. He is not under any obligation to deal with anyone he doesn't like.

The third is: the distinction between subforums is meaningless, as there is a feature in this forum called New Posts, that makes such a distinction void. So, every day I log here I click the New Posts button, and every new thread and post is shown, regardless it is on the Main RPG forum or into the Deepest Recesses of Pundit's Butthole forum. It doesn't matter. So, arguing about this is pointless, and trying to fight against such a useless rule is pointless. If I want post about Dogs in the Vineyard no one is stopping me, and if someone posts about AW I am going to see it no matter where the thread ends. All this discussion is void, and people being banned or leaving over it is a damned shame.

I have clashed many many times with the Pundit but I understand that I have no right to demand that he makes the forum the way I want it instead of the way he wants it. His management may be better or worst, and his rulings may be great or counterproductive, that is a very different matter: he has the right to them.

Kyle said some time ago that the only universal rule is don't fuck with the mods. And he was right, because in a private website they have every right to enforce any ruling they see fit. Either you stay and abide by that rules or you leave, there are many other places.

Quote from: Imperator;665721I agree fully with Dan here. Let me share a thought, anyway.

The first thing it must be noted is: this is a privately owned place, therefore the owner can inplement any rule he wishes, and it's fair even if we users do not like them. The Pundit would be well within his rights to decide that any discussion about any game he does not like is verboten, and there is nothing to reproach there. He pays the bills, so he has the right to enforce any ruling he wants regarding the contents of the site.

The second thing is that, given that this is a privately owned place, not very unlike an extension of the owner's place, he has the right to boot anyone for any reason. He does no need to apologize or justify anything. If he decided tomorrow to ban all Spaniards because he does not like us, it would be perfectly fair. He is not under any obligation to deal with anyone he doesn't like.

The third is: the distinction between subforums is meaningless, as there is a feature in this forum called New Posts, that makes such a distinction void. So, every day I log here I click the New Posts button, and every new thread and post is shown, regardless it is on the Main RPG forum or into the Deepest Recesses of Pundit's Butthole forum. It doesn't matter. So, arguing about this is pointless, and trying to fight against such a useless rule is pointless. If I want post about Dogs in the Vineyard no one is stopping me, and if someone posts about AW I am going to see it no matter where the thread ends. All this discussion is void, and people being banned or leaving over it is a damned shame.

I have clashed many many times with the Pundit but I understand that I have no right to demand that he makes the forum the way I want it instead of the way he wants it. His management may be better or worst, and his rulings may be great or counterproductive, that is a very different matter: he has the right to them.

Kyle said some time ago that the only universal rule is don't fuck with the mods. And he was right, because in a private website they have every right to enforce any ruling they see fit. Either you stay and abide by that rules or you leave, there are many other places.

I agree, though it used to be "Speak Your Mind Without Fear".

But on the other hand, I've seen more tearing of garments over this divide than actual amount of threads about non - traditional RPGs.

Quote from: Rincewind1;665884I agree, though it used to be "Speak Your Mind Without Fear".

You can speak your mind without fear.  You just can't intentionally disrupt the forums by speaking repeatedly in the wrong area as an intentional act of forum-sabotage.

This wasn't about GW "speaking his mind"; he could have bitched about my policies till his face turned blue, in the right forum. He could have written about how horny storygames make him to his heart's content, in the right forum for it.  None of that was what got him banned.

RPGPundit

Quote from: Rum Cove;665321In what subsection does The One Ring belong?

The same one as Pendragon and Ars Magica

It would be useful for the forums here to have a stickiEd list of games that pundit doesn't consider RPGs. Some may be common sense,  but some come right out of left field, like when I was told Red Box Hack was a story game.

Quote from: TristramEvans;667363It would be useful for the forums here to have a stickiEd list of games that pundit doesn't consider RPGs. Some may be common sense,  but some come right out of left field, like when I was told Red Box Hack was a story game.

Umm, that's because it is. By the designer's, hell the text's, own admission.

Quote from: J Arcane;667367Umm, that's because it is. By the designer's, hell the text's, own admission.

Kindof mîssing the point there. And citations appreciated.